EPTNigerian "Baby Factory" Raided. - Page 4
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WArped
United Kingdom4845 Posts
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Elroi
Sweden5617 Posts
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BlackFlag
499 Posts
Also, the "foreign aid" South-Sahara Africa got was one of the reasons the food market broke down and local farmers went out of business. Overfishing of their coasts was another nail for the coffin (one of the reasons for the rise of piracy in Somalia). Many of the African problems are "left-overs" from European colonialism. | ||
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xarthaz
1704 Posts
On June 02 2011 17:33 Zombie_Velociraptor wrote: Guys, you realize slavery pretty much still exists in modern day Africa, right? Majority of profits that are generated in Africa (natural resources mostly, esp. precious and radioactive materials, also oil of course), are controlled by international corporations and rest assured, they don't pay competitive salaries or provide health insurance for their workers. The constant skirmishes and wars are encouraged by the fact that weapons are often more readily available than food, and it's just a never-ending circle because despite all the humanitarian outcries, there's far too much money to be made in abusing the continent. You can't say it's all the Africans' fault and imperialism ended ages ago etc, because what's happening there today IS a result of what the Western world is doing. Even if a slave makes a single dime off his work, he too is a profiteer. This is the absurdity of the liberal anti-profit ideology. Even a slave is evil. | ||
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SkyTheUnknown
Germany2065 Posts
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xarthaz
1704 Posts
Africa WANTS slavery, africa WANTS poverty- when will you get it! Africa acts in a manner that rejects the premises of wealth accumulation - the establishment of property rights and liquid capital markets, hence it demonstrated its preference of poverty. Lets say youre on an island. And so too is another guy. And you choose to steal and plunder each others stuff constantly, instead of trading and peaceful relations. Now how can you blame the rest of the world what these two guys are doing? It is clearly their own preference to live in poverty, so let them have it i say. Eliminate all foreign aid, and let them handle their affairs like adults. If they want poverty and misery, let them have it. | ||
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Mangemongen
Sweden125 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:19 BlackFlag wrote: Imperialism still exists today, it's just not quite as "in-your-face" as in the 19th century. Look at Shell and Nigeria. Also, the "foreign aid" South-Sahara Africa got was one of the reasons the food market broke down and local farmers went out of business. Overfishing of their coasts was another nail for the coffin (one of the reasons for the rise of piracy in Somalia). Many of the African problems are "left-overs" from European colonialism. All their major problems are left-overs from colonialism, imperialism, capitalism, call it what you want. Thing is, they are still getting just as fucked as they were hundreds of years ago. The world is upside down and completely fucked up. | ||
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HellRoxYa
Sweden1614 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:24 SkyTheUnknown wrote: A lot of Africans haven't grasped the concept of helping each other, not neighbourhood-wise of course, but state- and community as a whole - wise. But this concept of being responsible for others is necessary to have a social system being close to a democracy. Among the elites and politicians in Africa there is no will to make their countries prosper. The enrichment of yourself and your family is the biggest purpose for these people. Even some ambivalent countries like China have a government, which is trying to make the country prosper, not so in Africa. Funny how it sounds like you know what you're talking about while at the same time being completely wrong. The problem is actually general widespread corruption. A lot, if not most, of the aid sent to Africa goes in to private pockets. A lot of projects never get of the ground or are never finished (things like building wells and schools). This in turn creates a mentality in society that is built upon distrust, which means that the protection and enrichment of or betterment of yourself and your own family is the most important or only priority. Now, people can't be expected to behave and pay taxes and support a system which doesn't work, and the system can't work unless the people behave and pay taxes. So nothing happens, and nothing will, as long as the west just keeps throwing money at the problem. It's a lot more deeply rooted than one might suspect. http://www.qog.pol.gu.se/research/research1.htm (main site: http://www.qog.pol.gu.se/) On June 02 2011 20:31 Mangemongen wrote: All their major problems are left-overs from colonialism, imperialism, capitalism, call it what you want. Thing is, they are still getting just as fucked as they were hundreds of years ago. The world is upside down and completely fucked up. Gigantic half-truth. Not to mention the fact that there is actually a lot of money and good will being thrown at the problem. | ||
