|
Calgary25969 Posts
UPDATE: Teamliquid has released the Liquipedia - an indepth wiki housing a wealth of strategic information. Liquipedia and these Recommended Threads don't fully overlap one another, so you should use both resources.
Below is a list of recommended threads on a variety of topics. We suggest you read through these to avoid opening a similar thread. Also remember that only the best of the best are posted in this list - there is a completely separate wealth of information that can be found using the search function as well.
Credit to GroT and Taiche for the original Recommended Threads.
Recommended threads now have a '!' before their title. Do not start a thread and put the ! in yourself, I will edit it in when I link it to the recommended threads.
GENERAL GUIDES
Beginner
+ Show Spoiler +
Advanced
+ Show Spoiler +
RACE SPECIFIC GUIDES
Protoss
+ Show Spoiler +
Terran
+ Show Spoiler +
Zerg
+ Show Spoiler +
TEAM GUIDES
2v2
+ Show Spoiler +
MAP SPECIFIC GUIDES
Current Competitive Maps
+ Show Spoiler +
Old or Casual Maps
+ Show Spoiler +
OBSOLETE GUIDES
+ Show Spoiler +BigBalls on PvZ - Originally written for Lost Temple, but the fundamentals still hold up. BigBalls on PvT - Also written for Lost Temple. Otherwise still applicable. Stopping 9/10 Gate - Somewhat obsolete because they encourage Hatch at ramp, but still contains good information.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
This will be kept current. You have no idea how many threads I sifted through, but of course I missed a lot, so please post suggestions. Keep in mind that we want only the best of the best in here. Obsolete guides are generally excluded unless a lot of their advice is general and can be applied to today's strategies.
|
YES CHILL!
EXCELLENT job, mate. ^_^
|
the other was indeed getting outdated. helps to have current topics in the mix
|
Taiche
France1963 Posts
Wooo, nice new thread Chill 
|
Woohoo. The work so far has been amazing, Chill! 
|
|
|
thanks alot for this chill, a updated thread really helps.
|
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?curren tpage=1&topic_id=38851
might wanna add this. Somewhere in there is the key to how dark swarm works lol. Seems many people don't know exactly how it works so it might be useful to add up there
forgot to add: great work (thought you deserved a "great work" from me too)
|
|
|
On October 11 2007 04:18 Lord_of_Chaos wrote:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?curren tpage=1&topic_id=38851 might wanna add this. Somewhere in there is the key to how dark swarm works lol. Seems many people don't know exactly how it works so it might be useful to add up there forgot to add: great work (thought you deserved a "great work" from me too)
nm, works now
|
On October 11 2007 07:59 Wizard wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2007 04:18 Lord_of_Chaos wrote:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?curren tpage=1&topic_id=38851 might wanna add this. Somewhere in there is the key to how dark swarm works lol. Seems many people don't know exactly how it works so it might be useful to add up there forgot to add: great work (thought you deserved a "great work" from me too) nm, works now
doesnt work for me? "not enough rights"
|
|
|
|
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
BigBalls' PvT/PvZ guides are too obsolete? I still think they're interesting for LT play.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
I originally glanced through and thought it was obsolete. Rereading now.
K seems good ill add it.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
Listal's guide is already up in the Zerg section.
I read BigBalls and there's a lot of talk about cliffing and Fact Port, so I'm going to put it in obsolete.
Similarly, the PvZ has a lot of mention of worry about cliff defense, and slow expansions. I'll put it in obsolete.
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
yeah i edited my post like six times
realizing each time that what i wanted to you to post up there you had already posted
|
Calgary25969 Posts
No problem, rather have more suggestions than fewer.
|
wow
nice renovation of the recommended threads chill
|
|
|
intrigue
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
|
nice!!
btw,
"Playing PT - Breif advice on each of the matchups." :s
|
Just for the sake of uniformity and completeness, maybe you could change the titles of the threads to have a [G] on them? It's completely unnecessary but it would look nicer 
|
Hi Chill, I was just curious as to wether or not you would like me to update my guide (seeing as how my skill has increased vastly since then) I would be able to implent the current format that you want for your strategy forum.
