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No Deathballs - Xel Naga - Page 4

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
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Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-10 03:43:55
March 10 2011 03:43 GMT
#61
Good work but why the hate toward the deathball? Blame the players, not the game. It's not the game's fault that players don't know how to micro their armies.
One day players' deathballs will start to get destroyed by careful positioning and micro, they'll have no other choice but to step their game up, and stop doing a-move deathball
o choro é livre
pzea469
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1520 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-10 04:21:04
March 10 2011 04:19 GMT
#62
I just played a game. It was amazing. So much better, i cant believe it. I knew the deathball thing was a problem and always hated it but i didn't realize how much it would affect the game. I played vs a terran ai at insane, just messing around. I got marine rushed very early(I wasn't ready lol), but anyways, i had a few stalkers and even though i lost i was actually able to micro my stalkers quite a bit to pick off some marines. This was because not all the marines were super clumped, all hitting at the same time. Stalker micro was much more present than retail. Not only that, but it looked far better, cleaner and more clear. Simply amazing, i really REALLY hope blizzard pays attention to this. Anyone who hasn't tried it, please try it. I felt like one of my major gripes about this game had vanished. SC2 isn't broodwar, I know, but this is definitely something that shouldve remained the same. SC2 clumping/deathball sucks... really bad.

Thank you Cryosin, for showing me how unit collision size makes a bigger difference than i had ever thought it did.
Kill the Deathball
JieXian
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Malaysia4677 Posts
March 10 2011 04:57 GMT
#63
Hopefully this catches on with the the big shots :D
Please send me a PM of any song you like that I most probably never heard of! I am looking for people to chat about writing and producing music | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noD-bsOcxuU |
pzea469
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1520 Posts
March 10 2011 05:21 GMT
#64
maybe some of you could join the "nodeathballs" chat channel and we could play/spectate some matches. Then i could make a video of some battles and a thread could be made in the sc2 general forum with the video to bring more attention to this. Anyone game?
Kill the Deathball
Stane
Profile Joined April 2010
United States64 Posts
March 10 2011 05:49 GMT
#65
Suggestion for Pro mod: siege tanks overshoot like they did in sc1. Makes for zealot-bombs and other fun dynamics.
pzea469
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1520 Posts
March 10 2011 06:36 GMT
#66
I played quite a bit and even though i like it i think its a tad overdone. So i think the idea is good, but the unit collision size has been made too big. Reduce it a bit and it should be good. But so far its a bit too much. And i understand why you thought the stalker seems too big now lol. But i think reducing the collission size a bit should be good.
Kill the Deathball
Cryosin
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States182 Posts
March 10 2011 07:37 GMT
#67
A new version is in the works. I need one final thing to add though. Does anyone know how to make spectators work? For some reason it wont let me do it.


Things happening in the new version:
Unit sizes have been refined. Many units(including stalkers) have been made smaller.

Zealot, Sentry, and Roach now have their sizes properly increased.


Possible map change and/or increase in ramp size.

Spectator feature is in the works(can anyone help me with this?)


And i also would like to know what map(s) people would like the mod to be on. Please post your suggestions here.

The new version should be out either by friday or monday at the latest. Thanks again everyone for the feedback.
Sirion
Profile Joined August 2010
131 Posts
March 10 2011 09:19 GMT
#68
As a first impression, zerglings are horribly huge. Fighting in the chokes leading to the natural felt like fighting an a small ramp, with 4 marauders completely blocking every movement. Got frustrated by that so no comments on late game armies.
Kleinmuuhg
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Vanuatu4091 Posts
March 10 2011 12:46 GMT
#69
I think this is a very very good idea , but as mentioned it may be necessary to lower the radius of some units and increase those of others to balance it out better
Nevertheless great job man
This is our town, scrub
GHOSTCLAW
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States17042 Posts
March 10 2011 16:35 GMT
#70
On March 10 2011 14:49 Stane wrote:
Suggestion for Pro mod: siege tanks overshoot like they did in sc1. Makes for zealot-bombs and other fun dynamics.



I think that this is a game engine thing, and not easily modifiable
PhotographerLiquipedia. Drop me a pm if you've got questions/need help.
hayata2.0
Profile Joined January 2010
Canada655 Posts
March 10 2011 17:47 GMT
#71
On March 11 2011 01:35 GHOSTCLAW wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 10 2011 14:49 Stane wrote:
Suggestion for Pro mod: siege tanks overshoot like they did in sc1. Makes for zealot-bombs and other fun dynamics.



