EPTThis is a problem and you have renewed my desire to stop contributing to it, thank you for that, gl to all who are with me in this.
The sc2 community and gay bashing - Page 8
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paddyz
Ireland628 Posts
This is a problem and you have renewed my desire to stop contributing to it, thank you for that, gl to all who are with me in this. | ||
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meowmeow-
Germany291 Posts
On October 28 2011 12:15 turdburgler wrote: because it sounds like its being done for the wrong reasons. you arent saying gay bashing is wrong, you are saying bashing me is wrong, fuck the other guy. like i said in my post. ive put up with short being used as a describing word and as an insult too. i didnt choose to be short, most people arent short. people use swear words in many situations, the primary examples seem to be the school yard and over the internet. admittedly i dont see anyone making short jokes over the internet, but i can relate to the school yard example and imo thats enough. the short jokes never bothered me, not once. maybe im just dead inside but they really didnt. every kid develops a thick skin in school to verbal abuse, thats just how it is. im not saying its good or right or anything like that, its just how it is. whether you are short, fat, black, gay, tall, white, stupid, ginger. kids will find something, anything, no matter how rediculous and take the piss out of you. why is gay different or special? Midget pride, my brother from another mother. Midget pride, yo. | ||
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darklight54321
United States361 Posts
On October 29 2011 00:58 meowmeow- wrote: Midget pride, my brother from another mother. Midget pride, yo. As a giant, this made my day. | ||
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bonifaceviii
Canada2890 Posts
This can take the form of mocking and/or dismissal of the gameplay of the participants, eg "2 ez" or "gj abusing op units, play a real game next time", or by attempting to make the insult personal through use of various epithets. This is actually quite difficult to do, since a BMer has no idea about what specific race/body type/gender person they are playing, but this difficulty can be somewhat offset by employing the shotgun method (listing as many triggers as possible hoping that at least one will cause the desired effect): "terrible game, i hope your father gets aids, your mother gets kreutzfeld-jakob disease and your twin brother burns to death in a car accident you gay fat virgin mormon chinese nigger" Moral of the thread: BM is bad, don't do it. | ||
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Rozza
United Kingdom45 Posts
sounds seriously like a whine to me, the same could be said for racism/sexism etc etc etc. I believe that your merits make people respect you, and tbh you shouldnt really care if some random internet troll disrespects you anyway. tldr: deal with it, or avoid places/situations where homosexuals get flamed | ||
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Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
On October 28 2011 21:36 hoby2000 wrote: My intention is certainly not to offend. Homosexuals have as much as a right for using the word "gay" for homosexual as I do for using "gay" for stupid. The only reason people focus on the idea that it's wrong to use the word "gay" in place for stupid or lame is because they believe that homosexuals own the word - but they don't. No. Nobody thinks homosexuals own the word "gay." However, the word does indeed mean "homosexual," and the pejorative meaning has come about simply as an extension of this primary meaning. No one owns a word. The word "gay" meant something completely different before homosexuals started using it to describe themselves. In fact, I believe the only reason they used "gay" in the first place is because of the stereotype of homosexuals always sounding happy. Fait accomplit. This doesn't mean you get to leverage continuing prejudice to devise a new, pejorative meaning. Why do you think the word "gay" means what you use it to mean, when you use it in a pejorative sense? Also, you seem to have missed a majority of my reply. It doesn't matter what my intention is, because someone will take offense anyway - therefore meaning the offended create the feeling of being offended, instead of it being created by the offender. Yes, and if you take offense when I insult your mother, it's really you just creating the feeling of being offended --- but somehow it's still not acceptable to insult someone's mother. I'm asking you. Define "gay" as you want to use it. Now think a moment about where the meaning comes from. Now think a moment about whether homophobic prejudice isn't still alive and strong (hint: it is). Now think whether it's a good thing or a bad thing to blithely reinforce that prejudice. | ||
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alpenrahm
Germany628 Posts
so no. sorry i like insulting people when they deserve it and i am going to keep doing it in whatever way I think is appropriate. Edit: also here in germany people dont really use the gay equivalent as much as the english speaking community. Simply because the word has more then double the letters to it. I think the easy way to use it is another reason why "gay" as a word is being used rather frequently as an insult. It is much harder to do nice and eloquent bashing then just throwing out the F bomb coupled with a little homophobia. | ||
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prplhz
Denmark8045 Posts
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
As for getting called "gay" after you make a heart towards a guy, that isn't gay bashing, that's you being feminine as a male and getting bashed for it and that happens to both straight and gay people. If I give a random male a heart (even as a straight person, probably especially as a straight person) he's going to call me gay too. This will happen everywhere by the way, and if you take that as offensive, you're not going to get by a day in your life not being offended if you keep on acting overly feminine as male. The issue here isn't that gays aren't accepted in society, it's that males are raised to be closed off about their feelings where acting feminine in any way is considered to be unmanly. | ||
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ComaDose
Canada10357 Posts
