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On November 12 2013 20:37 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:35 exioNAntyx wrote:On November 12 2013 19:44 Everlong wrote:On November 12 2013 19:42 iznobest wrote:On November 12 2013 19:35 Everlong wrote:On November 12 2013 19:30 Sapphire.lux wrote:On November 12 2013 18:31 MockHamill wrote:
I really feel sorry for Protoss now that tanks got 2.8 attack speed. I do not think that mech can be defeated any more but maybe some Code S player can figure out a solution. This seems right. So brave from Blizz to buff the Tank so much. At least they didn't go through with the mammoth 2.7 and scaled it back to a still enormous 2.8. I played a game where one of my Immortals actually died to Tanks, 2.8 really seems broken.. What am I supposed to do now when my units actually dies when I run into 20 sieged Tanks? Blizzard, seriously, get your shit together.. when i run my bio army into tanks I also die without killing anything, thats why you dont do that. Maybe you should consider other options than trying to run your army into 20 sieged tanks No, sorry, I refuse playing a game where there are units I can't run into with my Immortals (why would you name them so?) and not come out ahead!!! What would be the purpose of my units then? Sit and wait for him to kill me? LOL. You're actually complaining about immortals vs a mass Terran mech army? Are you serious? Basically, Immortal, ONE protoss unit is the main reason Terran DOES NOT mech vs Protoss and your complaining about the unit? Wow...you should follow up on your word to stop playing Starcraft 2 man, we don't need that type of thought process in the Starcraft 2 Community. More proof that Protoss is spoiled in the TvP matchup. If anything it's proof of your sarcasm detector malfunctioning very, very hard
His first post no less hehe
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On November 12 2013 20:31 keglu wrote:
If it's queen patch for TvZ all over again i will laugh so hard. I also hope that TvZ meta won't change into mech/air turtling. We don't need another deathbally matchup.
I´m also think that the current patches could lead into quiet boring turtle mech into mass bc/Ravens what would be realy horrible. How ever, the WM nerf was mor than needed and finaly they gave roaches the borrow speed back (I neverunderstood why they nerfd it in WOL better at the first place.
How ever, I would still like have a option beside Mutaplay against Marine Madic Mine play. Since the Medivac boost is in the game drops so f**** mobile and cost efficent. I dont see how Zerg is supoosed to hold that of without Mutas.
I also would like a unit which is able to shut down bio play and force Terran in to a dif. unit mix (it used to be the Infestor). Right now Terran can play Marine + Madic + X in nearly any MU against nearly any composition, that just not how a strategy game shuold be. Maybe the WM nerf already helped in that why. Maiby this is something we will get in Void.
We will see.
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ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch
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I think we will just need to let some time pass to figure out how to deal with the changes. I personally don't like the speed increase for an oracle as it will probably force me to build a spore crawler per every base.
Might it be that this speed-up is temporary, as the new patch 2.1 will surely add some other changes to the balance as well.
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On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch
Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D
Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is.
Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles.
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On November 12 2013 20:31 Erik.TheRed wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:05 boxerfred wrote:
THIS IS NOT A FUCKING BETA
I mean, seriously. Enough changes, let it develop. Concentrate a bit more on maps or arcade or whatever but just stop treating the game as if it's a beta.
If you ruined the game, you might patch once or twice, if there is like a constant 3-5% winrate ratio difference in any matchup, okay, one might consider the game being imbalanced. But seriously, why are you guys selling HotS for 60 bucks, then go all back into beta stage again. Aarrrgh. So much rage.
And, for the most ppl here probably the least important thing: what the fuck are the new 4v4 maps about. Lol. Yeah fuck blizzard for investing resources into trying to improve the quality of the game. They are totally scamming all of us by selling us a game and then having the balls to update it instead of allocating their time and money into other things! Also wtf david kim why can't you perfectly predict the metagame 2 years in the future learn to do your job seriously.
If you prefer an ongoing game with balance changes every 2-3 months, I guess you're fine and satisfied. I prefer a game with blanace changes every 6-12 months (if ever), that is actually balanced and well thought out when the development is finished. No need to hate on me for my approach.
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Austria24422 Posts
On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles.
I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate.
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On November 12 2013 20:46 Tif wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:31 keglu wrote:
If it's queen patch for TvZ all over again i will laugh so hard. I also hope that TvZ meta won't change into mech/air turtling. We don't need another deathbally matchup. I´m also think that the current patches could lead into quiet boring turtle mech into mass bc/Ravens what would be realy horrible. How ever, the WM nerf was mor than needed and finaly they gave roaches the borrow speed back (I neverunderstood why they nerfd it in WOL better at the first place. How ever, I would still like have a option beside Mutaplay against Marine Madic Mine play. Since the Medivac boost is in the game drops so f**** mobile and cost efficent. I dont see how Zerg is supoosed to hold that of without Mutas. I also would like a unit which is able to shut down bio play and force Terran in to a dif. unit mix (it used to be the Infestor). Right now Terran can play Marine + Madic + X in nearly any MU against nearly any composition, that just not how a strategy game shuold be. Maybe the WM nerf already helped in that why. Maiby this is something we will get in Void. We will see.
Defensive/turtle mech play being the best option in TvZ is not the Terran's or the patch's fault, it's the fault of the poorly designed swarm host supported by mass static defense (which IMO should cost supply for zerg, since it's not "static" at all) backed up by Vipers, and this is an uphill battle for battle and outright unbeatable if played correctly.
As long as this is possible Terran will never be able to be really active out on the map with a mech-based army, a redesign of SHs and a nerf/change to Blinding Cloud (things that are not used at all in standard ZvT) would suddenly breath a lot of new life to the matchup.
