EPTOn July 31 2012 20:27 wcr.4fun wrote:
moving shot? Phoenixes don't have moving shot.
moving shot? Phoenixes don't have moving shot.
Yes they do?
Patch 1.5: Custom Game Use Old Balance Patch - Page 5
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Marcus420
Canada1923 Posts
Yes they do? | ||
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desRow
Canada2654 Posts
On July 31 2012 16:56 Cutlery wrote: I was thinking this to myself a few weeks back. Now that phoenix got the range upgrade, the change which let them attack while moving no longer follows logic reasoing? I don't remember the comment for that change, but do you really need range 6 AND firing while moving? I'm pretty sure this was mainly to deal with mutas -- now done by the range upgrade instead. Would make sense.. But might be a bug. With micro you can still get them to fire while moving, can you not? Not necessarily a bad change, to demand micro, for a game like starcraft no one gets that range upgrade.. BUT since phoenix are already garbage this hidden nerf makes them even more useless pvp hooray blizzard :D | ||
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apm66
Canada943 Posts
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
"Just tested on Patch 1.5. Phoenix still fires whilst moving. Everyone calm down. http://drop.sc/232098" | ||
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eusoc
Italy82 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:01 phodacbiet wrote: Neither do they shoot while moving. You literally just have to right click phoenixes away from stuff and they do the rest themselves. 3.75=>muta speed You just can't "right click phoenixes away", you must attack the muta ball, or it will become too big. I'm not saying it's difficult to micro phoenixes with range upgrade, but you must do it 90% of time vs mutas, and you have to keep macroing behind that, even going to build 2 pylons or warping a bunch of stalkers may ends up losing 1-2 phoenixes because mutas appear just in that 0.5 second. Without range upgrade it's even more difficult, mutas just run away and turn to kill phoenxis, without perfect control you end up losing too much. On the other hand, playing MM vs baneling/infestor is more difficult to actually micro, doing the split in the minimum time possible, but the macro is much easier(no CB to be done on stargate, no warp), just hotkeys, depots and mules. On July 31 2012 20:25 dynwar7 wrote: So? So what? Phoenixs are super quick. Yes MM can stim, but on creep its tough. Really tough having to split vs banelings and infestors because if infestors can fungal a big clump, then a few banelings will finish that. But I dont want to turn this into a TvP thread. I'll let other experienced terran players tell you.....if you dont think so, try playing MM vs bling infestors without tanks. If marines and marauders shoot while moving, of course I can just stim and move back As i said just few lines above, phoenixes are fast... yet, you must keep them moving and constantly keep attaccking the mutas. I play all races at approximately the same level, and the most mirco-intensive unit(beside speed warp prism with immortals) I think sc2 have is phoenix. As I said the MM micro is limited in few seconds, you don't need to keep stimmed marines kiting lings all the time moving around them. | ||
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Diamond
United States10796 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:38 dynwar7 wrote: StimmedProbe....if you are reading, please edit your original post....one guy up there said it is fine "Just tested on Patch 1.5. Phoenix still fires whilst moving. Everyone calm down. http://drop.sc/232098" Cmon man read further..... | ||
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InfusedTT.DaZe
Romania693 Posts
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:39 eusoc wrote: 3.75=>muta speed You just can't "right click phoenixes away", you must attack the muta ball, or it will become too big. I'm not saying it's DIFFCULT to micro phoenixes with range upgrade, but you must do it 90% of time vs mutas, and you have to keep macroing behind that, even going to build 2 pylons or warping a bunch of stalkers may ends up losing 1-2 phoenixes because mutas appear just in that 0.5 second. Without range upgrade it's even more difficult, mutas just run away and turn to kill phoenxis, without perfect control you end up losing too much. On the other hand, playing MM vs baneling/infestor is more difficult to actually micro, doing the split in the minimum time possible, but the macro is much easier(no CB to be done on stargate, no warp), just hotkeys, depots and mules. As i said just few lines above, phoenixes are fast... yet, you must keep them moving and constantly keep attaccking the mutas. I play all races at approximately the same level, and the most mirco-intensive unit(beside speed warp prism with immortals) I think sc2 have is phoenix. As I said the MM micro is limited in few seconds, you don't need to keep stimmed marines kiting lings all the time moving around them. Moving a unit that auto attacks is not micro intensive ok, full stop. At the same time MM are so vulnerable to fungal and blings. they get fungaled in a big clump, then say goodbye to that as banelings easily destroy those clumped units. Everybody knows MM vs bling infestor is super hard vs a decent zerg....no need to argue here to make your protoss look micro intensive....but as I said, you can say what you want, I dont want to turn this thread into this kind of discussion. Peace. Sorry, I cant find anything, what did I miss? O.o | ||
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Province
United Kingdom314 Posts
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IPS.Mardow.