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necroticah
South Africa233 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:31 Mangemongen wrote: All their major problems are left-overs from colonialism, imperialism, capitalism, call it what you want. Thing is, they are still getting just as fucked as they were hundreds of years ago. The world is upside down and completely fucked up. Honestly, I wish it were as easy as "look, we got fucked a few years ago, let's try to fix all that." Unfortunately, Africa is not capable of living a Western World Way. People in top spots of each country had the same education as other top people in other countries, do not, for one minute believe that the president of South Africa / Nigeria, even Sudan had no education. These are educated people, it's the mentality of "Hell, I suffered and passed, why can't they?" that's plagueing this continent. Also, too many people here have strong beliefs that their way is the right way, and they are sure as hell ready to fight for it. | ||
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shadymmj
1906 Posts
USA, Australia, South Africa, Cyprus, New Zealand, Canada...these countries arent doing badly, are they? Okay, how about colonies with other races who were being exploited, then? Hong Kong, Singapore, India, Malaysia...nope, still fine. It's just an African problem, period. Foreign exploitation may have a small part, but most of the independent countries have gotten exactly what they wanted - independence, and they've gone to shit. You have countries that have been nuked twice and a devastated post war economy with scarce natural resources, yet with foreign aid they were able become the worlds #2 economy just about 30 years later. And then a country which fought a bloody war and had their capital destroyed, and yet is now the world's leading esports hub. Countries that have been raped and plundered in the 19th century, and yet has now has the world's second largest GNP with much greater potential for growth. And then you have Africa. Western powers do not exploit Africa selectively. They have exploited Asia too. They'd exploit anything they can get, including space monkeys, if they could. That's just human nature. Chinese and Indian workers are still being exploited by the truckloads, but the country is on the whole progressing. Africa just isn't. Stop making it seem like Africa is the ugly product of the entire industralised world, because it isn't. | ||
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KaasZerg
Netherlands927 Posts
Loyalty is always along tribal and religiuos divides. So democracy doesn't work. It is always a tribe in control or a loose allaiance of tribes. If youre from the wrong tribe you are screwed. Protection of minorities is no priority for the leaders who are only looking out for themselves. I have heard stories of teachers who tried to set up schools. Officials go alang with it milking the funding comming in. When it commes to putting in some efforts or funding themselves they stalled. The teachers returned disillusioned after 3 years. Colonialism/neocolonialism is only a part of the problems. The ''african'' culture is sickening. Other excolonies like India and others developed. Africa did not. | ||
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svi
405 Posts
if they want to start living in the modern world, these africans need to radically change their culture, and to end nonsense like "voodoo", which should have been abolished 2000 years ago. | ||
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EndOfTime88
Austria259 Posts
On June 02 2011 19:13 KaiserJohan wrote: The world outside the West is truly a living hell. I can't even begin to imagine what else exists that we don't know about. Similar things happen in western countries daily as well. | ||
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ChApFoU
France2986 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:26 xarthaz wrote: Africa WANTS slavery, africa WANTS poverty- when will you get it! Africa acts in a manner that rejects the premises of wealth accumulation - the establishment of property rights and liquid capital markets, hence it demonstrated its preference of poverty. Lets say youre on an island. And so too is another guy. And you choose to steal and plunder each others stuff constantly, instead of trading and peaceful relations. Now how can you blame the rest of the world what these two guys are doing? It is clearly their own preference to live in poverty, so let them have it i say. Eliminate all foreign aid, and let them handle their affairs like adults. If they want poverty and misery, let them have it. O_o; You live in a fucking fairy-tale dude ! Things are just a LITTLE bit more complicated than 2 guys on an island. You know, history and stuff and political and economical relations with the rest of the world .... | ||
