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On January 24 2012 12:58 insanet wrote:
I already lost hope on sc2 with dustin browder and david kim designing this game, the only way to save sc2 is to fire them.
they want to balance bronze league and grandmaster at the same time and that is retarded, they should balance everything about grandmasters and then release a newbie mod or ladder or whatever for lower leagues if they care so much.
they actually say that they care more about the higher leagues/pro scene than the lower leagues....
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On January 24 2012 13:05 ninini wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 11:22 dmnum wrote:On January 24 2012 11:09 poopman wrote:But brood war looks so "clean"  BW is a good looking game, but it's like comparing a woman when she's 20 and when she's 35. The 20 year old looks better than the 35 year old, and most people will go for the former only because of that. But ultimately the 35 year old is better in bed because she has experience. I would say SC2 looks like a 20 year old with too much make-up on. She looks ridiculous, but most are going after her either way because she's considered desirable for some strange reason. BW on the other hand looks like a sophisticated 35 year old. A bit aged but still very beautiful. SC2 is a graphic nightmare for someone who tends to look at the details. Units move as clumps, and because of the unit graphical design and lighting, it's hard to distinguish them beyond that. It's extremely hard to distinguish different unit types from eachother. It really surprises me how little criticism have been directed at the SC2 graphics. Everybody complains about bland units and easy mechanics, but for me the biggest thing turn off with SC2 was the graphics. I just can't see what goes on in the battles, other than who's winning.
Oh on some parts of that I can agree with you. Sometimes, especially with protoss, battles can be a little bit confusing. The worst unit in that regard is the colossus IMO, the lasers are way too flashy.
But I was watching polt vs hero the other day(Two korean players in case you don't follow sc2, polt is terran and hero is protoss), and polt was spreading his units to when he engaged. It make the battles look way more exciting, and made a big difference too, because polt was able to negate a lot of aoe from hero's army. I think in the end pros will learn to keep their army split at all times in order to take less aoe damage, and then the battles will look better. But the game could use a little bit of tone down in it's effects though.
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On January 24 2012 13:10 Soyuz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 12:58 insanet wrote:
I already lost hope on sc2 with dustin browder and david kim designing this game, the only way to save sc2 is to fire them.
they want to balance bronze league and grandmaster at the same time and that is retarded, they should balance everything about grandmasters and then release a newbie mod or ladder or whatever for lower leagues if they care so much. they actually say that they care more about the higher leagues/pro scene than the lower leagues....
well you are naive if believe everything they say. look, this is what they promised us, at the starcraft 2 zerg reveal trailer 2 years ago
![[image loading]](http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/9513/dibujobkdq.jpg)
Uploaded with ImageShack.us
Cool.
but what we actually got? this shit.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/J0iBR.jpg)
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On January 24 2012 12:58 jidolboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 12:55 blade55555 wrote:
This thread should just be closed. this is just another "why sc2 sucks" thread in the bw section that bw players don't even care about other then to trash it.
Honestly I wish both could live side by side but just doesn't look like it but I hope there is at minimum 1 more year of MSL that Jaedong gets out of his crappyish play and dominates :D. Seriously bro? I advise you to read ( if you can ) that says Farewell MBCGame on the side where it is clearly visible.
I meant OSL my bad lol. I know they closed sometimes mistype :D. Sorry bout that bra!
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On January 24 2012 13:08 reDicE wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:02 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:58 reDicE wrote:On January 24 2012 12:40 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:17 Xeteh wrote:On January 24 2012 11:28 Caladbolg wrote:
Sigh.
No LAN? Right... and you wanted to be taken seriously as an e-Sport?
Clumped units?
Magic casting?
Small maps?
No defender's advantage?
I could deal with MBS and unlimited unit selection (because the latter simply means the inferior players can move around their army a little better - but you still have to use all the hotkeys if you want to engage properly), but the rest? Ugh.
