EPT[Show] Weapon of Choice - 7:00 PM EDT - Page 60
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FLu
Germany147 Posts
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corpuscle
United States1967 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:24 FLu wrote: Technically the word "Nigger" just means black. (The latin word for "black" is "niger") I can't tell if you're trying to point out something pretty much everybody knows (the Latin root of the term) or if you're trying to say that people shouldn't be offended by the n-word because its root is "black" in Latin. If it's the first, uh... thanks? If it's the second, suffice it to say that a word's societal meaning has little to do with its origins, it's how the word's been used over the years. | ||
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Mordiford
4448 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:24 TomSlick wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=58904¤tpage=3#53 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=35452#10 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=34847¤tpage=5#91 http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=105987#5 wow man someone censor this guy! inControl mentioned and honed up to all the stupid shit he's done in the past, that doesn't really take away from his point in my opinion. | ||
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Homosax
20 Posts
Argue all you want, that's how I see it. He has to be more mature and care about his image. Destiny doesn't need to care about that, he's just being himself. | ||
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Fiercegore
United States294 Posts
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kethers
United States719 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:24 Homosax wrote: Ban me, I don't care. I don't want to be a part of a community that would do that. I actually believe in freedom of speech and I'm not willing to change the way I act for a small group of people. Those are dangerous words to post on TL forums | ||
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kittensrcute
United States617 Posts
You can't ask people to just get used to hearing them as many people (myself not included) are offended due to personal experiences. It is never acceptable to say something like "wow, I owned that faggot" on a stream that attracts thousands of daily viewers because there might be a viewer or viewers out there who have been tormented by the word and cannot simply get used to hearing it. I personally do not get offended upon hearing these words but as an icon in such a large community, it seems irresponsible to advocate the usage of these words and even more ridiculous to say that people should just get used to hearing them because you don't mean any harm in saying them. If the goal isn't to harm or negatively affect viewers on a stream, then don't use words that are potentially hurtful. | ||
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ArgosDelta
23 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:24 Homosax wrote: Second post from a lurker, since I feel the need to defend Destiny yet again. First things first, Destiny rarely says nigger from what I've seen. He says faggot from time to time, but I'm pretty used to that. I just wanted to set the record straight on that. I have yet to see Destiny use the word Nigger. Now, I saw some two-faced person in this thread accuse Destiny of putting a black person on his show just to "prove a point" or something. You sir, are racist. Destiny actually has a black friend, who has been on his show regularly. For you to assume that he simply put some black guy on his stream just to prove something, you're without a doubt more racist than he is. They've been friends for fucking ages. You disgust me. I think Destiny touched on something great that not a single person defaming him right now even paid attention to. He said that he was a firm believer in capitalism, and that if his viewers stopped watching his stream due to profanity, he would look at himself and change accordingly. His words, not mine. He's not unwilling to change, but he is going to stand for what he believes in, and what he believes in is, harmless. Since some person here put a laugh-worthy TL;DR post with a bunch of personal examples, I'll give some context too. First of all, I'm homosexual. Flamboyantly so. I like musicals. You can make fun of me, I make fun of myself. I also have a family member who was sexually abused, and raped. While I feel strongly about the latter, I come from a gaming background and I'm fully aware of what rape means in a game context, and have no problem with it. The thing about words is they change over time. Nigger is still going to have a history, but I think you should still be allowed to say it regardless. Whether or not you tune in to a person stream due to a persons language is your prerogative, and ultimately determines the fate of Destiny. I'm honestly pretty ashamed to see the constant elitism in this forum. Incontrol didn't "destroy" Destiny, just because you agree with him, doesn't make his argument better. I thought they both did pretty good, but Incontrol lost me when he smugly laughed at Destiny as he gathered his thoughts. If you call that mature and respectful, well hey, guess what? I think you're a fucking moron. Sue me. Ban me, I don't care. I don't want to be a part of a community that would do that. I actually believe in freedom of speech and I'm not willing to change the way I act for a small group of people. On topic, I'm impressed with DJWheat, I never really paid him any mind, but seeing him being so open to Destiny really impressed me, him raising a kid older than Destiny's and all. Keep it up, Wheat, I'll definitely tune in to your show now. Seriously, this is the truth. Part of the argument I feel is being shied away from is the fact that Destiny really represents the 'old guard" of gaming. Young teenage or college age males with disregard to the politically correct sensibilities of the mainstream. This is undeniable. I think Destiny's stream is a rallying point for this huge demographic in the sense that starcraft2 is becoming really pretentious about it's growth. With the boom of e-sports I've personally watched alot of players, incontrol included, try to posture themselves as John Maddens and the like instead of the raucous young men they used to be. Now im not saying that professionalism is bad, but it just seems like a paper thin charade to attract middle-aged divorcees and retirees to watch so that people can profit. It can really chafe. | ||
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Homosax
20 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:54 kittensrcute wrote: It honestly seems ridiculous that people can support the usage of words like "faggot", "nigger", "gay", and "rape". To ask people to learn to accept the usage of these words is absurd, even if the person saying these things doesn't mean harm by them. You can't ask people to just get used to hearing them as many people (myself not included) are offended due to personal experiences. It is never acceptable to say something like "wow, I owned that faggot" on a stream that attracts thousands of daily viewers because there might be a viewer or viewers out there who have been tormented by the word and cannot simply get used to hearing it. I personally do not get offended upon hearing these words but as an icon in such a large community, it seems irresponsible to advocate the usage of these words and even more ridiculous to say that people should just get used to hearing them because you don't mean any harm in saying them. If the goal isn't to harm or negatively affect viewers on a stream, then don't use words that are potentially hurtful. They're not asking, they're saying if you don't like it, don't watch. Destiny said if he ever casted a professional match he'd have to tone it down. He only talked about his own, personal stream. Judging by the fact that Destiny makes quite a lot of money daily, I don't think he needs to censor himself to please a few people. | ||
