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We understand this is an issue that has led to a lot of opinions. Please remember above all to keep the discussion respectful and on topic. - This thread is specifically about NaNiwa and GOM and the controversy that occurred between them. It is not about IdrA and Sen in Code S, nor is it about any other players or tournaments. Pleas discuss that here.- This thread is not about the merits of the Blizzard Cup structure, or GOM's foreigner invite system. Please discuss that here.- Finally, this thread is not about Korean culture, Swedish culture, or any other ethnicity or group of people. Keep racism and cultural stereotypes out of this thread. Responsibility for keeping a thread constructive is primarily yours. Please keep that in mind. |
well there is one good point about all of it. Now they have to show all games in their team league x3. Since 5/0 doesn't mean its over, all games need to be played so the viewer aren't offended.
And I hope they will make sure to jump Naniwa and calm him down (his team now), when he is on tilt again. It makes him train really hard, but in tournaments its his biggest weakness imo.
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On December 15 2011 08:25 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
I think the punishment fits perfectly. Naniwa didn't want to compete in GOM's tournament. Now, he doesn't have to.
Why are you so ignorant? He stopped competing in the tournament after he was knocked out of it prior to the controversial match.
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Korea takes Starcraft more seriously than anyone else in the world. And by alot too. I am a HUGE NaNiWa fan but because he didn't wanna play his last game, meaningless or not, he decided to act like a child. Very disrespectful to himself, Nestea, the GSL and korean Starcraft in general. Punishment is severe but necessary. Sorry NaNiWa but if you do not wanna act like you want to be there getting the most out of your games vs. high level korean players, then you simply do no deserve to be there. Good luck to Idra and Sen in GSL January. Foreigners fighting!
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Overreaction by GOM IMO. Started out with Naniwa acting childish when things didn't go his way and now GOM is responding in suit and throwing the toys out of the pram. Take a fine out of his winnings or something but randomly changing rules for a different event and handing out arbitrary punishment seems kinda..weird.
Is this the most talked about SC2 game so far?
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I honestly hope people who support GOM reconsider their stance after reading this:
On December 15 2011 08:23 m0ck wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:19 Paladia wrote:On December 15 2011 06:33 GOMTV wrote:It seems like a lot of people have been under the impression that NaNiWa has received a Code S seed for taking 2nd place at MLG Providence. The truth however is that NaNiWa has received the right to compete in the Blizzard Cup for his 2nd place achievement at MLG Providence. Gom, why are you making this up? 1. Why were the two seeds called "INTERNATIONAL SEED" and the other one "MLG PROVIDENCE CODE S SEED" on your official website (which you in stealth changed today)? 2. Why did your own twitter comment say that you revoked his Code S seed (which you also, deleted today)? 3. Why was it announced on your official partners website that Naniwa has .. earned a seat in Code S? 4. And why does it still say on your official website when you announced the partner program still (not had time to change that one yet, had you?) say that: At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status.What you are doing right now is much much worse than what Naniwa could ever do or any player has ever done in the history of Starcraft 2. You are falsely removing the prize of a tournament several months after the tournament has happened and trying to delete all evidence of it. This is worse than those tournaments who don't pay the prize money, as at least they acknowledge the fact that there is a prize. I really expected that your so called "honor" would be more than this. Removing one of the major prizes of a tournament, lying, deleting threads, in secret altering your own statements, I think all GomTV has built up was just thrown down the drain and I honestly wish that no player would ever have anything more to do with you. I don't see how you dare talk about "honor" or professionalism. It really is pretty ugly. Further proof: Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:09 illsick wrote:and something that is strange is also this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=293877Nani: "Even if I win Blizzard Cup nothing will change. I think prestige is important but in my opinion Code S is the most prestigious tournament in the world. So I want to continue challenge myself in Code S." What was the interviewer thinking after a response like that? No one in the GOM studio cared to correct him by saying that he wasn't in code S yet but that he was in the running for a spot with other foreigners? I think that GOM was lying, they had opportunities to claim otherwise about the code S spot in question when all different types of media announced that nani had earned it, including one of the two parties involved with the exchange program (MLG). I think it was easier for them to say people had the wrong impression that naniwa got a code S spot (I mean how could someone have the right impression when all sorts of media stated otherwise?) than to say he was kicked out of code S.
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Vatican City State582 Posts
On December 15 2011 07:09 Miscellany wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 06:53 fantomex wrote:
Thank you OT for actually describing what happened, which none of the TL front page stories or statements by related parties bothered to do.
TL.net is very poorly designed site. You guys have no business criticizing the MLG site (although MLG is still worse).
