EPTAlso I am really struggling against mass muta play. any advice of how to set up defenses once he reaches like 20+ sometimes it is even more once he trades out some lower units. It just always seems like he is right there blowing down my expansion with ease, I can never seem to get his muta count right and end up overcompensating or not sending enough. One game I built 3x3 turrets on my forth and he still had enough muta to destroy it, also I had both upgrades for turret. Couldn't this be a sign my macro isn't up to snuff yet? since he shouldn't be able to get that many mutas to begin with? I am really struggling vs this.
The HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 276
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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Ottoman042
United States35 Posts
Also I am really struggling against mass muta play. any advice of how to set up defenses once he reaches like 20+ sometimes it is even more once he trades out some lower units. It just always seems like he is right there blowing down my expansion with ease, I can never seem to get his muta count right and end up overcompensating or not sending enough. One game I built 3x3 turrets on my forth and he still had enough muta to destroy it, also I had both upgrades for turret. Couldn't this be a sign my macro isn't up to snuff yet? since he shouldn't be able to get that many mutas to begin with? I am really struggling vs this. | ||
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LlamaSc2
Scotland12 Posts
On May 09 2014 07:35 Ottoman042 wrote: I am looking for opinions about Terran vs Terran. I've been doing a technique rush build out of 1-1-1. This consist of about 6-8 marines 1 tank and a medevac. then I add a reactor to rax and also the starport, to make Vikings to support the tanks and for faster reinforcements. Move out as soon as first tank is done. Usually I just move tanks into position to take out some supply(at choke main or natural) leapfrog up the ramp with the medevac, then push to their mineral or production line. I am just wondering since platinum may be easier to actually win with this, it has been getting rather close the last few games. Is this build something I should stick with or maybe rethink rework somehow? Also I am really struggling against mass muta play. any advice of how to set up defenses once he reaches like 20+ sometimes it is even more once he trades out some lower units. It just always seems like he is right there blowing down my expansion with ease, I can never seem to get his muta count right and end up overcompensating or not sending enough. One game I built 3x3 turrets on my forth and he still had enough muta to destroy it, also I had both upgrades for turret. Couldn't this be a sign my macro isn't up to snuff yet? since he shouldn't be able to get that many mutas to begin with? I am really struggling vs this. Open banshee first then do your build. Get the range and armour upgrades for your turrets if your being defensive, if your being aggressive its kind of a big risk for the zerg to be harassing you. | ||
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Tzela
Canada48 Posts
On May 09 2014 02:15 Danglars wrote: What's the current preferred way to deal with 10/10 in-base proxy gates on 2player maps? I'm thinking of KSS where I recently learned 4 scvs don't kill before a chrono zealot pops. Is attacking with 5 scvs the answer, attacking the gates generally, or pylon if he foolishly loses the probe? Is it a bunker in mineral line with some combination of SCV+Reaper or SCV+Marine? I'm primarily interested in masters terrans answering because I've defended against diamond protoss just due to their mistakes in micro. The masters protoss that beat me forced micro'd the zealots to avoid losses, stop mining, and diminish marine micro. this is old but still kinda should work out i usually just ignore the whole gateway pylon thing, it costs to many minerals to pull 10 scvs, he should just cancel the gateways before they are done and drop a nexus instead. go for a bunker on one side of the mineral line with a depot wall on the other while pumping 2 rax marines. if you build your first depot at the ramp like i do then remember to build extra depots walling in your mineral line because your going to lose that one. once you have enough marines its easy to just kite all the zelots dead. dont go for reapers vs this they take too long to build. | ||
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Ottoman042
United States35 Posts
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Tzela
Canada48 Posts
On May 09 2014 10:35 Ottoman042 wrote: In the OP it says banshee openings are less effective, why would I delay my strategy for something that is not actually recommended in the OP even though still frequently used? The OP however says nothing about a tank technique rush with medevac be it defending or execution. the banshee opening is one of the OPs recommended tvt builds, your fast tank push is not. how will you stop the banshee from killing your tanks and marines as they are moving across the map? even without cloak, you can kite marines until stim | ||
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Jazzman88
Canada2228 Posts
