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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On July 27 2012 08:52 Chargelot wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:45 Antylamon wrote:On July 27 2012 08:42 Teliko wrote:On July 27 2012 08:40 BoggieMan wrote:
if this is whats needed to stop people using hacks, i don't have an issue with mods flying out the window with it. It won't stop hackers in the slightest which is why I'm particularly annoyed about it. Can you clarify, please? Hacks don't modify MPQ files. Most of the successful hacks are what are referred to as "external". If they edited the MPQ files, Warden would tear them a new one within seconds.
This will stop very few hacks, I'm afraid. Basically, the stuff the game uses is loaded into the RAM of your computer, which is quickly read and written to by the game. Maphacks and production tab hacks don't read the MPQs or interact with them directly, but instead read your computer RAM, find the game data that's on it (and constantly being updated while you play) and reads that, finding out what your RAM knows-- the state of the game, what your opponent has, etc. It then operates a UI-like overlay (think about a stream overlay, for example) that's external to Sc2. Very few, if any hacks read MPQs directly.
It's likely this behavior is unintentional on blizzard's part, probably something they used for the PTR or just updating files more easily. They are in favor of the team color mod, as we know.
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Again, could someone with a US bnet account please post this on the forums with a link to this thread and petition and I'll add it to the OP.
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On July 27 2012 08:51 sAsImre wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:49 Wroshe wrote:
Honestly I'm glad about this. Stronger Color Mod in streams is a pain in eye but surely there must have been easier ways to get rid of it. *honnestly i'm glad that color blind ppl don't have a way to play/stream/commentate the game. WTH /w some ppl on TL sometimes...
The thing I don't get it why they use the STC mod (which clearly has about as many fans as detractors) instead of the regular game. I don't see what is stopping tournaments from running 2 streams, one with the mod that burns people's eyes out and one with the regular game.
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Surely if enough people sign the petition you open up the possibility of Blizzard developing, or at least officially endorsing, mods such as the stronger team colours. If enough people are behind this then they can see how much the community would want mods like these to be implemented in the game on a wider scale. I'm willing to bet many tens of thousands more people would implement some of these mods if they were a) easier to install, and b) endorsed by Blizzard officially.
Just seems a shame that things that obviously took a lot of time and effort to create can be wiped out in an instant in the 'fight' against piracy and hacking.
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On July 27 2012 09:01 Wroshe wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:51 sAsImre wrote:On July 27 2012 08:49 Wroshe wrote:
Honestly I'm glad about this. Stronger Color Mod in streams is a pain in eye but surely there must have been easier ways to get rid of it. *honnestly i'm glad that color blind ppl don't have a way to play/stream/commentate the game. WTH /w some ppl on TL sometimes... The thing I don't get it why they use the STC mod (which clearly has about as many fans as detractors) instead of the regular game. I don't see what is stopping tournaments from running 2 streams, one with the mod that burns people's eyes out and one with the regular game.
cause some casters can't, and you just ignored the players. Setting two streams could be hard for smaller organization such as ESV
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On July 27 2012 08:48 Antylamon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:46 Dyme wrote:
I think it's most fair if everyone has the same models and colours. Customization is bad for fair competition imo. I hated WoW PvP most for the amount of retarded add-ons you had to have to be maximum efficient.
It's probably bad for people who have difficulties seeing colours (assuming stronger team colours help them at all), but then Blizz should make a universal official colour blind version, that is easily accessable and the same for everyone.
Yea, and changing background picture... I don't care about at all. The main reason I don't like what Blizz is doing is because I am obsessed with BW voice swap. I never even played BW very much, but they still left a much larger mark than SC2 sounds did.
I could also see fairness-imbalance if you edited sound files of Starcraft to only play important sounds (for example you could remove the sentences units say every time they receive a command and replace them with a *click* sound, so that important messages stand out more, like nukes or supply blocks or whatever. One could also replace Marine shooting sound with a *click* so stutterstepping is 0,01% more efficient or shit like that. )
I just kinda like the idea that everyone has the exact same chances and exact same tools (as far as the software goes at least).
Obviously it's all really really minor and unimportant, so it's not a big deal either way.
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On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen.
That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style.
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On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style.
The technology just isn't there yet.
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On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style.
1. Blizzard is not your bitch.
2. Blizzard has designed the EULA to say they can and will ban you for MPQ editing, be glad they supported it for as long as they did.
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On July 27 2012 08:58 bokchoi wrote:
The problem is a lot of these things stronger team color, model mods, etc. can give an unfair advantage to those using it. Makes units more clear, stand out, etc. These are not intended features and should be done away with. The fact that a majority of hacks come from this same exact file modification is also a concern. Although, the custom logins, and backgrounds are kind of cool, its a necessary sacrifice to get where we need to be.
It's not like the game is hard to see as it is. Stronger color is enjoyed by people who do find it harder to make distinctions th an those who obviously don't and so have no interest in it - like me. But I support it. I think it's a bit of a hoax to say that it has any impact on play balance. If it had that kind of potential, everyone and their mom would be using it, and Blizzard would on the record be against it rather than in support of it. It seems like it's a casualty to an overarching concern of theirs.
This thread is not about balance of mods. If you think that moderations to aesthetics have any pertinence to game balance, well, you're just wrong.
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Scotland184 Posts
I signed up to the petition, there doing this to prevent hackers but it wont help at all, i use STC and Background, pretty grim that there doing this, if they do they should at least add stronger colours themselves as well as letting you customize your background!, full support 
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On July 27 2012 09:07 Chargelot wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style. 1. Blizzard is not your bitch. 2. Blizzard has designed the EULA to say they can and will ban you for MPQ editing, be glad they supported it for as long as they did.
You do realize that Blizzard employees have publicly endorsed the use of stronger team colors, right?
