On August 25 2012 19:06 Zhalad wrote: BrosephBrostar is either delusional or a troll, probably best just to ignore him...
I've yet to see anything but baseless fearmongering from anyone supporting the ESF. Everyone is conveniently forgetting that they're pulling out after previously agreeing to play and going through the preliminaries, but I guess that's ok because kespa is evil and trying to take SC2 away from you.
It's like I'm listening to Al Sharpton or something.
No, no one is forgetting that, but we see the rebellion on ESF's part as necessary and they must as well. They believe this is the right step. I doubt any of the players and people in the ESF are just doing this to thumb their noses. They believe this is what they MUST do to maintain the state of Esports. Due to KeSPA's history, they feel that if they give in, then KeSPA will maintain a monopoly. They went into the OSL on faith in the "Esport Vision" deal that was made earlier in the year, not to mention that KeSPA has implied that they would allow their players to play once they got more practice, and by the state of WCG most people feel that their players should be ready enough to at least try out for the qualifier.
Necessary for what? Why would they want to maintain the state of esports? Isn't the objective to grow it? I'm still waiting for a real reason why kespa entering the SC2 scene is a bad thing.
On August 25 2012 18:32 BrosephBrostar wrote: I'll say it again, there's absolutely no way a fan of SC2 should support the ESF here. What they're doing is absolutely retarded. If their goal really is to "carry Korean E-sports a step forward" isn't getting on TV pretty much the biggest step they can take right now? Am I really supposed to believe that the players are willing to pass up their chance at playing in a Starleage, something they've probably been dreaming of since they became progamers, for the "dignity" of some organization? Don't make me laugh. It's obvious that GOM has ESF on a leash and they're yanking the chain because they're afraid of becoming irrelevant. Anyone that supports this kind of bogus politics has no right to call himself a fan of "esports."
And you think Kespa is in the right? Hell no. Kespa is the WORSE possible thing that can happen to SC2, should they force their way in and having shit done their way, whenever they want.
ESF is in the right and there is no point in trying to dispute that.
You supoort Kespa? Your no fan of Esports then.
More baseless claims that kespa is some kind of boogeyman trying to ruin SC2 forever.
?
Most of us agree that, basing on the fact that KeSPA had an iron grip on the BW scene, that their sole objective is to have a monopoly on the Korean SC2 scene. They do not care about the foreigners pointed out already by many posts, since their sponsors are focusing on the Korean demographic. How is all this "supporting eSports"?
On August 25 2012 19:30 BrosephBrostar wrote: Necessary for what? Why would they want to maintain the state of esports?
Because it favors them, financially. More money for them. History of BW is my evidence.
On August 25 2012 19:30 BrosephBrostar wrote: Isn't the objective to grow it?
In Korea only, and only if they have a monopoly and total control of the scene. History of BW is my evidence.
On August 25 2012 19:30 BrosephBrostar wrote: More baseless claims that kespa is some kind of boogeyman trying to ruin SC2 forever.
You're claims are equally baseless. Aside from making BW popular in terms of korea spectators and getting some sponsors, they've done basically nothing good for anyone and made things difficult for everyone. Even their own players and korean fanbase agree there.
le sigh.... and this is why we can't have nice things. professional gamers should be able to make their own ______ decisions, not the other way around.
My guess is that the members of the ESF have a deep appreciation for Chae and all the work he has done with GOM, while most of the top SC2 players still have bad memories of being B-teamers with no personal freedom under Kespa.
On August 25 2012 19:41 Twinkle Toes wrote: Wake me up when all of this is over. What is the problem really here? Money? Sponsorship? Previous bad blood?
Nothing less than the survival of the current GSL teams, as well as the freedom and liberty for the KeSPA players.
From interviews with some Samsung players for coming in 1st in SPL
Q: There's still OSL and WCG to prepare for. Jangbi: Other than the WCS qualifiers, this will be my first time playing against GSL players. I am very worried, and I'm not sure if I'll play well. I hope to be able to beat at least one person.
Poor guy. He probably practised so hard he hadn't had the chance to come to know about this yet.
