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On August 02 2011 02:45 Warpath wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
higher quality games? better control schemes? Computers can just do a hell of a lot more than a console can. You don't need Plugins to play a game.
Diablo III is hardly pushing top end graphics (not that it should) and consoles can use a keyborad and a mouse.
Please note that I prefer PC games to console games because I find the latter too restricted, with things like... You know, no mods.
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On August 02 2011 02:20 Filo wrote:Show nested quote +There reasoning for removing the skill points and traits is completely rediculous...
They say that people would get arcane missle and swap it out for arcane orb later because its better. This has nothing to do with a flaw in their system just balancing, one skill is supposed to be a slow aoe and the other is a fast single target hit. They could make it so both are equally usable but no they opted for the lazy way out and basically said "here everyone can take every skill, so we dont have to worry about people taking the first tier abilities".
This change completely murdered replayability, and now every character is a slate off of which people shoot every spell. You will never be able to think wow thats one good fire wizard or summon witchdoctor, all your are going to be able to say is that they were that class, and had some good gear. There isnt even a reason to level more then one of each class, then you can just keep whatever gear you want in your stash, and change to whatever you think is good in an instant. One of my favorite parts of diablo 2 was playing through as a whirlwind barb, and if I wanted to later I could play through as a frenzy barb. I could do that now with their current system, but it feels like a player has to force themselves to play with restrictions rather then play the game. Leveling wont even have much of a feel to it, its not like before where you get the next level and you see your choice for a new skill or to make another one powerful, every 6 levels you will just pick a new spell and your done with it. Past level 30 you don't even get anything new, you just keep getting a higher number while your skills get more powerful by no choice of your own.
Im particularly dissapointed about how this will affect the arena system. I liked the idea that every person could work out their own build and in the first round of the arena you would see what everyones abilities were. That way in the following rounds you would react to their playstyles according to your own. If they can hotswap the abilities its like playing that first round over and over again. (they probably wouldn't allow this but my frustration is making want to point out every flaw)
Also what ever happened to their idea of having an incredible amount of builds? Now for skills its just 6 out of 20, If someone else is a similar build to you, you just have the same build. You dont get the choice of saying I like this skill a little more powerful while this one is a little weaker, you just have those skills. While their rune system fixes some of this, they have "new" ideas were you randomly get runes not knowing what they do and just plug them in, hoping that it does something that you want. The runes should be treated like something in a skill tree, very percise and you know what they are going to do.
With this game being shallower than a puddle now I don't have the excitement for the game I did before. And I hope that blizzard falls back on some of these new ideas that they have and go back to their old plans before this barrage of dissapointing announcements.
/rant
Quote spoilered due to length.
I like this post, sums up a lot of the problem that i have heard about the system (havnt actually tried yet, just read/heard stuff).
The no-skill-point system kills any desire to replay any one class. I cant believe this escape the minds of the developer. How can they choose to wiggle their way out of (admittedly tedious and often difficult) balancing with some cheap tricks that crush any kind of replay value that might have existed?. Now i am not really sure how the Rune system works, but doesnt sound to me like it can compare to the skill points. I especially dont like the idea that every other noobs that have a few spare dollars can become Gosu.
Also the idea of real-money trade. Lets ignore for the moment that all those features clearly are aimed to milk even more money from players (who already bought the game). We all know that real-money trading has been considered a Taboo for most games so far (outside of some game where you buy from their Cash Shop, like Maple Story).. Im pretty sure many people have gotten their accounts banned for real-money trading, in WoW and Guild War.. You cant just say "hey there are other people doing it, so whats wrong with making it legal?".. Its like saying "Hey so many people are already smoking Heroine, Coke, etc, why not just legalise it? What happens to murder, rape, etc?".. Again either they are too stupid to see the problem that will almost definitely come with real-money trading, or they cant care less and only wants to make money for themselves. Whichever option it is, it doesnt speak very well of them.
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I will buy Diablo III, finish the storyline, and get back to SC2. I will not invest my time in a game that sells items with stats for real money.
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The Game is so dead before its even released. Buying Items/Chars and Gold for RealLife-Money is a joke. The more money you invest the better you will be, thats pathetic! I see alot of newbs buying chars/items and facerolling.
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What about PVP and hardcore players? Will HC players be able to pvp? Did they give any info about this?
I know HC players & PVP are not right from a RP/logic point of view but in the screenshots you have two separates Menus, "versus" and "campaign", so idk...