As much as I like playing SC2, and like watching SC2, to see my BW heroes play that game would be the death of me. Hope no one above the level of MVP/ForGG/Hyun switches right off the bat. Give it time, BW has had 11 years to turn in to an amazing game. Give SC2 the time it needs. I honestly believe it'll get there at some point. Sorry but I'm going to grab and rant on this one. Give it time, SC2 will die in its current state. I don't care how the game will develop, and I don't care what the skill cap is going to be. GomTV is still a minority channel (if its even considered a channel, they broadcast on borrowed timeslot from an anime channel) in Korea, and the players themselves are not making more money. What SC2 needs right now is the corporate sponsors, and bigger coverage of tournaments, as well as better production value and sets. I don't care if BW took 11 years to become amazing. BW, as amazing it is, had a lucky start, but SC2 didn't have that. In fact, SC2 failed in Korea due to illegal advertising, funky price packages etc. Want an example? Couple of friends and I went to a PC Bang in Korea. We played few BW 2v2s and decided to play SC2. Turns out, two of us (including myself) do not have Korean passport, which meant we couldn't create Korean battle.net account (this has been solved with TW/KR server). The server merge solved the problem, yes, but that's not the point. SC2 had an awful kick start in Korea. So unless something dramatic happens (ideal solution: GomTV and OGN both casts SC2 games, or some kind of Proleague that's casted on both "stations"), SC2 ain't getting big in Korea Note: I've been talking about Korea, don't bring 'foreign scene' into the discussion. I think you sort of forgot what you were arguing about a sentence into your first paragraph. What the above were arguing about was not whether or not the Korean scene would be great in 11 years, but whether or not the actual game would become great in 11 years. What you were ranting about is how the SC2 SCENE will die out in Korea in it's current state. EDIT: Oh, I just read "I don't care how the game will develop," so now I ask: Why did you even respond to him? Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years. In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens. What happens after the dramatic change (whether it be KeSPA-GomTV agreement or something) is something that I'll consider when it actually happens. "Giving it time" is not the answer; at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea. "Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years." Again, why respond when we're talking about whether or not the game will become great if you don't care? "In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens" Actually, in the 2 years sc2 has been out, it has developed a TON. Again, we're not talking about the Korean scene developing, but the actual game. Also, even if SC2 dies in Korea, I believe the foreign scene will continue to develop the game. EDIT: Updated with your edited post. " at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea." Once again, you miss the point of their posts.
I don't even know where you're trying to go with this if you're going to pick up small statements of what I said, break it apart, and compare it to the foreign scene while I've been DISCUSSING WITH KOREAN SCENE FOR THE ENTIRE THREAD.
NO, I don't care how the game will develop. I care about the scene because it contributes to Korean eSports in general. Is this what you were looking for? Then maybe you should read the entire thread, including the op, to understand where everyone's coming from and why people are talking in such way. Because at this rate, you're the one who's not on the same page as me (as well as rest of the people in this thread), while you're trying to disprove everything that I'm saying.
EDIT: But yes, thanks for clarifying everything, and turning this topic in to SC2 vs BW. I really appreciate your effort into creating another 'informative' thread into flame war. I guess it really is hard for people to stay on topic if they think one game is better than other, while some other people are trying to stay on the actual topic for the entire thread.
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On January 24 2012 13:15 supernovamaniac wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:08 reDicE wrote:On January 24 2012 13:02 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:58 reDicE wrote:On January 24 2012 12:40 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:17 Xeteh wrote:On January 24 2012 11:28 Caladbolg wrote:
Sigh.
No LAN? Right... and you wanted to be taken seriously as an e-Sport?
Clumped units?
Magic casting?
Small maps?
No defender's advantage?
I could deal with MBS and unlimited unit selection (because the latter simply means the inferior players can move around their army a little better - but you still have to use all the hotkeys if you want to engage properly), but the rest? Ugh.
