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On August 14 2025 18:53 Harris1st wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 15:44 Optimus Prime2 wrote:On August 14 2025 07:37 WombaT wrote:
I personally really enjoyed season 1. I think Tasteless was more energised than I’ve seen him for a while,
I’m interested to see where they go moving forwards. With his salary for 2h casting a day, anyone would be. Games were super bad and not exciting, Clem just gave up twice in a row with Classic, other series were just a roflstomps. Only real good series was Classic vs ByuN. But even there, it feels like Classic wasn't been playing his full strength with a lead, and gave ByuN too many chances for comeback, so it went 2-0 > 3-2 You think this tournament is a scam because the games were not to your liking? Do you even hear yourself?
thats your idea, not mine. i didnt connect players line up / games quality with money transparency.
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Northern Ireland25448 Posts
On August 14 2025 22:33 Optimus Prime2 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 18:53 Harris1st wrote:On August 14 2025 15:44 Optimus Prime2 wrote:On August 14 2025 07:37 WombaT wrote:
I personally really enjoyed season 1. I think Tasteless was more energised than I’ve seen him for a while,
I’m interested to see where they go moving forwards. With his salary for 2h casting a day, anyone would be. Games were super bad and not exciting, Clem just gave up twice in a row with Classic, other series were just a roflstomps. Only real good series was Classic vs ByuN. But even there, it feels like Classic wasn't been playing his full strength with a lead, and gave ByuN too many chances for comeback, so it went 2-0 > 3-2 You think this tournament is a scam because the games were not to your liking? Do you even hear yourself? thats your idea, not mine. i didnt connect players line up / games quality with money transparency.
No, you merely brought it up in a thread about just that topic, which you yourself started.
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On August 14 2025 23:15 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 22:33 Optimus Prime2 wrote:On August 14 2025 18:53 Harris1st wrote:On August 14 2025 15:44 Optimus Prime2 wrote:On August 14 2025 07:37 WombaT wrote:
I personally really enjoyed season 1. I think Tasteless was more energised than I’ve seen him for a while,
I’m interested to see where they go moving forwards. With his salary for 2h casting a day, anyone would be. Games were super bad and not exciting, Clem just gave up twice in a row with Classic, other series were just a roflstomps. Only real good series was Classic vs ByuN. But even there, it feels like Classic wasn't been playing his full strength with a lead, and gave ByuN too many chances for comeback, so it went 2-0 > 3-2 You think this tournament is a scam because the games were not to your liking? Do you even hear yourself? thats your idea, not mine. i didnt connect players line up / games quality with money transparency. No, you merely brought it up in a thread about just that topic, which you yourself started.
i just replyed to a guy, who was overly excited on season 1 and upcoming season 2 , which was just mediocre level at its best and line up is not getting better.
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On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them.
You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud. They are frequently related, but they are not the same thing. A deception can be a scam without being fraud. e.g. Selling a PICTURE of a gaming console on eBay for the price of a gaming console is a scam but not necessarily fraud if the listing makes it clear what is being sold.
RSL presents itself as trying to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future". RSL does note their proposed prize pools (in a currency that the audience is unlikely to be familiar), so they aren't engaging in fraud, but there isn't a single person in the world who would think that paying Gemini, Ziggy, and State over ten thousand dollars a year is a necessary part of the future of SC2. I would, however, expect that a vast majority of people would think that the players need to receive more than 10% of the money raised.
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On August 14 2025 23:29 RogueTheGOAT wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them. You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud.
I'm not conflating anything.
Buy a dictionary.
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On August 14 2025 23:46 MJG wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 23:29 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them. You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud. I'm not conflating anything. Buy a dictionary.
Which dictionary provides your definition?
From Merriam-Webster:
Scam - a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation
RSL purports to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future" while its intent is to funnel money to the organizers. That's deceptive and therefore a scam under that definition.
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On August 15 2025 00:04 RogueTheGOAT wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2025 23:46 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 23:29 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them. You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud. I'm not conflating anything. Buy a dictionary. Which dictionary provides your definition? From Merriam-Webster: Scam - a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation RSL purports to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future" while its intent is to funnel money to the organizers. That's deceptive and therefore a scam under that definition.
It's neither fraudulent nor deceptive if they do exactly what they said they were going to do.
+ Show Spoiler [What they said they'd do...] +On April 17 2025 23:13 Gemini_19 wrote:
Goal 1: Base level - we will be operating at this level for 2025 regardless of what level we hit
Event Scope: Two online seasons of your StarCraft 2 tournament.
Prize Pool: 5 million KRW per season (10 million KRW total).
Hosted from a new studio space in Seoul, casters would be offline and together for the broadcast
Features:
Professional broadcast production. 2 broadcasts a week during the season with professional commentators in person and together (State, Gemini, Tasteless, and more!)