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According to Blizz, hardcore players are not allowed to use the real money shop, so I imagine that hardcore mode will be the main "bragging rights" avenue of the game. Players in regular mode can enjoy buying items if they want, while hardcore players will succeed only through their skills and not their wallet.
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On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
Why would you want mods? There weren't any for D2 that I recall except for maphack but that's hard to argue for.
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My thoughts on the real money AH:
Gold selling/item selling is going to be inevitable: everyone knows it. History has proven it.
By introducing the real money AH system: I suppose Blizzard can protect "would be buyers" from various scams and account thieves.
Ofc: what is there to stop two parties from agreeing to a trade outside of the AH to avoid blizz's cut into the profit?
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On August 02 2011 02:49 TheGreenMachine wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:04 ballasdontcry wrote:On August 02 2011 02:01 Msr wrote:
they said they aren't bringing back hardcore, unless that changed? in force's auction house video he said there was no AH option for hardcore, so I'd have to assume HC is going to be back for D3 there is no real money auction house for hardcore there IS a gold auction house for hardcore
Doesn't that defeat the point of trying to prevent people from losing hundreds on a HC char biting it? Look for HC items you want on a SC char, then find them listed on the SC AH and buy them using gold you purchase with RM?
Unless they expect gold to deflate into an arbitrary gold cap so that no one will sell an expensive items on the gold AH, this makes no sense unless the intent is to assure that there will be demand for people to change their RM into gold?
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On August 02 2011 03:08 Logros wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
Why would you want mods? There weren't any for D2 that I recall except for maphack but that's hard to argue for.
There are thousands of D2 mods, completely new games have been made using the d2 engine with those mods, maybe you shouldn't speak out your ass on topics you know nothing about.
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On August 02 2011 03:12 Souai wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:49 TheGreenMachine wrote:On August 02 2011 02:04 ballasdontcry wrote:On August 02 2011 02:01 Msr wrote:
they said they aren't bringing back hardcore, unless that changed? in force's auction house video he said there was no AH option for hardcore, so I'd have to assume HC is going to be back for D3 there is no real money auction house for hardcore there IS a gold auction house for hardcore Doesn't that defeat the point of trying to prevent people from losing hundreds on a HC char biting it? Look for HC items you want on a SC char, then find them listed on the SC AH and buy them using gold you purchase with RM? Unless they expect gold to deflate into an arbitrary gold cap so that no one will sell an expensive items on the gold AH, this makes no sense unless the intent is to assure that there will be demand for people to change their RM into gold?
you cant transfer gold between softcore and hardcore, it would be a separate shared stash and soft and hardcore characters cannot join the same games.
Which means softcore auction house and hardcore auction house wont be connected.
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On August 02 2011 03:08 Logros wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
Why would you want mods? There weren't any for D2 that I recall except for maphack but that's hard to argue for.
?????
What?!
Sorry for this shit post.. but WHAT?!
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On August 02 2011 02:50 CrimsonLotus wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 02:45 Warpath wrote:On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
higher quality games? better control schemes? Computers can just do a hell of a lot more than a console can. You don't need Plugins to play a game. Diablo III is hardly pushing top end graphics (not that it should) and consoles can use a keyborad and a mouse. Please note that I prefer PC games to console games because I find the latter too restricted, with things like... You know, no mods.
I'm sorry, but in no way is it possible to develop a game that depends on keyboard and mouse for a console. Asking for that is suicide, if you develop a game for a console, it has to be adapted for a gamepad, just like PC ports have keyboard and mouse controls. And it is a lot easier to find people that use gamepads for PCs than mouses for consoles.
On August 02 2011 03:12 Hikari wrote:
My thoughts on the real money AH:
Gold selling/item selling is going to be inevitable: everyone knows it. History has proven it.
By introducing the real money AH system: I suppose Blizzard can protect "would be buyers" from various scams and account thieves.
Ofc: what is there to stop two parties from agreeing to a trade outside of the AH to avoid blizz's cut into the profit?
Supply mostly, I believe. They auction house is anonymous, so you can't actually contact the other guy directly, and a third party website would definatelly lack the amount of items the easy to acess, official and safer one. Plus, I think they may just add a small listing cost when you put the items for sale, as indicated by the fact they talked about limited free listings. I don't think their cut will be significant enough for people to seek other alternatives. You may even be able to directly spend that money on HotS or the upcoming maps marketplace for SC2.
