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Wait so Rebs what do you believe managers do that makes their team successful?
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On April 25 2013 22:38 city42 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 17:19 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 06:06 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 05:57 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 05:45 city42 wrote:On April 24 2013 23:16 Pandemona wrote:
Personally i think they got found out pretty quickly tactically, and i think it will show tonight tactically vs Mr Mourinho. Found out indeed. Can you please stop posting nonsense about Bundesliga clubs now? p.s. Mourinho's tactics were amazing as usual. Forcing Özil out wide and pushing Modric up...fantastic. Any teams can do it for one season  If Germans can do what English teams did in the mid 00s then fair enough, until then they are not AWESOME! WORLD BEATERS just yet. They are good no doubt, but Dortmund might get dismantled by the big spenders next season xD Leaves one team to fly the flag? Nothing you just said is relevant to your original argument at all. In what way have Dortmund's tactics been found out? In what way did Mourinho exploit this? I thought you were just trolling. Tactics have been found out if you listened to Mourinho's comments after the game you would realize his players didn't turn up defensively. He said, we know EVERYTHING about Lewandowski, we know he runs to the far post when the cross comes in from the right foot on the left side, but we failed to defend it. We knew it was coming and didn't defend it. He then went onto to say more stuff about Lewandowski. But the reason Madrid lost was their back 4 was shocking >.< and Dortmund had a field day vs it. The game last night was won on them having to play Pepe and Varane together instead of Varane and Ramos with Essien RB. IF Dortmund do something similar in the Bernabeau then i will say Mourinho hasn't "found them out", but as im sure Real as like Barca will be 110% better than the away legs, we cannot do anything but wait for the next 90minutes. But no questions German fans can't celebrate their domestic success at the moment! I don't care about what Mourinho said. Mourinho also says that FIFA award voting is effectively rigged. You can say anything without proof. What I'm asking is for you to give analysis on how Mourinho adjusted to Dortmund tactically yesterday. What I saw was Götze rendering Xabi ineffective yet again, Modric and Özil being played out of position, and a bizarre decision to start Higuain, who never does anything against good teams. Also, Arbeloa is their usual starting RB. Not sure why you are bringing up Essien. edit: And just to respond to the Mourinho line, how many Lewandowski goals involved him running to the far post when a cross came in from the left side? If they defended the first goal properly and the game ended 3-1, would it be considered a tactical masterclass by Jose? They were completely impotent offensively and only scored because Dortmund's concentration was lost after the penalty claim.
I think he plays Modric at CAM and pushes Ozil out to the wing because he trusts Modric to track back and help defend more. It's no secret that Ozil and Ronaldo can be a bit lazy when defending at times. He played Ozil on the wing against Bayern in last year's CL, and he's played Modric at CAM with Ozil on the wing against United in the CL and in the Clasico. Ozil can play just fine on the wing, the problem, as someone stated, was that he never got the ball.
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On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage.
Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q
If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((.
But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already?
*off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form.
*on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't.
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On April 25 2013 23:37 sc4k wrote:
Wait so Rebs what do you believe managers do that makes their team successful?
Well for starters the best managers gain the absolute trust of their players and have the respect of everybody at the football club
so even a dimwit like Harry Redknapp can get a team to play well.
You play that football manager game thing right what do you do. Pick teams and make transfers right ?
ofcourse its not that simple, theres tons of variables just within the things I just mentioned. But tactics for the most part is not the most painstaking thing a manager has to worry about.
On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:
But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already?
uhh what ? that just leads more to my arguement that tactics < execution.
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On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. Dude ive been watching it since before you were probably born. I said "later" Torres. Ergo torres was not a part of the CL run. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Are you talking about those games in liverpools CL run because they didnt play Madrid that year, mustve been a great game though. I was just as happy as anyone else when they came back against "MILAN" but if anyone is putting that down to any tactical adjustment give me a freaking break. Go watch the game again. They squeaked past Juve, Leverkusen was lets be fair not really the team they were 3 years prior, theyd been picked up apart and lost players to retirement. I think they played Chelsea after not sure, all I really remember is that the games were super shit but thoroughly entertaining. Every pivotal moment in that run required something special, and that special had little to do with Benitez. It was all Gerrard Also Mourinho doesnt always "counter attacks." theres plenty of games where his teams setup offensively, you probably just havent seen any. Just because youve seen a few classicos doesnt make him a defensive coach who counter attacks. Yes against teams he deems better than his and who can hurt them he tends to lean toward cato style and I dislike that immensely but he doesnt do that all the time. anything else ?