On October 29 2011 03:47 BadgerBadger8264 wrote: You should just live with the fact that words like "gay" and "faggot" have gone past meaning "homosexual", especially on the internet where people aren't as afraid to be politically incorrect. Using those words in an offensive setting is not gay bashing. Generally, when used, they're just meant as an insult, similar to "retard" which is not meant to offend people with actual handicaps, it just changed meaning to an insult. Languages evolve. Get over it. This is not true because it is offensive. You cannot say Nigger or Slut for the same reasons. Its politically incorrect and offensive. I know when you rage your not questioning your opponents sexuality your just being a bigot. | ||
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
This is not true because it is offensive. You cannot say Nigger or Slut for the same reasons. Its politically incorrect and offensive. I know when you rage your not questioning your opponents sexuality your just being a bigot. Both terrible examples. Nigger hasn't evolved past its meaning of a degrading insult towards black people, so that one doesn't fit the ticket. Same with slut. You don't seem to grasp the concept of an evolving language. As for actual examples, how about saying "god damnit", isn't that offensive to religious people? What about "jesus christ"? Yet we still use them, because they evolved past their actual meanings and now no longer mean what they used to mean. Languages evolve. Get over it. And I don't rage, I'm not defending myself. I just think it's ridiculous to get offended to the extend of writing an essay by someone just using those words when they are clearly not actually gay bashing. | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
TLDR Louis is a great show. | ||
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Keitzer
United States2509 Posts
However, in most cases, the person saying such term is not trying to insult. It's just another swear word to them. What if someone addicted to sex got offended when someone said fuck -- because they thought the person saying it was insulting the sex act. Like... really? It's just another word the angry person uses. What about when we were kids.... everything was stupid, dumb, retarded, idiot, moron, etc... Yes, those ARE harmful to the mentally and physically challenged, yet it's not as big in the news (and by news, I'm referring to the amount of TL threads I see) as the homophobic/homosexual threads complaining about the community. Similar to "your mom" jokes. I have a friend of mine who's mom is very close to him, and he doesn't like it when we spout out your mom jokes... Even though he knows we're kidding, he's told us he doesn't like it. TL;DR: They're not insulting you. Bring it to their attention you don't like the words, and hope you don't hear them. No those words do not mean ANYTHING to them. Do not act like they do. Those words most likely never will mean anything to them. Edit: they're just words, calm down. | ||
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Praetorial
United States4241 Posts
On October 29 2011 01:05 bonifaceviii wrote: BM is an attempt by a player, either out of frustration at his own loss/shortcomings or to gain an advantage, to elicit an emotional response from the other player through abusive language. This can take the form of mocking and/or dismissal of the gameplay of the participants, eg "2 ez" or "gj abusing op units, play a real game next time", or by attempting to make the insult personal through use of various epithets. This is actually quite difficult to do, since a BMer has no idea about what specific race/body type/gender person they are playing, but this difficulty can be somewhat offset by employing the shotgun method (listing as many triggers as possible hoping that at least one will cause the desired effect): "terrible game, i hope your father gets aids, your mother gets kreutzfeld-jakob disease and your twin brother burns to death in a car accident you gay fat virgin mormon chinese nigger" Moral of the thread: BM is bad, don't do it. Though, most insulters wouldn't think to use something as obscure/long as kreutzfeld-jakobs. I've found that the most common BM usually refers to the winner's mother, but that's just me. | ||
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Lassepetri
Denmark112 Posts
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agitprop
United States37 Posts
As Chill said, at heart, the issue has been talked about in two camps, one is those that do not have malicious intent and just want to use a word they do not see as injurious, and those that say it should not be said regardless of intent. I am with the latter camp. I believe that bashing gay people or using the word "gay" and "faggot" perjoratively, regardless of intent, harms gay people, youth, and males alike. I even see a link to how psychological harm for women. The reason lies with social acceptance. We all want to be accepted, and we all want to be social. It is generally understood that isolation and ostricization lead to mental breakdown, to constant anxiety, and to other pathologies of the mind. For the gay man, he was once a child, a prepubescent teenager, and a young adult. At every stage, if he led a rather typical life, he was told that he was not socially acceptable and that he never would be. This idea was reinforced over and over to the point of frequently (in my lay opinion) creating a worldview that divided him from others, reduced him to something less valuable, caused him to walk around fatalistic and ashamed, etc. There are numerous wonderful examples in literature of this phenomenon like "Giovanni's Room" by James Baldwin, a gay black writer who also understood how racial struggle related (and didn't relate) to sexuality. As a child I remember watching a documentary on the untouchable caste of India. Even after being freed and told they were equal, they still maintained patterns of subservience, mental weakness, a dominated spirit... Much can be said of those slaves that were emancipated after the civil war, blacks during apartheid, or blacks during the Jim Crow era (and even after). It takes a rare individual to maintain a strong sense of spirit and self-confidence in the face of cultural onslaught. To the soldier that said PTSD was causing him to consider taking his life, I say that your mental anguish is only different in cause, not strength. You might not understand that because you have suffered in different circumstances, but the truth is that mental pain can be unbearable and we all know this. Moreover, I assert that lack of social acceptance, and