As much as I like playing SC2, and like watching SC2, to see my BW heroes play that game would be the death of me. Hope no one above the level of MVP/ForGG/Hyun switches right off the bat. Give it time, BW has had 11 years to turn in to an amazing game. Give SC2 the time it needs. I honestly believe it'll get there at some point. Sorry but I'm going to grab and rant on this one. Give it time, SC2 will die in its current state. I don't care how the game will develop, and I don't care what the skill cap is going to be. GomTV is still a minority channel (if its even considered a channel, they broadcast on borrowed timeslot from an anime channel) in Korea, and the players themselves are not making more money. What SC2 needs right now is the corporate sponsors, and bigger coverage of tournaments, as well as better production value and sets. I don't care if BW took 11 years to become amazing. BW, as amazing it is, had a lucky start, but SC2 didn't have that. In fact, SC2 failed in Korea due to illegal advertising, funky price packages etc. Want an example? Couple of friends and I went to a PC Bang in Korea. We played few BW 2v2s and decided to play SC2. Turns out, two of us (including myself) do not have Korean passport, which meant we couldn't create Korean battle.net account (this has been solved with TW/KR server). The server merge solved the problem, yes, but that's not the point. SC2 had an awful kick start in Korea. So unless something dramatic happens (ideal solution: GomTV and OGN both casts SC2 games, or some kind of Proleague that's casted on both "stations"), SC2 ain't getting big in Korea Note: I've been talking about Korea, don't bring 'foreign scene' into the discussion. I think you sort of forgot what you were arguing about a sentence into your first paragraph. What the above were arguing about was not whether or not the Korean scene would be great in 11 years, but whether or not the actual game would become great in 11 years. What you were ranting about is how the SC2 SCENE will die out in Korea in it's current state. EDIT: Oh, I just read "I don't care how the game will develop," so now I ask: Why did you even respond to him? Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years. In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens. What happens after the dramatic change (whether it be KeSPA-GomTV agreement or something) is something that I'll consider when it actually happens. "Giving it time" is not the answer; at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea. "Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years." Again, why respond when we're talking about whether or not the game will become great if you don't care? "In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens" Actually, in the 2 years sc2 has been out, it has developed a TON. Again, we're not talking about the Korean scene developing, but the actual game. Also, even if SC2 dies in Korea, I believe the foreign scene will continue to develop the game. EDIT: Updated with your edited post. " at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea." Once again, you miss the point of their posts. I don't even know where you're trying to go with this if you're going to pick up small statements of what I said, break it apart, and compare it to the foreign scene while I've been DISCUSSING WITH KOREAN SCENE FOR THE ENTIRE THREAD. NO, I don't care how the game will develop. I care about the scene because it contributes to Korean eSports in general. Is this what you were looking for? Then maybe you should read the entire thread, including the op, to understand where everyone's coming from and why people are talking in such way. Because at this rate, you're the one who's not on the same page as me (as well as rest of the people in this thread), while you're trying to disprove everything that I'm saying. EDIT: But yes, thanks for clarifying everything, and turning this topic in to SC2 vs BW. I really appreciate your effort into creating another 'informative' thread into flame war.
Well, you see, the two posts you were responding to had nothing to do with the Korean scene. It had to do with how the actual game will develop in 11 years. So if you bothered to read the root post, you'd realize what you had to say does not relate to the conversation they were having. And, yes, I understand that you don't care how the game develops, which is why I'm confused as to why you were responding to him.
Also, I'm not trying to start a BW vs SC2 thread at all, if you actually understood what I posted. I'd like you to find one instance of me trying to turn this into a BW vs SC2 thread.
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On January 24 2012 13:23 reDicE wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:15 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 13:08 reDicE wrote:On January 24 2012 13:02 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:58 reDicE wrote:On January 24 2012 12:40 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 12:17 Xeteh wrote:On January 24 2012 11:28 Caladbolg wrote:
Sigh.
No LAN? Right... and you wanted to be taken seriously as an e-Sport?
Clumped units?
Magic casting?
Small maps?
No defender's advantage?
