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United States23455 Posts
On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing.
Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape.
And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon.
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On November 22 2014 07:56 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:53 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:On November 22 2014 07:47 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:44 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
Hmm don't Dota players use this term all the time? I mean out of context it's a terrible tweet but in the gaming world this just means he thinks he's going to win by a large amount in his next game. Doesn't mean that I agree that they use the term for that but he obviously didn't mean it literally. (Besides Maddelisk would beat him up IRL she's amazingly strong lol). I can understand fragbite's decision because they don't want to have to explain that shit. Still really really nasty for Maddelisk to have to read such things, but I feel a bit bad for Kas too as he'd never mean this and english is not his first language. I think Kas clearly did not mean the word "rape" using its literal definition. However, I don't think it is a good idea to allow "rape" to fester in gaming communities anymore. Just because people use the term "all the time" doesn't mean we should continue doing so. You aren't helping to get girls into gaming by using words like rape. Oh yeah as I said it's a very understandable decision to draw a line and ban him from the tourny, I just hope Kas doesn't get in trouble too much and that this doesn't blow up more. Oh I imagine it won't, and I don't think it should. Kas has apologized personally and Maddelisk has accepted it. I also think this will keep Kas from doing this again. Basically I don't think Kas should be crucified or anything, but I think this is as good a time as any to open up a conversation about this kind of terminology (includes other hate speech in my mind e.g. retarded). This isn't as big of an issue in SC2 as in other games of course.
Honestly, if I were his team manager I would forbid him from ever tweeting anything anymore without my permission. If I wouldn't outright fire him on the spot that is.
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On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing.
Don't try to argue that point... it was fun being that subculture that once consisted of lik 99,8% of guys once, but those times are over and with it the way we communicate over our grudges and stuff. We are mainstream now baby! Need to behave a bit better!
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Sad, Kas has never seemed like a BM guy to me. Not making excuses for him but the fact that English isn't his first language and he probably doesn't speak it much outside the not exactly PC gaming community didn't help. Hopefully this doesn't affect him going forward.
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United States23455 Posts
On November 22 2014 07:57 CamoPillbox wrote:Hmm so rape no pointed on nickname + Sweden tourney and most of this weird cause gets miracously Sweden player Sortof who advance for free no conspiracy here?  points for kas that he keeped his cool about this, cause this is bu.ls.it of high calibre.For protest i will not watch tournament easy for me i dont like unfair games behind scenes. If he sayed it in game or in lobby cause rage ok but with no point on twitter u can say u rape whole world and who cares cause words is free especcially in games on internet where nobody mean what they write in 99% of time . I guess in Sweden have no sense of humour. PS: if u play tournament watch opponents twitters cause they can say something that u can capitalize on
Oh for the love of god man
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United States23455 Posts
And people do raise good points. What Nightend did was probably a good deal worse...
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On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon.
So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault?
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On November 22 2014 07:57 CamoPillbox wrote:Hmm so rape no pointed on nickname + Sweden tourney and most of this weird cause gets miracously Sweden player Sortof who advance for free no conspiracy here? points for kas that he keeped his cool about this, cause this is bu.ls.it of high calibre.For protest i will not watch tournament easy for me i dont like unfair games behind scenes. If he sayed it in game or in lobby cause rage ok but with no point on twitter u can say u rape whole world and who cares cause words is free especcially in games on internet where nobody mean what they write in 99% of time . I guess in Sweden have no sense of humour. PS: if u play tournament watch opponents twitters cause they can say something that u can capitalize on
lmao
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United States23455 Posts
On November 22 2014 08:04 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon. So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault?
If you don't mind I'm going to stop swimming after this red herring now
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On November 22 2014 08:06 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:04 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon. So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault? If you don't mind I'm going to stop swimming after this red herring now
It's fine if you don't want to explain your opinions.
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On November 22 2014 07:14 Absentia wrote:
Using the word 'rape' to describe beating somebody at a video game has always been distasteful; the sooner it's no longer part of gaming's vernacular the better.
I feel this fine statement deserves to be repeated because it touches the core of this issue.