I think that this is a game engine thing, and not easily modifiable


SC2BW did that just fine.
You just need to make it have a projectile with some short but non-zero travel time, IIRC.
Fateless
Profile Joined January 2011
United States99 Posts
March 10 2011 17:57 GMT
#72
On March 09 2011 22:30 GinDo wrote:
My question is why didnt Blizzard do this in the 1st place .

Now we have to spam this on the Blizzard Forums so it gets implemented. I seriously think Zergs problem is the fact that everything clumps. Zerg just dies to splash so badly. Before in BW with enough stuff they could over-run tanks, but now they can;t.


Please don't.

To OP I think your exploration of this mod is great, and none of the following is meant to insult your mod. I might be the only one, but I seriously think you should either just play BW or enjoy SC2 as its own game. This is getting kind of sad, it's like when your favorite dog dies and you get him stuffed instead of moving on.

Why didn't Blizzard do this? Because they were trying to make a new game, this shit is unbelievable, Blizzard puts out another quality product after 10 years of research and development and all I hear is that it's either too much like BW or not enough like BW. Furthermore Blizzard employs the most talented game designers and artists in the f-ing world. Do you seriously think changing a couple of settings in the editor (THAT THEY BUILT!) is beyond them?

Am I the only one who thinks micro is way more fun now? Battles look way way more impressive, Blizzard added a SHITLOAD of new mechanics, units, and content and still maintains a level of balance that is untouchable in the industry. But then someone changes a couple of settings and we get "ZOMG! SOMEONE TELL BLIZZARD WE FIXED THE GAME!" If blizzard made a balance patch like this people would shit their pants because the game would be completely broken and ten years of work would be for nothing.

Sorry about the soap box, I'm just really getting tired of people just carelessly throwing our crit the game company that has done more to make awesome games and maintain a quality product then anyone else in the industry.
OPman
Profile Joined December 2010
United States131 Posts
March 10 2011 18:19 GMT
#73
I'm gonna side with the Pro-deathball argument here. Any unit that deals splash damage becomes waaaay less effective, and players with better micro won't be at as great of an advantage.
Ph'nglui Mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.
JustinHit
Profile Joined October 2010
United States196 Posts
March 10 2011 18:35 GMT
#74
I dont think Zerglings can be considered a death ball unless you're just really bad.
For the swarm for life!
Argoneus
Profile Joined July 2009
Czech Republic283 Posts
March 10 2011 19:04 GMT
#75
On March 11 2011 02:57 Fateless wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2011 22:30 GinDo wrote:
My question is why didnt Blizzard do this in the 1st place .

Now we have to spam this on the Blizzard Forums so it gets implemented. I seriously think Zergs problem is the fact that everything clumps. Zerg just dies to splash so badly. Before in BW with enough stuff they could over-run tanks, but now they can;t.


Please don't.

To OP I think your exploration of this mod is great, and none of the following is meant to insult your mod. I might be the only one, but I seriously think you should either just play BW or enjoy SC2 as its own game. This is getting kind of sad, it's like when your favorite dog dies and you get him stuffed instead of moving on.

Why didn't Blizzard do this? Because they were trying to make a new game, this shit is unbelievable, Blizzard puts out another quality product after 10 years of research and development and all I hear is that it's either too much like BW or not enough like BW. Furthermore Blizzard employs the most talented game designers and artists in the f-ing world. Do you seriously think changing a couple of settings in the editor (THAT THEY BUILT!) is beyond them?

Am I the only one who thinks micro is way more fun now? Battles look way way more impressive, Blizzard added a SHITLOAD of new mechanics, units, and content and still maintains a level of balance that is untouchable in the industry. But then someone changes a couple of settings and we get "ZOMG! SOMEONE TELL BLIZZARD WE FIXED THE GAME!" If blizzard made a balance patch like this people would shit their pants because the game would be completely broken and ten years of work would be for nothing.

Sorry about the soap box, I'm just really getting tired of people just carelessly throwing our crit the game company that has done more to make awesome games and maintain a quality product then anyone else in the industry.