On August 02 2011 03:16 VirtuallyJesse wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 03:08 Logros wrote:On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
Why would you want mods? There weren't any for D2 that I recall except for maphack but that's hard to argue for. ????? What?! Sorry for this shit post.. but WHAT?!
There were no official mods for Diablo, they all came much later by alterating the gamefiles, so it's not at all surprising that people don't know about them. There were definatelly no mods like the ones you see on mod friendly games, that actually support them. From what we know, D3 will offer as much support as D2, but it will probally be harder to alter and create unofficial mods.
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On August 02 2011 03:01 King of Kings wrote:
The Game is so dead before its even released. Buying Items/Chars and Gold for RealLife-Money is a joke. The more money you invest the better you will be, thats pathetic! I see alot of newbs buying chars/items and facerolling.
Everyone chill the fuck out. Do you guys realize that the trading of real items for money was already happening in Diablo 2? What they're doing is just creating a trusted system for players to use, because Blizzard understands that this is already going to happen, whether or not Blizzard themselves puts the system in to Diablo 3. So instead of people dealing with shady people through an unverified source, you can deal with shady people through a verified source. Regardless of how shady they are though, you will get your money and they will get their items.
Blizzard is using battle.net to support this system, which is why they're taking a cut of the profits. It's only fair that they can at least take SOMETHING in exchange for providing a constant server to which you can connect, play, and trade. Everyone keeps talking about constant connectivity like it's a bad thing... but in the end, it resolves a lot of issues that have been plaguing the PC game industry for so long - piracy, cheating (which is still really hard to prevent), hacking, modding (which isn't neccesarily a bad thing, and is again going to probably happen regardless, but I honestly could care less about this stuff - If you're so into modding, then make your own damn game. There are plenty of tools out there that will help you learn and understand.), and real-money transactions that were constantly being taken advantage of.
The skill and rune system is different, but I'm not against it. I don't know why people think that an RPG game should have the same fucking system as the game before it, but I would get really sick of Diablo if it was the same gameplay as Diablo 2 - Regardless of how awesome Diablo 2 was. The point is that this is a new game, not Diablo 2.
If you don't want to play Diablo3 , then I could honestly not give 2 shits. You're one person, and even collectivity, everyone who refuses to play the game because of these changes can go ahead and not play. I promise you, just like World of Warcraft and it's expansions, Starcraft 2 and other present and/or future Blizzard sequels, there will be more than a fuck ton of people playing the game who won't give a shit that you're not playing. END OF STORY.
TL;DR - No one cares if you think that change is bad, because people are going to play and love this game, regardless. Blizzard may sound like an evil corporation, but if they keep shitting out gold, then god damn it, I will play their games.
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On August 02 2011 03:16 TheGreenMachine wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 03:12 Souai wrote:On August 02 2011 02:49 TheGreenMachine wrote:On August 02 2011 02:04 ballasdontcry wrote:On August 02 2011 02:01 Msr wrote:
they said they aren't bringing back hardcore, unless that changed? in force's auction house video he said there was no AH option for hardcore, so I'd have to assume HC is going to be back for D3 there is no real money auction house for hardcore there IS a gold auction house for hardcore Doesn't that defeat the point of trying to prevent people from losing hundreds on a HC char biting it? Look for HC items you want on a SC char, then find them listed on the SC AH and buy them using gold you purchase with RM? Unless they expect gold to deflate into an arbitrary gold cap so that no one will sell an expensive items on the gold AH, this makes no sense unless the intent is to assure that there will be demand for people to change their RM into gold? you cant transfer gold between softcore and hardcore, it would be a separate shared stash and soft and hardcore characters cannot join the same games. Which means softcore auction house and hardcore auction house wont be connected.
Oh sweet. That should make the hardcore option a bit more popular, though I expect this will solidify a place for the third party markets if there was ever any doubt that they'd still exist with blizzard implementing a RMT system.
It kind of sucks then that you are limited to 10 characters per account then, if you want to play both gametypes and all the classes you'll max out your slots on just that.
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I'm not sure why everyone is hating on the auction house system Blizzard developed. Every popular online RPG game has people trading items for money, and the fact that Blizzard has given us a safe medium to do it through is only a good thing.
I personaly won't be buying items with real money, but if there is someone that's willing to I don't see why it's a big deal that they can. We still have the option to buy items with gold. Just remember that it is up to us to determine how we will be using this new system.
