EPTRandom and its place on the ladder - Page 15
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Rah
United States973 Posts
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babysimba
10466 Posts
Maps also have a large part to play. Blind cheeses are less likely to work on 4 player map. As zerg, i have to take risks in some way or another if i am behind right from the start. It's easier to play a tech/upgrade-centric style though, since playing the drone game is pretty much walking on razor's edge especially when you are behind. If you want proper practice on ladder, just go blind greed to counter their greed. If you happen to face early cheeses, just quit and get done over with. Playing when behind is also good practice though. | ||
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turtles
Australia360 Posts
From personal experience I was stuck in silver league as R for ages and about equally good at each race. But when I chose to play as Zerg I almost instantly jumped straight up to platinum just from being able to focus on mechanics and timings. I haven't played in ages but I'm about to start again and play as random. I will be playing at least a league lower than I would if I chose one of the other races, but I will be having more fun. So empirically random is heavily disadvantaged for GM+ and from my own experience random is heavily disadvantaged for bronze-platinum. It's possible that there could be a sweet spot in diamond and masters where being random actually helps but I see very little reason to think that would be so and it definitely would not fit the pattern. | ||
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JJoNeEightY
United States509 Posts
On August 20 2012 04:49 uberism wrote: LOL at people thinking that there is an advantage to playing random. There is a reason why no pro player picks random. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GuMiho This guy qualified for one of the GSL open seasons as random. Just saying. People need to step their game up, though, instead of complaining and rallying for changes to the game when they are having a problem. I honestly don't even feel like the 'balance changes' that have been made throughout WoL have really been anything much more than the design team saying "Hey, guys, use these units more, like this." If queen range went back to being whatever it used to be, I'm still pretty sure we'd see these heavy queen openers in ZvT. People need to play with mindset that the problem lies with their gameplay, and not with the game itself, because 99.999999% of the time, it does. Oye. | ||
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MyFirstProbe
Netherlands294 Posts
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reki-
Netherlands327 Posts
Playing against random learns you how to scout and react instead of trusting you can fast expand | ||
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-orb-
United States5770 Posts
I feel biased in completely the opposite way, because I get trash talked on a daily basis just for being random. Many games start with my opponent (whom I have never played or talked to before) calling me a fucking asshole etc and just continue with relentless trash talk just because I like playing all 3 races  | ||
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Penecks
United States600 Posts
And I don't really get the "focused practice" argument, I'm mid master and often run into players with 600+ games this season alone, while I barely play enough to empty my bonus pool. Should I get a couple more scvs at the start of a game because they've had more "focused practice" than me? | ||
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
I'd hate playing vs random as toss, cus if they hit zerg you dont know if you can forge FE In BW I hate random players with a passion, but that is because I am a racepicker, so people who random piss me off as I dont play zvz (add to the fact that the vast majority will throw some stupid cheese but predictable cheese at you just adds oil on the fire). I suppose I could just quit racepickin but playing PvZ is so much more fun than ZvZ :p | ||
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StevieWonder333
55 Posts
On August 20 2012 04:04 Liquid`NonY wrote: You should practice gateway openings in PvZ to fix this problem. Fucking Liquid Nony up in this bitch. I agree with this sentiment. | ||
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Dont-Panic
Germany567 Posts
1. Lose a shit ton of games. 2. Play poorly, recognize how terrible you are. 3. People talking shit before the game even begins: "Oh fuck not a cheesy random again." Or after I tell my race: "Yeah, as if I would believe that." 4. Start to get better but still getting flamed eventhough I am playing a macro game every time. I'm pretty frustrated at the moment but I know that the bad reputation is well earned by random players who just want to trick their opponent, rather than playing straight up. But here is some advice for all the non-random players. Just play safe against random. If they still win, it is only your own fault, because you should be way better than them at that matchup. | ||
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jinorazi
Korea (South)4948 Posts
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dAPhREAk