On May 09 2014 10:35 Ottoman042 wrote: In the OP it says banshee openings are less effective, why would I delay my strategy for something that is not actually recommended in the OP even though still frequently used? The OP however says nothing about a tank technique rush with medevac be it defending or execution. To add to what the above poster said in reply to you, nearly all TvT openings that feature Tank play with some sort of pressure incorporate Banshee play, because you can pick off opposing Tanks and Marines. If you don't go Tank/Banshee, you HAVE to get Vikings, otherwise the Banshees of your opponent will kill your Tanks or their Vikings will prevent you from having the ability to drop and/or control space with your air units. The most typical way to handle and execute Tank pressures in the matchup right now is gas-first Cloak Banshee, then getting a Reactor on the Barracks and a Tech Lab on the Factory, and pumping out lots of Marine/Tank while preserving your Banshee count. If you intend to be pressuring, you can pick off whatever with the Banshees (SCVs, Depots, Marines, etc.), whereas if you want to go straight up all-in with it, you concentrate on whittling down his Marine count and laying shots on any Tanks you find unprotected so that yours will dominate the field. | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On May 09 2014 10:35 Ottoman042 wrote: In the OP it says banshee openings are less effective, why would I delay my strategy for something that is not actually recommended in the OP even though still frequently used? The OP however says nothing about a tank technique rush with medevac be it defending or execution. The OP has been written at the beginning of HotS, many things are completely outdated. What's written in "Q. What are the standard recommended strategies per match-up?" is more up to date. | ||
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herMan
Japan2056 Posts
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
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Mafab
Germany458 Posts
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PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
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geokilla
Canada8246 Posts
I really hate this game. I don't understand why I still play it. Bio vs Mech is absolutely silly. I expand and mine more than my opponent to try and reach Sky Terran. But wait, Mech is OP now because mech shares the same upgrades! I admit in this game I just played, I forgot about my Armory so I couldn't get past 1/1 upgrades for a while, and my drops failed because I didn't look at them again after I had my drops set, causing me to lose Medivacs full of units to his Turret rings. But then at the same time if a bio Terran can't drop, and a bio Terran can't attack head on, and a bio Terran outmining a mech Terran can't use his advantage aside from mobility (negated by mech in this game), then how do I attack and win? He took on my 200/200 army with a simple 1A. To make matters worse, Blizzard adjusted the league distribution so me being in top Platinum right now is actually more like Gold from before. This means that my skill level has dropped while everyone keeps on increasing. Been playing since WOL and if this is the best I can do, then that's pretty sad imo. | ||
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Sajaki
Canada1135 Posts
On May 10 2014 14:16 geokilla wrote: http://www.ggtracker.com/matches/5011796 I really hate this game. I don't understand why I still play it. Bio vs Mech is absolutely silly. I expand and mine more than my opponent to try and reach Sky Terran. But wait, Mech is OP now because mech shares the same upgrades! I admit in this game I just played, I forgot about my Armory so I couldn't get past 1/1 upgrades for a while, and my drops failed because I didn't look at them again after I had my drops set, causing me to lose Medivacs full of units to his Turret rings. But then at the same time if a bio Terran can't drop, and a bio Terran can't attack head on, and a bio Terran outmining a mech Terran can't use his advantage aside from mobility (negated by mech in this game), then how do I attack and win? He took on my 200/200 army with a simple 1A. To make matters worse, Blizzard adjusted the league distribution so me being in top Platinum right now is actually more like Gold from before. This means that my skill level has dropped while everyone keeps on increasing. Been playing since WOL and if this is the best I can do, then that's pretty sad imo. You had a pretty big advantage supply-wise but lost it in two drops that did absolutely nothing. But i have to ask, why are you even dropping in the first place? Yes, drops are good in general, and yes, drops are very good vs mech. BUT, the meching player is only on two base, AND the meching player invested A LOT (700 minerals!) into countering that play. Skip to 16:20. Notice the army sizes? Imagine if you had those 4 medivacs and all 32 supply worth of bio! There is no way that terran could have taken his third. What you should have done is just siege up in front of his natural with your first two tanks, and set a forward rally. You don't need to actually be attacking anything, just contain him. There is no way he could have broken out with what he had if you hadn't suicided 30 supply for 0 gain. Eventually, if your contain is successful, he will have to either inefficiently trade into you and break the contain, or 2) starve to death because you will control 2+ more mining bases than he can. Only after he establishes his third/fourth/etc and tries to siege the map should u consider going crazy with aggro drop play. Until then containment is very efficient. | ||