I know I shouldn't, but I'll bite.
It was Gerrards fantastic goal that kept the dream alive, but if your gonna let that taint the tactical brilliance displayed in the later stages I can see why you don't believe in that very principle. The "squeaking" past Juventus was all about an immaculate defensive performance in Turin, and no the players of Liverpool were not as good as the ones Juventus had at that time, but the Italians got out fought and out thought. The Leverkusen games were fantastic games where all of Leverkusens defensive holes were exploited to the very maximum, and where Igor Biscan at times made Bernd Schneider look like some tired pub player.
The Chelsea games were two smart men trying to outsmart each other, I can agree that effort more than tactics won this one.
Regarding the final against Milan I might actually go watch it again, what a game! While effort certainly was important in this game, aswell as a fantastic Gerrard, there is simply do doubt at all that the tactical changes at half time turned the game around, if only for some 20 minutes that was enough time for Liverpool to capitalise on their control. When Hamann came on Milan lost their grip on the midfield, because now with Garcia dropping abit there was suddenly a four vs four battle in the middle, not the two v four from the first half. This again created loads of space for Riise and Smicer, and they were pretty pivotal in a few goals, no? If you can't appreciate the tactical stroke of genius which changed this game long enough for Liverpool to score three goals I just don't know what to say.
The Real Madrid game I refered to was obviously the one in 2009, I just kinda thought that was obvious, Im sorry about that. All the players were brilliant in this game, and Liverpool really exploited the spaces Real left between the midfield and their defense, and the incredible pockets of space left behind their wing backs.
Regarding Mourinho his teams always play very direct, I guess thats a better way of saying it than counter attack. They do always rely on a solid defence though, but I do admit that most of my Mourinho games are either in the premier league or in champions league.
tldr: There are brilliant tacticians, and they play an extremely important role in football.
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On April 26 2013 00:05 kyllinghest wrote:
tldr: There are brilliant tacticians, and they play an extremely important role in football.
Sure there are, but tactics are not some magic sauce. Adjustments need to be made in every game.
Ditti Hamman coming on wasnt a stroke of genius, he had to do it, it was a snap response. Anyone could see they were getting over run.
Theres been many more chess matches and much better ones not involving Benitez (lol), and brilliant tacticians tend to remain brilliant,
If anything he was better at Valencia when he was still being.. o whats that thing people like to say "figured out."
how do you explain some of the stuff Benitez has done recently or near his end at Mersey? Hes a pocket strat man.
His teams are organized (usually) and hes pretty good at drilling discipline but off the cuff adjustments are not hard for even a spectactor to notice.
And there is no mystery to them. That was all I was trying to say.
Consistently good managers tactically would be your Van Gaal, Hitzfelds and sadly Mourinho. WIth the exception of Hitzfeld I thorougly dislike the other 2 on a more personal level.
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On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't.
Malaga are sixth in La Liga...
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On April 26 2013 00:08 Ferrose wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't. Malaga are sixth in La Liga...
Oh right, I was thinking of bilbao last year against man.u.
Whatever, same thing, 6th la liga team vs the 2nd beast team in europe.
Judging by that rm should mope the floor with the germans.
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On April 26 2013 00:10 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:08 Ferrose wrote:On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't. Malaga are sixth in La Liga... Oh right, I was thinking of bilbao last year against man.u. Whatever, same thing, 6th la liga team vs the 2nd beast team in europe. Judging by that rm should mope the floor with the germans.