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killa_robot
Canada1884 Posts
On June 02 2011 16:23 Lexpar wrote: http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110601/wl_africa_afp/nigeriacrimechildtrafficking_20110601143218 Full Story: + Show Spoiler + LAGOS (AFP) – Nigerian police have raided a home allegedly being used to force teenage girls to have babies that were then offered for sale for trafficking or other purposes, authorities said on Wednesday. "We stormed the premises of the Cross Foundation in Aba three days ago following a report that pregnant girls aged between 15 and 17 are being made to make babies for the proprietor," said Bala Hassan, police commissioner for Abia state in the country's southeast. "We rescued 32 pregnant girls and arrested the proprietor who is undergoing interrogation over allegations that he normally sells the babies to people who may use them for rituals or other purposes." Some of the girls told police they had been offered to sell their babies for between 25,000 and 30,000 naira (192 dollars) depending on the sex of the baby. The babies would then be sold to buyers for anything from 300,000 naira to one million naira (1,920 and 6,400 dollars) each, according to a state agency fighting human trafficking in Nigeria, the National Agency for the Prohibition of Trafficking in Persons (NAPTIP). The girls were expected to be transferred to the regional NAPTIP offices in Enugu on Wednesday, the regional head Ijeoma Okoronkwo told AFP. Hassan said the owner of the "illegal baby factory" is likely to face child abuse and human trafficking charges. Buying or selling of babies is illegal in Nigeria and can carry a 14-year jail term. "We have so many cases going on in court right now," said Okoronkwo. In 2008, police raids revealed an alleged network of such clinics, dubbed baby "farms" or "factories" in the local press. Cases of child abuse and people trafficking are common in West Africa. Some children are bought from their families to for use as labour in plantations, mines, factories or as domestic help. Others are sold into prostitution while a few are either killed or tortured in black magic rituals. NAPTIP says it has also seen a trend of illegal adoption. "There is a problem of illict adoption and people not knowing the right way to adopt children," said Okoronkwo. Human trafficking is ranked the third most common crime after economic fraud and drug trafficking in the country, according to UNESCO. Put simply, this is one of the most disgusting things I've ever read. It ranks up there with South African men raping toddlers because of their belief that sex with a virgin could cure AIDS. I truly hope that somewhere in the future the backwards continent of Africa can receive real humanitarian aid and reparations for the hundreds of years of social and economic damage the rest of the world has caused it. It seems like many of the most terrible articles I read are fueled by the ever pressing poverty and hunger and disease that grips the African continent. I'm interested in TL's opinion as to whether or not the hundreds of western charities set up to benefit Africa can, have, or will make a real difference. Is a larger, international, government effort needed? Maybe it's wrong to bring this in this direction, but: does reading an article related to sexual slavery change anyones opinion of our use of the word "rape"? Yes it's off topic, but I find it impossible not to bring up given the heated debate thats taken place here recently. Personally, I find it hard to justify the use of the word in a casual sense when it is attached (regardless of context) to such awful acts. It seems incredibly naive to me that people would try to deny the connection. Heres a similar example: would we accept it if a caster or gamer said " that game was a holocaust!". Yes, that word has other definitions than the mechanical slaughter of jews- just like "rape" is synonymous with "pillaging"- but can you deny that theres an obvious and uncomfortable anti-semetic tone to it? I personally feel that our use of the word rape has a similar anti-feminine tone. I'm interested in what difference people see between the two. Please share your thoughts on the story, Africa in general, and language. I'd really like to see a civil discussion. I hate to sound like an ass, but Africa isn't the only place to be enslaved, the only real different is they are the only place to not recover. Then again they were pretty much forced into the "civilized" world as they were really far behind in terms of....well everything. Democracy won't work in a location in as bad shape as Africa. What they need is someone to come in, take charge, find some sort of stable income, stabilize the continent, and then leave and allow them to take control. As far rape... Yes I can deny all of that. I fail to see how rape has any anti-feminine tone, at all. You're aware that men can be raped too right? | ||
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Nightfall.589
