On October 29 2025 01:48 Legan wrote:
All the talk about antisemitism has started to look to me like a pointless distraction that is being intentionally pushed to avoid any action against Israel. It seems like all arguments and statements need to fit a very strict purity test, while very little is actually done. Especially, I would expect sanctions to be put in place just because of how the West Bank is treated by Israel.
At the same time, while policing every statement from nobodies, the IDF has killed tens of thousands of civilians in their bombings. Those killings get struck off many times because the dead are viewed as just human shields used by Hamas, and Hamas is blamed for the deaths. I doubt that the same kind of disregard would be viewed as acceptable towards random jews getting hit by stray implications of a statement made by a nobody.
In general, I think that in many issues, people are demanding that others make tangents that muddy and weaken the original statements. For example, criticising the USA often leads to demands to criticise Russia, China, Iran, and so on and including those would make the text less coherent. Regarding Israel, the demand is to make a clear distinction from any form of antisemitism or to denounce Hamas. Also, it usually does not matter how clearly someone states their agreement on the tangent if the tangent is not at least as long as the other parts of the statement.
I am trying hard not to be baited (not saying you are baiting) into a discussion on antisemitism, because I don't think the average person knows the extent of it, so I'll ask you about your latter point:
To what extent do you hold Israel responsible for the death of civilians who have been put in harms way (assuming they were)?
Do you indeed believe that Hamas covers itself that way systematically, or do you reject it?
Is it ever justified to cause the death of a civilian during a war, or is it always a war crime in your perception?
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On October 29 2025 21:15 Jankisa wrote:
As always, you are posting in extremely bad faith, I wasn't posting long posts, I made an off hand comment that I was asked follow up questions which I answered.
You can try to make this about something else because of your personal grievances, but I'm not taking the bait, I do, however, find your bad faith attempts at debatelording pretty sad.
Wow super weak dodge, I'm the one posting in bad faith... I was trying to be nice, as were others but clearly it is more important for you to be right than correct. Down playing a genocide that is going to remove a culture from that planet is an awful thing to do. I'm going to chose to see you as one of those weak people who can't admit they were wrong to make such an ignorant take over a evil jerk down playing genocide on purpose.
Here is your off hand comment, totally not long posts... the last one that I replied to was especially a off hand comment. s/
+ Show Spoiler +On October 24 2025 00:41 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2025 05:43 Manit0u wrote:On October 21 2025 22:02 Jankisa wrote:
I'm beginning to like the Chinese approach, at least their ethnic cleansing is more humane, their repression mechanisms more chill and their approach to territorial expansion more laid back. What? How does "ethnic cleansing" and "humane" go together? Well, I get what you are trying to say, neither are humane, but I'd much rather, as a human, be treated the way that China treats Uyghurs then how Israel treats Palestinians. And not even Palestinians in Gaza, Uyghurs have way better lives and treatment then Palestinians in the West bank. In a few months or years, I have a feeling that I'd also rather be a Uyghur in a re-education camp then an undocumented immigrant to the USA, soon, if the Venezuela thing happens I don't even want to imagine what Miller has in store for them. In news relevant to this thread, it seems like the media cycle is once again buying Trump's bullshit, or at least that's how this new "Trump is angry at Putin this time for real" news cycle looks to me. He enacted sanctions to Rosneft and Lukoil, which, from what I'm seeing so far are very ill defined and no one really knows what will they entail. So, in the end, I think this will get a news cycle, fizzle out, the oil prices will go up, USA wasn't really doing business with these companies anyway and whatever lower revenues Russia suffers will be offset by the higher oil prices. Then in a week we'll have another "call between Putin and Trump" and rice and repeat. On October 24 2025 09:02 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2025 05:14 Manit0u wrote:On October 24 2025 00:41 Jankisa wrote:On October 22 2025 05:43 Manit0u wrote:On October 21 2025 22:02 Jankisa wrote:
I'm beginning to like the Chinese approach, at least their ethnic cleansing is more humane, their repression mechanisms more chill and their approach to territorial expansion more laid back. What? How does "ethnic cleansing" and "humane" go together? Well, I get what you are trying to say, neither are humane, but I'd much rather, as a human, be treated the way that China treats Uyghurs then how Israel treats Palestinians. And not even Palestinians in Gaza, Uyghurs have way better lives and treatment then Palestinians in the West bank. Do you even know what you're talking about?