I don't how you manage to be completely inaccessible to casual fans over a period of years. E-Sports needs better. You may want to present any criticisms you have with correct grammar if you want them to be taken seriously.To avoid further fallacious discussion: I think Naniwa's decision to throw his game was immature and disrespectful. I think GOM's decision to revoke his seed for January was fair - I'm sure quite a few would have wanted a permanent ban, but I think their decision was best for all the parties involved. I hope this incident can be used positively so in future pro-gamers can remember that they need to remain professional and respectful at all times.
Nice grammar dude. You are totally taken seriously.
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On December 15 2011 08:28 SC2NeCro wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:25 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
I think the punishment fits perfectly. Naniwa didn't want to compete in GOM's tournament. Now, he doesn't have to. Why are you so ignorant? He stopped competing in the tournament after he was knocked out of it prior to the controversial match.
The tournament format dictated that he had one more match. The fact that he could not advance was a him problem, not a GOM problem.
On December 15 2011 08:40 SC2NeCro wrote:I honestly hope people who support GOM reconsider their stance after reading this: Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:23 m0ck wrote:On December 15 2011 08:19 Paladia wrote:On December 15 2011 06:33 GOMTV wrote:It seems like a lot of people have been under the impression that NaNiWa has received a Code S seed for taking 2nd place at MLG Providence. The truth however is that NaNiWa has received the right to compete in the Blizzard Cup for his 2nd place achievement at MLG Providence. Gom, why are you making this up? 1. Why were the two seeds called "INTERNATIONAL SEED" and the other one "MLG PROVIDENCE CODE S SEED" on your official website (which you in stealth changed today)? 2. Why did your own twitter comment say that you revoked his Code S seed (which you also, deleted today)? 3. Why was it announced on your official partners website that Naniwa has .. earned a seat in Code S? 4. And why does it still say on your official website when you announced the partner program still (not had time to change that one yet, had you?) say that: At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status.What you are doing right now is much much worse than what Naniwa could ever do or any player has ever done in the history of Starcraft 2. You are falsely removing the prize of a tournament several months after the tournament has happened and trying to delete all evidence of it. This is worse than those tournaments who don't pay the prize money, as at least they acknowledge the fact that there is a prize. I really expected that your so called "honor" would be more than this. Removing one of the major prizes of a tournament, lying, deleting threads, in secret altering your own statements, I think all GomTV has built up was just thrown down the drain and I honestly wish that no player would ever have anything more to do with you. I don't see how you dare talk about "honor" or professionalism. It really is pretty ugly. Further proof: On December 15 2011 08:09 illsick wrote:and something that is strange is also this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=293877Nani: "Even if I win Blizzard Cup nothing will change. I think prestige is important but in my opinion Code S is the most prestigious tournament in the world. So I want to continue challenge myself in Code S." What was the interviewer thinking after a response like that? No one in the GOM studio cared to correct him by saying that he wasn't in code S yet but that he was in the running for a spot with other foreigners? I think that GOM was lying, they had opportunities to claim otherwise about the code S spot in question when all different types of media announced that nani had earned it, including one of the two parties involved with the exchange program (MLG). I think it was easier for them to say people had the wrong impression that naniwa got a code S spot (I mean how could someone have the right impression when all sorts of media stated otherwise?) than to say he was kicked out of code S.
The thing is, I think kicking him out of Code S would have been perfectly acceptable. In my opinion, what Naniwa did was worse than what Rain did and Rain got a worse punishment. If I was running things over at GOM, I would have banned him for one season, at least.
Throwing a match is just not acceptable behavior, not for any reason.
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On December 15 2011 08:40 SC2NeCro wrote:I honestly hope people who support GOM reconsider their stance after reading this: Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:23 m0ck wrote:On December 15 2011 08:19 Paladia wrote:On December 15 2011 06:33 GOMTV wrote:It seems like a lot of people have been under the impression that NaNiWa has received a Code S seed for taking 2nd place at MLG Providence. The truth however is that NaNiWa has received the right to compete in the Blizzard Cup for his 2nd place achievement at MLG Providence. Gom, why are you making this up? 1. Why were the two seeds called "INTERNATIONAL SEED" and the other one "MLG PROVIDENCE CODE S SEED" on your official website (which you in stealth changed today)? 2. Why did your own twitter comment say that you revoked his Code S seed (which you also, deleted today)? 3. Why was it announced on your official partners website that Naniwa has .. earned a seat in Code S? 4. And why does it still say on your official website when you announced the partner program still (not had time to change that one yet, had you?) say that: At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status.What you are doing right now is much much worse than what Naniwa could ever do or any player has ever done in the history of Starcraft 2. You are falsely removing the prize of a tournament several months after the tournament has happened and trying to delete all evidence of it. This is worse than those tournaments who don't pay the prize money, as at least they acknowledge the fact that there is a prize. I really expected that your so called "honor" would be more than this. Removing one of the major prizes of a tournament, lying, deleting threads, in secret altering your own statements, I think all GomTV has built up was just thrown down the drain and I honestly wish that no player would ever have anything more to do with you. I don't see how you dare talk about "honor" or professionalism. It really is pretty ugly. Further proof: On December 15 2011 08:09 illsick wrote:and something that is strange is also this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=293877Nani: "Even if I win Blizzard Cup nothing will change. I think prestige is important but in my opinion Code S is the most prestigious tournament in the world. So I want to continue challenge myself in Code S." What was the interviewer thinking after a response like that? No one in the GOM studio cared to correct him by saying that he wasn't in code S yet but that he was in the running for a spot with other foreigners? I think that GOM was lying, they had opportunities to claim otherwise about the code S spot in question when all different types of media announced that nani had earned it, including one of the two parties involved with the exchange program (MLG). I think it was easier for them to say people had the wrong impression that naniwa got a code S spot (I mean how could someone have the right impression when all sorts of media stated otherwise?) than to say he was kicked out of code S.