I could deal with MBS and unlimited unit selection (because the latter simply means the inferior players can move around their army a little better - but you still have to use all the hotkeys if you want to engage properly), but the rest? Ugh.
As much as I like playing SC2, and like watching SC2, to see my BW heroes play that game would be the death of me. Hope no one above the level of MVP/ForGG/Hyun switches right off the bat. Give it time, BW has had 11 years to turn in to an amazing game. Give SC2 the time it needs. I honestly believe it'll get there at some point. Sorry but I'm going to grab and rant on this one. Give it time, SC2 will die in its current state. I don't care how the game will develop, and I don't care what the skill cap is going to be. GomTV is still a minority channel (if its even considered a channel, they broadcast on borrowed timeslot from an anime channel) in Korea, and the players themselves are not making more money. What SC2 needs right now is the corporate sponsors, and bigger coverage of tournaments, as well as better production value and sets. I don't care if BW took 11 years to become amazing. BW, as amazing it is, had a lucky start, but SC2 didn't have that. In fact, SC2 failed in Korea due to illegal advertising, funky price packages etc. Want an example? Couple of friends and I went to a PC Bang in Korea. We played few BW 2v2s and decided to play SC2. Turns out, two of us (including myself) do not have Korean passport, which meant we couldn't create Korean battle.net account (this has been solved with TW/KR server). The server merge solved the problem, yes, but that's not the point. SC2 had an awful kick start in Korea. So unless something dramatic happens (ideal solution: GomTV and OGN both casts SC2 games, or some kind of Proleague that's casted on both "stations"), SC2 ain't getting big in Korea Note: I've been talking about Korea, don't bring 'foreign scene' into the discussion. I think you sort of forgot what you were arguing about a sentence into your first paragraph. What the above were arguing about was not whether or not the Korean scene would be great in 11 years, but whether or not the actual game would become great in 11 years. What you were ranting about is how the SC2 SCENE will die out in Korea in it's current state. EDIT: Oh, I just read "I don't care how the game will develop," so now I ask: Why did you even respond to him? Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years. In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens. What happens after the dramatic change (whether it be KeSPA-GomTV agreement or something) is something that I'll consider when it actually happens. "Giving it time" is not the answer; at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea. "Because I really don't care how the game will develop, whether it be amazing or horrible, in next 10 years." Again, why respond when we're talking about whether or not the game will become great if you don't care? "In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens" Actually, in the 2 years sc2 has been out, it has developed a TON. Again, we're not talking about the Korean scene developing, but the actual game. Also, even if SC2 dies in Korea, I believe the foreign scene will continue to develop the game. EDIT: Updated with your edited post. " at the current state SC2 is only going to stay small in Korea." Once again, you miss the point of their posts. I don't even know where you're trying to go with this if you're going to pick up small statements of what I said, break it apart, and compare it to the foreign scene while I've been DISCUSSING WITH KOREAN SCENE FOR THE ENTIRE THREAD. NO, I don't care how the game will develop. I care about the scene because it contributes to Korean eSports in general. Is this what you were looking for? Then maybe you should read the entire thread, including the op, to understand where everyone's coming from and why people are talking in such way. Because at this rate, you're the one who's not on the same page as me (as well as rest of the people in this thread), while you're trying to disprove everything that I'm saying. EDIT: But yes, thanks for clarifying everything, and turning this topic in to SC2 vs BW. I really appreciate your effort into creating another 'informative' thread into flame war. Well, you see, the two posts you were responding to had nothing to do with the Korean scene. It had to do with how the actual game will develop in 11 years. So if you bothered to read the root post, you'd realize what you had to say does not relate to the conversation they were having. And, yes, I understand that you don't care how the game develops, which is why I'm confused as to why you were responding to him. Also, I'm not trying to start a BW vs SC2 thread at all, if you actually understood what I posted. I'd like you to find one instance of me trying to turn this into a BW vs SC2 thread.