Well Real has been struggling against some of the relegation candidates in La Liga this year
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On April 26 2013 00:03 Ferrose wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 22:38 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 17:19 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 06:06 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 05:57 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 05:45 city42 wrote:On April 24 2013 23:16 Pandemona wrote:
Personally i think they got found out pretty quickly tactically, and i think it will show tonight tactically vs Mr Mourinho. Found out indeed. Can you please stop posting nonsense about Bundesliga clubs now? p.s. Mourinho's tactics were amazing as usual. Forcing Özil out wide and pushing Modric up...fantastic. Any teams can do it for one season If Germans can do what English teams did in the mid 00s then fair enough, until then they are not AWESOME! WORLD BEATERS just yet. They are good no doubt, but Dortmund might get dismantled by the big spenders next season xD Leaves one team to fly the flag? Nothing you just said is relevant to your original argument at all. In what way have Dortmund's tactics been found out? In what way did Mourinho exploit this? I thought you were just trolling. Tactics have been found out if you listened to Mourinho's comments after the game you would realize his players didn't turn up defensively. He said, we know EVERYTHING about Lewandowski, we know he runs to the far post when the cross comes in from the right foot on the left side, but we failed to defend it. We knew it was coming and didn't defend it. He then went onto to say more stuff about Lewandowski. But the reason Madrid lost was their back 4 was shocking >.< and Dortmund had a field day vs it. The game last night was won on them having to play Pepe and Varane together instead of Varane and Ramos with Essien RB. IF Dortmund do something similar in the Bernabeau then i will say Mourinho hasn't "found them out", but as im sure Real as like Barca will be 110% better than the away legs, we cannot do anything but wait for the next 90minutes. But no questions German fans can't celebrate their domestic success at the moment! I don't care about what Mourinho said. Mourinho also says that FIFA award voting is effectively rigged. You can say anything without proof. What I'm asking is for you to give analysis on how Mourinho adjusted to Dortmund tactically yesterday. What I saw was Götze rendering Xabi ineffective yet again, Modric and Özil being played out of position, and a bizarre decision to start Higuain, who never does anything against good teams. Also, Arbeloa is their usual starting RB. Not sure why you are bringing up Essien. edit: And just to respond to the Mourinho line, how many Lewandowski goals involved him running to the far post when a cross came in from the left side? If they defended the first goal properly and the game ended 3-1, would it be considered a tactical masterclass by Jose? They were completely impotent offensively and only scored because Dortmund's concentration was lost after the penalty claim. I think he plays Modric at CAM and pushes Ozil out to the wing because he trusts Modric to track back and help defend more. It's no secret that Ozil and Ronaldo can be a bit lazy when defending at times. He played Ozil on the wing against Bayern in last year's CL, and he's played Modric at CAM with Ozil on the wing against United in the CL and in the Clasico. Ozil can play just fine on the wing, the problem, as someone stated, was that he never got the ball.
Özil can play on the wing if you have a proper no.10 to replace him centrally. Modric is simply not capable of that role. With him out of position and Xabi stuck chasing Götze around the flanks, who was left to distribute the ball to Özil? I don't have an anti-Mourinho agenda but I think a finger has to be pointed at him for this.