Honestly people, this is an unintentional change that happened when they implemented the streaming game files, if enough people get behind this poll they'll most likely add mod support of some type. This isn't going to stop a single hacker, and as for people having slight advantages through modding files it will not change the outcome of a game 99.9% of the time, unless they are colorblind, in which case many people just can no longer play/commentate the game.
I don't even use Mods and would hate to see them removed, even if Blizzard added some of the customization levels instead of allowing full modding it would be good. Also these passive aggressive statements on TL are starting to get annoying. If you have something to say explain your reasoning behind it. It helps facilitate actual conversations, and makes TL a lot nicer place to be.
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On July 27 2012 09:07 Chargelot wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style. 1. Blizzard is not your bitch. 2. Blizzard has designed the EULA to say they can and will ban you for MPQ editing, be glad they supported it for as long as they did.
You come into this petition thread / crowd just to say "blizz isn't your bitch, be glad they 'supported' you in this for as long as they did"
Really? Betcha wouldn't say this around some real world sc fans just hangin out having this conversation and expressing their remorse for losing these things that they enjoyed. Because then you'd see them looking at you and realize what kind of person you were in that moment for saying that. But you'd see that coming and avoid it IRL, so why not here? We're still just as unimpressed.
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On July 27 2012 09:17 draumr wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 09:07 Chargelot wrote:On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style. 1. Blizzard is not your bitch. 2. Blizzard has designed the EULA to say they can and will ban you for MPQ editing, be glad they supported it for as long as they did. You do realize that Blizzard employees have publicly endorsed the use of stronger team colors, right? Honestly people, this is an unintentional change that happened when they implemented the streaming game files, if enough people get behind this poll they'll most likely add mod support of some type. This isn't going to stop a single hacker, and as for people having slight advantages through modding files it will not change the outcome of a game 99.9% of the time, unless they are colorblind, in which case many people just can no longer play/commentate the game. I don't even use Mods and would hate to see them removed, even if Blizzard added some of the customization levels instead of allowing full modding it would be good.
I'm sure it's an accident too, but Blizzard employees never speak for Blizzard. It's something you see a lot on the forums, any time someone from Blizzard agrees with something or comments on something with his own personal opinion it's never "official". Which was sort of my point, they could have said "I like this mod" and then banned everyone who used it anyways. The EULA is the master of the rules, not Blizzard Employee X, even if he happens to be David Kim or similar. It was a miracle that they didn't ban for this even with employee endorsement.
On July 27 2012 09:20 Lumi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 27 2012 09:07 Chargelot wrote:On July 27 2012 09:03 nafta wrote:On July 27 2012 08:56 CajunMan wrote:
What pisses me off is all of this mods are very easy for Blizzard to implement on there own and everyone would love them for it but no that would never happen. That would be too reasonable though.....Not really blizzard's style. 1. Blizzard is not your bitch. 2. Blizzard has designed the EULA to say they can and will ban you for MPQ editing, be glad they supported it for as long as they did. You come into this petition thread / crowd just to say "blizz isn't your bitch, be glad they 'supported' you in this for as long as they did" Really? Betcha wouldn't say this around some real world sc fans just hangin out having this conversation and expressing their remorse for losing these things that they enjoyed. Because then you'd see them looking at you and realize what kind of person you were in that moment for saying that. But you'd see that coming and avoid it IRL, so why not here? We're still just as unimpressed.
Yes I would tell you Blizzard is not your bitch in real life. I'm a student of the University of Delaware, so if you're ever in the area shoot me a PM so I can tell you that Blizzard is not your bitch. But thanks for the laugh.
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On July 27 2012 08:41 SeraKuDA wrote:
Eh... Mods aren't a huge deal to lose. I think it's only a small percentage of people that use them.
You'd actually be very surprised.
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STC was the only thing who made watching ZvZ possible. Large balls of blck and red lings bumping into other balls of black and red lings while trying to avoid banelings who look exactly the same no matter what team they are on.
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Most people don't use mods anyways, and they are right not to. It's against the terms of use, and only one of them is really useful (the stronger team color) and this one has already been passably accepted by Blizzard anyways (maybe they'll even officially include it in HoTS). The others are just useless cosmetics made to appeal to little 8 years old girls who want their game to be more flashy/new/different. They add nothing at all to the games and are against the TOS. Why on earth would Blizzard listen to any kind of petition/poll? You aren't even supposed to play with it in the first place. It's like if a cop would free prisoners because they made a petition about how they love to steal cars. It's just a nonsense to me.
Even if STC isn't implemented in HoTS, I still think this is the right decision. Why would you threaten people they can be banned for doing something when you can simply block them from doing so in the first place? It's like not locking your doors but activating the alarm system at the same time.
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So they only reason you're against the change is because you want your colour mod and custom backgrounds? That sounds weak to me, I guess colour mod makes sense for colorblinds, and even then I'm not sure..
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Red-green colourblind people like me are already pissed enough about the use of red and green to differentiate good and bad. I can't see the friggin' building placement grid properly... I can't see the friggin' tiny red nuke dots since I can't differentiate between the green ground and the red dot... Friend and foe colour schemes make all units look the same to me, which makes team games with a large number of players frustrating.
Just replace either red or green with blue or yellow and we're good to go.
How much more pissed am I going to be when I can't use any mods to change any of this? How pissed do you think I should be? 7-10% of the world's male population has this issue (wiki it)... I'm not sure why we're generally ignored.
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If these changes make improvements to Blizzard's actual service, it shouldn't be held back because a tiny minority of people like to mod stuff. You knew you were taking a risk when you modded the stuff that it would all be for nothing. Now that the risk has possibly turned into reality, suck it up and let Blizzard get on with improving the playing experience without having to deal with stupid petitions.
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EPT
