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We all know, that burrowed lurkers are not affected by siege tank damage under the dark swarm. From this I did conclude, that splash damage does not affect burrowed units under dark swarm.
But in recent replays (eg. Nada - Eriador at WWI) terran players are using firebats to *kill* the lurkers under the swarm. What is the explanation to that? And if bats can kill lurkers under the swarm, can archons? Reavers? An enemy lurker? Storm, Yamato, Nuke and other spells surely can.
Edit: on Blizzard's description about dark swarm it states:
The following units are able to damage units underneath a Dark Swarm with their normal attacks:
Protoss: Probes, Reavers, Dark Templar, Zealots, Archons
Terrans: SCVs, Firebats, Siege Tanks in Siege Mode
Zerg: Drones, Zerglings, Lurkers, Ultralisk, Broodlings, Infested Terrans
but again, we all know siege tanks don't damage under swarm, so maybe in a later patch, they did change that to an exception?
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Swarm protects vs ranged attacks, such as a marine. It does not protect vs melee attacks like a firebat or ling, thats why lings can hurt you under swarm. Archons can, I think reaver can, enemy lurker can because its a melee attack.
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afaik the Firebat and the Archon has a ranged attack (range of 2). Why are they considered melee attackers?
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i think archon under swarm make less damage.
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Firebats, though they have range, are still considered a melee attack I believe.
And units such as Archons/Seige Tanks do still do damage, but not their full damage. It's just the splash damage that affects.
By the way, it is possible to kill burrowed units with the Seige Tank's splash under swarm, as long as there is a unit nearby it. Same concept as killing a lurker without detection. You can't target the lurker itself, but if another unit is close by it, is fire at, and the lurker is under the splash, it will take damage.
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Firebats attack count as melee, unaffected by uphill and downhill etc. I thought archon would do full damage under swarm, but then again I've never played pvz before.
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Archons and Firebats do not do their direct damage. They are able to cause damage via their splash/area of effect damage(Which is less).
Maybe someone who knows more clearly could extrapolate, but pretty much an archon vs a bunch of lings will still do similar damage to what it did out of swarm just because of all its splash. But vs one ling it will only do like 1/4 of its normal damage as it is only hitting with splash. Something similar for firebat.
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when dark swarm comes out basically its gg for terran.. u guys see the [RED]NaDa TvZ game on tracker where he was pushed back to his base @ RoV cuz of dark swarm ..-_- it really pained me.
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
haha hey its not always GG for terran..if only zvt was so simple!  defiler rush everytime then, lol.
anyway yeah what MTF said is correct...
firebats are melee + splash damage so yeha.. o_O
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On April 17 2006 02:52 Overlord wrote:
The following units are able to damage units underneath a Dark Swarm with their normal attacks:
Terrans: Siege Tanks in Siege Mode
but again, we all know siege tanks don't damage under swarm, so maybe in a later patch, they did change that to an exception?
maybe, if the tank and its enemy are under the same swarm, the tank do a normal damage (which, as you know, is not always certainly 70dmg)
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On April 17 2006 04:07 iloveyou[KTF] wrote:
when dark swarm comes out basically its gg for terran.. u guys see the [RED]NaDa TvZ game on tracker where he was pushed back to his base @ RoV cuz of dark swarm ..-_- it really pained me.
that.. was random..
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Sweden33719 Posts
Tanks can't hit a lurker directly under swarm, BUT, if there are lings/other units on top of the lurker, the tanks splash will hit the lurker.
Archons only deal their splash damage under swarm, meaning they do about 5 dmg to ultras -,-
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all rangedattacks get stuck on the edge of the swarm if u guys have noticed so if u aim at the lurker it will hit the side of the swarm but if it focus on for example a ling over it it can die
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swarm protects only from ranged firering units, and firebats are counted as "melee" units.
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if theres loads of lurkers close together then some of them will die from missed shots on others
its very strange
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Thanks for your answers, everything is clear now 
On April 17 2006 07:01 ShabZzoY! wrote:
if theres loads of lurkers close together then some of them will die from missed shots on others
its very strange
This is not true, only if some of them are unborrowed.
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Can someone exactly tell how big damage do archons under swarm do?
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I think it is possible to explain it all in terms of splash/hit damage. But I am not sure. This my idea of how it works:
Direct hit damage does not deal damage.
Splash damage do.
Some units deal only hit damage (marines, hydras etc), some only splash damage (lurker, firebats), some BOTH (siege tank, archon).
The tank and the arcon deals hit damage to the target, and splash damage to nearby units, but not splash damage on the target. As swarm cancels the hit damage, you only should take damage by archons and tanks if another unit nearby is targeted.
This seams logic to me, but I'm not sure that is how it works... will a single zergling be invulnerable from 2385 tanks and 657 archons if it's alone?
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On April 17 2006 07:14 HasuZealot wrote:
Can someone exactly tell how big damage do archons under swarm do?
iirc they do 5 hp damage, but im not sure.
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Um Swarm isn't gg for terrans, usually they have 435349904 Science Vessels and just irridiate everything.
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EPT