Nauru12397 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:23 Penecks wrote: Not sure how anyone can have fun playing random, it's just going to be non-standard practice since a lot of players tend to freak out when against a random, either doing something weird/chessy aka what you won't see much of in a real game. And I don't really get the "focused practice" argument, I'm mid master and often run into players with 600+ games this season alone, while I barely play enough to empty my bonus pool. Should I get a couple more scvs at the start of a game because they've had more "focused practice" than me? some people play the game just for fun, not to "practice" or "get better." i dont understand how people can stand playing so seriously all the time. why turn a hobby into a job? | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:08 JJoNeEightY wrote: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/GuMiho This guy qualified for one of the GSL open seasons as random. Just saying. People need to step their game up, though, instead of complaining and rallying for changes to the game when they are having a problem. I honestly don't even feel like the 'balance changes' that have been made throughout WoL have really been anything much more than the design team saying "Hey, guys, use these units more, like this." If queen range went back to being whatever it used to be, I'm still pretty sure we'd see these heavy queen openers in ZvT. People need to play with mindset that the problem lies with their gameplay, and not with the game itself, because 99.999999% of the time, it does. Oye. What's the point of bringing up Gumiho? He's the one and only random player to ever get through the GSL qualifiers (in 2010), only to drop out in the RO64. He switched to Terran the following season. If anything it exemplifies why no "pro" player would ever pick random. | ||
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Malaz
Germany1257 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:23 Penecks wrote: Not sure how anyone can have fun playing random, it's just going to be non-standard practice since a lot of players tend to freak out when against a random, either doing something weird/chessy aka what you won't see much of in a real game. Is it really bad if games play out non-standard? For me it's way more exciting. I get bored just playing one race really quickly and yet many people in this thread whine because they can't play their one standard build they play every fucking game. Now playing one build over and over THAT would bore me to death. Well people are different I guess. | ||
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Rah
United States973 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:14 -orb- wrote: I feel biased in completely the opposite way, because I get trash talked on a daily basis just for being random. Many games start with my opponent (whom I have never played or talked to before) calling me a fucking asshole etc and just continue with relentless trash talk just because I like playing all 3 races You sure that's because of your race choice? | ||
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-orb-
United States5770 Posts
You can make unrelated jokes and poke fun all you want, but when I play random I play on a different account under a different name, so what you're implying is not the case. | ||
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xrapture
United States1644 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:14 -orb- wrote: You should be able to do a 1gate expo PvZ no problem. There was a time when no one FFE'd, and even after it became standard it was a really long time before it became so exclusive... gate expands are still quite viable. You really shouldn't have such a tough time playing against random. I feel biased in completely the opposite way, because I get trash talked on a daily basis just for being random. Many games start with my opponent (whom I have never played or talked to before) calling me a fucking asshole etc and just continue with relentless trash talk just because I like playing all 3 races Why not just flip a coin before race select to determine what race you'll be. Why must you start the game with an unfair advantage. You obviously aren't playing random solely because you like every race-- part of it is the advantage. | ||
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cydial
United States750 Posts
On August 19 2012 22:07 Kasu wrote: I disagree. Its absolutely not hard to have a safe opening that "branches" out into race-specific strats after you scout. The whole "random players get a secret build-order" thing only applies if you get unlucky on a 4-player map. The exceptions to this are PvZ (but GW expands aren't that bad, see Adelscott) and ZvR where you gamble slightly on pool- or hatch-first. Terrans in particular have it easy vs random, I 1-rax FE and very rarely have to do anything different to the normal matchups. Online or irl it fucking baffles me sometimes how people say things and then don't realize the contradictions they're making. You say random is fine as is, then later say that there are situations where 4 player maps occur and you get, "Unlucky." ........ Random needs to display the race before the match starts, it makes no sense in a competitive game for some gimmicky wins to be allowed based on a computer generated number. | ||
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Saechiis
Netherlands4989 Posts
On August 20 2012 05:14 -orb- wrote: You should be able to do a 1gate expo PvZ no problem. There was a time when no one FFE'd, and even after it became standard it was a really long time before it became so exclusive... gate expands are still quite viable. You really shouldn't have such a tough time playing against random. I feel biased in completely the opposite way, because I get trash talked on a daily basis just for being random. Many games start with my opponent (whom I have never played or talked to before) calling me a fucking asshole etc and just continue with relentless trash talk just because I like playing all 3 races You're getting trashtalked because you start the game with hidden information whereas the opponent does not. There's simply no reason for random to not show what race it selects for you on the loading screen. It limits one players' early game options whereas the other can act with full knowledge of the matchup he is playing. You can't 6 pool, proxy gate or cannon rush when you don't know what race your opponent is spawning and you have to scout earlier to account for all the variables that the unknown race brings, yet the random player can do whatever he pleases because he has been randomly assigned a significant information advantage. The notion that random players deserve an edge because they have to learn more MU's than other players is ridiculous. If you choose to play 3 races instead of one you're accepting the burden of having to learn 3 times more. You can't willingly choose to play with such a handicap and then pretend you're entitled to some arbitrary equaliser. | ||
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