Yeah, you're definitely on the wrong page. Congratulations on coming into the thread late, reading only last couple of posts, and while I tried to keep things on the right track with the 'scene' discussion instead of game (don't get me wrong, I had to stop myself and PM couple of people to stop doing so), you go back insisting that it's about discussion of a game, something that I never want to do on forums and tried to stop by changing the topic into discussions. Way to stay relevant to the OP
"In reality, there won't be any development in SC2 unless something dramatic happens" Actually, in the 2 years sc2 has been out, it has developed a TON." Given that you think that I don't think SC2 has developed that much (according to your definition), aren't you trying to start something here? Because if you're not, think again. Tons of people on the forums would grab and hold onto something like this, and start endless discussion which leads to SC2 vs BW. Don't believe me? Go search yourself.
"Also, even if SC2 dies in Korea, I believe the foreign scene will continue to develop the game." Way to bring something else into the discussion even after I stated what I was arguing about + the aggression
If you want to argue more while being on the completely different page as I am, don't even bother replying here because your 'useful' posts took up a lot of space. If you want to argue more, take it to PM.
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On January 24 2012 07:27 PrinceXizor wrote:Hey guys! i know alot of you are not sc2 fans and as such have probably not read a recent interview from thisisgame. the interview is here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305648. I'd like to just summarize the BW relevent info in this thread so you guys don't have to read anything in the sc2 forums if you don't want to. haha. okay 1. the coach of one of the larger SC2 teams mentions in the interview a rumor about the KeSPA teams starting sc2 in april. 2. the same coach has recieved offers from KeSPA teams, but will not state which offers. 3. Zergbong, the current best zerg in SC2, has received offers from KeSPA teams as well, in addition to being consulted for new talent for SC2 that KeSPA teams can pick up. 4. Zergbong's admission to KeSPA teams scouting talent from SC2 teams means that likely very few if any pros will switch to SC2 come april. it's probable only a few practice partners, B teamers, and fading stars will switch, as KeSPA seems to be scouting current SC2 talent a lot. this means that we don't have much to fear from the addition of sc2. 5. Zergbong mentions that KeSPA teams are interested in the lowest rung of sc2 talent, the players who have not made a name for themselves, to get them cheap and train them on their own (this is good for BW, as it means much less money will be spent on sc2 right away). 6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us. 7. I'd like to thank the translator jellyjello for translating the interview, without that some of these rumors and actions would go unknown to us.
On topic looks like from the interview it seems bw teams are hiring the current sc2 talents instead of trying to turn already the current pro's from broodwar to sc2 .Bw teams will have a sc2 division in their teams I guess to capitalized on the money that sc2 is generating for now.
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6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us.
Well this is just about the best news I could have asked to read tonight. Thank you for summarizing the interview, would not have this happy news otherwise. 
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On January 24 2012 13:28 Sawamura wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 07:27 PrinceXizor wrote:Hey guys! i know alot of you are not sc2 fans and as such have probably not read a recent interview from thisisgame. the interview is here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305648. I'd like to just summarize the BW relevent info in this thread so you guys don't have to read anything in the sc2 forums if you don't want to. haha. okay 1. the coach of one of the larger SC2 teams mentions in the interview a rumor about the KeSPA teams starting sc2 in april. 2. the same coach has recieved offers from KeSPA teams, but will not state which offers. 3. Zergbong, the current best zerg in SC2, has received offers from KeSPA teams as well, in addition to being consulted for new talent for SC2 that KeSPA teams can pick up. 4. Zergbong's admission to KeSPA teams scouting talent from SC2 teams means that likely very few if any pros will switch to SC2 come april. it's probable only a few practice partners, B teamers, and fading stars will switch, as KeSPA seems to be scouting current SC2 talent a lot. this means that we don't have much to fear from the addition of sc2. 5. Zergbong mentions that KeSPA teams are interested in the lowest rung of sc2 talent, the players who have not made a name for themselves, to get them cheap and train them on their own (this is good for BW, as it means much less money will be spent on sc2 right away). 6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us. 7. I'd like to thank the translator jellyjello for translating the interview, without that some of these rumors and actions would go unknown to us. On topic looks like from the interview it seems bw teams are hiring the current sc2 talents instead of trying to turn already the current pro's from broodwar to sc2 .Bw teams will have a sc2 division in their teams I guess to capitalized on the money that sc2 is generating for now.
