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On May 18 2012 11:32 Adreme wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2012 06:26 zezamer wrote:
MLG shouldn't try to hurt/insult/whatever GOM, in the end they need GOM players to attend their events. The thing is though "GOM players" arent owned by GOM in same way KESPA players are a part of KESPA. Leenock was completely willing to skip up/down matches to go to MLG but that would not happen if it were a KESPA league with KESPA players.
You know that could change anytime right? GOM has the venue, the show, the sponsors, the money.. they are face of SC2 in Korea. If it gets to a pissing contest I am sure MLG has far more to lose than GOM.
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On May 21 2012 00:08 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2012 11:32 Adreme wrote:On May 18 2012 06:26 zezamer wrote:
MLG shouldn't try to hurt/insult/whatever GOM, in the end they need GOM players to attend their events. The thing is though "GOM players" arent owned by GOM in same way KESPA players are a part of KESPA. Leenock was completely willing to skip up/down matches to go to MLG but that would not happen if it were a KESPA league with KESPA players. You know that could change anytime right? GOM has the venue, the show, the sponsors, the money.. they are face of SC2 in Korea. If it gets to a pissing contest I am sure MLG has far more to lose than GOM.
Kespa has all those and more and they are on the OGN tv network. Plus BW star players are more popular then Korean SC2 players Also I don't see what MLG can lose. They host an open tournament and now they get more exclusive star power, because of Kespa.
EDIT: Oh and Kespa or OGN are doing LoL the most popular game in korea atm.
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On May 18 2012 22:39 xBillehx wrote:Anaheim is in June isn't it? Nestea plays on May 21st and U&D's finish the 25th. On that subject I'm a bit confused by Sundance's jab at GSL saying they made some behind the scene announcement that U&D are the same as Anaheim when clearly they aren't even close.
I think that it implies that GSL originally planned to do the U&D on the week of the 4th (after the opening round of the GSTL), but because of players wanting to go to Anaheim, they moved U&D to this week.
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On May 21 2012 00:15 zaii wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2012 00:08 s4life wrote:On May 18 2012 11:32 Adreme wrote:On May 18 2012 06:26 zezamer wrote:
MLG shouldn't try to hurt/insult/whatever GOM, in the end they need GOM players to attend their events. The thing is though "GOM players" arent owned by GOM in same way KESPA players are a part of KESPA. Leenock was completely willing to skip up/down matches to go to MLG but that would not happen if it were a KESPA league with KESPA players. You know that could change anytime right? GOM has the venue, the show, the sponsors, the money.. they are face of SC2 in Korea. If it gets to a pissing contest I am sure MLG has far more to lose than GOM. Kespa has all those and more and they are on the OGN tv network. Plus BW star players are more popular then Korean SC2 players Also I don't see what MLG can lose. They host an open tournament and now they get more exclusive star power, because of Kespa. EDIT: Oh and Kespa or OGN are doing LoL the most popular game in korea atm.
I don't see how any of what you said contradicts what I stated. GOM can absolutely require its players to be sort of exclusive, since MLG started with that shit. OGN and LOL are very popular in Korea, but the best SC2 players are in the GSL, at least for the foreseeable future, and that's what really boils down to when organizing tournaments. This could create two blocks of players/tournaments.. a total disaster for esports.
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On May 21 2012 00:24 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2012 00:15 zaii wrote:On May 21 2012 00:08 s4life wrote:On May 18 2012 11:32 Adreme wrote:On May 18 2012 06:26 zezamer wrote:
MLG shouldn't try to hurt/insult/whatever GOM, in the end they need GOM players to attend their events. The thing is though "GOM players" arent owned by GOM in same way KESPA players are a part of KESPA. Leenock was completely willing to skip up/down matches to go to MLG but that would not happen if it were a KESPA league with KESPA players. You know that could change anytime right? GOM has the venue, the show, the sponsors, the money.. they are face of SC2 in Korea. If it gets to a pissing contest I am sure MLG has far more to lose than GOM. Kespa has all those and more and they are on the OGN tv network. Plus BW star players are more popular then Korean SC2 players Also I don't see what MLG can lose. They host an open tournament and now they get more exclusive star power, because of Kespa. EDIT: Oh and Kespa or OGN are doing LoL the most popular game in korea atm. I don't see how any of what you said contradicts what I stated. GOM can absolutely require its players to be sort of exclusive, since MLG started with that shit. OGN and LOL are very popular in Korea, but the best SC2 players are in the GSL, at least for the foreseeable future, and that's what really boils down to when organizing tournaments. This could create two blocks of players/tournaments.. a total disaster for esports.