Canada766 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:51 shadymmj wrote: Let's take a look at other colonies... USA, Australia, South Africa, Cyprus, New Zealand, Canada...these countries arent doing badly, are they? I'm not sure if their native populations would agree with you on that. What, between the genocides, residential schools, having their land taken from them, and centuries of discrimination... Ever been on a reserve? | ||
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Lucidx
United States122 Posts
I don't know what is needed to stop things like this in Africa; UN intervention? But it seems hopeless to me. My heart goes out to all the people who suffer from atrocities such as this. | ||
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TheGiz
Canada708 Posts
On June 02 2011 16:23 Lexpar wrote: + Show Spoiler + I truly hope that somewhere in the future the backwards continent of Africa can receive real humanitarian aid and reparations for the hundreds of years of social and economic damage the rest of the world has caused it. It seems like many of the most terrible articles I read are fueled by the ever pressing poverty and hunger and disease that grips the African continent. I'm interested in TL's opinion as to whether or not the hundreds of western charities set up to benefit Africa can, have, or will make a real difference. Is a larger, international, government effort needed? Maybe it's wrong to bring this in this direction, but: does reading an article related to sexual slavery change anyones opinion of our use of the word "rape"? Yes it's off topic, but I find it impossible not to bring up given the heated debate thats taken place here recently. Personally, I find it hard to justify the use of the word in a casual sense when it is attached (regardless of context) to such awful acts. It seems incredibly naive to me that people would try to deny the connection. Heres a similar example: would we accept it if a caster or gamer said " that game was a holocaust!". Yes, that word has other definitions than the mechanical slaughter of jews- just like "rape" is synonymous with "pillaging"- but can you deny that theres an obvious and uncomfortable anti-semetic tone to it? I personally feel that our use of the word rape has a similar anti-feminine tone. I'm interested in what difference people see between the two. I can and will use the word "rape" however which way I want. You write some of the final exams that I write and find a better word to describe them than "rape." George Carlin said in best in that a word is just a word and the only meaning it has is the meaning YOU attach to it. If you can't deal with the meaning of some words as you understand them, then it's your problem, not mine. The word "anti-semitic" also means anything pertaining to the Semite religions, which includes more than just Jews. This is one of the most misused terms in the English language. Now let's get to Africa. Africa was the first continent to ever be inhabited by humans. It has seen its share of empires, wars, and colonization by greater powers, but so has every other place in the world. Do not think that Africa is the way it is because of 'other' people though. Africa is the way it is because of everyone, especially Africans. There are many African countries that have been self-governed for a while now, and they cannot resolve their differences (religious, tribal, racial) and get along worth squat. From top to bottom Africa is full of war (Libya, Somalia, Congo, Sudan, Rwanda), murder (South Africa), mismanagement of resources (the whole continent), despicable inhuman acts (Nigeria, Rwanda, South Africa, everywhere), and corruption (Egypt, Libya, South Africa, Zimbabwe). For some reason Morocco seems to escape most of these problems. The charitable efforts of other countries is only trying to improve the situation. The only damage it may be doing is preventing people from learning to make it on their own, which is probably the biggest problem with Africa's development. NO ONE is willing to work for anything (with regional exceptions to the rule). So really the only way to save Africa is to allow for some hardcore policing by hopefully benevolent dictators or a powerful democratic house, and get some economy going. Without an economy Africa will constantly be the failure of the world. Basically, fascism will save Africa. | ||
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Marou
Germany1371 Posts
On June 02 2011 16:54 LaSt)ChAnCe wrote: we stole their resources and people? slavery in the US was a long time ago.. unless you are talking about something else? Slavery, followed by colonosation, followed by arming them so they kill each other and we can take all their minerals and gas. GG. | ||
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sandyph
Indonesia1640 Posts
On June 02 2011 20:51 shadymmj wrote: Let's take a look at other colonies... USA, Australia, South Africa, Cyprus, New Zealand, Canada...these countries arent doing badly, are they? yeah, google the stolen generation and let see whether you still think the same | ||
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