On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
You joking? The average lifestyle for people back in medieval times was so much more intensive on all physical and athletic levels, we are far less athletic than people were back then, they had no cars so they had to walk for days month, even years sometimes to travel anywhere, they were lifting heavy loads from early childhood every day of every week unless you were royalty. Ask anyone who does archry, barely anyone alive today can use a British longbow effectively because they simply arn't strong enough, yet it was a staple weapon for any common archer back in the old British army of the medieval times. (knowing tl i have just started a 20 page argument as to whether people are less athletic and physical, oh dear!)
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
You joking? The average lifestyle for people back in medieval times was so much more intensive on all physical and athletic levels, we are far less athletic than people were back then, they had no cars so they had to walk for days month, even years sometimes to travel anywhere, they were lifting heavy loads from early childhood every day of every week unless you were royalty. Ask anyone who does archry, barely anyone alive today can use a British longbow effectively because they simply arn't strong enough, yet it was a staple weapon for any common archer back in the old British army of the medieval times. (knowing tl i have just started a 20 page argument as to whether people are less athletic and physical, oh dear!)
You can find pretty similar living conditions as back then in parts of todays Africa and Asia (aka the third world). People are tougher and can endure more there, but they are certainly not more athletic or even muscular.
To be muscular you need to eat tons of protein, something at least the average archer had no access to I am sure. People were also much smaller than they are now.
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
You joking? The average lifestyle for people back in medieval times was so much more intensive on all physical and athletic levels, we are far less athletic than people were back then, they had no cars so they had to walk for days month, even years sometimes to travel anywhere, they were lifting heavy loads from early childhood every day of every week unless you were royalty. Ask anyone who does archry, barely anyone alive today can use a British longbow effectively because they simply arn't strong enough, yet it was a staple weapon for any common archer back in the old British army of the medieval times. (knowing tl i have just started a 20 page argument as to whether people are less athletic and physical, oh dear!)
Isn't this one of the myths posted a few pages back that apparantly arent true?
The british longbow required extensive training and practice to use. Draw weights around 150 pounds. Not "any common" archer could pick it up and use it effectively.
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
You joking? The average lifestyle for people back in medieval times was so much more intensive on all physical and athletic levels, we are far less athletic than people were back then, they had no cars so they had to walk for days month, even years sometimes to travel anywhere, they were lifting heavy loads from early childhood every day of every week unless you were royalty. Ask anyone who does archry, barely anyone alive today can use a British longbow effectively because they simply arn't strong enough, yet it was a staple weapon for any common archer back in the old British army of the medieval times. (knowing tl i have just started a 20 page argument as to whether people are less athletic and physical, oh dear!)
You do realize that you're talking about something quite different to what you quoted, right? He's saying that people that can actually wield weaponry properly often aren't very muscular compared to the kind of bodybuilders that you see showing up on TV, because those guys train and diet specifically to build muscle mass (hence Loras not being totally ripped doesn't mean that he's not strong enough or can't fight properly). Then you start talking about how the average person back then was stronger because they did physical labor and whatnot... That doesn't relate to whether or not "hollywood muscles" equals practical strength with weaponry, which was the original point.
Granted, I'm no expert on physiology or whatnot, I've just read a few articles by trainers that talk about how developing huge muscles in a gym doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do practical things that demand a lot of strength or endurance, which is what the guy was getting at, and which I think is a fair point. How the hell would Drogo get pecs like that by riding a horse and swinging those light little blades, right? :-p
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
You joking? The average lifestyle for people back in medieval times was so much more intensive on all physical and athletic levels, we are far less athletic than people were back then, they had no cars so they had to walk for days month, even years sometimes to travel anywhere, they were lifting heavy loads from early childhood every day of every week unless you were royalty. Ask anyone who does archry, barely anyone alive today can use a British longbow effectively because they simply arn't strong enough, yet it was a staple weapon for any common archer back in the old British army of the medieval times. (knowing tl i have just started a 20 page argument as to whether people are less athletic and physical, oh dear!)
You do realize that you're talking about something quite different to what you quoted, right? He's saying that people that can actually wield weaponry properly often aren't very muscular compared to the kind of bodybuilders that you see showing up on TV, because those guys train and diet specifically to build muscle mass (hence Loras not being totally ripped doesn't mean that he's not strong enough or can't fight properly). Then you start talking about how the average person back then was stronger because they did physical labor and whatnot... That doesn't relate to whether or not "hollywood muscles" equals practical strength with weaponry, which was the original point.
Granted, I'm no expert on physiology or whatnot, I've just read a few articles by trainers that talk about how developing huge muscles in a gym doesn't necessarily mean you can actually do practical things that demand a lot of strength or endurance, which is what the guy was getting at, and which I think is a fair point. How the hell would Drogo get pecs like that by riding a horse and swinging those light little blades, right? :-p
Genes. That's why he was their leader before he fucked up.
On May 30 2012 11:50 UdderChaos wrote: anyone interested in the "power ranking" in the series (of hand to hand combat), after what Jamie said the other week im wondering who would go where at the moment:
The old guy (kings guard bloke who was dismissed by Jeoffry and everyone was afraid to fight him) Jamie Ned (before he died he put up a good fight against jamie before someone else stepped in) Rob Stark possibly the butch women who's got Jamie captive? The Hound The Mountain Tywin Theon
All i can think of right now, silly ranking i guess because we don't get to see them all fight, be that to me seems fair so far.
You missed a lot of characters. Also Jamie seems pretty weak in general (although I guess he is strong for a Lannister).