Gom can't require their players to be exclusive to them Since they don't have the massive corporation backing that Kespa has to pay for the teams, The best SC2 players are the korean players and they are all over the place playing for a lot of leagues, They are not exclusive to Gom. Oh and outside players will be able to play in Kespa through MLG.
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Regarding the exclusivity thing - I don't understand why it's supposed to be such a given that they would strike a deal like that. He talks as if it is the most natural thing in the world. In fact this is a very unique situation wherein an organisation has complete control over several teams and MLG went ahead and effectively split the scene right in half. Does anyone really expect it to turn out any other way?
MLG keeps asserting that kespa has a history of not letting their players compete in foreign events which is strange, considering there literally were no other events than WCG/blizzcup and CS 1.6 teams that are part of kespa have competed all across the world. I guess I'm supposed to think that MLG is single-handedly bringing kespa players out into an international scene? Yeah, I don't really buy that. When there are events with prize pools that are large enough to justify the travel, and there are no conflicting pro league / individual league matches happening, I doubt kespa would be hesitant to let their players attend, MLG or no MLG.
"Over-saturation," by which he means other events doing a surprisingly good job of competing with their PPV style events. Imo, if they're so concerned with making money they should be happy that there are a lot of events happening all across the world and thereby expanding the fan base. Starcraft 2 is simply nowhere near large enough that this should be a matter of concern. His reasoning seems really short-sighted to me.
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Wish Gamespot articles were able to be read from GameFAQs... Can't stand the look of GSpot. Though GameFAQs has pretty much completely split from there, though.
Thanks for the interview, though! Nice info :D
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Kespa has to remain relevant somehow, and I think much of this discussion has more to do with OGN/Kespa than MLG.
I still think Sundance is a complete douchebag. His answers always seem canned, and he takes forever to say anything of substance. I really can't stand the 9,000 disclaimers and caveats he spits out. I want to grab him and shake him until he snaps out of his trance. What the fuck. =(
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its rather cute to sugar coat blunt cutthroat bussiness with naniwa/gsl problem.
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Man I would really hate for GOM to just be left behind like that after all they've done...
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On May 18 2012 04:33 TORTOISE wrote:
MLG is killing esports while maximizing monetary profit. Fuck them and their monopoly.
Agreed. I can't see how people are supporting MLG here. They're just trying to make a buck by making moves behind the scene to restrict competition and lock down players. Their master plan will be to control Korea through Kespa and outside of Korea through their 'partnerships'. Time to boycott MLG!
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Mlg lags again(eu), really pro company. Time after time promises HD streams but still lag at 480p.
Really pro production, really LOL
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On May 21 2012 01:47 ProxyKnoxy wrote:
Man I would really hate for GOM to just be left behind like that after all they've done...
You meaning securing that SC2 exclusivity back then?
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Sundance always finds a way to shit on GOM in every interview I'd seen of him. Talk about professionalism.
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Kespa said they wanted to work with GOM, but what does that involve beyond PR? Restricting players from participating in tournaments forces them to choose between one of two leagues and with Kespa's better sponsorship that's going to push GSL players to Kespa. Once they get the players, Kespa is then able to collective do whatever the f*ck they want and you're not going to be able to stop them. Kespa is very adept at boycotting whoever they don't see eye to eye with.
It begins.