Goal 2: Enhanced Online Seasons ($11,000/month)
Event Scope: Three online seasons of your Starcraft 2 tournament.
All features from Goal 1
Launch a regular Patreon-only podcast hosted by Gemini and Ziggy to discuss events, have guest pros and community figures on for interviews.
Increased marketing and promotion efforts.
Potentially bring in guest commentators or analysts for certain matches.
Community engagement initiatives (e.g., player spotlights, fan contests).
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On August 15 2025 00:12 MJG wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2025 00:04 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 23:46 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 23:29 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them. You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud. I'm not conflating anything. Buy a dictionary. Which dictionary provides your definition? From Merriam-Webster: Scam - a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation RSL purports to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future" while its intent is to funnel money to the organizers. That's deceptive and therefore a scam under that definition. It's neither fraudulent nor deceptive if they do exactly what they said they were going to do. + Show Spoiler [What they said they'd do...] +On April 17 2025 23:13 Gemini_19 wrote:
Goal 1: Base level - we will be operating at this level for 2025 regardless of what level we hit
Event Scope: Two online seasons of your StarCraft 2 tournament.
Prize Pool: 5 million KRW per season (10 million KRW total).
Hosted from a new studio space in Seoul, casters would be offline and together for the broadcast
Features:
Professional broadcast production. 2 broadcasts a week during the season with professional commentators in person and together (State, Gemini, Tasteless, and more!)
Goal 2: Enhanced Online Seasons ($11,000/month)
Event Scope: Three online seasons of your Starcraft 2 tournament.
All features from Goal 1
Launch a regular Patreon-only podcast hosted by Gemini and Ziggy to discuss events, have guest pros and community figures on for interviews.
Increased marketing and promotion efforts.
Potentially bring in guest commentators or analysts for certain matches.
Community engagement initiatives (e.g., player spotlights, fan contests).
Can you point out to me where it says they will use the rest of the money to pay each of themselves more than the combined sum the RSL Patreon pays out to the players?
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On August 15 2025 00:44 RogueTheGOAT wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2025 00:12 MJG wrote:On August 15 2025 00:04 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 23:46 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 23:29 RogueTheGOAT wrote:On August 14 2025 17:40 MJG wrote:On August 14 2025 00:01 RogueTheGOAT wrote:
If your crowdfunding pays out 5 different individuals more than the sum paid out to ALL players for the entire different year despite claiming to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future", then it is reasonable to characterize it as a scam and the individuals running it as scammers. Note, something being a scam does not inherently require it to be a crime. Anyone who knows anything about timeshares would characterize those as scams.
A scam is when someone doesn't fulfil their obligations or lies about their obligations. It requires dishonesty on the part of the scammer. RSL have thus far done exactly what they said they would do in their Patreon pitch. How is that a scam? EDIT: There are plenty of legitimate criticisms you can make of this tournament. That they haven't done what they said they'd do isn't one of them. You're conflating a scam with criminal fraud. I'm not conflating anything. Buy a dictionary. Which dictionary provides your definition? From Merriam-Webster: Scam - a fraudulent or deceptive act or operation RSL purports to "help carry the torch of SC2 into the future" while its intent is to funnel money to the organizers. That's deceptive and therefore a scam under that definition. It's neither fraudulent nor deceptive if they do exactly what they said they were going to do. + Show Spoiler [What they said they'd do...] +On April 17 2025 23:13 Gemini_19 wrote:
Goal 1: Base level - we will be operating at this level for 2025 regardless of what level we hit
Event Scope: Two online seasons of your StarCraft 2 tournament.
Prize Pool: 5 million KRW per season (10 million KRW total).
Hosted from a new studio space in Seoul, casters would be offline and together for the broadcast
Features:
Professional broadcast production. 2 broadcasts a week during the season with professional commentators in person and together (State, Gemini, Tasteless, and more!)
Goal 2: Enhanced Online Seasons ($11,000/month)
Event Scope: Three online seasons of your Starcraft 2 tournament.
All features from Goal 1
Launch a regular Patreon-only podcast hosted by Gemini and Ziggy to discuss events, have guest pros and community figures on for interviews.
Increased marketing and promotion efforts.
Potentially bring in guest commentators or analysts for certain matches.
Community engagement initiatives (e.g., player spotlights, fan contests). Can you point out to me where it says they will use the rest of the money to pay each of themselves more than the combined sum the RSL Patreon pays out to the players?
The amount of money going towards the prize pool is part of the list so...
I agree that the prize pool could do with being higher.
I disagree that they deceived anyone about it.
Thus I don't think it can be characterised as a scam.
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EPT