Khal Drogo Syrio Forel (Aria's sword-master) Jaqen H'ghar (Aria's assassin friend) The Hound Bronn Brienne of Tarth Rattleshirt aka Lord of Bones (guy with skull mask... seems tough) ... Jamie (seems really overrated though) Ned Stark Rob Stark Jon Snow
Also Pyat Pree (the Qarth warlock) seems almost impossible to beat.
Jaime isn't underrated at all. The "old guy Joffrey kicked out" is Ser Selmy Barristan.
On May 31 2012 03:17 SkelA wrote: Did i just get fuckin spoiled by Tur or he is just trolling ? -_-
It wasn't a spoiler, when Stannis's troops are running away, you can hear some of them yelling about "the Ghost of Renly." Loras was wearing Renly's armor and leading the attack, which caused them to believe he was Renly come back from the dead.
On May 31 2012 03:17 SkelA wrote: Did i just get fuckin spoiled by Tur or he is just trolling ? -_-
It wasn't a spoiler, when Stannis's troops are running away, you can hear some of them yelling about "the Ghost of Renly." Loras was wearing Renly's armor and leading the attack, which caused them to believe he was Renly come back from the dead.
I didn't catch the soldiers yell "the Ghost of Renly." Could you point out the specific time in the video?
On May 31 2012 00:00 TwoToneTerran wrote: Do you guys remember a few episodes ago where the two nameless Lannister grunts were talking about the best fighters in the land before they were eaten by Rob's wolf after making a fart joke?
They specifically mention Jamie and the Cleganes before pointing out that Loras is better with a sword than any of them (before mocking him for being gay). As well as we're aware, he's the best contest duelists and in general one of the best if not the best swordsmen in the realm. Of people who are still assuredly alive, I'd probably rank it Barristan/Jamie (too close to call, Barristan is one of the best there ever was from all we're told, but he's old), Loras, Hound, Mountain.
Based on the tv-series we've seen Loras losing to Brienne, so I doubt he can be called the best duelist. On a side note, I wonder why the actor didn't buff up more for the role? Loras isn't supposed to be big, but he seems strangely unmuscular for such a great fighter.
No one would have had hollywood muscles in those days (or at least assuming we are talking about our history comparing in some way to GoT). Many regular sword fighting re-enacters have unimpressive muscles but can hold weapons up and wield them more effectively and for longer than 'muscular' guys.
if a large part of your workday and training includes walking around in plate armor, you'd look a lot more buff than that actor does. He'd basically look more like a wrestler, with huge neck and shoulder muscles from carrying all that weight, and a really compact core from swinging as sword around a lot. And since he's highborn he gets to eat venison or whatever, which means plenty of protein. Yeah, the actor should've bulked up, because he's not exactly convincing as an armor-clad knight.. I can understand not caring too much about it, because at the end of the day what he looks like isn't that important, but anybody who thinks his frame is realistic considering what the character has been doing his entire life, they basically don't understand human anatomy at all
On May 31 2012 04:07 Juggernaut477 wrote: Go to 2:35.In a few second you hear it in the backround,easier it hear if you have headphones.
i hear "get to the boats" at around 2:30, "get away" at around 2:35 and some distant scream which if i really want can sound like "Renly"
Also on Loras, i understand people being confused about him not being ripped and all, but that is his character, a girl-ish young man who looks soft but is one of the best jouster in the kingdoms. Im pretty sure it's not a mistake, and they deliberately recruited someone with that looks, doesnt make sense? Well, it is what it is.
When i've first seen the knight of flowers, i was like "GAAAAAY" and shortly after it he turned out to be gay indeed, so GJ there HBO
On May 30 2012 12:17 BlindKill wrote: Robb,Jon and Theon are just bad. They are only as powerful as their liegelords/army.
I'd say the power rankings should have these people:
Brienne Loras Tyrell Barristan Selmy Jaime Lannister Clegane brothers Robert ( He did beat the Dragon Prince Rhaegar ) Drogo Bronn ( Killed Ser Vardis Egen, champion of Vale of Arryn) Syrio Forel Ned (his past is very badass)
I'd say Barristan Selmy or Sandor Clegane is probably the best, but you gotta give Jaime a hand, too
In my opinion:
Garlan Tyrell (Loras' brother) Barristan the Badass (in his prime and now) Jaime (in his prime) Bronn Syrio Robert (in his prime) Ned (in his prime) Brienne
Uhhh... let's not make up nicknames for warriors... Barristan the BOLD is called that from the books, among couple of other names "Barristan the Old, Ser Grandfather, etc". Barristan the badass is not a name used for the great Barristan Selmy
Calm down there quick-draw. We can call characters anything we want. Barristan the Badass is very fitting imo. Barristan the Beaming Beacon of Badassness is better though.
Also on Loras, i understand people being confused about him not being ripped and all, but that is his character, a girl-ish young man who looks soft but is one of the best jouster in the kingdoms. Im pretty sure it's not a mistake, and they deliberately recruited someone with that looks, doesnt make sense? Well, it is what it is.
When i've first seen the knight of flowers, i was like "GAAAAAY" and shortly after it he turned out to be gay indeed, so GJ there HBO
they basically emphasized the "flowers" over "the knight" ...and that is whatever, who really cares in the long run. But anybody claiming his frame is realistic forsomeone who is a knight in practice, not just as a title, are completely wrong. It's also stereotypical casting as far as homosexuals go. Big, burly men can be homosexuals too. Example, Bjarne Melgaard:
EPT
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