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PandaBlunt
United States292 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:24 diddLY wrote: This matters because Idra is quitting pro gaming to become a caster. You are right for the wrong reasons TB. Source please. I'd love to read where you read this. | ||
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Holcan
Canada2593 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:24 probablywrong wrote: Well, it's about sports commentary, not quantum mechanics. I don't think you can just pull out a list of references for play-by-play commentary that people would call legit or "scholarly". It's not as if he's got a bad argument anyway, if you try to digest what TB wrote. __________ Anyway, I really don't see the point as to why TB really needs to go at length about it though. People enjoy IdrA and he's one of the few exceptions when it comes to monotonous casting. I'd sort of liken it to listening to Hubie Brown calling NBA games. He doesn't stick out like when Marv Albert goes "YES" but he really calls games beautifully. Im just quoting to tell you that Marv is a play by play commentator, and Hubie is the color guy, its two different personalities you are comparing. note: if the person you are saying is like Marv was actually an ex coach, you'll probably wrong :D. | ||
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TheBanana
Norway2183 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:12 LITTLEHEAD wrote: if you're referencing wikipedia for your points, idk how much you should take from what he says He didn't reference Wikipedia for any points. He referenced Wikipedia for people to see 2 facts. Most people in the forum think play-by-play commentators are color commentators and they would never take his word for it when he says otherwise. He's educating them. Many people in the forum are simple-minded. I know this one guy who couldn't tell the difference between a point and a fact. And he used his own ignorance to hate on someone else. Can you believe that guy? | ||
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GummyZerg
United States277 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:26 iYiYi wrote: TB brings nothing to the table. His "emotions" mean nothing when there is no content to fill them with. Whenever I hear him cast it seems like he is just straining himself just to think of things to say. With IdrA everything comes natural because he is watching a game he knows about. Of course IdrA isn't really a caster, but he sure is a lot better then some british/australian guy shouting random things into the mic. Learn the game before you judge others TB, because in my opinion you aren't qualified to even cast professional starcraft. Totally agree with this, TB's response sort of sounded as if he was defending casters with no knowledge of the game. IMO there are a lot of these in Starcraft, I think there are people in between like Incontrol, tasteless or Artosis, all of them have extensive Starcraft knowledge and are great casters. | ||
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uSnAmplified
United States1029 Posts
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rbx270j
Canada540 Posts
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riboflavin
United States226 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:25 Frugalicious wrote: Sadly after you made this statement, people reinforce your statement on the ignorance of the vocal minority. We all know Idra has excellent analysis skills, but again, a casual would be bored as they would not understand the depth of Idra's analysis and his monotonous voice. More experienced SC2 players are going to be drawn in by the analysis and overlook the monotony with ease. Casuals cannot. A simple analogy would be listening to Idra's analysis (from a casual's perspective) would be like listening to a teacher lecture in class, not fun/enjoyable. TB has the charisma that Idra lacks, but does not possess the same level of game knowledge, hence he admits he is in the position of a play-by-player commentator. I find it difficult that so many people cannot comprehend something so simple and well-defined several times in this thread. Thank God, someone who gets it. The amount of garbage in the thread was making me sad for TL. I expect they stopped reading at the title and just responded based on a false claim. I'll say it again. TB wasn't unfair or slamming anyone. I only hope that his point of view about the casuals market is shared by the entrepreneurs of eSports. As a more hardcore fan, you can expect my business either way. But to win over the more casual spectators, leagues will have to present their product in an appealing fashion and not just throw some really smart SC guys in the booth. | ||
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TT1
Canada10011 Posts
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Swineflew
United States61 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:23 IronMonocle wrote: Yahzee uh i mean Totalbiscuit needs to understand that this is not American Football he is casting but a deep strategic game of Starcraft 2. You don't have people yelling when someone makes a good play in a lot of sports especially strategic ones like chess. This I guess is the basis of how I feel. I just feel like he's asking a soccer caster to cast a game of chess. THERE IT IS CHECKMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATE. Just because TB calls him a "colour-commentator" doesn't mean that TB can instantly say what IdrA should and should not be saying. TB is assuming that's why he was brought on and that those are black and white rules. | ||
