EPTanyway cheering for spain because if england win we won't hear the fucking end of it
2023 - 2024 Football Thread - Page 7
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GTR
51650 Posts
anyway cheering for spain because if england win we won't hear the fucking end of it | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
On August 16 2023 04:00 Pandemona wrote: Simon Jordan talks about it on talksport a lot, today he spoke with an accountant who used to work for City and showed the loopholes that we are "using" It’s basically due to the extra money you can save through the covid allowances, that we don't have to put the 50 million payments through books as well and also u get allowance for academy stuff. Long story short, the accounts up until right now show a negative £10 million balance, that is it, including the Caciedo transfer fee. This is yesterdays video, i can't find todays. Don't forget we have the highest amount of player sales in since they took over. They can dance around FFP perfectly legally this way, but ultimately they’re still spending a LOT of dosh, and giving players atypically long contracts. If any form of shit hits the fan, how’s that look like? You’re probably not seeing any kind of COVID-style atypical event anytime soon, but what if the TV deals start plateauing, or even reversing? Or the general football commercial market? It seems a strategy that is predicated on spreading cost and assuming that you’ll be able to count on increased revenues to finance it, while growing in the interim, so you come out ahead overall. Could be fine but IMO it’s not without pitfalls. People point to how mismanaged clubs like Barca, Juve were etc were but they’d have likely been alright too if it weren’t for COVID | ||
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
But yeah the way they doing it is banking on us finishing top 5 this year, then making it consistent again and finishing off this new stadium too. | ||
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zev318
Canada4306 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
On August 17 2023 02:40 zev318 wrote: greenwood seems to be on his way back to manu. gonna get a lot of hate once he starts playing Where you reading that? Last I heard it was very much still up in the air and everyone was being tight lipped? I fucking hope he’s not tbh, but hey it’s football, decorum and values largely departed years ago | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Its a flipping huge mess of a shit show of a case. Evidence showing he did it, but during this time, they have got back together, are engaged, have a kid on the way. https://www.manutd.com/en/news/detail/club-statement-on-mason-greenwood-16-august-2023 That is yanited response to all the media reports right now about the decision has been made. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8912 Posts
united may have a commercial concern but i dont think they have any legal leg to stand on if they want to cut him loose. my only complaint is the ridiculous amount of time it has taken for the club to do anything about the situation. straight up incompetence | ||
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zev318
Canada4306 Posts
On August 17 2023 03:18 evilfatsh1t wrote: i think hell be back and i dont actually have a problem if he does. what footballers do in their personal lives is a matter for them. if the law didnt take the matter into their hands then i dont see why the public should have any say about his ongoing employment. united may have a commercial concern but i dont think they have any legal leg to stand on if they want to cut him loose. my only complaint is the ridiculous amount of time it has taken for the club to do anything about the situation. straight up incompetence i think its a common thing to put some sort of clause like if u go to jail, we have the right to terminate your contract etc. not sure about things like conduct detrimental to the club, probably differs from club to club. but i think in american sports, its pretty common. the teams will cut u so fast anytime for being charged (unless you're a good player, then they might wait a bit), they dont even care about the actual judicial process or the whole "innocent until proven guilty" thing. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
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sharkie
Austria18707 Posts
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Oukka
Finland1683 Posts
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KobraKay
Portugal4359 Posts
Ruben Dias was really missed in that D for city. De Bruyne as well obviously. But let's wait and see if Foden picks his game up. | ||
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DropBear
Australia4415 Posts
On August 17 2023 02:04 Pandemona wrote: This is why the Americans are doing it, they see the club valuation up to £10 billion in the next 10 years i think, they are pumping in now, so can do multiple windows selling off kids and other players without needing much more. But yeah the way they doing it is banking on us finishing top 5 this year, then making it consistent again and finishing off this new stadium too. The thing is, they can value the club whatever they want. To actually get that 10 billion, there needs to be someone who will buy it for 10 billion and actually HAS that 10 billion. Just look at the United sale. Still hasn't happened. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8912 Posts