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ArgosDelta
23 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:54 kittensrcute wrote: It honestly seems ridiculous that people can support the usage of words like "faggot", "nigger", "gay", and "rape". To ask people to learn to accept the usage of these words is absurd, even if the person saying these things doesn't mean harm by them. You can't ask people to just get used to hearing them as many people (myself not included) are offended due to personal experiences. It is never acceptable to say something like "wow, I owned that faggot" on a stream that attracts thousands of daily viewers because there might be a viewer or viewers out there who have been tormented by the word and cannot simply get used to hearing it. I personally do not get offended upon hearing these words but as an icon in such a large community, it seems irresponsible to advocate the usage of these words and even more ridiculous to say that people should just get used to hearing them because you don't mean any harm in saying them. If the goal isn't to harm or negatively affect viewers on a stream, then don't use words that are potentially hurtful. This point is irrelevant in a game about mass murder, genocide, xenophobia, torture, cross-species breeding, and terrorism. | ||
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Danjoh
Sweden405 Posts
On May 30 2011 13:12 Doodsmack wrote: Enlighten us on the meaning of the word "nigger" in teh gaming community. You seemed a bit vague when you said that it "carries contrasting connotations within certain groups of people." He didn't specify that "nigger" had a meaning in the gaming community, but you can't deny that if a black guy uses the word, it's usually a form of greating, and if a white person uses the word in the exact same context, it's suddenly a insult. | ||
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ArgosDelta
23 Posts
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Diumlol
United States1 Post
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SlipperySnake
248 Posts
In summary those who trivialize words that have been used to put down and justify violence against others without concern for what they actually mean are naive. These words have definitions that aren't up for interpretation of context. Destiny needs to stop trying to be so transparent and non-hypocritical. He needs to own up when he is wrong and stop pretending that he has his own special contexts when these words are alright. | ||
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NoScary
United States151 Posts
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kittensrcute
United States617 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:59 ArgosDelta wrote: This point is irrelevant in a game about mass murder, genocide, xenophobia, torture, cross-species breeding, and terrorism. Oh, okay. I guess it's okay to use words like that when you're just talking about a video game since nobody who is watching will be able to relate nor will they be offended by the use of the words. Great point, sir. | ||
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Homosax
20 Posts
On May 30 2011 15:15 SlipperySnake wrote: It seems like every argument if favor of Destiny just has no education at all on the difference between racial slurs and swearing. These slurs add nothing to any dialog and are completely unnecessary when it comes to expressing your anger. There is no situation in which I think there is no other expression that gets across the point these words get across. It is just to be inflamatory and meant to be offensive. It isn't conversational language that you would use in any other way unless you were meaning to insult or put someone down. In summary those who trivialize words that have been used to put down and justify violence against others without concern for what they actually mean are naive. These words have definitions that aren't up for interpretation of context. Destiny needs to stop trying to be so transparent and non-hypocritical. He needs to own up when he is wrong and stop pretending that he has his own special contexts when these words are alright. Really? | ||
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On May 30 2011 14:24 Homosax wrote: Now, I saw some two-faced person in this thread accuse Destiny of putting a black person on his show just to "prove a point" or something. You sir, are racist. Destiny actually has a black friend, who has been on his show regularly. For you to assume that he simply put some black guy on his stream just to prove something, you're without a doubt more racist than he is. They've been friends for fucking ages. You disgust me. Actually it's not that far-fetched to consider it convenient that Debo came on during that discussion, considering the fact that during WoC Destiny rattled off the names of several black gamers (including Debo) who agreed with him, as evidence for his argument. This occurred when a black gamer called into the show. In my opinion, Destiny teetered on the edge of racism when he claimed that black people wearing $200 shoes shouldn't be offended by the word nigger. On May 30 2011 14:24 Homosax wrote: I think Destiny touched on something great that not a single person defaming him right now even paid attention to. He said that he was a firm believer in capitalism, and that if his viewers stopped watching his stream due to profanity, he would look at himself and change accordingly. And another thing he said was that since the number of viewers who would likely be offended by slurs (that is, people who are either black, victims of rape, or gay) is so low, he would only lose a negligible amount of viewers and thus his income wouldn't be harmed. He implied that this is a reason he shouldn't restrain himself from using those words. Whether or not that's a selfish thing to say I guess is up to the viewer to decide. What I got out of Destiny's time on WoC is that the last thing he's going to do is look at himself and change according to input he's received from outside. | ||
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On May 30 2011 15:00 Danjoh wrote: He didn't specify that "nigger" had a meaning in the gaming community, but you can't deny that if a black guy uses the word, it's usually a form of greating, and if a white person uses the word in the exact same context, it's suddenly a insult. That is indeed a distinction in intended meanings of the word nigger, but it's not relevant to a white guy angrily calling his opponent a nigger in a video game. | ||
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Homosax
20 Posts
Destiny is right. The amount of rape victims or homosexuals in his stream is likely going to be incredibly small and negligible. What this all boils down to is Destiny isn't going to censor the way he talks on his own personal stream. I think it's sort of a fallacy to lay the blame on Destiny(the way Incontrol did), because he attains a large viewerbase, he should be responsible for them. If anything, the fact that he has a large viewerbase demonstrates his point. | ||
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