Thank you for this...I am pretty shocked that they would go back on a promise THAT EVERYONE knew about. and now they are making stealth changes to their original statement months back. lmao.
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On December 15 2011 09:00 Golgotha wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:40 SC2NeCro wrote:I honestly hope people who support GOM reconsider their stance after reading this: On December 15 2011 08:23 m0ck wrote:On December 15 2011 08:19 Paladia wrote:On December 15 2011 06:33 GOMTV wrote:It seems like a lot of people have been under the impression that NaNiWa has received a Code S seed for taking 2nd place at MLG Providence. The truth however is that NaNiWa has received the right to compete in the Blizzard Cup for his 2nd place achievement at MLG Providence. Gom, why are you making this up? 1. Why were the two seeds called "INTERNATIONAL SEED" and the other one "MLG PROVIDENCE CODE S SEED" on your official website (which you in stealth changed today)? 2. Why did your own twitter comment say that you revoked his Code S seed (which you also, deleted today)? 3. Why was it announced on your official partners website that Naniwa has .. earned a seat in Code S? 4. And why does it still say on your official website when you announced the partner program still (not had time to change that one yet, had you?) say that: At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status.What you are doing right now is much much worse than what Naniwa could ever do or any player has ever done in the history of Starcraft 2. You are falsely removing the prize of a tournament several months after the tournament has happened and trying to delete all evidence of it. This is worse than those tournaments who don't pay the prize money, as at least they acknowledge the fact that there is a prize. I really expected that your so called "honor" would be more than this. Removing one of the major prizes of a tournament, lying, deleting threads, in secret altering your own statements, I think all GomTV has built up was just thrown down the drain and I honestly wish that no player would ever have anything more to do with you. I don't see how you dare talk about "honor" or professionalism. It really is pretty ugly. Further proof: On December 15 2011 08:09 illsick wrote:and something that is strange is also this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=293877Nani: "Even if I win Blizzard Cup nothing will change. I think prestige is important but in my opinion Code S is the most prestigious tournament in the world. So I want to continue challenge myself in Code S." What was the interviewer thinking after a response like that? No one in the GOM studio cared to correct him by saying that he wasn't in code S yet but that he was in the running for a spot with other foreigners? I think that GOM was lying, they had opportunities to claim otherwise about the code S spot in question when all different types of media announced that nani had earned it, including one of the two parties involved with the exchange program (MLG). I think it was easier for them to say people had the wrong impression that naniwa got a code S spot (I mean how could someone have the right impression when all sorts of media stated otherwise?) than to say he was kicked out of code S. Thank you for this...I am pretty shocked that they would go back on a promise THAT EVERYONE knew about. and now they are making stealth changes to their original statement months back. lmao.
Yeah they are hurting themself more with this shit tbh..
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My thoughts:
1: Naniwa is just a dick.
2: GOM is right
3: I would love to hear John the Translator's opinion.
4: Fuck yeah SEN!
5: Next NesTea vs Naniwa match is gonna be Awesome.