On August 17 2023 06:00 Pandemona wrote: Issue is, from our point of view as the public he looks so guilty it not even funny. The girl had multiple bruises, she records him multiple time doing stuff to her when she is telling him to stop. Then it gets released into the public, then Greenwood is arrested and put behind bars for a length of time while the investigation continues, this happens when the Police are very confident that you are guilty/danger to the public. That is never good, for him now to get back to playing is going to be mad. yeah i get that the evidence in the public domain didnt look good and the public can come to any conclusion they want. however the reason why a judicial system exists is to not allow the public to be judge, jury and executioner. as far as this case goes, the legal system had their chance and they decided not to pursue further. from a legal perspective and as a matter of principle, greenwood has not been found guilty of any breach of law and therefore should be treated as such. regardless of what the public thinks, the reality is that no one can definitively prove what greenwood did. the tapes could have been doctored for all we know; only those closest to the case would know the actual facts. its why even the prosecutors dropped the case, the audio and videos alone werent enough to prove him guilty and they required testimony, which his partner has refused to supply now. thats why i say if the law had their chance and nothing came of it, that should be the end of it. its a dangerous path to allow the public to dictate what happens with someones life. benjamin mendy didnt have the benefit of his club protecting him like greenwood had for united, and look where hes ended up. facing bankruptcy charges and having to sue city for backpay. i would be very shocked if united did cut greenwood loose. like i said, i dont think they have any legal standing because they wouldnt be able to claim greenwood damaged the clubs reputation if it cannot be proven that greenwood did those things. furthermore i dont think the glazers of all people really give a shit about public opinion anyway. their mere ownership devalues the club far more than any scandal a player could bring. | ||
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KobraKay
Portugal4359 Posts
On August 17 2023 14:34 evilfatsh1t wrote: yeah i get that the evidence in the public domain didnt look good and the public can come to any conclusion they want. however the reason why a judicial system exists is to not allow the public to be judge, jury and executioner. as far as this case goes, the legal system had their chance and they decided not to pursue further. from a legal perspective and as a matter of principle, greenwood has not been found guilty of any breach of law and therefore should be treated as such. regardless of what the public thinks, the reality is that no one can definitively prove what greenwood did. the tapes could have been doctored for all we know; only those closest to the case would know the actual facts. its why even the prosecutors dropped the case, the audio and videos alone werent enough to prove him guilty and they required testimony, which his partner has refused to supply now. thats why i say if the law had their chance and nothing came of it, that should be the end of it. its a dangerous path to allow the public to dictate what happens with someones life. benjamin mendy didnt have the benefit of his club protecting him like greenwood had for united, and look where hes ended up. facing bankruptcy charges and having to sue city for backpay. i would be very shocked if united did cut greenwood loose. like i said, i dont think they have any legal standing because they wouldnt be able to claim greenwood damaged the clubs reputation if it cannot be proven that greenwood did those things. furthermore i dont think the glazers of all people really give a shit about public opinion anyway. their mere ownership devalues the club far more than any scandal a player could bring. Did they drop the case or the girl just withdrew the charges once they got back together? That is a significant difference. If it was indeed the prossecutors dropping the case for lack of or unsustainable evidence then I'm with you, but regardless, he will still be burned already with the general public. | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9950 Posts
On August 17 2023 16:49 KobraKay wrote: Did they drop the case or the girl just withdrew the charges once they got back together? That is a significant difference. If it was indeed the prossecutors dropping the case for lack of or unsustainable evidence then I'm with you, but regardless, he will still be burned already with the general public. Witnesses dropped out and refused to testify so they had to drop the case because there wasn't a realistic chance of conviction. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
On August 17 2023 14:34 evilfatsh1t wrote: yeah i get that the evidence in the public domain didnt look good and the public can come to any conclusion they want. however the reason why a judicial system exists is to not allow the public to be judge, jury and executioner. as far as this case goes, the legal system had their chance and they decided not to pursue further. from a legal perspective and as a matter of principle, greenwood has not been found guilty of any breach of law and therefore should be treated as such. regardless of what the public thinks, the reality is that no one can definitively prove what greenwood did. the tapes could have been doctored for all we know; only those closest to the case would know the actual facts. its why even the prosecutors dropped the case, the audio and videos alone werent enough to prove him guilty and they required testimony, which his partner has refused to supply now. thats why i say if the law had their chance and nothing came of it, that should be the end of it. its a dangerous path to allow the public to dictate what happens with someones life. benjamin mendy didnt have the benefit of his club protecting him like greenwood had for united, and look where hes ended up. facing bankruptcy charges and having to sue city for backpay. i would be very shocked if united did cut greenwood loose. like i said, i dont think they have any legal standing