Not too sure, as I've seen some weird posts in the past where I've seen really obscure proleague formats that included both sc2 and BW in same match. It never happened, but no one knows if that exact format was discussed or not. Hopefully not.
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On January 24 2012 13:10 Soyuz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 12:58 insanet wrote:
I already lost hope on sc2 with dustin browder and david kim designing this game, the only way to save sc2 is to fire them.
they want to balance bronze league and grandmaster at the same time and that is retarded, they should balance everything about grandmasters and then release a newbie mod or ladder or whatever for lower leagues if they care so much. they actually say that they care more about the higher leagues/pro scene than the lower leagues....
where did you get this from? Last I read was the changes they were making were for all levels of play.
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On January 24 2012 13:30 supernovamaniac wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:28 Sawamura wrote:On January 24 2012 07:27 PrinceXizor wrote:Hey guys! i know alot of you are not sc2 fans and as such have probably not read a recent interview from thisisgame. the interview is here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305648. I'd like to just summarize the BW relevent info in this thread so you guys don't have to read anything in the sc2 forums if you don't want to. haha. okay 1. the coach of one of the larger SC2 teams mentions in the interview a rumor about the KeSPA teams starting sc2 in april. 2. the same coach has recieved offers from KeSPA teams, but will not state which offers. 3. Zergbong, the current best zerg in SC2, has received offers from KeSPA teams as well, in addition to being consulted for new talent for SC2 that KeSPA teams can pick up. 4. Zergbong's admission to KeSPA teams scouting talent from SC2 teams means that likely very few if any pros will switch to SC2 come april. it's probable only a few practice partners, B teamers, and fading stars will switch, as KeSPA seems to be scouting current SC2 talent a lot. this means that we don't have much to fear from the addition of sc2. 5. Zergbong mentions that KeSPA teams are interested in the lowest rung of sc2 talent, the players who have not made a name for themselves, to get them cheap and train them on their own (this is good for BW, as it means much less money will be spent on sc2 right away). 6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us. 7. I'd like to thank the translator jellyjello for translating the interview, without that some of these rumors and actions would go unknown to us. On topic looks like from the interview it seems bw teams are hiring the current sc2 talents instead of trying to turn already the current pro's from broodwar to sc2 .Bw teams will have a sc2 division in their teams I guess to capitalized on the money that sc2 is generating for now. Not too sure, as I've seen some weird posts in the past where I've seen really obscure proleague formats that included both sc2 and BW in same match. It never happened, but no one knows if that exact format was discussed or not. Hopefully not.
I suggested it a while back..its not likely but it would be pretty cool I think.
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On January 24 2012 13:30 supernovamaniac wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:28 Sawamura wrote:On January 24 2012 07:27 PrinceXizor wrote:Hey guys! i know alot of you are not sc2 fans and as such have probably not read a recent interview from thisisgame. the interview is here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305648. I'd like to just summarize the BW relevent info in this thread so you guys don't have to read anything in the sc2 forums if you don't want to. haha. okay 1. the coach of one of the larger SC2 teams mentions in the interview a rumor about the KeSPA teams starting sc2 in april. 2. the same coach has recieved offers from KeSPA teams, but will not state which offers. 3. Zergbong, the current best zerg in SC2, has received offers from KeSPA teams as well, in addition to being consulted for new talent for SC2 that KeSPA teams can pick up. 4. Zergbong's admission to KeSPA teams scouting talent from SC2 teams means that likely very few if any pros will switch to SC2 come april. it's probable only a few practice partners, B teamers, and fading stars will switch, as KeSPA seems to be scouting current SC2 talent a lot. this means that we don't have much to fear from the addition of sc2. 5. Zergbong mentions that KeSPA teams are interested in the lowest rung of sc2 talent, the players who have not made a name for themselves, to get them cheap and train them on their own (this is good for BW, as it means much less money will be spent on sc2 right away). 6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us. 7. I'd like to thank the translator jellyjello for translating the interview, without that some of these rumors and actions would go unknown to us. On topic looks like from the interview it seems bw teams are hiring the current sc2 talents instead of trying to turn already the current pro's from broodwar to sc2 .Bw teams will have a sc2 division in their teams I guess to capitalized on the money that sc2 is generating for now. Not too sure, as I've seen some weird posts in the past where I've seen really obscure proleague formats that included both sc2 and BW in same match. It never happened, but no one knows if that exact format was discussed or not. Hopefully not.