Are you a wizard? You just read my mind Don't make SC2 into BW, SC2 is a new SC, if you dont like it no one's holding you here, go back to your stupid units
Terran OP
Jetaap
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France4814 Posts
March 10 2011 19:23 GMT
#76
Stop trying to make it a sc2 vs bw post please... this is a mod trying to improve some aspect of the game , you don't like it : don't play it , that's all ...
Cryosin
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States182 Posts
March 10 2011 20:45 GMT
#77
On March 11 2011 02:57 Fateless wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2011 22:30 GinDo wrote:
My question is why didnt Blizzard do this in the 1st place .

Now we have to spam this on the Blizzard Forums so it gets implemented. I seriously think Zergs problem is the fact that everything clumps. Zerg just dies to splash so badly. Before in BW with enough stuff they could over-run tanks, but now they can;t.


Please don't.

To OP I think your exploration of this mod is great, and none of the following is meant to insult your mod. I might be the only one, but I seriously think you should either just play BW or enjoy SC2 as its own game. This is getting kind of sad, it's like when your favorite dog dies and you get him stuffed instead of moving on.

Why didn't Blizzard do this? Because they were trying to make a new game, this shit is unbelievable, Blizzard puts out another quality product after 10 years of research and development and all I hear is that it's either too much like BW or not enough like BW. Furthermore Blizzard employs the most talented game designers and artists in the f-ing world. Do you seriously think changing a couple of settings in the editor (THAT THEY BUILT!) is beyond them?

Am I the only one who thinks micro is way more fun now? Battles look way way more impressive, Blizzard added a SHITLOAD of new mechanics, units, and content and still maintains a level of balance that is untouchable in the industry. But then someone changes a couple of settings and we get "ZOMG! SOMEONE TELL BLIZZARD WE FIXED THE GAME!" If blizzard made a balance patch like this people would shit their pants because the game would be completely broken and ten years of work would be for nothing.

Sorry about the soap box, I'm just really getting tired of people just carelessly throwing our crit the game company that has done more to make awesome games and maintain a quality product then anyone else in the industry.



I think you're taking the intent of this mod the wrong way. The goal was not to make something "better", because better at this point is opinion.

In "my" opinion(and clearly many others), the "deathball" mechanic of SC2 is not very fun to play.

I am no trying to make this game more like BW(there is SC2BW mod, which is a great mod that does that).

All i want is for the game to feel much more open and spacious, which again is personal preference.

I think the mod community adjusting the game to their preferences is something blizzard actually wants.

For example:

ICCUP ladder was introduced by the community and was a big reason sc1 had its life prolonged so significantly.

Im not gonna say that my mod is prolonging the life of SC2, but thats what the mod community should be doing, in whatever way they can.



GhettoSheep
Profile Joined August 2008
United States150 Posts
March 10 2011 21:03 GMT
#78
this is just a terrible idea game balance wise...

All the splash units in the game were balanced around units clumping together more. Compare the size of storm in bw to the size of storm in sc2. In bw it was a lot bigger. Similarly, in sc2, tank splash radius is actually pretty small, just increasing the damage wont balance it out, you need to increase the radius so it still does splash at all. If splash units dont deal splash or they are doing like 50% less damage, MMM will just be invincible lol

i also just dont see the point of this other than making the game look a little prettier
Cryosin
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States182 Posts
March 10 2011 21:12 GMT
#79
On March 11 2011 06:03 GhettoSheep wrote:
this is just a terrible idea game balance wise...

All the splash units in the game were balanced around units clumping together more. Compare the size of storm in bw to the size of storm in sc2. In bw it was a lot bigger. Similarly, in sc2, tank splash radius is actually pretty small, just increasing the damage wont balance it out, you need to increase the radius so it still does splash at all. If splash units dont deal splash or they are doing like 50% less damage, MMM will just be invincible lol

i also just dont see the point of this other than making the game look a little prettier



The radius of splash was increased as well.
Akill_
Profile Joined November 2008
United Kingdom80 Posts
March 10 2011 22:27 GMT
#80
this looks to make the game fun to play again, i love using good unit control to gain advantages, and there are so many units in SC2 which seem to take advantage of this. stalkers, lings, immortals, even reapers.

The death ball makes the game ugly to watch and less fun to play, and in honesty it will highlight issues with bad players and they will start to realise that maybe they are losing games because of bad control
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