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On September 23 2011 00:06 Magulina wrote:
I don't really care about the change but is it really possible to call it APM anymore? It's not truly recording actions per minutes now, it's more like "actions per minutes with a modification". (APMWAM)?!
How about ATMPM? Actions-that-matter-per-minute. Clicking the mouse, spamming 1-5 at 450 APM is not challenging. I can do that. What IS hard, are actions that make a difference. Your never going to react/come up with things to do that your fingers couldnt handle once your drilled where the keys for those actions are.
Now we know who truly has a high APM. And Id imagine people that were earlier deemed "slow" or low APM players dont look so bad anymore since the inflated APM figures of spammers go down.
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to me tapping IS meaningful actions, because I'm cycling between my units/production/scouter/whatever else and checking on things. I'm not hitting my hotkeys cause I want to, or I feel like it makes me cool, I tap through hot keys cause I don't want to miss anything.
I still spam at the start of the game cause I want to keep as steady and high an APM I can, pretty much the exact same way Iplayed BW.
Also, the biggest beef I have with this change is this......The only reason APM even mattered in the first place was to be amazed by how fucking fast Koreans can move dem fingers, and now I can't be amazed by that number anymore. Makes me sad T.T
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Affected my overall apm just because my early game apm have gone to an all-time low of 20 lol. My macro apm stays around the same at around 80 since i use camera hotkeys for injects anyway. Majority of my apm is micro component which hits up to 250. Not that i really care about apm, but it actually inflates my ego abit when since i often beat players that have more than double my apm. It gives me an indication that i'm playing the smart way through game understanding etc, and i'm pretty confident of my micro since my mouse accuracy comes from my fps background while the ability to make split-second micro decisions come from years of dota.
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I think in a few months we will see how this new APM has done for better or for worst i dont know.
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France12750 Posts
On September 22 2011 23:39 Erandorr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 23:32 iblink wrote:
The thing that annoys me the most is that blizzard is trying to force RTS competition down to a more noob casual friendly scale despite what community thinks or wants. APM still doesnt mean jackshit, but the only reason they implemented this change was to make bronze-platinum players feel better about themselves while shitting on professional play and its spectator value. cant they just stick to balance changes and leave APM and sound alerts the way it were? not everything requires 'fixing', you know. Wait , you guys are seriously giving a shit about this change?
Of course we give a shit.
That means Blizzard wants the game to be as casual-friendly as possible.
Sure it brings more money, but meh -;-
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I rather they have an EAPM along with an APM tab. Removing the spamming completely feels kinda weird.
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Almost related topic.
I think the APM change is causing major lag when using Razer products. I suspect the APM detector in them is now off sync with the new APM. I'm getting crazy robo noises everytime I make an action.
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It wouldn't hurt if Blizz actually created 2 APM categories.
1 - Raw APM which measures every action regardless of what it is.
2 - Effective APM which, much like this change tries to do, tries to remove redundant actions from the counter to see what sort of actual pace players are working at.
On September 22 2011 16:41 Leyra wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 16:16 synkronized wrote:
Why would people think this change is bad? Your performance shouldn't be gleaned by a value that can easily be juked by spam clicking a spot a shit ton or incessantly tapping keys in the first 5 minutes of a game. That goes both ways. If "APM" matters so little to people who look at it and say LOL, UR APM MEENS NOTHING, then why bother changing it? And this change isn't even close to creating and eAPM stat, because this change doesnt actually measure effective APM, because a lot of the actions it is filtering, are in fact effective actions; production cycling, for example.
You must be projecting pretty hard since I never said "APM doesn't matter." I asked why is the change bad. And from what I've seen it's mainly the APM spammers lamenting over the popping of one of their epeen inflation techniques.
In any case it becomes tiresome when APM spammers claim more skill because they inflate their APM during the first 5 minutes. That and regardless of who you are, you do make redundant actions like frantic spam clicking in the middle of a scrum, actions that would benefit from filtration to see what your real APM is to get an idea of how many meaningful actions you make on average.