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Zeke50100
United States2220 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:25 pbjsandwich wrote: IdrA is not a good caster. He does not have the training to be a good caster, he is too quiet, he is frequently monotone, he stumbles in his speech, he has no flow to speak of, he lacks the ability to express passion and emotion. this part just kills me. If Idra isn't a good caster then what does that makes TB? Did you read the entire post? >.< | ||
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Morphs
Netherlands645 Posts
Gretorp, however, seemed to trade in a lot of his enthousiasm because he was sitting next to IdrA. This left Gretorp with nothing, as he is not an analyst but a "hyper". So the only thing he was doing during the casts, was acknowledging everything IdrA said in a similar calm voice and with a lot more words. I'm curious to see how the InControl - IdrA combo will be. I really like the excitement from InControl, let's hope he doesn't hold back. | ||
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Zeri
United States773 Posts
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shaladdle
United States41 Posts
The one word of advice I have for you, TotalBiscuit, is to chill out. I think you are a perfectly good caster, I probably would have watched your VODs a lot when I was in silver/gold league. But, if you were to tone down your emotions, you would get flamed a lot less. Don't take things personally, don't give the impression that you are freaking out (don't freak out). Calmly say what you know is true and less people will blindly hate. It just seems like you are trying to push people's buttons sometimes. <3 | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
I also don't think there's any room for play-by-play. In traditional sports PBP adds something, whether it's the speed and type of pitches in baseball or formations in football. In chess or SC2 you're just re-stating things that are incredibly obvious to the viewer if you do PBP, so you need people who can analyze the game or you quickly run out of meaningful things to talk about. Just my 2 cents. | ||
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Frugalicious
United States121 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:27 pbjsandwich wrote: and honestly his point about the amount of casual viewers there are? Who knows that for sure? Who is taking a poll w/ every major cast asking the skill level of these players? Maybe the majority of the viewers are the more hardcore? When has that been true for any type of eSport or sport? Casuals have always been the dominant form of viewer-ship. WC3 for a example was difficult to understand for casuals and could not pick up a similar momentum to SC1 which was significantly easier to watch and understand. That is just one example of many. Unfortunately I do not have any support at hand to back up such claim, but I feel it is near common sense for anyone who is a spectator themselves of Sports or eSports. | ||
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
On May 13 2011 16:23 IronMonocle wrote: Yahzee uh i mean Totalbiscuit needs to understand that this is not American Football he is casting but a deep strategic game of Starcraft 2. You don't have people yelling when someone makes a good play in a lot of sports especially strategic ones like chess. You should listen to more Korean casts of BW games. There is a reason why quite a few people get riled up and start complaining whenever the only livestream of a match are from Chinese casters talking over the Korean commentary. There is a reason why PLAYGUUU, STORMUUU, REAVER REAVER REAVER are some of the most recognizable semi-memes in the SC community. I do agree with TB comments. Idra is a fantastic analytical colour commentator. However, him alone cannot make a game entertaining. Analysis is only part of the entertainment, and I doubt that it alone can be a complete package in terms of entertainment. There needs to be that voice that can funnel energy into the audience through tone and play-by-play excitement in addition to the analytical voice. Of course, forced passion is distracting, but when the caster fully masters that passion, the results are just as important as genius analysis. Tastosis does this brilliantly well, as does Day[9] whenever he is solo-casting or dual-casting. | ||
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Loving Memory
United States70 Posts
He also talks about how he is working to address the current lack of analytical casters in the scene, which is pretty commendable. All in all, he makes a lot of good points, and I agree with most of them. By the way, here's a link to the original article: http://gosu.com/2011/05/some-advice-to-casters-what-idra-brings-to-nasls-table/ You might want to include this next time. | ||
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Coolwhip
927 Posts
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pbjsandwich
United States443 Posts
yeah he's just defending himself on points people criticize him on bottom line is most people in the community would rather listen to idra than TB he jelly User was warned for this post | ||
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Zeles
United States335 Posts
Unfortunately - most of the people deeply immersed in the game that enjoy watching competitive play are far less than casual, and so his casts come off as annoying and slightly obnoxious. This is really frustrating to deal with and showed up most notably in the IPL where he dumb-downed the game even though the majority of the audience was more than likely on another level. | ||
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