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On December 15 2011 08:24 Kazeyonoma wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2011 08:19 Paladia wrote:On December 15 2011 06:33 GOMTV wrote:It seems like a lot of people have been under the impression that NaNiWa has received a Code S seed for taking 2nd place at MLG Providence. The truth however is that NaNiWa has received the right to compete in the Blizzard Cup for his 2nd place achievement at MLG Providence. Gom, why are you making this up? 1. Why were the two seeds called "INTERNATIONAL SEED" and the other one "MLG PROVIDENCE CODE S SEED" on your official website (which you in stealth changed today)? 2. Why did your own twitter comment say that you revoked his Code S seed (which you also, deleted today)? 3. Why was it announced on your official partners website that Naniwa has .. earned a seat in Code S? 4. And why does it still say on your official website when you announced the partner program still (not had time to change that one yet, had you?) say that: At every 2011 Pro Circuit Live Competition after MLG Columbus, GSL placement will occur as follows:
Code S status will be awarded to the highest placing player, regardless of country of origin, who doesn't already have Code S status.What you are doing right now is much much worse than what Naniwa could ever do or any player has ever done in the history of Starcraft 2. You are falsely removing the prize of a tournament several months after the tournament has happened and trying to delete all evidence of it. This is worse than those tournaments who don't pay the prize money, as at least they acknowledge the fact that there is a prize. I really expected that your so called "honor" would be more than this. Removing one of the major prizes of a tournament, lying, deleting threads, in secret altering your own statements, I think all GomTV has built up was just thrown down the drain and I honestly wish that no player would ever have anything more to do with you. I don't see how you dare talk about "honor" or professionalism. What? This is the only announcement gom ever made official: ![[image loading]](http://img.gomtv.net/img/n_net/gsl_format.jpg) in terms of their format, this has always been how it looked, there never was a "PROVIDENCE SEED" put on there. Stop spreading propoganda about GOM ninja'ing their own stuff, they never needed to make a change to this file. I have it on my desktop to try to create a better format of it to explain it when they first announced this back in october or whatever. They haven't changed shit. I don't recall their twitter stating they "banned" him either, it was a mistranslation... jeezus christ.
This is a reply to that post. I do not know which one is correct. As I said before, I do not really care, either, as banning would be fine by me. Though, I think that discussion is supposed to stay in that thread, as per the little thingy at the top of this thread.
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"It is true that NaNiWa has not taken actions that break any explicit rules, like for example using a cheat to gain an unfair advantage. NaNiWa has however purposefully not tried his best and shown this in a disrespectful manner"
Massive backtrack from GOM's original statement, "Using abuse behaviour" was I believe their original justification, does this mean they will remove that and find another rule to take action under once it becomes too much of a PR problem again?
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Thanks for clearing things up.
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Naniwa's comments on Live on Three seem to show he actually does agree with the " pr comment " on the Quantic apology post.
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On December 15 2011 09:30 Dodgin wrote:
Naniwa's comments on Live on Three seem to show he actually does agree with the " pr comment " on the Quantic apology post.
Yeah and he says he is confused with MLG and GOM because MLG said he got code S after providence but GOM never told him that he did. So some huge miscommunication between the two.
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Korea (South)17174 Posts
why u tryin to be idra bro?
there can only be one
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It's funny some people think this is too much when basically a "fine" could be covered by just placing in code S. He earned that code S spot? So did Coca (not even in the GSL and in a tournament with no code A spot on the line). You do stupid shit, you get punished, it's how life works. A warning is too good for naniwa at this point. I can't believe people have forgotten all the shit he's gotten away with with "warnings".
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Sigh -_- Naniwa should have just payed a fine like Jinro stated
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On December 15 2011 06:51 Paladia wrote:Interestingly enough GOM are now making things up to save face, making me lose all respect for them. Naniwa earned a spot in Code S yet now they claim he didn't? Even the official MLG website says he earned a code S spot. http://www.majorleaguegaming.com/news/naniwas-ascension/"Naniwa [..] earned a seat in Code S." In my opinion, GOM are getting quite desperate to save face here. First they tried to play the "he broke a rule card", but as people realized he didn't break any rules. So now they are trying the "Well, he didn't break any rules, but he wasn't even invited to begin with, so it is no penalty.", card. Obviously, this doesn't work very well when it has already been announced that he has earned a spot.
No, what you're saying is absolutely wrong. GOM has no reason to justify itself to you, as you can't/did not bother to read in the first place and any further statements would be wasted on an illiterate person/ignored the same way their prior statements have.
Check out the writting, Gom-MLG exchange lasted til December. 2nd place seed was for Blizzard Cup. I'm surprised that GOM gave a second place seed for 2nd place at Providence anyways, I would've thought a 1st place IPL (idra)/1st place NASL (puma) would bring in more viewers. No 2nd place WCG/Dreamhack winner were invited, I guess MLG just got preferential treatment, being GOM's primary partner.
I was happy to see him even at Blizzard Cup, I was then absolutely disappointed by his throw. You do realize that we, the fans, asked for the "meaningless matches" because we never got to see who was better during AoL2? Leenock and Sage were elim'd with 1-2, and fans wanted them to have a chance at 2-2 to show a good record and display their skill comparative to their group.
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EPT