The Chinese government has imprisoned more than one million Uyghurs since 2017 and subjected those not detained to intense surveillance, religious restrictions, forced labor, family separations, and forced sterilizations.
Their treatment of Uyghurs has been labeled as crimes against humanity and it's not much different from how Palestinians are being treated. Might as well vote for Cthulhu, why choose a lesser evil? It's a very simple proposition. Who would you rather be oppressed by, given current circumstances. Not all crimes against humanity are of the same severity, some are simply worse then others. We can go over the numbers the other way around, but, to me, I'd much rather be subjected to everything listed then 2 years of relentless bombing in the case of Gaza, outside of that basically almost everything else listed is happening there except forced sterilizations. Add in blockade, famine conditions, 80 % of buildings razed, etc. I'm in no way shape or form saying Chinese treatment of Uyghurs is anything other then monstrous and shouldn't be condemned, I just said if I had to choose between the two to me the choice would be easy. On October 24 2025 21:17 Jankisa wrote:
I guess that where we diverge is that you guys seem to be extrapolating this into further hypotheticals.
I thought my statement was pretty clear. At this moment in time, I'd rather be this, rather than that. Maybe I'm in a bubble of my own, but I do stand by my choice. I'd rather be a Uyghur than someone in the West bank.
As Harris1st said, not really the thread for this, if you'd like, we can go to the Palestine thread and rethread the "who has it worse" which was done a few months ago there as well, thinking that I'd rather be one thing than the other, once again, doesn't mean I condone or defend either thing.
In my defense regarding the relevance of all this to this thread, I made this comparison as a reply to a relevant "balance of power" discussion, and who is the Superpower I'd rather be subjected to, and that comment had plenty of other relevant discussion that no one was really interested in engaging on, same with most of my subsequent ones, which contained replies to this line of questioning. On October 27 2025 20:08 Jankisa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2025 02:10 RvB wrote:
You're wrong. Uyghurs live in a police state. There are no Uyghur who live a nice and stable life except some of the elite that cooperate with the CCP. See for instance part of the article below. It's long but describes it well.. There is not much there that has anything more then what West bank Palestinians don't have, just a different flavor of repression, and from everything I've read, less violent. Also, another thing that crossed my mind when reading this, China, in general is a police state for most of it's citizens, obviously not to the extent of what is being done to Uyughurs but way more then what Israel does to non-West bank Palestinian citizens. You also, haven't really provided any evidence for what you wrote, yes, this city has all this, there is 12 million Uygurhs, going around and providing one article and extrapolating it to "no Uyghur who live a nice and stable life" is quite a leap, especially when you put it after an arrogant "you're wrong". In general you are trying to project some sort of "factually you are wrong" stance when you are obviously quite ignorant on this outside of "how can this guy say something I disagree with". Xinjiang spans over 1.6 million square kilometers, Uyghur dominated areas are about a quarter of that, still bigger then any European country. Average GDP for a Palestinian in 2024 according to IMF is $2,440. Average for Xinjiang is around $10,500. There is plenty of programs that aren't just incredibly repressive to Uyghurs, such as affirmative action that actually help them, there are plenty of Uyghurs who have a much better chance of a good life then Palestinians. And then there is the random and state sponsored violence and living under a military occupation. This is why I'd much rather be a Uyghur. Maybe I don't have a problem with saying fuck my religion or national identity, so it's easier for me to imagine having a better life, but it's very wrong to say "You're wrong" on saying that on average there are both who live normal lives and I'd like my chances in China more. Again, fuck the CCP for doing this shit, it's a slow roll Ethnic Cleansing and Cultural Genocide, too bad that people like you who attack me for saying it's not as bad as West Bank can't say the same about policies that Israel implements there.
It is like you are trying to gaslight as if me (or RVB) or probably anyone who disagree's with your horrible take is the bad guy, but the problem is the posts stay unlike words you speak, you get this right?
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EPT
