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On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue.
The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it.
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Northern Ireland27478 Posts
On November 22 2024 06:41 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue. The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it.
What are you seeing? What do you personally want to see?
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United States44448 Posts
On November 22 2024 06:41 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue. The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it.
Who is patting these people on the back for not considering him?
And if you think this is the first time employment discrimination has been on record then you've not been paying attention.
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babes wake up, vivek and elon husk are making an entertainment podcast about DOGE and "cost cutting" sections of our government bsky.app
surely the most cringe thing youll see at least till tomorrow's Newsmax host WH pick
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On November 22 2024 07:44 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2024 06:41 BlackJack wrote:On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue. The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it. What are you seeing? What do you personally want to see?
I like this question and am curious to see it answered, though I doubt the answers would be as concrete as we'd want.
Also I keep having to stop myself from kneejerk reporting Husyelt's post above because it just looks like a bot post at a glance lmao
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On November 23 2024 07:33 Fleetfeet wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2024 07:44 WombaT wrote:On November 22 2024 06:41 BlackJack wrote:On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue. The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it. What are you seeing? What do you personally want to see? I like this question and am curious to see it answered, though I doubt the answers would be as concrete as we'd want. Also I keep having to stop myself from kneejerk reporting Husyelt's post above because it just looks like a bot post at a glance lmao
I don't really know how to answer that. What do I want to see? Less of the type of stuff I posted about? Fortunately that's what's happening. San Francisco's mayor - Voted out. Oakland's mayor - Recalled. Soft-on-crime criminal justice reform DAs? San Francisco - Recalled. Oakland - Recalled. Los Angeles - Voted out. Defund the police went down in flames and now everyone will pretend they never supported it in the first place. California governor Gavin Newsom is out on the streets clearing homeless encampments himself and has threatened to withhold state funds to cities that doesn't comply in cleaning up their streets. California passed a new proposition targeting shoplifting by increasing penalties. Oregon passed a new law to roll back its drug decriminalization. Those "racist" standardized tests like the SATs are back in town. Companies are rolling back their DEI divisions at neck break speed.
Of course in all of these scenarios it's not conservatives/Republicans making these rollbacks by winning elections in deep blue states. That's why it's super funny to me when people blame Kamala's loss on the fact that she was a moderate for like 3 months. Progressives are getting stomped everywhere regardless if they had a campaign rally with Liz Cheney. The theory presented is that progressives were too unenthused by Kamala to show up to the polls but evidently they didn't show up for all the other elections they lost in California. Trump gained with blacks, latinos, and the working class. Dems didn't lose because the white college educated progressives lost interest. Keep pandering to them instead of learning the lesson and it's just going to hand Republicans the next election as well.
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Saying Democrats are not Republican enough is not going to convince anyone.
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On November 24 2024 01:11 Magic Powers wrote:
Saying Democrats are not Republican enough is not going to convince anyone.
Clearly you're not familiar with Democrats.
Democrats single biggest achievement in our lifetimes has been to pass a healthcare plan that's to THE RIGHT of what Nixon proposed.
Few people today would dare call President Richard Nixon a radical liberal. But 44 years ago, he proposed a health plan that went far beyond what today’s Affordable Care Act includes.
Looking at this comparison of the plans, Freed says, it’s easy to see that Nixon’s proposals were far more “liberal” than what passed under the Affordable Care Act during President Obama’s first term.
ihpi.umich.edu
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On November 24 2024 03:14 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2024 01:11 Magic Powers wrote:
Saying Democrats are not Republican enough is not going to convince anyone. Clearly you're not familiar with Democrats. Democrats single biggest achievement in our lifetimes has been to pass a healthcare plan that's to THE RIGHT of what Nixon proposed. Show nested quote +Few people today would dare call President Richard Nixon a radical liberal. But 44 years ago, he proposed a health plan that went far beyond what today’s Affordable Care Act includes.
Looking at this comparison of the plans, Freed says, it’s easy to see that Nixon’s proposals were far more “liberal” than what passed under the Affordable Care Act during President Obama’s first term. ihpi.umich.edu
Yeah I agree with you. I'm saying Democrats are already right-wing enough. Moving further to the right makes no sense.
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Northern Ireland27478 Posts
On November 23 2024 18:57 BlackJack wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2024 07:33 Fleetfeet wrote:On November 22 2024 07:44 WombaT wrote:On November 22 2024 06:41 BlackJack wrote:On November 21 2024 23:25 KwarK wrote:
It amuses me that Blackjack's most outrageous and unjust story, one that he's told many times before as an example of just how fucked up SF is, is literally just a man applying for a job and not being properly considered due to his race. Something that is literally the default for a sizable chunk of the country.
He shares it as if it's some uniquely awful occurrence when in reality it's just normal. The only abnormal thing is that it happened to someone who looks the way that he does.