Also I can update techniques and strategies that may be able to be tweaked, along with finishing the "counter" section to it, however the "replay" achive of it, may be hurt, due to recent inactivity on my behalf, however I'm sure I could play a few games and use strategies according to which I stated in my guide.
If you'd like to me, PM me or respond to this comment, if not (due to all the flame in the thread) Please allow me to know.
Thanks :D
- LaStShAdOw
|
On October 15 2007 06:25 lastshadow wrote:
Hi Chill, I was just curious as to wether or not you would like me to update my guide (seeing as how my skill has increased vastly since then) I would be able to implent the current format that you want for your strategy forum.
Also I can update techniques and strategies that may be able to be tweaked, along with finishing the "counter" section to it, however the "replay" achive of it, may be hurt, due to recent inactivity on my behalf, however I'm sure I could play a few games and use strategies according to which I stated in my guide.
If you'd like to me, PM me or respond to this comment, if not (due to all the flame in the thread) Please allow me to know.
Thanks :D
- LaStShAdOw
If you plan on updating your guide please include reps of you executing your strategies. I really found those to make your last guide far more helpful. Daze's guide was great too but I think it would have been even better if he had perhaps picked out a few reps that were good examples of specific builds. When looking through his rep pack I had a hard time matching up some of his plays with the corresponding strategy in his guide. Ideally I'd like something like:
"The ______ build is good against the _____ build. You can see this shown particularly well in this rep. <rep link>"
Next to merz's FPvods with commentary I think these would be the next best thing to help struggling players. Unless of course you want to try commentating some FPvods.  merz's FPvod commentaries were the absolute best educational tools for me.
|
wow i'm speechless. this is the work of god...................
appreciations
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On October 15 2007 06:25 lastshadow wrote:
Hi Chill, I was just curious as to wether or not you would like me to update my guide (seeing as how my skill has increased vastly since then) I would be able to implent the current format that you want for your strategy forum.
Also I can update techniques and strategies that may be able to be tweaked, along with finishing the "counter" section to it, however the "replay" achive of it, may be hurt, due to recent inactivity on my behalf, however I'm sure I could play a few games and use strategies according to which I stated in my guide.
If you'd like to me, PM me or respond to this comment, if not (due to all the flame in the thread) Please allow me to know.
Thanks :D
- LaStShAdOw
100% yes. It's unfortunate that a lot of good posts had to be cut or put into the obsolete section because they deal with old play styles or maps.
I don't play TvP at all, but a lot of people told me your guide helped them a lot. I did read it, and here are some things I would change.
On second thought I PM'd you them to avoid drama.
|
Russian Federation4235 Posts
This is very nice Chill. Good job.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On October 12 2007 21:19 Equinox_kr wrote:Just for the sake of uniformity and completeness, maybe you could change the titles of the threads to have a [G] on them? It's completely unnecessary but it would look nicer
I love standardization as much as the next guy, but this is really just a waste of time
|
It would've taken about as much time as your post. :p
However, I think the stickies should look different from the other threads, even if it is less aesthetically pleasing.
|
Wouldn't it be possible to make them bold or colored?
|
Calgary25969 Posts
I updated all the thread titles. No, it's not possible to make them colours. Recommended threads now have a '!' before the title. If you add that ! yourself, I will seriously stab you.
This adds nothing, but people wanted it for some reason so I did it.
|
|
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
Don't forget the ZvT mech thread that has unusually good advice in it.
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
|
maybe you can add an external links section of strategies or advice, such as shockwave's beginner's guide and this
i know they helped me when i was still learning how to understand the game
|
Calgary25969 Posts
I'll read the skyglow post later, seems pretty decent so far.
Day's comment was added so people stfu about mech.
