EPTIt seems it wasn't an issue within blizzard, which is a big mistake on their part IMO.
What you did seems pretty darn good.
No Deathballs - Xel Naga - Page 2
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Denis Lachance
Canada162 Posts
It seems it wasn't an issue within blizzard, which is a big mistake on their part IMO. What you did seems pretty darn good. | ||
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aka_star
United Kingdom1546 Posts
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Pulzlulz
Germany412 Posts
On March 08 2011 21:05 aka_star wrote: I have high hopes for this, keep up the good work dood. I'm gonna try it out later today. Sounds like an awesome idea, my only query going in would be how well ramp blocking is going to be. That would add a huge factor to the defender's advantage so it's a step in the right direction. Keep up the work! | ||
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m3rciless
United States1476 Posts
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Jetaap
France4814 Posts
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eviltomahawk
United States11133 Posts
Unfortunately, I think the "ball" formation mechanic is an offshoot of the improved pathfinding that Blizzard attempted to implement into SC2. IMO, the pathfinding AI and unit control in SC2 feels much more comfortable and fluid compared to BW or any other recent RTS. As someone said previously in the thread, increasing collision size might have detrimental effects on the unit pathing, especially through chokes. It's interesting to see that early in SC2's development, a lot of the early preview screenshots did not show too many symptoms of the dreaded deathball. This mod's screenshots replicate those early images, and in a good way. Nevertheless, I'm just really worried about the problems that this may cause to unit pathing. I've already suffered enough with trying to micro retarded Dragoons and Goliaths in BW. Also, have you tried contacting Maverick for possibly implementing this into the SC2BW mod? It seems like it would be a good option to have there. | ||
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Denis Lachance
Canada162 Posts
Unfortunately, I think the "ball" formation mechanic is an offshoot of the improved pathfinding that Blizzard attempted to implement into SC2. IMO, the pathfinding AI and unit control in SC2 feels much more comfortable and fluid compared to BW or any other recent RTS. As someone said previously in the thread, increasing collision size might have detrimental effects on the unit pathing, especially through chokes. With this in mind, it is always possible to fix the problematic ''death ball'' directly through the pathing algorythms. For example, in SCBW it was impossible to make 2 units in the same selection touch eachother. It just could not be done. If you told both units to move to a point precisely in between, they would always leave a space. I haven't done any extensive research in the matter, but I do believe there are more of these types of specific rules all throughout the BW pathings. I myself believe that SC2 would benefit greatly from having a more breathe-friendly pathing system, similar to the one described in OP and in SCBW. It would probably unbalance the game, which would be subject to further balancing, but in the long run it can only be good for the game as a whole. It's funner to watch, and it's easier to visualise exactly what's happening to a more realistic setting. If you see 5 stalkers fighting 2 siege tanks, with adequate distance in between, you can easily visualise from the game what that must look like in person. However, if you see a giant deathball of stalker/colossus fighting a giant ball of thor/siegetank (Not that this would ever happen but for thoughtcrafting purposes only) it's difficult to really see how that is... The thor pathing in perticular is quite unfriendly to visual extrapolation. If you have 10 thors in a ball fighting it just makes no sense.. each one has it's face hugging another thor's backside. In this map, this is greatly remedied.. Though this solution is not perfect, it is definitely a huge eye-relief. I | ||
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febreze
167 Posts
Good luck on the pro mod, I'll try this map out once I'm in game. I also wish there was a search function in joining games as there is in creating them. | ||
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Shiladie
Canada1631 Posts
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Sirion
131 Posts
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orotoss
United States298 Posts
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laLAlA[uC]
Canada963 Posts
Now if only we could combine this with the Obs version... d: | ||
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Hilberer
Sweden64 Posts
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Cryosin
United States182 Posts
On March 08 2011 20:52 Saracen wrote: Wow, that actually looks much nicer than the current SC2 unit sizes. You can actually see individual units like in BW. Just to be clear, it looks like the units stayed the same size, but they don't clump as much. Is that right? Essentially, yes. Map will be on EU by tonight(or tomorrow) thank you Woozie. As for the Ramp situation: Similar to SC1, it is very easy to block a ramp. You will have to actually move units out of the way if you want all of your units to move up a ramp. | ||
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Tarot
Canada440 Posts
I always thought it looked so bad when large units started fumbling around and clipping through each other. | ||
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febreze
167 Posts
Marines could do well with smaller collision sizes. | ||
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Cryosin
United States182 Posts
On March 09 2011 16:14 febreze wrote: I just played a game on your map, and zerg seems OP. Terran MM gets stuck a lot by mass speedlings or BL. Basically zerglings can now hold their own since collision walls are created in engagements which favours swarmy playstyles. Marines could do well with smaller collision sizes. thank you for your feedback! could you please post a replay? I am not saying its your play that is the matter, but a replay will help with many things(this is for everyone) such as: 1) How much bigger/smaller marines need to be 2) What situations favor zerglings over marines. 3) Other fine details that may cause imbalance issues. I knew ahead of time that Zerg might be a bit overpowered, but replays would tremendously help me fine tune the mod. | ||
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woozie
Sweden53 Posts
... but I think Alongschlong got shafted, because when I checked the map after upload, "Alongschlong" wasn't part of the name anymore  Too long map name I guess. | ||
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Cryosin
United States182 Posts
On March 09 2011 17:09 woozie wrote: I just published it on EU under the name "No Deathballs - Xel Naga - By Cryosin 'n Alongschlong". ... but I think Alongschlong got shafted, because when I checked the map after upload, "Alongschlong" wasn't part of the name anymore Too long map name I guess.Thank you for uploading! I will update the OP. | ||
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woozie
Sweden53 Posts
On March 09 2011 17:12 Cryosin wrote: Thank you for uploading! I will update the OP. I've tested it out now, and It's pretty cool mod! Gotta try against some friends later, but for now I've had a couple of matches against AI. If anyones interested, replays below http://dl.dropbox.com/u/455671/No Deathballs Replays.zip | ||
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