It's fucked up, but it's not unusual. That's why race is still an issue. The only abnormal thing is that it’s happening on the record in a public meeting. I’m not saying zero POC have faced discrimination in a hiring process. But I’m definitely saying nobody is trying to normalize it or even celebrate it to the point where it would be done in the open and then the people doing it will pat themselves on the back for it. What are you seeing? What do you personally want to see? I like this question and am curious to see it answered, though I doubt the answers would be as concrete as we'd want. Also I keep having to stop myself from kneejerk reporting Husyelt's post above because it just looks like a bot post at a glance lmao I don't really know how to answer that. What do I want to see? Less of the type of stuff I posted about? Fortunately that's what's happening. San Francisco's mayor - Voted out. Oakland's mayor - Recalled. Soft-on-crime criminal justice reform DAs? San Francisco - Recalled. Oakland - Recalled. Los Angeles - Voted out. Defund the police went down in flames and now everyone will pretend they never supported it in the first place. California governor Gavin Newsom is out on the streets clearing homeless encampments himself and has threatened to withhold state funds to cities that doesn't comply in cleaning up their streets. California passed a new proposition targeting shoplifting by increasing penalties. Oregon passed a new law to roll back its drug decriminalization. Those "racist" standardized tests like the SATs are back in town. Companies are rolling back their DEI divisions at neck break speed. Of course in all of these scenarios it's not conservatives/Republicans making these rollbacks by winning elections in deep blue states. That's why it's super funny to me when people blame Kamala's loss on the fact that she was a moderate for like 3 months. Progressives are getting stomped everywhere regardless if they had a campaign rally with Liz Cheney. The theory presented is that progressives were too unenthused by Kamala to show up to the polls but evidently they didn't show up for all the other elections they lost in California. Trump gained with blacks, latinos, and the working class. Dems didn't lose because the white college educated progressives lost interest. Keep pandering to them instead of learning the lesson and it's just going to hand Republicans the next election as well.
I was talking more specifically inequity in things like discriminatory hiring practices.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to conclude that some cures may be worse than the disease so to speak. Assuming one believes that the disease is actually present.
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On November 24 2024 04:49 Magic Powers wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2024 03:14 GreenHorizons wrote:On November 24 2024 01:11 Magic Powers wrote:
Saying Democrats are not Republican enough is not going to convince anyone. Clearly you're not familiar with Democrats. Democrats single biggest achievement in our lifetimes has been to pass a healthcare plan that's to THE RIGHT of what Nixon proposed. Few people today would dare call President Richard Nixon a radical liberal. But 44 years ago, he proposed a health plan that went far beyond what today’s Affordable Care Act includes.
Looking at this comparison of the plans, Freed says, it’s easy to see that Nixon’s proposals were far more “liberal” than what passed under the Affordable Care Act during President Obama’s first term. ihpi.umich.edu Yeah I agree with you. I'm saying Democrats are already right-wing enough. Moving further to the right makes no sense.
The problem was you saying "Saying Democrats are not Republican enough is not going to convince anyone."
It convinces Democrats/their supporters and has for decades. Doesn't matter how obviously stupid, destructive, cruel, etc. it is.
Remember we're in the midst of libs/Dems already rationalizing their support for genocide, slavery, and arming Nazis. I'd say that's more than right wing enough, but they'll just keep ratcheting rightward with the support of their voters anyway.
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Norway28926 Posts
I'm not sure I've ever seen you say what you think the west should have done in response to Russia's 2022 invasion of Ukraine. Normally I don't have a hard time seeing a logically consistent world view from your postings but in this regard you've specified on multiple occasions that Putin's invasion is insert x bad superlative here yet you also seem opposed to the response to it. Saying 'they would've been better off maintaining 2013 trajectory than they are now' also isn't an answer to what the west was supposed to do in 2022.
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On November 24 2024 06:43 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I'm not sure I've ever seen you say what you think the west should have done in response to Russia's 2022 invasion of Ukraine. Normally I don't have a hard time seeing a logically consistent world view from your postings but in this regard you've specified on multiple occasions that Putin's invasion is <insert x bad superlative here> yet you also seem opposed to the response to it. Saying 'they would've been better off maintaining 2013 trajectory than they are now' also isn't an answer to what the west was supposed to do in 2022.
The last time he made the "arming Nazis" shitpost I gave him the obvious argument that any policy he supports that affects millions of people will invevitably benefit at least some Nazis, so finding a Twitter pic of a Ukrainian soldier with Nazi symbols is nowhere near good enough to reduce the plight of 40 million people to such a caricature. Beyond his engagement bait games, I have a hard time understanding why someone with such a severe lack of empathy would even want to be a socialist.
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On November 24 2024 06:43 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I'm not sure I've ever seen you say what you think the west should have done in response to Russia's 2022 invasion of Ukraine. Normally I don't have a hard time seeing a logically consistent world view from your postings but in this regard you've specified on multiple occasions that Putin's invasion is <insert x bad superlative here> yet you also seem opposed to the response to it. Saying 'they would've been better off maintaining 2013 trajectory than they are now' also isn't an answer to what the west was supposed to do in 2022.