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aZealot
New Zealand5447 Posts
I've been going Banshee first into CC and then Marine/Tank. Some of the Terrans are play against eventually transition into BCs which, so far, has caught me by surprise every time. Is there a good timing at which I should be anticipating this switch? When should I begin building BCs - if I should be building them at all? I usually switch out of Banshees into Medivacs. If so, do I just make Vikings as well and forget about making BCs? Also, I like your tag Sajaki.  | ||
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PanzerElite
540 Posts
On May 10 2014 18:04 aZealot wrote: I find TvT quite hard to figure out. (It can be so hard to end a game for one thing.) I've been going Banshee first into CC and then Marine/Tank. Some of the Terrans are play against eventually transition into BCs which, so far, has caught me by surprise every time. Is there a good timing at which I should be anticipating this switch? When should I begin building BCs - if I should be building them at all? I usually switch out of Banshees into Medivacs. If so, do I just make Vikings as well and forget about making BCs? Also, I like your tag Sajaki. raven ball + vikings and some mines bc's are trash. | ||
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On May 10 2014 18:04 aZealot wrote: I find TvT quite hard to figure out. (It can be so hard to end a game for one thing.) I've been going Banshee first into CC and then Marine/Tank. Some of the Terrans are play against eventually transition into BCs which, so far, has caught me by surprise every time. Is there a good timing at which I should be anticipating this switch? When should I begin building BCs - if I should be building them at all? I usually switch out of Banshees into Medivacs. If so, do I just make Vikings as well and forget about making BCs? Also, I like your tag Sajaki. I don't think it's really an exact timing, but sustained 3-4 base economy without much trading means they can tech into BC's very easily | ||
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gillon
Sweden1578 Posts
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Chaggi
Korea (South)1936 Posts
On May 10 2014 23:14 gillon wrote: So, with the new map pool, I don't really know how to win in TvZ. With literally every standard build I do I feel like the odds are stacked against me. The only time I win is when the zerg basically wins it for (bad execution/mechanics/just fucking sucks). Aligulac says TvZ is at ~44% right now, so I don't seem to be alone in this problem, but what are people doing nowadays? I'm at 55~58% this season and I do a lot of heavy aggression. In the newer maps, I abuse the fact that it's so big by going super greedy, like 2 engineering bays before adding on 2 rax, and a 9 minute 3rd CC. From there it's just mines/hellbats and lots of drops. I'm not the best player, but I've found success at a high diamond / low master level on KR. TvP's the thing that's been holding me back forever now, no matter what the map pool is | ||
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Gamlet
Ukraine336 Posts
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Sajaki
Canada1135 Posts
On May 10 2014 18:04 aZealot wrote: I find TvT quite hard to figure out. (It can be so hard to end a game for one thing.) I've been going Banshee first into CC and then Marine/Tank. Some of the Terrans are play against eventually transition into BCs which, so far, has caught me by surprise every time. Is there a good timing at which I should be anticipating this switch? When should I begin building BCs - if I should be building them at all? I usually switch out of Banshees into Medivacs. If so, do I just make Vikings as well and forget about making BCs? Also, I like your tag Sajaki. First off, thank you :D Secondly, BCs are vastly more useful against mechanic (and against really tank-heavy biomech) then they are against marine tank. If you are marine-tank vs marine-tank you don't really need to transition at all, you can just stay on that tech if you can apply enough pressure to prevent your opponent from safely creating the infrastructure/upgrades needed for the extremely expensive switch. In my 1600+ terran games i don't think i've ever built BCs vs marine-tank unless they did a complete late-game transition out of bio entirely for skymech. Against mech its different. Battlecruisers wreck tank lines (all factory untis, actually) so its often a way for a bionic player to break a mech player. As bio against mech you will want to be the first to get BCs. If he gets an air advantage + BCs + tank blob you are pretty screwed in any straight-up engagement so ensure that that doesn't happen. If you are playing reactive to an opponent who techhed BCS you CAN respond with BCs yourself, but I personally prefer just viking-raven. Until BCs get a critical mass and can just pop your entire army with yamato, i found viking/raven is just a better Air vs Air comp. As for when to transition, pretty much when you are maxed + have 8 barracks + 2-3 factories (bio/biomech) or 8 factories (mechanic). I usually throw down 3 additional starports (2 reactor 2 techlab) but can vary depending on the game. EDIT: removed a confusing, misworded bit. | ||
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