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at least sc2gears will have the correct apm.
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On September 23 2011 04:08 synkronized wrote:
It wouldn't hurt if Blizz actually created 2 APM categories.
1 - Raw APM which measures every action regardless of what it is.
2 - Effective APM which, much like this change tries to do, tries to remove redundant actions from the counter to see what sort of actual pace players are working at.
in my opinion this is by far the best option
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On September 23 2011 04:08 synkronized wrote:
It wouldn't hurt if Blizz actually created 2 APM categories.
1 - Raw APM which measures every action regardless of what it is.
2 - Effective APM which, much like this change tries to do, tries to remove redundant actions from the counter to see what sort of actual pace players are working at.
You forgot that they created "Blizzard" or SC2 APM which is 1.33333 or so times faster than "real time". so essentially there is like total 4 APM categories (sc2APM, sc2EAPM, APM, EAPM)
EDIT: removed random talk, readded part of it, zzz
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Seeing the APM numbers does nothing to improve you as a player. No one watching the game cares about it. For you retards out there, I am not saying APM doesnt matter. It obviously matters to some extent. But seeing it on a replay or from a casted game means absolutely nothing. Anyone that is outraged about this change needs to uninstall the game and figure out their purpose in life.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On September 23 2011 04:24 ishyishy wrote:
Seeing the APM numbers does nothing to improve you as a player. No one watching the game cares about it. For you retards out there, I am not saying APM doesnt matter. It obviously matters to some extent. But seeing it on a replay or from a casted game means absolutely nothing. Anyone that is outraged about this change needs to uninstall the game and figure out their purpose in life.
Nice post man. It is really awesome...
I always liked seeing my apm because the more I play and practice the more apm I see. I guess apm does not matter as you say, but to see that I am actually improving and playing faster is an awesome stat for me to see. It keeps me motivated to see the effect of practice.
I think it should have been left the way it was... Why change it what was the reasoning? Its really hard for me to tell if im playing faster or not because every game now my apm is the same...
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Before, APM told you how fast you were playing, irrespective of how good or bad you were. Now, APM literally tells you NOTHING. I now have the same APM as DDE but I have 10 times worse macro, micro, multitask. I can't even use this statistic, it's a complete joke. Perhaps someone's spam was helping them be better at the game?! Even though people thought apm was useless, on average, the person with higher apm was still winning and no one in the world can convince me that if DRG didn't press 345345345345345345345345345 every single second of the game, he would have injects as good as he does.
I am going to laugh when people say stuff like 'lol Vibe only has 150 apm he just spammmmms he actually sucks i have same apm lol.' Then I'm going to ask, 'why is his macro soooo much better then. You must suckkkkkk even harder if have useless apm in the useless apm meter.'
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I don't think APM necessarily translates to skill but I would like to know how fast I am playing. Is that so hard to understand?
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ye it just was a fun thing to look at in replays thats all :o
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Now that I've actually played 1.4 I think this change is pretty dumb. Checking your hotkeys does matter for checking build progress or larva injects. Sure it's possible to spam with those, but it's possible to spam almost any command... that doesn't mean that every use of it is spam. Sc2gears is the only place I'll bother checking APM from now on.
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I'd laugh if Sjow's apm dropped to like 30 haha. I don't see the problem though.. but maybe they should leave an option for normal APM to be able to be shown.
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I didn't realize the players spamming 8 move commands on a single spot was effective APM.
+ Show Spoiler +Yes I'm being facetious. You know the types of players, the ones that take a scouting worker and click on a xel'naga tower 5 times even though the 1st action was all that was necessary.
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On September 23 2011 05:25 garlicface wrote:I didn't realize the players spamming 8 move commands on a single spot was effective APM. + Show Spoiler +Yes I'm being facetious. You know the types of players, the ones that take a scouting worker and click on a xel'naga tower 5 times even though the 1st action was all that was necessary.
yep, they didn't really think this through when the worst type of spam still counts...
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EPT