Germany713 Posts
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ePdeLay
Australia220 Posts
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Djagulingu
Germany3605 Posts
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:54 dynwar7 wrote: Sorry, I cant find anything, what did I miss? O.o Apparently the bottom half of last page. | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:59 Djagulingu wrote: I don't understand why they can shoot while moving anyway. It's Protoss man, they invented some fancy technological shit. Thank god they don't have flying buildings yet. | ||
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Fragile51
Netherlands15767 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:59 Djagulingu wrote: I don't understand why they can shoot while moving anyway. They used to not be able to shoot while moving back in WoL Beta, but people complained that they were absolutely useless like that. So instead of increasing range or damage or HP they decided to give it moving shot. Seriously, who the fuck even complains about the phoenix anyway? | ||
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eusoc
Italy82 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:54 dynwar7 wrote: Moving a unit that auto attacks is not micro intensive ok, full stop. At the same time MM are so vulnerable to fungal and blings. they get fungaled in a big clump, then say goodbye to that as banelings easily destroy those clumped units. Everybody knows MM vs bling infestor is super hard vs a decent zerg....no need to argue here to make your protoss look micro intensive....but as I said, you can say what you want, I dont want to turn this thread into this kind of discussion. Peace. Sorry, I cant find anything, what did I miss? O.o Moving a unit that auto attacks into a +1 range advantage, that costs 150/100 to counter a 100/100 unit, producing it one at a time while the mutas get directly how many as you can afford, wiht 0.5 seconds of inadvertence that maybe cost u the whole game is microintensive. As I said I play every race at the same level, can you please TRY a PvZ going phoenixes to counter mutas? Guess you never even tried. | ||
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lindn
Sweden833 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:37 apm66 wrote: 1 extra apm should not hurt Yes it should. There's a reason why blizzard gave the phoenix moving shot back in beta. | ||
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ODKStevez
Ireland1225 Posts
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-Celestial-
United Kingdom3867 Posts
On July 31 2012 20:54 dynwar7 wrote: Moving a unit that auto attacks is not micro intensive ok, full stop. At the same time MM are so vulnerable to fungal and blings. they get fungaled in a big clump, then say goodbye to that as banelings easily destroy those clumped units. Everybody knows MM vs bling infestor is super hard vs a decent zerg....no need to argue here to make your protoss look micro intensive....but as I said, you can say what you want, I dont want to turn this thread into this kind of discussion. Peace. Try doing it for an entire game straight whilst simultaneously macroing, building a ground army, taking expansions, etc etc. You don't actually have to continuously dance MM around banelings and infestors for minutes at a time. The fight is over one way or the other in a few seconds. In terms of concentrated burst APM it may be higher, but you don't need the same endurance as you do for Phoenix not to die to...well...everything. Phoenix are micro-intensive in that they take up massive amounts of your attention and time to use. They're not micro-intensive in terms of pure burst APM. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
Regardless, it is likely a bug and can be fixed. People arguing that about balance are just looking for an excuse to whine. | ||
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