Thanks GI
On October 22 2007 06:24 XsEAJ wrote:maybe you can add an external links section of strategies or advice, such as shockwave's beginner's guide and thisi know they helped me when i was still learning how to understand the game
I don't know how I feel about linking to other sites. I'll think about it, thanks.
|
I don't think we should link to the Battle net guides. They are far too basic and don't really help much except general advice. I feel that TL's current way, through reading forums and general exposure is much better. Even following BigBall's really old guides are a lot better too.
|
Russian Federation4235 Posts
Battle.net is hardly a legitimate source of StarCraft-related info. Their official(!) unit stats table still lists dragoon's buildtime as 40.
|
|
|
|
|
infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
|
I was about to post the same thing infinity ^^. Helped my tvz macro so much.
|
|
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
Hey, I want to say thank you very much to people linking stuff in here. Sometimes I miss a good discussion, and sometimes I don't realize how good a post is until other people point it out.
Although eventually the recommended threads will get diluted if we put too much content in them, I think we are nowhere near that point for the time being, so I'm erring on the side of adding too many threads than too few.
I added this awhile ago, but it was because of your post. Thanks.
I didn't think his guide was good on first read, but there's some good tips in there. Thanks
Already in.
Yep, definitely should be in. Thanks.
Keep up the suggestions please! :D
|
Chill I updated my post on building placement to include as many possible combinations as possible:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?currentpage=1&topic_id=42920
You might want to add it to the TvP section. Could you edit the title for me too? I typoed it and didn't realise so it was hard to find by search.  Oh and it needs a [G] cause it was made before the tag system came in.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
thanks
|
Calgary25969 Posts
|
|
|
|
|
Lots of great content here, wow. And I just discovered that skyglow1 knows more about terran than me, lmao.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On February 29 2008 07:36 Dromar wrote:Modern Zerg Strategy by iNc. It's like a continuation of iNc's Tips for Zerg.
Oh my, I forgot about this. Whoops.
Thanks!
|
|
|
Aotearoa39261 Posts
Hmm, perhaps consider adding this post to the list? It's basically a list of timing for zerglings from various pool numbers and hatch/pool (including which builds are safe to which)
|
omfg this is fucking cool
thnx
ill read this all ;]
|
|
|
I think something that my self and my fellow noobs get hung up on is the psychological hesitation to attack as soon as we hit a new tech level or win a defensive battle. We think that if we just get a few more units the we will be safe and able to have an effective attack. When in reality we are just giving the enemy a chance to catch up.
This can be a really big deal early game where each new tech you get gives you a narrow window to take full advantage of that attack. So now I force my self to attack even with a small force because i know that I have an advantage.
Now that I think about it this is just one element of timing that's been going over my head, and others as well i think.
|
GroceryHeist- I know what you mean. I just watched a rep of mine. I decided (in the game) "Okay, just 6-8 more lings and i'll go". But by the time I attacked it was too late cuz the cannons had JUST warped in and laid waste to my army. But if i had attacked when I should have, I would have won ez. Not to mention I could have destroyed a warping stargate and prevented the eventual loss of all my ovies.
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
Updated with a zerg guide and a ZvP guide.
|
|
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
a lot of the walls being posted are mediocre at best though and honestly it requires some kind of consolidation or filtering out of the poor ones.
|
Oh I didn't realise because I hardly use walls. Anyway it's a good starting guide I think.
|
On June 20 2008 08:35 thedeadhaji wrote:
a lot of the walls being posted are mediocre at best though and honestly it requires some kind of consolidation or filtering out of the poor ones.
Tell me which ones are bad and I'll cut them out or take suggestions for better ones.
|
thedeadhaji
39489 Posts
I think
Forge FE - Where to place your buildings when you fast expand on popular maps.
could be renaed to Forge FE Wall-in's or something with a Wall, in the title.
ALso, XMShake's terran walling thread, basically the analogue to the PvZ walling thread above.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=73364
|
|
|
|
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
2nd entry in the beginner section has an error - i'm sure you can find it + tactics isn't capitalised? I'd have thought it should be - actually stuff like 'logic of larvae' should use capitals with the significant words imo.
Yeah.. [/nitpicking] but I find with stuff like capitalising I's and non-generic words important to attract readers, especially when skim reading :p
|
On November 15 2008 06:14 Tribe wrote:
2nd entry in the beginner section has an error - i'm sure you can find it.