How can you mash both sc2 and bw in to a single format . Please tell me they are rumours right ?
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On January 24 2012 13:34 Sawamura wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 13:30 supernovamaniac wrote:On January 24 2012 13:28 Sawamura wrote:On January 24 2012 07:27 PrinceXizor wrote:Hey guys! i know alot of you are not sc2 fans and as such have probably not read a recent interview from thisisgame. the interview is here http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=305648. I'd like to just summarize the BW relevent info in this thread so you guys don't have to read anything in the sc2 forums if you don't want to. haha. okay 1. the coach of one of the larger SC2 teams mentions in the interview a rumor about the KeSPA teams starting sc2 in april. 2. the same coach has recieved offers from KeSPA teams, but will not state which offers. 3. Zergbong, the current best zerg in SC2, has received offers from KeSPA teams as well, in addition to being consulted for new talent for SC2 that KeSPA teams can pick up. 4. Zergbong's admission to KeSPA teams scouting talent from SC2 teams means that likely very few if any pros will switch to SC2 come april. it's probable only a few practice partners, B teamers, and fading stars will switch, as KeSPA seems to be scouting current SC2 talent a lot. this means that we don't have much to fear from the addition of sc2. 5. Zergbong mentions that KeSPA teams are interested in the lowest rung of sc2 talent, the players who have not made a name for themselves, to get them cheap and train them on their own (this is good for BW, as it means much less money will be spent on sc2 right away). 6. GOMTV will not prevent KeSPA teams from participating in their events, and they hope KeSPA returns the gesture, if this is true and happens, it'll mean stability within the two sections of korean starcraft. likely ending a lot of issues and probably causing blizzard to back off of BW, again good for us. 7. I'd like to thank the translator jellyjello for translating the interview, without that some of these rumors and actions would go unknown to us. On topic looks like from the interview it seems bw teams are hiring the current sc2 talents instead of trying to turn already the current pro's from broodwar to sc2 .Bw teams will have a sc2 division in their teams I guess to capitalized on the money that sc2 is generating for now. Not too sure, as I've seen some weird posts in the past where I've seen really obscure proleague formats that included both sc2 and BW in same match. It never happened, but no one knows if that exact format was discussed or not. Hopefully not. How can you mash both sc2 and bw in to a single format . Please tell me they are rumours right ?
That's why I said 'weird' posts in the past where I've seen really obscure proleague formats that included both sc2 and BW in same match
It was on fomos, and it was a rumor. Some rumors on fomos have been right to a point where I started reading most of the rumors. Some are completely wrong, however.
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On January 24 2012 11:02 poopman wrote:
I don't understand why sc2 fans just watch some BW games, honestly there is no reason not to because its just so entertaining to watch AND its free for the top level play.
I for one have tried to watch it, aswell as most other top level e-sports out there but the fact that I do not play it myself and don't have any connection to the players whatsoever kind of ruins it. What's great about any e-sport is the players/teams; sure I can spot skill when I see it, but it's hard to make up for 10+ years of BW-storylines.