On August 25 2012 19:47 Weirdkid wrote: From interviews with some Samsung players for coming in 1st in SPL
Q: There's still OSL and WCS to prepare for. Jangbi: Other than the WCS qualifiers, this will be my first time playing against GSL players. I am very worried, and I'm not sure if I'll play well. I hope to be able to beat at least one person.
Poor guy. He probably practised so hard he hadn't had the chance to come to know about this yet.
It's actually WCG he is talking about, not WCS. Jangbi is in the WCG Korean Nationals ro16 but WCS Korea is ending tonight and he was not in that.
On August 25 2012 19:47 Weirdkid wrote: From interviews with some Samsung players for coming in 1st in SPL
Q: There's still OSL and WCS to prepare for. Jangbi: Other than the WCS qualifiers, this will be my first time playing against GSL players. I am very worried, and I'm not sure if I'll play well. I hope to be able to beat at least one person.
Poor guy. He probably practised so hard he hadn't had the chance to come to know about this yet.
Bosses never tell their employees important stuff unless and until it is absolutely necessary. So these means broodwar guys want to mess up the SC2 scene? I don't understand anymore? :/
On August 25 2012 19:41 Twinkle Toes wrote: Wake me up when all of this is over. What is the problem really here? Money? Sponsorship? Previous bad blood?
KeSPA wants money money money, GOM to die, and maybe to eventually establish a dictatorship again. No regard to e-sports, just themselves. ESF wants KeSPA to not kill them, and to stop oppressing their players. Full regard to e-sports' future, not just themselves. GOM wants money money money, but also everyone to get along.
On August 25 2012 19:47 Weirdkid wrote: From interviews with some Samsung players for coming in 1st in SPL
Q: There's still OSL and WCS to prepare for. Jangbi: Other than the WCS qualifiers, this will be my first time playing against GSL players. I am very worried, and I'm not sure if I'll play well. I hope to be able to beat at least one person.
Poor guy. He probably practised so hard he hadn't had the chance to come to know about this yet.
It's actually WCG he is talking about, not WCS. Jangbi is in the WCG Korean Nationals ro16 but WCS Korea is ending tonight and he was not in that.
Oops. That was a pure typo haha. Too used to WCS.
To TwinkleToes: It means what you wantever you want it to mean And you have a cute ID haha
On August 25 2012 19:41 Twinkle Toes wrote: Wake me up when all of this is over. What is the problem really here? Money? Sponsorship? Previous bad blood?
KeSPA wants money money money, GOM to die, and to eventually establish a dictatorship again. GOM wants money money money, but everyone to get along. ESF wants KeSPA to not kill them, and to stop oppressing their players.
come on, be fair. They want to everyone to get along because they dont have the power. If GOM would have a chance to let KeSPA die, they would do so too
I know very little about StarCraft 2 other than 5-games a day and my Day(9) dailies (compared to most), However i am a business investor that works within the Energy Sector.
I feel that preventing market saturation within an industry that is currently still in its infancy actually hinders a process of globalisation, which is what both the "consumers" and businesses (more so) really need to be incentivised to want to be in involved with competitive gaming.
While I understand there may be a conflict of interest from Kespas perspective I think the decision to limit exposure to what is currently a very niche marketplace is actually extremely short sighted and detrimental to the industry as a whole, in the long-term.(Even more so considering the dependence on sponsorships).
Apart from conveying an extremely negative image to a very informed consumer base, which Kespa will struggle to recover from. It means they are limiting awareness for a product that has yet to be fully globalised, which is … well its stupid.
As a simple Analogy: I could never trade energy with a business that had been un-touched by my competition, there would be no infrastructure, or desire for power, because everything runs on gas.
Selling competitive gaming would be a lot easier if they approached an already aware consumer base.
They should simply rely on having a superior product.
On August 25 2012 19:41 Twinkle Toes wrote: Wake me up when all of this is over. What is the problem really here? Money? Sponsorship? Previous bad blood?