The only concern is that if gold is as worthless as it was in D2 then people may be dissuaded from using the gold AH to begin with, but as long as gold has a value then people will use the "free" AH too.
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On August 02 2011 03:22 hoby2000 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 03:01 King of Kings wrote:
The Game is so dead before its even released. Buying Items/Chars and Gold for RealLife-Money is a joke. The more money you invest the better you will be, thats pathetic! I see alot of newbs buying chars/items and facerolling. Everyone chill the fuck out. Do you guys realize that the trading of real items for money was already happening in Diablo 2? What they're doing is just creating a trusted system for players to use, because Blizzard understands that this is already going to happen, whether or not Blizzard themselves puts the system in to Diablo 3. So instead of people dealing with shady people through an unverified source, you can deal with shady people through a verified source. Regardless of how shady they are though, you will get your money and they will get their items. Blizzard is using battle.net to support this system, which is why they're taking a cut of the profits. It's only fair that they can at least take SOMETHING in exchange for providing a constant server to which you can connect, play, and trade. Everyone keeps talking about constant connectivity like it's a bad thing... but in the end, it resolves a lot of issues that have been plaguing the PC game industry for so long - piracy, cheating (which is still really hard to prevent), hacking, modding (which isn't neccesarily a bad thing, and is again going to probably happen regardless, but I honestly could care less about this stuff - If you're so into modding, then make your own damn game. There are plenty of tools out there that will help you learn and understand.), and real-money transactions that were constantly being taken advantage of. The skill and rune system is different, but I'm not against it. I don't know why people think that an RPG game should have the same fucking system as the game before it, but I would get really sick of Diablo if it was the same gameplay as Diablo 2 - Regardless of how awesome Diablo 2 was. The point is that this is a new game, not Diablo 2. If you don't want to play Diablo3 , then I could honestly not give 2 shits. You're one person, and even collectivity, everyone who refuses to play the game because of these changes can go ahead and not play. I promise you, just like World of Warcraft and it's expansions, Starcraft 2 and other present and/or future Blizzard sequels, there will be more than a fuck ton of people playing the game who won't give a shit that you're not playing. END OF STORY. TL;DR - No one cares if you think that change is bad, because people are going to play and love this game, regardless. Blizzard may sound like an evil corporation, but if they keep shitting out gold, then god damn it, I will play their games.
This is a thread discussing Diablo 3. New information came out that made a lot of people's expectations for the game go down the gutter. I DO care what they say. So stop trying to talk like if you're any more important than anyone else here.
P.S : Gold?
WoW : Pretty disapointing game for me. Didn't like it.
SC2 : Gameplay is pretty good. Single player STORY was not good. Custom games are half-dead because of the un-usable lobby (my favorite part of older Blizzard games). Overall much lower on my list of good games than WC3 and SC.
D3 : Destroying my hope for the game 1 announcement at a time despite me being a huge Diablo 2 fan.
Blizzard has not been "shitting out gold" for over half a decade now.
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On August 02 2011 03:22 hoby2000 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 03:01 King of Kings wrote:
The Game is so dead before its even released. Buying Items/Chars and Gold for RealLife-Money is a joke. The more money you invest the better you will be, thats pathetic! I see alot of newbs buying chars/items and facerolling. Everyone chill the fuck out. Do you guys realize that the trading of real items for money was already happening in Diablo 2?
Do you know how much gold buying/selling there is in WoW?
Now, should blizzard do it as well so that it gets more safe and official?
Just because the problem already been there doesn't make it more legit because Blizzard now all of a sudden supports it.
Just like gold selling/buying encourages poor countries child labor this will now not only encourage it but make it legit.
Disgusting move by Blizzard.
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On August 02 2011 03:16 VirtuallyJesse wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2011 03:08 Logros wrote:On August 02 2011 02:41 CrimsonLotus wrote:
No mods? WTF?
Then what's the point of this being a PC game?
Why would you want mods? There weren't any for D2 that I recall except for maphack but that's hard to argue for. ????? What?! Sorry for this shit post.. but WHAT?!
Relax, I haven't played D2 in years but I did for a long time and never heard about any of them. And from what I gather if you play a modded version you can't play over battle.net so I don't really see the point as the game is designed to play and trade with a ton of other people.
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Don t see how it can be possible without the game being forbidden to 18- players.
Dropping a good item is mostly about luck and betting games are forbidden to 18- no?
Well maybe its ok since the player do not have to bet something but still , will be a challenge to every country laws on that subject imo
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EPT
