EPTThe HotS Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 262
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. Do not just ask for build orders. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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sUgArMaNiAc
Australia110 Posts
On May 12 2014 18:25 SatedSC2 wrote: What's the proper build order for a proxy Oracle rush in both PvP and PvT, when using the second Pylon to proxy..? This is taken from: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/426907-15-hots-protoss-all-in-builds-by-believe-and-toxsik Not my work but answers your question Guide 2.2: PvT – Oracle All-In. The Build: -9 Pylon -13 Gateway (after putting this down send that probe near his base to proxy the oracle and plant your second pylon near his base. -15 double assimilator (mine with 3) when the cybernetics finishes make the stargate and a stalker to defend ur main from a potential reaper harass while the stargate is building add 3 more gateways. -when first oracle is out send it to his base, and build 2 more and chronoboost them, always aim for his units over the SCV's with your oracle harass because your followup will be a 4 gate so you want him to have as few units as possible. -after 2 warp ins and 3 oracles go attack him with your army! -TRANSITION : Add a twilight council and dark shrine and a forge, go for charge with dt harass and +1 armor, later on you want to get a third base and a ton of chargelot archon eventually into double robo collosus when your on full 3 base saturation, add cannons in ur bases for drops and a templar at the main and third to feed back incoming drops. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
Also, personally when i do the Tasteless Build i don't get a MsC. Early on you are starved for gas, and if you delay it you don't get enough energy for Time Warp in time. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
I feel as though you don't need the obses since you have phoenixes, both real and imaginary, to scout and spot incoming drops, although the downside is that you have to use cannon/surviving oracle for finding mines until you do ultimately get robo. Am I wrong? | ||
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playa
United States1284 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Aldo_EU
Russian Federation16 Posts
On May 12 2014 22:08 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: If you open Stargate in PvT, is it still a stylistic choice to transition into HT as opposed to Robo in the same way it is without a Stargate opener? I feel as though you don't need the obses since you have phoenixes, both real and imaginary, to scout and spot incoming drops, although the downside is that you have to use cannon/surviving oracle for finding mines until you do ultimately get robo. Am I wrong? HT openings became significantly harder to make work, thanks to the new mines. Zealots just die. You often have to have plenty of stalkers to deflect marine-mine drops/pushes, which makes blink preferable a bit later. And oracles, they force more marine heavy composition at the start, which colossi have less problem with (storm can be dodged even with marines, archon's splash as well). So I have little sympathy for stargate->HT now. | ||
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
In general, since the mine buff any templar style with little/no detection is extremely hard to execute. | ||
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playa
United States1284 Posts
On May 12 2014 22:30 SatedSC2 wrote: NonY has been using a Stargate opening into Chargelot/Templar in his PvT games recently. Phoenixes shut down drops pretty well, but are also really useful in engagements (by lifting a significant portion of the opponent's army and by preventing the opponent from retreating), pick off Medivacs as the Terran tries to cross the map, and can generally be a nuisance around the Terran's base. Unfortunately, he has deactivated VODs on his stream so I can't provide any links  Are you sure you wouldn't rather 2 base all-in? You'll have a lot more success than by going Carriers. In any case, if you want to go Carriers then I would suggest opening Chargelot/Archon/Void Ray and transitioning into Carriers later on instead of rushing towards them immediately. They need AoE and Feedback support from Templar if they're going to win against Hydras/Corruptors and Infestors/Vipers respectively, so using an opening that already includes Templar can't be a bad thing. I think that positioning is the main thing you need to be aware of when using Carriers: You need to be careful with your positioning so that the Zerg can't just run Hydralisks underneath them or Abduct them onto Spore Crawlers, but they can be a powerful unit if used correctly. I suppose if you wanted to rush for Carriers then you could use a Cannon-heavy defence given that you'll have a lot of spare minerals. Stardust did something like that in WoL on Ohana when the hybrid Proleague was still a thing (I guess he was still called M18M back then), so you could check that VOD out and try to adjust it for HotS..? I can't think of any recent pro games involving Carriers in PvZ Thanks. I don't have it in me to do all-ins. I couldn't stay on 2 bases if I planned on it. I'm not sure about archons, but I'll try getting HT faster. I'm surprised that no one is going carriers in p vs z. Staying on pure void rays, for your air units, for instance, seems far harder to make work, yet has been a thing for some. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
On May 13 2014 00:53 SatedSC2 wrote: Also, I've come up against people doing the bloody 2 Rax Reactor/Tech Lab opening again recently. The Terrans I've played have claimed that they have a very good win-rate with it. I guess it's because Protoss have gotten greedier and greedier and have probably crossed over some line that previously made 2 Rax stupid against Photon Overcharge. Every time I've come up against it so far I've been Dark Templar rushing, and so a Dark Templar at my base and a Dark Templar at their base has defended nicely, so I'm wondering how people have fared against it with 1GFE builds. That's assuming anyone else has actually seen it and I haven't just been flukily coming up against the handful of people who do it  I've seen that a lot lately too. I just have been doing the response from back in the day. Rush an immortal and use immortal/sentry/stalker to hold it off. 2-3 sentries minimum so you can split their army up or on certain maps fully forcefield the ramp off if need be. I lost to it a ton at first but now I basically never do anymore. Like literally, I just do a Wings of Liberty-style opening and can hold. On seeing a reactor I blind do this response because it works against this two barracks thing and it is good against that multipronged hellions at natural/mine drop in main build that is common. Do they try and specifically target the nexus down or try and damage it and then attack again and finish it off? That's is what the people I'm facing that do this seem to do. | ||
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Xinzoe
Korea (South)2373 Posts
mech turtle gas first (6:30 hellion medivac marine widowmine) preferably progamers + Show Spoiler + also no avilo please  | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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FreeZEternal
Korea (South)3396 Posts
On May 12 2014 12:47 SC2John wrote: Leave a zealot at the third when you recall then . You probably also need to start your followup tech (usually a robo) earlier too. Shoot us a replay to look at so we can pinpoint exactly what the problem is.OK, left a zealot in third and took my gasses much faster while teching to robo (while killing third instead of warping too many zealots). My second push (tons of sentries and 2 immortals) killed the zerg. This is working quiet well right now and I am starting to get cursed/sweared at and BM by zergs LOL. | ||
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