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On April 26 2013 00:15 city42 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:03 Ferrose wrote:On April 25 2013 22:38 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 17:19 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 06:06 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 05:57 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 05:45 city42 wrote:On April 24 2013 23:16 Pandemona wrote:
Personally i think they got found out pretty quickly tactically, and i think it will show tonight tactically vs Mr Mourinho. Found out indeed. Can you please stop posting nonsense about Bundesliga clubs now? p.s. Mourinho's tactics were amazing as usual. Forcing Özil out wide and pushing Modric up...fantastic. Any teams can do it for one season If Germans can do what English teams did in the mid 00s then fair enough, until then they are not AWESOME! WORLD BEATERS just yet. They are good no doubt, but Dortmund might get dismantled by the big spenders next season xD Leaves one team to fly the flag? Nothing you just said is relevant to your original argument at all. In what way have Dortmund's tactics been found out? In what way did Mourinho exploit this? I thought you were just trolling. Tactics have been found out if you listened to Mourinho's comments after the game you would realize his players didn't turn up defensively. He said, we know EVERYTHING about Lewandowski, we know he runs to the far post when the cross comes in from the right foot on the left side, but we failed to defend it. We knew it was coming and didn't defend it. He then went onto to say more stuff about Lewandowski. But the reason Madrid lost was their back 4 was shocking >.< and Dortmund had a field day vs it. The game last night was won on them having to play Pepe and Varane together instead of Varane and Ramos with Essien RB. IF Dortmund do something similar in the Bernabeau then i will say Mourinho hasn't "found them out", but as im sure Real as like Barca will be 110% better than the away legs, we cannot do anything but wait for the next 90minutes. But no questions German fans can't celebrate their domestic success at the moment! I don't care about what Mourinho said. Mourinho also says that FIFA award voting is effectively rigged. You can say anything without proof. What I'm asking is for you to give analysis on how Mourinho adjusted to Dortmund tactically yesterday. What I saw was Götze rendering Xabi ineffective yet again, Modric and Özil being played out of position, and a bizarre decision to start Higuain, who never does anything against good teams. Also, Arbeloa is their usual starting RB. Not sure why you are bringing up Essien. edit: And just to respond to the Mourinho line, how many Lewandowski goals involved him running to the far post when a cross came in from the left side? If they defended the first goal properly and the game ended 3-1, would it be considered a tactical masterclass by Jose? They were completely impotent offensively and only scored because Dortmund's concentration was lost after the penalty claim. I think he plays Modric at CAM and pushes Ozil out to the wing because he trusts Modric to track back and help defend more. It's no secret that Ozil and Ronaldo can be a bit lazy when defending at times. He played Ozil on the wing against Bayern in last year's CL, and he's played Modric at CAM with Ozil on the wing against United in the CL and in the Clasico. Ozil can play just fine on the wing, the problem, as someone stated, was that he never got the ball. Özil can play on the wing if you have a proper no.10 to replace him centrally. Modric is simply not capable of that role. With him out of position and Xabi stuck chasing Götze around the flanks, who was left to distribute the ball to Özil? I don't have an anti-Mourinho agenda but I think a finger has to be pointed at him for this.
That's true. I was just trying to give my opinion as to why Mourinho played Modric and Ozil like that.
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On April 26 2013 00:15 city42 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:03 Ferrose wrote:On April 25 2013 22:38 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 17:19 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 06:06 city42 wrote:On April 25 2013 05:57 Pandemona wrote:On April 25 2013 05:45 city42 wrote:On April 24 2013 23:16 Pandemona wrote:
Personally i think they got found out pretty quickly tactically, and i think it will show tonight tactically vs Mr Mourinho. Found out indeed. Can you please stop posting nonsense about Bundesliga clubs now? p.s. Mourinho's tactics were amazing as usual. Forcing Özil out wide and pushing Modric up...fantastic. Any teams can do it for one season If Germans can do what English teams did in the mid 00s then fair enough, until then they are not AWESOME! WORLD BEATERS just yet. They are good no doubt, but Dortmund might get dismantled by the big spenders next season xD Leaves one team to fly the flag? Nothing you just said is relevant to your original argument at all. In what way have Dortmund's tactics been found out? In what way did Mourinho exploit this? I thought you were just trolling. Tactics have been found out if you listened to Mourinho's comments after the game you would realize his players didn't turn up defensively. He said, we know EVERYTHING about Lewandowski, we know he runs to the far post when the cross comes in from the right foot on the left side, but we failed to defend it. We knew it was coming and didn't defend it. He then went onto to say more stuff about Lewandowski. But the reason Madrid lost was their back 4 was shocking >.< and Dortmund had a field day vs it. The game last night was won on them having to play Pepe and Varane together instead of Varane and Ramos with Essien RB. IF Dortmund do something similar in the Bernabeau then i will say Mourinho hasn't "found them out", but as im sure Real as like Barca will be 110% better than the away legs, we cannot do anything but wait for the next 90minutes. But no questions German fans can't celebrate their domestic success at the moment! I don't care about what Mourinho said. Mourinho also says that FIFA award voting is effectively rigged. You can say anything without proof. What I'm asking is for you to give analysis on how Mourinho adjusted to Dortmund tactically yesterday. What I saw was Götze rendering Xabi ineffective yet again, Modric and Özil being played out of position, and a bizarre decision to start Higuain, who never does anything against good teams. Also, Arbeloa is their usual starting RB. Not sure why you are bringing up Essien. edit: And just to respond to the Mourinho line, how many Lewandowski goals involved him running to the far post when a cross came in from the left side? If they defended the first goal properly and the game ended 3-1, would it be considered a tactical masterclass by Jose? They were completely impotent offensively and only scored because Dortmund's concentration was lost after the penalty claim. I think he plays Modric at CAM and pushes Ozil out to the wing because he trusts Modric to track back and help defend more. It's no secret that Ozil and Ronaldo can be a bit lazy when defending at times. He played Ozil on the wing against Bayern in last year's CL, and he's played Modric at CAM with Ozil on the wing against United in the CL and in the Clasico. Ozil can play just fine on the wing, the problem, as someone stated, was that he never got the ball. Özil can play on the wing if you have a proper no.10 to replace him centrally. Modric is simply not capable of that role. With him out of position and Xabi stuck chasing Götze around the flanks, who was left to distribute the ball to Özil? I don't have an anti-Mourinho agenda but I think a finger has to be pointed at him for this.