For me it's the same way as with Quake games. I love to watch it, but I can't add anything to a discussion about it, I can't feel a connection to any player outside of my country etc.
This is probably not the view of most sc2-fans but I thought I'd offer my opinion anyway.
To add to the actual topic, it would be sad if anything was forced on the fans of both BW and SC2 since that helps no one.
A good example is CS:S if anyone knows about that scene. They tried to force a game on a community that just laughed and the only ones switching over were (kind of) awful teams and newer players, whilst the pros and fans stayed put and never gave it a second glance.
The money comes and goes but a large fanbase is hard to win back.
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On January 24 2012 12:41 dartoo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 12:25 Sawamura wrote:On January 24 2012 12:20 gngfn wrote:On January 24 2012 12:17 Xeteh wrote:On January 24 2012 11:28 Caladbolg wrote:
Sigh.
No LAN? Right... and you wanted to be taken seriously as an e-Sport?
Clumped units?
Magic casting?
Small maps?
No defender's advantage?
I could deal with MBS and unlimited unit selection (because the latter simply means the inferior players can move around their army a little better - but you still have to use all the hotkeys if you want to engage properly), but the rest? Ugh.
As much as I like playing SC2, and like watching SC2, to see my BW heroes play that game would be the death of me. Hope no one above the level of MVP/ForGG/Hyun switches right off the bat. Give it time, BW has had 11 years to turn in to an amazing game. Give SC2 the time it needs. I honestly believe it'll get there at some point. Mods, please make "give it time" bannable We gave sc2 ten's year of time to develop it self in to the ultimate "E-Sports" game like DB and friends have been preaching , I mean I still recall them saying the editor " Can Do ANYTHING " . Well if it can do anything than un clump the units and not make it into the ball when you right click a control group of units to the destination you ordered them to go. I dont really see the point of harping on about this in every post that mildy relates to sc2. It's a different engine, it's not about the editor. We've seen people do a lot of amazing things with the editor. sc2 uses the swarm AI, whereas bw uses a-star. The editor (probably)allows you to script stuff, not change core engine bits, for which you you'd have to create a whole new build. It seems like you pulled a sentence out of a random promo video and are using it to bash the game, I do agree that clumping sucks when compared to bw late game battles, but blaming the editor for it is not right.
I understand why bw unit movement is so weird now. It`s just A* + hard/soft collision avoidance.
I think some sort of "Maintain formation" button would alleviate this issues tho. But that wouldn't remedy the fact that strategical positioning is not such a staple principle in sc2 as it is in bw.
EDIT: And I think this is actually doable in the editor to some extent. Not worth the effort tho, as if you put it into a map most people would go WTF LOL DUMB UNITS BORKEN WONT MOVE
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How this is going on depends on the market, actually I think SC2 offers an established niche (much smaller than BW) and the actual Kespa Teams dont want invest a lot in something that right now doesnt have a good revenue, but can be a good complement, because those teams have already the installations. If you see the PC Bangs numbers, it would be stupid to replace BW for SC2 or even forcing a transition in a MMO world and where the only real contender is BW.
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I love how Lim Jae Duk is "Nestea" in the SC2 threads and "Zergbong" in the BW threads. As for the BW pros switching over, I wonder if only B-teamers will come over to test the waters or will it be a full transition.
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On January 24 2012 13:10 Soyuz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2012 12:58 insanet wrote:
I already lost hope on sc2 with dustin browder and david kim designing this game, the only way to save sc2 is to fire them.
they want to balance bronze league and grandmaster at the same time and that is retarded, they should balance everything about grandmasters and then release a newbie mod or ladder or whatever for lower leagues if they care so much. they actually say that they care more about the higher leagues/pro scene than the lower leagues....
But their purpose is to make money, so in the end they only "say" they care more about higher leagues but will still balance and introduce new units with lower level players taken into consideration.
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After harping on this thread, I watched Bisu vs Iris again...
Truly, truly. Nothing compares.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/823/dibujobkdq.jpg/)
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