frequent repetition of this idea to an individual, causes such anguish. We are primed to seek out love and affection from others and gay people are particularly vulnerable because we're likely to be denied such love and affection from our family members, our friends, etc. Gay people do not have the luxury of immediately identifying other gay people, so its easy to feel completely alone in the very beginning. It is easy to feel imprisoned. Remember, teenagers play this game, come to these boards, and watch Destiny's stream. Do we really expect them to overcome the massive amount of stimuli reinforcing the idea that being gay is wrong, just at the time they're struggling to come to terms with their own identity? How does that foster a worldview that leads to self-confidence? People are not born confident and then choose to be offended. Offense is often too weak a word anyway. It is pain, and a recall of the horror of feeling scared of your own family, your classmates, your friends, your teachers, people you should expect to love you. It is a reinforcement of the idea that you are not worth anything to anyone, that you will not find love, you will not have a good career, you do not measure up to the expectations of your gender (or so they say!)... Intent does not matter, that requires a level of awareness and sophisticated observation of other's behavior and mental state to trully appreciate amongst all the people who are genuinely interested in bashing gay people. They're everywhere. The United States is about 50-50 on gay marriage right now, a lot of people everywhere are definitely "anti-gay" and the effect is extremely toxic to the psyche of gay people. Use of these words reinforces those opinions amongst those who are anti-gay, regardless of intent. A person who is against gay people hearing other people say "gay" and "faggot" doesn't have to understand the intent to have his idea of gay is wrong reinforced. Moreover, I find it constricting as a male how often I'm told, via commercials, via other people bashing gay people, via rediculous expectations of gender, how awful it is for me to express affection to another male. Not every society or every community is like this. I should state I live in the southern United States. But, it leads me to believe that for all males, this notion of bashing gays and of reinforcing those notions with using the word "gay" and "faggot" and "suck a dick", etc, tends to separate us from other males and make it more difficult to achieve pair bonds that could really matter. I believe it also makes women feel bad for being female. And if fellatio is so denigrating, then if you are a straight male, you might be hurt by this because your female companion does not wish to denigrate herself by performing fellatio for you. Or maybe, she even feels shame for being penetrated. As to the arguments that this is the internet and why does it matter? Some pro on some stream might read this (I AM LOOKING AT YOU DESTINY) and think, you know what, I do have little kids and even adults for whom great mental pain and many horrible memories are attached to these words and maybe I should stop using these words. Others might read this and become a tiny step closer to being for gay marriage. This community takes itself seriously, is heavily moderated for a reason, and tends slowly towards a better place to share ideas and resonate around common interests. This thread may do a bit towards advancing that goal, and so yes, lets take it seriously. Finally, for those who believe that we should lend a helping hand to those that are struggling, I hope we can see that those who grow up in self-shame and a sense of social isolation are in need of a bit of assistance. It is hard for the gay rights movement to make progress because people typically respect strength, and its hard to have strength after the formative years of a gay youth that could be qualitatively described as an emotional beatdown of the individual. While it is important to become less a victim, it is also important to acknowledge that victimization occured, and if you're strong and self-confident, consider that the change asked of you (stop reinforcing this idea) is so much less than the change asked of these victims (change your worldview to a positive, self-actualized, self-confident human). If you read my whole post, I appreciate it, thank you, Agitprop | ||
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
if you let those words anger you then guess what? you are satsifying the person who insulted you. that is EXACTLY what they want from you. when someone insults you they WANT to hurt you, they WANT to make u cry and they WANT to make you feel bad. that is what a fucking insult is.... when u call someone a "bitch" it is no diffrent from calling them a "faggot". when u call someone a "whore" it is no diffrent from calling him gay. even something as small as saying "your a idiot" or "your a moron" has the same exact goal which is to make u feel bad about who you are. so the best thing to do is LET IT THE FUCK GO. seriously, stop letting them get to you or the insulters will only insult you more. why? because they now know what buttons to push to make u mad. dont let them get to you and just ignore it... there is no reason to bump this thread and no reason for it to have existed in the first place. there will always be someone that insults you because they dont feel good about there own self. because of that they will personally attack you to make you feel as bad as they are feeling, but if you ignore that and dont let it bother you then the insultor has failed at his goal. the person that insulted you will feel even worse about himself because he could not make you feel as bad as he is feeling. you are still happy and he is still in a bad mood, u have won. so why give them what they want? by making threads like these u are publically saying "HERE IS MY BUTTON! PLEASE PUSH IT SO U CAN MAKE ME FEEL BAD!" just let it go... | ||
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ThatGuy89
United Kingdom1968 Posts
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On February 28 2012 18:38 ThatGuy89 wrote: funny. i played a guy on ladder yesterday and he started by saying 'gl hf ♥' now that u mention it, same thing happened to me a few days ago. guy tried to cheese and clamed he was a girl. idk if it really was a girl or not, but im sure its some new cheesing strat. | ||
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Flondra
Canada56 Posts
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