For putting more faith in Modric than he deserved? I think thats not the worst mistake he couldve made, but yeah Ozil not playing the 10 is beyond me to especially with all the options he has outside aswell.
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On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:
*off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form.
man, you are one bad loser, cant even lose with dignity
Bayern werent even on 100% on Tuesday and still crushed Barca.
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On April 26 2013 00:20 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:
*off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form.
man, you are one bad loser, cant even lose with dignity Bayern werent even on 100% on Tuesday and still crushed Barca.
Atleast hes a good winner, I dont think you qualify as either.
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On April 25 2013 22:55 Savage88 wrote:@Lewy No he cannot leave! He can agree to whatever he wants, if Dortmund doesn't accept an offer he will stay. 
We've all known that he would leave us for a while now. It's not that shocking, and his announcement has respectable timing and tact.
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On April 26 2013 00:10 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:08 Ferrose wrote:On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't. Malaga are sixth in La Liga... Oh right, I was thinking of bilbao last year against man.u. Whatever, same thing, 6th la liga team vs the 2nd beast team in europe. Judging by that rm should mope the floor with the germans.
But, they didn't. In fact, neither team did. To claim that The Spaniards are still clearly better than the Germans when "on form" after getting completely demolished in two separate games is the height of arrogance.
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On April 26 2013 00:20 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:
*off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form.
man, you are one bad loser, cant even lose with dignity Bayern werent even on 100% on Tuesday and still crushed Barca.
Why do you say that dude, I'm not just being spiteful.
I honestly don't see in bayern the same quality barca displayed for some years or manu/chelsea before that or milan before that or real before that.
But they can be a really good team next year if guardiola buys the right players.
I guess all I'm trying to say is that bayern beat barca when they were already down, against rm, psg and milan barca had being bad or at best average.
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On April 26 2013 00:29 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:10 Steveling wrote:On April 26 2013 00:08 Ferrose wrote:On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't. Malaga are sixth in La Liga... Oh right, I was thinking of bilbao last year against man.u. Whatever, same thing, 6th la liga team vs the 2nd beast team in europe. Judging by that rm should mope the floor with the germans. But, they didn't. In fact, neither team did. To claim that The Spaniards are still clearly better than the Germans when "on form" after getting completely demolished in two separate games is the height of arrogance.
But to claim otherwise might be naivity. 2 days of football can't be used to announce the fall of the spanish or the start of german domination.
I have no idea why everything has to be so black - white in this thread. Bayern has a fantastic team and they're showing what they are capable of every year. Dortmund played a horrible cl-season last year, they do play a fantastic cl-season this year. What are they going to do next year? We have no idea. And until Germany can reliably get two teams into cl-quarters and one into euro league semis I wouldn't talk about any kind of rise of whichever words are thrown around.