This is more of the typical "dick in the bear trap" + Show Spoiler +This is a staple of US politics (climate change is one people are generally more familiar with) where after decades of shouting down the people (pretty much always socialists and whoever else they can get to come along) telling them not to stick their proverbial dicks in the bear trap, they turn — bloody member in hand — to ask what their bright idea is to fix the fact that their dick was severed by a bear trap.
Then once reattached, exclaim they have no good reason for them not to stick it in again. Then when they've ignored the warnings long enough and they've done it enough times that reattaching it isn't an option they look around and decide dicks are overrated and anyone that doesn't agree is the problem.
Presuming you're specifically talking about the "arming Nazis" part, you don't let Obama lift the ban on arming Nazis. Then when you miraculously get Trump to ban arming Nazis go ahead and have Biden lift the ban on arming Nazis again.
Setting that clear Democrat support of arming/training neo-Nazis aside... I think it ultimately has to be up to Ukrainians to determine what they do, but all the dicks are pretty well mangled at this point, so the options aren't pretty.
Without speculating too much about what could have been done to avoid Russia invading at all in 2022, under realpolitik lesser evilism, the reasonable response would be to maximise the pros/minimizing the cons in the negotiations and settle asap. Saving hundreds of thousands of casualties and hundreds of billions of dollars.
In turn those millions/billions of limbs, lives, and resources could have went toward improving the quality of lives of Westerners, Ukrainians, (and Russians for anyone that still recognizes their humanity) instead of being blown up for nothing "democracy". Which again, a democracy that is on hold indefinitely, and has actually gotten worse since before Maidan.
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On November 24 2024 07:37 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2024 06:43 Liquid`Drone wrote:
I'm not sure I've ever seen you say what you think the west should have done in response to Russia's 2022 invasion of Ukraine. Normally I don't have a hard time seeing a logically consistent world view from your postings but in this regard you've specified on multiple occasions that Putin's invasion is <insert x bad superlative here> yet you also seem opposed to the response to it. Saying 'they would've been better off maintaining 2013 trajectory than they are now' also isn't an answer to what the west was supposed to do in 2022. This is more of the typical "dick in the bear trap" + Show Spoiler +This is a staple of US politics (climate change is one people are generally more familiar with) where after decades of shouting down the people (pretty much always socialists and whoever else they can get to come along) telling them not to stick their proverbial dicks in the bear trap, they turn — bloody member in hand — to ask what their bright idea is to fix the fact that their dick was severed by a bear trap.
Then once reattached, exclaim they have no good reason for them not to stick it in again. Then when they've ignored the warnings long enough and they've done it enough times that reattaching it isn't an option they look around and decide dicks are overrated and anyone that doesn't agree is the problem. stuff I've mentioned before. Presuming you're specifically talking about the "arming Nazis" part, you don't let Obama lift the ban on arming Nazis. Then when you miraculously get Trump to ban arming Nazis go ahead and have Biden lift the ban on arming Nazis again. Setting that clear Democrat support of arming/training neo-Nazis aside... I think it ultimately has to be up to Ukrainians to determine what they do, but all the dicks are pretty well mangled at this point, so the options aren't pretty. Without speculating too much about what could have been done to avoid Russia invading at all in 2022, under realpolitik lesser evilism, the reasonable response would be to maximise the pros/minimizing the cons in the negotiations and settle asap. Saving hundreds of thousands of casualties and hundreds of billions of dollars. In turn those millions/billions of limbs, lives, and resources could have went toward improving the quality of lives of Westerners, Ukrainians, (and Russians for anyone that still recognizes their humanity) instead of being blown up for nothing "democracy". Which again, a democracy that is on hold indefinitely, and has actually gotten worse since before Maidan.
How the fuck can you be pro-palestine and anti-ukraine at the same time. Make it make sense.
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Norway28926 Posts
What do you imagine such a settlement that would be acceptable to Russia would look like? Cause to me it looks like a) having to cede at least as much territory as Russia currently holds b) having to install a government that is pro russia c) abandoning plans to ever try to get closer to western europe, which essentially accepts the notion that Ukraine is within Russia's sphere of influence and consequently it has no real claim to sovereignty because the world order that lets bigger nations bully smaller nations is just like, how it is and always will be.
Now, you might argue that this is preferable to the status of being actively in war. Sure. But it's hard for me to grasp this type of cynical attitude from an idealist revolutionary who otherwise consistently argues in favor of long term improvement even if it involves current hardship.
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The only peace plan Russia accepts is the one that lets them invade Ukraine again in a decade when they rebuilt their army.
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On November 24 2024 08:28 Gorsameth wrote:
The only peace plan Russia accepts is the one that lets them invade Ukraine again in a decade when they rebuilt their army.
And with a puppet regime in Ukraine that's going to surrender on day one.
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EPT