There is no error. The lowercase 'i' is in a quote, so it does not follow grammatical rules, for the sake of accuracy. If you quote a work that has a misplaces comma, for example, you still have to keep the comma where it is, you can't change what's inside the quote.
edit: In response to your edit, where you expressed further concern about capitalization, you should note that Chill is reproducing the titles that other people give to their guides.
Oh, and apparently it's Chill's birthday. Happy birthday, Chill!
|
Then it is an incorrect quote. Did you even look at the thread it linked to? Because there is no lowercase I in that thread's title.
And no, he's not reproducing the titles.. look at the threads.
Oh um HB lol
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On November 15 2008 06:14 Tribe wrote:
2nd entry in the beginner section has an error - i'm sure you can find it + tactics isn't capitalised? I'd have thought it should be - actually stuff like 'logic of larvae' should use capitals with the significant words imo.
Yeah.. [/nitpicking] but I find with stuff like capitalising I's and non-generic words important to attract readers, especially when skim reading :p
... thanks?
|
Even though it's not a thread, I think that the commentary tutorial vids on the nevake YouTube account can be really helpful to new players. They answer a lot of questions that keep popping up in threads here.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=E2C2D043BAFD00A1
Maybe they can be linked to also?
|
|
|
On December 13 2008 18:45 Ilikestarcraft wrote:
all of idra's post in strat forum ^^
ROFL?, awesome man Thanks
|
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=80595
Day[9]'s FE about Fantasy. I know it's an article but it contains a lot of valuable information and insight about mech TvZ, and includes a rudimentary build order for the Fantasy build. I don't know how many people go to the FE section to look for strategy help, but it can't be many. I noticed this has already been brought up on the second half of page 4, but you didn't add it or give any justification for not adding it, so I dunno if you saw it.
|
Thanks for putting all the guides in one easy thread and thanks to the people who actually wrote them Really helping me learn the game.
|
|
|
i think this guide on ctrl/shift usage should be put in the basic section of the recommended threads. initially i assumed this was an overly detailed guide about what was common knowledge, but upon looking at the replies i think this is definitely worth the add.
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On January 01 2009 07:43 bluemanrocks wrote:i think this guide on ctrl/shift usage should be put in the basic section of the recommended threads. initially i assumed this was an overly detailed guide about what was common knowledge, but upon looking at the replies i think this is definitely worth the add.
Added
|
Calgary25969 Posts
|
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
|
|
|
|
|
Typo in beginner's guides:
Ctrl and Shift Useage
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On January 19 2009 10:04 onepost wrote:
Typo in beginner's guides:
Ctrl and Shift Useage
Thx
|
|
|
I've been looking for quite a while. Is there any written guide for each map and what makes that map good for each given race. I could look through a whole bunch of commentaries like i have been but it would be really nice if there was already one available.
|
This is the only one I know of, but it only covers a few maps.
|
is there a place where i can download the tourney maps plays in korea?
i cant go on bnet lol
|
On March 08 2009 13:05 dP1 wrote:
is there a place where i can download the tourney maps plays in korea?
i cant go on bnet lol
Here or here
|
|
|
12 Hatch Zerg Guide - Very good guide covering most of the basics of playing 12 Hatch.
Yo Chill, this link's dead.
It's been down for some time now.
Just letting you know.
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
|
Calgary25969 Posts
On March 11 2009 03:27 Trozz wrote:12 Hatch Zerg Guide - Very good guide covering most of the basics of playing 12 Hatch.Yo Chill, this link's dead. It's been down for some time now. Just letting you know.
deleted, its obsolete anyways
ty
|
I have a lot of things that I feel should be added to this post...... like the TvZ Art of HanBan and many others that are very thorough
|
United States11390 Posts
|
|
|
very cool chill, nice renovation.
|
Braavos36372 Posts
On March 26 2009 02:12 AoW_)e`X`ecutor(_ wrote:very cool chill, nice renovation.
please change your username lol
|
Added further to Schnake's request, his new Terran guide is very very helpful, and is an extension of the thread Schnake mentioned.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=90288 (which has a link to his FPVOD thread as well) goes more in depth of the builds, advice, and how to react to many different situations.