because they wouldnt be able to claim greenwood damaged the clubs reputation if it cannot be proven that greenwood did those things. furthermore i dont think the glazers of all people really give a shit about public opinion anyway. their mere ownership devalues the club far more than any scandal a player could bring. If the tapes were doctored in any way first thing Greenwood/United would have done would have been to hire some digital analyst to prove that they were. Greenwood also broke his bail conditions repeatedly, which for some reason isn’t a big deal It’s a bit perverse, Mendy stood trial, was exonerated, didn’t have pretty damning material in the public domain. Feel bad for the bloke. Finally it’s really not a legal matter, it was when it was and it’s relevant to whether United can sack him. It’s not when it comes to fielding him as a United player, with all that entails. Does an entity in the entertainment business, and their sponsors want to give that green light or not? A colleague of mine got sacked for racist social media posts. A couple more for getting involved in an incident in a bar while in uniform. Fellow grunts doing menial jobs that have little visibility, they didn’t have to break the law to be let go. And finally, bastardised by commercialisation though they are, football clubs are beloved social and community institutions. It’s why they inspire such sometimes fanatical levels of emotional investment. In that context things like this very much matter. Ultimately Greenwood probably did what he was accused of, he then broke legal court orders to contact the plaintiff and primary witness against him, and the case collapse. Probably under legal advisement for now but he’s never commented, owned up to anything or shown any contrition whatsoever. So yeah it fucking stinks to high heaven. How would any United fan who’ a victim of domestic abuse, or people who’ve helped someone else pick up the pieces feel every time he’s sauntering on to the green fields of the Theatre of Dreams? I’m a big believer in redemption and rehabilitation, if he took any of the steps on his end to begin that process, then I personally would be OK with an eventual return. Perhaps he could be a powerful advocate against abusive and coercive behaviour, especially to younger men. Do some community work, whatever, something. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18707 Posts
On August 17 2023 18:17 WombaT wrote: ... How would any United fan who’ a victim of domestic abuse, or people who’ve helped someone else pick up the pieces feel every time he’s sauntering on to the green fields of the Theatre of Dreams? ... I think thats the biggest point one needs to make about Greenwood. Victims will totally feel gut-punched about the whole situation. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
On August 17 2023 16:49 KobraKay wrote: Did they drop the case or the girl just withdrew the charges once they got back together? That is a significant difference. If it was indeed the prossecutors dropping the case for lack of or unsustainable evidence then I'm with you, but regardless, he will still be burned already with the general public. The Crown Prosecution Service I imagine have a very good gauge of what’s prosecutable, not just in terms of the law, but in terms of jury attitudes and how they are likely to react. The U.K. isn’t atypically bad in this regard, indeed it’s probably reasonably enlightened globally, but sexual offences still have a pretty low conviction rate. The various ‘she was asking for it’ defences re promiscuity, being drunk, how they were dressed still sway plenty a jury in plenty a case. I can only surmise that the second the plaintiff decided not to testify and resumed a relationship with the defendant the people in charge thought there’s not a snowball’s change in fucking hell that that won’t sway the jury, so what’s the point in proceeding? There would likely have been folks on that jury who had private opinions on her being a gold digger, given I see such an attitude being expressed seemingly every second comment on threads, it would seem statistically likely that that bias would come in too. Would be my guess. Something of an indictment on our still quite inadequate collective attitudes on such matters. People can’t seem to grasp that you can both be violated by someone, but yet still love and forgive them nonetheless. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27207 Posts
On August 17 2023 14:15 DropBear wrote: The thing is, they can value the club whatever they want. To actually get that 10 billion, there needs to be someone who will buy it for 10 billion and actually HAS that 10 billion. Just look at the United sale. Still hasn't happened. Football is too big now. And unprofitable at a club level. It’s honestly not that unlike a pyramid scheme. Due to wage/transfer inflation what revenue streams do increase tend to get sucked up. You can’t not spend this money or your team will drop off the top end of the game, and being there is how you get that extra TV/prize money and keep fans on board and buying your merchandise. You buy it, hoping to flip it for a big profit to the next person who either hopes that they can crack the code to make big yearly profits, or is intending to do to the next person what you’re doing to them. Aside from fan owner patronage and vanity projects, this is how football clubs have swapped hands for at least 20 years now amongst the people trying to make money off it. There’s basically nobody left to flip clubs to and make a big return. We’re at a billionaire/hedge fund/nation state level already. At least for the biggest clubs around. This game of pass the parcel has to have the music stop and the last layer expectantly torn off. It could well be Todd Boehly left as the man in possession and with a big problem. | ||
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