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On November 12 2013 21:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles. I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate.
Lets see what the future holds - I will remember your quote about making a single turret.
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Oracle as a unit is a bad-designed one.. It has no late-game or no extended usage.. What instead it has is an INSAANE DPS, far too high for an early-game opener..
If the unit had like 20 more HP/SP and a spell that will increase it's later usage, then it would afford to have lower DPS overall..
That being said - I still think BY FAR that the Oracle's problem isn't in it's mobility, but rather - the very high DPS it has and that it 2-shots everything (by everything I mean Marines and SCVs) on the ground from Terran early on..
However - there's still another work-around this problem (and I believe that Blizz itself would count on this one as a fix) and that is to increase the build-time of the Stargate itself, or at least the build-time of the Oracle overall..
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How many of the people complaining here have actually played the game with the changes?
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On November 12 2013 21:07 10bulgares wrote:
How many of the people complaining here have actually played the game with the changes?
Do you want everybody that has written anything in the thread to respond to this - or is this your way of saying "you guys have no clue what you are talking about" ?
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On November 12 2013 21:09 Glorfindel! wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 21:07 10bulgares wrote:
How many of the people complaining here have actually played the game with the changes? Do you want everybody that has written anything in the thread to respond to this - or is this your way of saying "you guys have no clue what you are talking about" ?
Probably the second, it was rhetorical question. 
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On November 12 2013 21:13 Ramiz1989 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 21:09 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 21:07 10bulgares wrote:
How many of the people complaining here have actually played the game with the changes? Do you want everybody that has written anything in the thread to respond to this - or is this your way of saying "you guys have no clue what you are talking about" ? Probably the second, it was rhetorical question.
Because if it was a rhetorical question stating nobody knows anything - perhaps adding why and why his experience with the new patch proves the persons that not have played it wrong, etc. etc.
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On November 12 2013 18:18 gingerfluffmuff wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 18:04 Bagi wrote:On November 12 2013 16:55 c0olL wrote:On November 12 2013 16:08 Interstellar wrote:
Also all the Terrans forgetting they just got their mech and air upgrades combined. Prob the best Terran buff ever. Everybody fixating on the oracle buff... Problem with Mech is vipers and immortals, the combined upgrades wont change it. Vikings help against vipers and banshees help against immortals and both of those get free upgrades now. I'm not saying mech will be great now but combined upgrades does help against both units. If the map doesnt look like Akilon Wastes with 3 expos tied together, you gonna have a bad time with mech when Mr. Warprism comes to remind you, that attacking the P was a bad idea.I am really afraid of what happens when LotV is out for like half a year. Because then really nobody is gonna give a damn about the game problems anymore. These patches are stalling for time, nothing else.
This. The problem with Mech is that there is no unit in the game with more hard and soft counters in the game than Siege Tanks. Protoss is basicly one big counter to Tank. The only unit that does not fare well against Tanks is early game Stalkers before they have Blink.
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France19747 Posts
On November 12 2013 16:12 DarkLordOlli wrote:
The oracle "buff" is actually a nerf to protoss because when you fly that thing to your opponent's base now and look away to macro, it'll already be there and die to marines
The Medivac boost is actually a nerf to Terran because when you fly that thing to your opponent's base and now look away to macro, it'll already be there and die to Stalkers.
Please.
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On November 12 2013 21:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles. I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate.
Except it wont. With the new speed the oracle can dart in and out of minerallines even with a turret and harass production, cast revelation etc. etc. As if protoss didnt have enough low/no risk highreward earlygame options in tvp.
+ Show Spoiler +Booo David Kim, Booooooooooooo.
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On November 12 2013 21:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles. I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate.
Quick question: is there any reason not to proxy the stargate? I mean it's not as if you need it ever again afterwards, so losing it isn't that big of a hit. You build your initial few oracles and once the terran has enough turrets they are basically useless except for scouting for which one or two are enough.
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On November 12 2013 21:26 Snusmumriken wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 21:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles. I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate. Except it wont. With the new speed the oracle can dart in and out of minerallines even with a turret and harass production, cast revelation etc. etc. As if protoss didnt have enough low/no risk highreward earlygame options in tvp. Booo David Kim, Booooooooooooo.
Plus a single turret doesn't completely cover the mineral line and gases. You still need marines to push it away. Also, the timing of the turret will have to come very early even if the oracle isn't proxied. This means delaying your factory and thus, medivacs. In turn, this will delay your push to stall the protoss's third.
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On November 12 2013 21:03 DarkLordOlli wrote:Show nested quote +On November 12 2013 20:56 Glorfindel! wrote:On November 12 2013 20:49 Viserion wrote:
ForGG after playing elfi "fucking disgtusting orracle"
Elfi´s respond "yeah it will get nerfed for sure"¨
haha what a patch Haha, yeah that game was quite fun. ForGG was stuck in his base, left with a drop and 2 oracles and a phoneix killed everything that was left. Drop hitting, Nexus Cannon kills evertyhing :D Oracles with the new stats will be opened everygame in TvP. There just aint any way to not make them worth is. Meanwhile Terran will only have Reaper - Reactor - Expand as their only viable opening. I think everything else has close to autoloss to the Oracles. I doubt that. A single turret still shuts it down the same way it did before unless you proxy the stargate.
Even with a turret the oracle can still kill the SCVs on gas, as well as the ones that are building and/or being transferred to the natural. Also with the new speed I think dodging any mines becomes almost trivial to a good player where as previously it was possible to lose an oracle to a well placed mine.
Wouldnt surprise me if stargate became the standard opener in PvT now, at least on paper it seems to have everything.
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EPT