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1. Monopolies are bad ... unless they are run as a kinda non-profit organization, a government-run water supply for example. MLG has to make a profit, so their desires and the benefit of the consumer will clash eventually. I had thought Koreans were smart, but the reemergence of KeSPA with the same old stupid stuff is bad. They should have noticed by now that Starcraft 2 is MUCH more of a global eSport than BW ever was and that a monopoly with all its rules for the players is a bad thing.
2. I dont think "eSport" is a viable job! The reason is simple ... in Starcraft terms: There is no logical transition after the eSport phase since you basically didnt learn any profession during the most receptive time of your life to learn. Sure there may be a few jobs on the "outskirts" of eSports (casting, PR, organizations), but since those jobs can be filled for much longer than an eSport career I dont think there will be many vacancies there. Thus I am not going to shed a tear if the big monetized Starcraft 2 tournaments disappear and only the weekly 100$ tournaments remain ... broadcasted by a few enthusiasts in their spare time.
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Do not like the sounds of this.
I hope western teams don't work too closely with MLG. Sounds like MLG-Kespa is looking to keep them under lockdown too.
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On May 17 2012 08:46 densha wrote:
Did Sundance just say that GSL is losing Up and Down players to MLG? Would any Korean team really let their players miss out on a chance at Code S just for a few thousand dollars?
In general I am really uncomfortable with Sundance/Kespa having so much power. I really want the BW pros playing SC2 but at the same time I'm so happy with the current scene. I really don't get why Kespa would even need to make such a big commitment to MLG... aren't they big enough to act on their own without needing to trust in such a young, inexperienced CEO?
In things like this, a monopoly isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, would your rather have the NHL, or 5-10 different small leagues all over North America? The competition becomes more meaningful in a unified way.
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On May 21 2012 03:11 mprs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 08:46 densha wrote:
Did Sundance just say that GSL is losing Up and Down players to MLG? Would any Korean team really let their players miss out on a chance at Code S just for a few thousand dollars?
In general I am really uncomfortable with Sundance/Kespa having so much power. I really want the BW pros playing SC2 but at the same time I'm so happy with the current scene. I really don't get why Kespa would even need to make such a big commitment to MLG... aren't they big enough to act on their own without needing to trust in such a young, inexperienced CEO? In things like this, a monopoly isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, would your rather have the NHL, or 5-10 different small leagues all over North America? The competition becomes more meaningful in a unified way.
It's not good. It deprives players of choice. The organisation in power will become complacent and soon everyone else except them will lose leverage and are forced to play nice with them. Don't like their league as a player? Where else are you gonna play? Wrote an article that doesn't put MLG / Kespa in a fucking awesome light? Don't expect anymore interviews or press passes. Same thing for casters and every other potential newcomer trying to break into the industry.
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On May 21 2012 03:11 mprs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 08:46 densha wrote:
Did Sundance just say that GSL is losing Up and Down players to MLG? Would any Korean team really let their players miss out on a chance at Code S just for a few thousand dollars?
In general I am really uncomfortable with Sundance/Kespa having so much power. I really want the BW pros playing SC2 but at the same time I'm so happy with the current scene. I really don't get why Kespa would even need to make such a big commitment to MLG... aren't they big enough to act on their own without needing to trust in such a young, inexperienced CEO? In things like this, a monopoly isn't necessarily a bad thing. For example, would your rather have the NHL, or 5-10 different small leagues all over North America? The competition becomes more meaningful in a unified way.
The former.
What you guys don't understand is that an unified league with Kespa at the head -> they control when and what players participate in -> you don't get all these small leagues, player streams, showmatches, etc. Kespa keeps their players on a tight leash and I don't see that changing with this press release.
It's going to result in less content. Kespa and MLG are going to run their leagues with a ton of commercials - ala pro-league, individual leagues, etc. - and that's it. That's what you're going to get and you won't be able to stop them.
I for one enjoy eSports because it is not physical sports where leagues control everything and players have no freedom to participate in community events.
Esports in SC 2 has been very bottom up. Kespa, however, wants to make it top down.
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EPT