KeSPA wants money money money, GOM to die, and to eventually establish a dictatorship again. GOM wants money money money, but everyone to get along. ESF wants KeSPA to not kill them, and to stop oppressing their players.
come on, be fair. They want to everyone to get along because they dont have the power. If GOM would have a chance to let KeSPA die, they would do so too
IMO it's a good thing ESF sticks up after kespa's GSL5 participation announcement, since it's pretty obvious what kespa's modus operandi is (see sc1, see now what they are doing with their gomtv/mlg link-up in sc2), and their refusal to recognise ESF. Personally I quite dislike whenever someone claim ESF has nothing to lose and stuck up for gomtv for loyalty - just ponder what would realistically happen if gomtv dies over sc2 / kespa wins (Kespa can survive without sc2 since they have LoL, and they are a government-backed entity so they can't really die).
1) gomtv dies, the only other local korea competition sc2 is via Kespa-blessed OSL etc 2) So for the home turf, the current ESF players will have to go back under kespa's control since for kespa league they need their progamer license. 3) Many ESF players were former bw/kespa players (A/b-teamer still under the same Kespa control) and didn't like it, hence ESF is formed in the first place. 4) The foreign scene (outside korea) has been heavily bolstering the potential earnings of home turf players when they get sent out to those foreign competitions. It can be one player, two players, etc, as long as the player is willing and the competition host is supportive (some deals on flight ticket/accomodation). Try doing that under kespa when they can flat out say the entire A-team and B-team can't attend at all regardless. The supposed B-teamer will chances if they can go to other competititions. 5) So ESF players have a lot to lose if gomtv goes the same way as it did in sc1 - make less, play less (no control on foreign tournament participations), under the same condition that they were previous in that they didn't like. Practically ESF players live or die with gomtv (not just the entity known as ESF).
Yes, it's not helpful to fracture the korea scene, but kespa still trying to exert the same power as it had as if it's still bw (not a question of whether they should or should not) with continued dominance of bw in korea esport (it's no longer number 1).
On August 25 2012 19:53 Battle toad wrote: I know very little about StarCraft 2 other than 5-games a day and my Day(9) dailies (compared to most), However i am a business investor that works within the Energy Sector.
I feel that preventing market saturation within an industry that is currently still in its infancy actually hinders a process of globalisation, which is what both the "consumers" and businesses (more so) really need to be incentivised to want to be in involved with competitive gaming.
While I understand there may be a conflict of interest from Kespas perspective I think the decision to limit exposure to what is currently a very niche marketplace is actually extremely short sighted and detrimental to the industry as a whole, in the long-term.(Even more so considering the dependence on sponsorships).
Apart from conveying an extremely negative image to a very informed consumer base, which Kespa will struggle to recover from. It means they are limiting awareness for a product that has yet to be fully globalised, which is … well its stupid.
As a simple Analogy: I could never trade energy with a business that had been un-touched by my competition, there would be no infrastructure, or desire for power, because everything runs on gas.
Selling competitive gaming would be a lot easier if they approached an already aware consumer base.
They should simply rely on having a superior product.
Exactly. I think that their system of control is antiquated and that they don't truly understand the state of global SC2, nor do they understand the players and fans.
On August 25 2012 19:53 Battle toad wrote: I know very little about StarCraft 2 other than 5-games a day and my Day(9) dailies (compared to most), However i am a business investor that works within the Energy Sector.
I feel that preventing market saturation within an industry that is currently still in its infancy actually hinders a process of globalisation, which is what both the "consumers" and businesses (more so) really need to be incentivised to want to be in involved with competitive gaming.
While I understand there may be a conflict of interest from Kespas perspective I think the decision to limit exposure to what is currently a very niche marketplace is actually extremely short sighted and detrimental to the industry as a whole, in the long-term.(Even more so considering the dependence on sponsorships).
Apart from conveying an extremely negative image to a very informed consumer base, which Kespa will struggle to recover from. It means they are limiting awareness for a product that has yet to be fully globalised, which is … well its stupid.
As a simple Analogy: I could never trade energy with a business that had been un-touched by my competition, there would be no infrastructure, or desire for power, because everything runs on gas.
Selling competitive gaming would be a lot easier if they approached an already aware consumer base.
They should simply rely on having a superior product.
Exactly. I think that their system of control is antiquated and that they don't truly understand the state of global SC2, nor do they understand the players and fans.
Frankly, they're just using it again because it worked in BW. The fact it went totally unchecked and they held a monopoly in BW gives them the impression they can do it again. Stick to what you know and what (they think) works.
EPT
And you have a cute ID haha