And I would not forget the english teams (not too sure about Italy). Out of the elite: Bayern, Real, Barca, ManU, (maybe others like Chelsea, AC Milan) every team can beat the others on a given day and neither has to fear that the core of the team is bought by others. They reached a status where it is most likely harder to fail than to succeed but only one of them can be the champion every year. Of course none of these care for anything but the title but if they draw each other in the quarters a single bad day might be the end. That still doesn't mean they are thrown out of the Olymp.
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On April 26 2013 00:22 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2013 22:55 Savage88 wrote:@Lewy No he cannot leave! He can agree to whatever he wants, if Dortmund doesn't accept an offer he will stay. We've all known that he would leave us for a while now. It's not that shocking, and his announcement has respectable timing and tact.
and psg has enough money to convince dortmund to let him go
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On April 26 2013 01:08 smr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2013 00:29 Stratos_speAr wrote:On April 26 2013 00:10 Steveling wrote:On April 26 2013 00:08 Ferrose wrote:On April 26 2013 00:04 Steveling wrote:On April 25 2013 23:30 Rebs wrote:On April 25 2013 23:23 kyllinghest wrote:On April 25 2013 23:09 Rebs wrote:
Being able to get teams to play well when you have the right kind of players for your style is not being tactically astute, its tactically rigids,
Thats why for all my dislike for Mourinho he is by far the most versatile manager around. He can take any set of players and make them play any way he needs to. Fergie is similar but he also tends to have the luxury of getting players he wants.
Benitez is not particularly tactically impressive. His major successes have been riding the coat tails of an over performing Gerrard and later Torress.
Benitez' biggest success were no doubt his Champions League runs with Liverpool, the most impressive ones being without Torres. If you think that one man can carry a team and a manager like that I would like to add that I think you are completely wrong! Rafa Benitez is one of the most impressive tacticians out there, and my guess is that you have not seen Liverpool trash Leverkusen, who were a good side back then, you have probably not seen Liverpool walk over Inter, fight their way trough Juventus, stomp Real Madrid in whats the single greatest game of football I have ever seen from any team. You want to talk about the CL run ? What tactics involve Gerrards howitzer bailing them out against the Greeks ? They would never have even made it past the group stage. Why did you remind me of that? Q_Q If any of you don't remember liverpool qualified from group stage the year they got the cl with a 87min 25meters goal by gerrard against olympiakos. We had rivaldo in his last decent year then, (((. But your argument is bad rebs. For example this dortmund that trashed RM barely scrapped a win against malaga who's hovering around relegatio zone, or did everyone forget about that already? *off topic* Dortmund is no god team, same as bayern, they are not as good as barca on form. *on topic again* Chelsea last year probably didn't deserve to win against any side in the knockout phases, who cares, does that mean you can shit on their manager for winning cl the way they did? No it doesn't. Malaga are sixth in La Liga... Oh right, I was thinking of bilbao last year against man.u. Whatever, same thing, 6th la liga team vs the 2nd beast team in europe. Judging by that rm should mope the floor with the germans. But, they didn't. In fact, neither team did. To claim that The Spaniards are still clearly better than the Germans when "on form" after getting completely demolished in two separate games is the height of arrogance. But to claim otherwise might be naivity. 2 days of football can't be used to announce the fall of the spanish or the start of german domination. I have no idea why everything has to be so black - white in this thread. Bayern has a fantastic team and they're showing what they are capable of every year. Dortmund played a horrible cl-season last year, they do play a fantastic cl-season this year. What are they going to do next year? We have no idea. And until Germany can reliably get two teams into cl-quarters and one into euro league semis I wouldn't talk about any kind of rise of whichever words are thrown around. And I would not forget the english teams (not too sure about Italy). Out of the elite: Bayern, Real, Barca, ManU, (maybe others like Chelsea, AC Milan) every team can beat the others on a given day and neither has to fear that the core of the team is bought by others. They reached a status where it is most likely harder to fail than to succeed but only one of them can be the champion every year. Of course none of these care for anything but the title but if they draw each other in the quarters a single bad day might be the end. That still doesn't mean they are thrown out of the Olymp.
O look at that common sense.. I honestly feel like the amount of weight thats placed on a single knockout competition as a reflection of footballing prowess is painfully over rated.
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EPT