It should definitely be added.
|
Day9's audio commentaries should probably be added to this thread also.
Particularly the one on beating Mech ZvT, it's awesome.
|
Still not in the list, grrrr
|
Chillllllllllllllllll your thread is calling youuuuuuuuuuu
|
|
|
|
|
Calgary25969 Posts
Thanks, I dropped the ball on this. I will take a look and make a large update when I get back next week.
|
On May 15 2009 23:41 Chill wrote:
Thanks, I dropped the ball on this. I will take a look and make a large update when I get back next week.
*cough*
|
|
|
On May 29 2009 22:18 Crunchums wrote:Show nested quote +On May 15 2009 23:41 Chill wrote:
Thanks, I dropped the ball on this. I will take a look and make a large update when I get back next week. *cough*
*cough*
+ Show Spoiler +On October 10 2007 07:18 Chill wrote:
This will be kept current. You have no idea how many threads I sifted through, but of course I missed a lot, so please post suggestions. Keep in mind that we want only the best of the best in here. Obsolete guides are generally excluded unless a lot of their advice is general and can be applied to today's strategies.
*cough*
|
|
|
Can't believe they arent in here
|
On June 12 2009 05:22 Elegance wrote:Can't believe they arent in here
same I think they should be added, very helpful terran guides.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
On June 09 2009 13:17 Grobyc wrote:Show nested quote +On May 29 2009 22:18 Crunchums wrote:On May 15 2009 23:41 Chill wrote:
Thanks, I dropped the ball on this. I will take a look and make a large update when I get back next week. *cough* *cough* + Show Spoiler +On October 10 2007 07:18 Chill wrote:
This will be kept current. You have no idea how many threads I sifted through, but of course I missed a lot, so please post suggestions. Keep in mind that we want only the best of the best in here. Obsolete guides are generally excluded unless a lot of their advice is general and can be applied to today's strategies. *cough*
Bio is certainly less "standard" in TvZ now that there's more mech play, but it is far from obsolete.
|
Calgary25969 Posts
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I was looking for the guys who said he would accept a replay and give constructive feedback, help please?
|
|
|
|
|
On August 05 2009 02:10 Neivler wrote:NOW!
huh??? O_O
|
On August 05 2009 02:10 Neivler wrote:NOW!
!!!!!!
Seriously it's such a good guide! Especially with the VODs and replays included with it.
I've had a lot of success with the 2 hatch hydra/muta build vs mech, shame there isn't such a guide for ZvP
|
Wow.. some of the guides don't get near as much praise as they should. The Stopping The Blob ZvT is great, so many things mentioned that I'd never really considered.
|
Great thread, keep it upppp
|
|
|
+1
Same here, there's alot of threads that pop up about being a beginning and how to start playing. This answers alot of those questions.
|
|
|
Hi,
I am an AOE2 veteran getting big time into starcraft after a long hiatus from video games. I used to play AOE2 competitively so I understand a lot of the basics but am completely unfamiliar with the details of the game. I am learning Protoss and could not find a Noob thread (not surprising, how many noobs would you expect for starcraft at this point) and this seems to be the best thread for asking noobish questions.
This site is awesome and a big thank you to everyone who made it possible. Like I said, I am a new Protoss player and am starting out with the PvT matchup. I have a pretty generic question so forgive me if it is a stupid one - On what supply count would you consider it an early, mid and late game respectively? I have a bunch of starts and am working on my builds. However most articles talk strats in terms of early/mid/late game and I am kind of lost as to at what point should I feel one transitions into the other. Is this something you just get a feel from practice or are there specific supply counts at which a player is expected to transition from one to the other? Any replies are appreciated.
|
In PvT, 1 and 2 base, early.
2 and 3 base, mid.
4 and more, late
|
or: midgame is the part of the game which looks the same in all your games. Early game leads to there. Endgame is when all bases on the map are taken, or when one player decides he has enough bases.
|
Liquidpedia have helped me a lot... Really a lot!
Thanks for doing such a thing!
|
|
|
Didn't this thread used to be stickied? Can't find it in the Strategy forum anymore unless I search for it.
I agree, that thread was very helpful.
|
fatty77 thats what I said before. I was going to direct a new poster to the guidelines and they disappeared now this is suddenly back but not guidelines... weird.
|
3FFA, I think I've figured it out. At the bottom of the threads page, I originally had it set to Show "14 days" in the drop down menu (I think that is the default) and we need to switch it to Show "All". Even though a thread may be stickied it still won't show up unless the last reply was posted in that timespan we have it set to.
|
O ok thx fatty!
edit: yep it worked. fatty= awesome fat bitch XD(yes thats a compliment)
|
im an sc2 newb and need to practice my micro and macro now i finally know how to do thnks to this thread :D
|
I can't create a new thread so I'll ask in here:
What does #LL mean?
I ask people on Battle.net but they call me a noob and don't answer me.
|
United Arab Emirates5091 Posts
On March 03 2010 23:43 scnoob wrote:
I can't create a new thread so I'll ask in here:
What does #LL mean?
I ask people on Battle.net but they call me a noob and don't answer me.
Lan Latency for chaos launcher
|
|
|
On March 25 2010 07:25 123asop wrote:
awesome thread!
No its not awesome "thread"; its awesome "threads". This is the thread of all great threads. The thread of awesomeness, the Cave of Guides, the.... well you get the point.
Quick question to Chill: Why isn't the Ultimate Dark Templar Abuse Guide in here? I found it very helpful to me in helping me use DTs and getting them out with the minimum amount of units for defense out. It also taught me how to use them against all races effectively. It even has vods from progamers for examples in large amounts which REALLY helped me understand the guide more. Please tell me why It was not selected to be put in here because only some searching for Dark Templar guides allowed me to find it.
edit: link for The Ultimate DT Abuse Guide
|
wow its a shame i didn't see this until now..
this helped me so much! thanks chill :D
|
On April 04 2010 12:21 S[-_-]iege wrote:
wow its a shame i didn't see this until now..
this helped me so much! thanks chill :D
lol. How did u miss a sticky? U just failed lol. Overall Chill is awesome, he just isn't so good at replying to questions lol.
|
|
|
Terrible bump, but a wonderful thread to bump. I was actually thinking of bumping this thread, anyways.
kiddod12, if you are still playing the computer, we're not going to really be able to help you. Play a lot more, get comfortable with the hotkeys and units and overall knowledge of the game, and then read Liquipedia. After you are able to play comfortably on iCCup, make a help thread in strategy.
The reason I wanted to bump this thread in the first place is that a lot of people new to SC2 are missing many of the basics that are now second nature to BW players. Threads like these:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=44758
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=65645
are still extremely relevant in SC2, and are a must read for those who haven't yet.
|
Liquidpedia is the bible.
|
Is this still up to date for all the zerg guides and zerg related guides? because i dont want to spend time reading everything if it is irrelavaent today sorry for bump
|
On September 21 2010 12:00 greenkid wrote:
Is this still up to date for all the zerg guides and zerg related guides? because i dont want to spend time reading everything if it is irrelavaent today sorry for bump
most of these guides will always be recommended for beginners anyway.
|
unless you're in the D+/C- range AT LEAST, it doesnt really matter if its modern or not. there hasn't been huge changes at the core level.
|
This is a great collection of links Chill, you should make one for SC2, it would be greatly appreciated. Half the time I don't know how to separate the stuff that's worth reading from the clutter in that forum!
|
Wow this is amazing..Im gonna read all of these now
|
just found this thread ...awesome thank you very much
|
|
|
I think this could use a bump for all the players posting those "where do I start" threads. This is a goldmine that is full of info helpful at every level.
|
hy
Which one the program, which shows it ingame APM?
something MINI v9.32 or idk..., but i dont find nowhere.
User was warned for this post
|
Croatia9487 Posts
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