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Stupid drama, nothing more imo. I understand that the tournament kinda had to dq him, but that they actually "had to"is kinda embarassing tbh.
I think the fact that this got so "huge" is extremely childish and shows the problem we are facing right now (everybody gets mad at rather unimportant stuff way too fast).
Parting says he will rape avilo? Haha lolol
Someone says the same about a gamer girl? OMG most bm of all time.
That double standard is worse than his statement imo. (cause we all KNOW what he meant)
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United States23455 Posts
On November 22 2014 08:07 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:06 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 08:04 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon. So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault? If you don't mind I'm going to stop swimming after this red herring now It's fine if you don't want to explain your opinions.
Excellent thank you for your permission
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On November 22 2014 07:41 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:38 Paljas wrote:On November 22 2014 07:26 travis wrote:On November 22 2014 07:23 Paljas wrote:On November 22 2014 07:11 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
So what Kas said was obviously wrong, but I kind of don't like how because he said it to a girl, it makes it suddenly much much worse. But thats how it is. Saying "Nigger" to a black person is much worse than saying it to a white person, and saying that you will "gas someone" is much worse if you say it to a jewish person. Public statements dont just exist in a vacuum, historical and social context is always important. rape is not exclusive to women, and it's a stupid comparison anyways because this isn't even the context in which rape was being used. saying that you will rape someone is obviously always inacceptable. but its especially problematic when you make this statement directly to a woman, who are way more often victim of rape and sexual harassment. for a lot of them, the "joke" might be reality. i dont quite understand what you mean with your second sentecne. you cant just use a word and act like it has no connection to it's acutal use in our society. what I mean is that when you use the word "nigger" to a person there is only one meaning. when you say you are going to "rape" someone, in the context of the game, everyone knows you don't mean that you are going to forcibly have your way with them. so it's not really a good example, because those 2 situations are not the same.
I'm pretty sure that's exactly what most people mean. What they don't mean is that the forceful way-having will involve their genitalia. Interestingly, there is a vast cornucopia of alternative verbiage which could be used to send a similar message in a less offensive way. Just be original and don't use the word rape which (rightly) implies a sexual context due to its unfortunate endemic nature in human history.
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On November 22 2014 08:04 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon. So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault?
There are a lot of differences between the two examples you picked. First of all, when people use the word rape they draw heavily on the symbolism often to a disturbing degree, while the word beat is no longer dependent on the primary meaning of the word. Secondly, rape is something men do to women so it becomes disturbing again when men use it triumphantly in their language as an expression of victory. Third, the emotional connotations of rape are more severe than beat.
But you know all of this, so why are you trying to play Debate Club in this thread? :/
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On November 22 2014 08:02 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 07:57 CamoPillbox wrote:Hmm so rape no pointed on nickname + Sweden tourney and most of this weird cause gets miracously Sweden player Sortof who advance for free no conspiracy here? points for kas that he keeped his cool about this, cause this is bu.ls.it of high calibre.For protest i will not watch tournament easy for me i dont like unfair games behind scenes. If he sayed it in game or in lobby cause rage ok but with no point on twitter u can say u rape whole world and who cares cause words is free especcially in games on internet where nobody mean what they write in 99% of time . I guess in Sweden have no sense of humour. PS: if u play tournament watch opponents twitters cause they can say something that u can capitalize on Oh for the love of god man
With that logic on this case is MC disqualified from all tournaments nearly , there is only that MC is well known for that KAS not so they just diss him + it help Sweden player advance for free i guess i am on point . Go pray to another God maybe he will not be blind like yours.....
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On November 22 2014 08:07 Darkwhite wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:06 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 08:04 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 08:01 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:58 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:55 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:51 Darkwhite wrote:On November 22 2014 07:33 maartendq wrote:On November 22 2014 07:02 Zanzabarr wrote:
Well, Maddelisk has to get wins somehow. In all seriousness though, she would have been "raped" in the series. Men can rape other men. If kas said this about a male opponent, nothing would have come of it. No, she would have suffered a heavy defeat, stood no chance whatsoever, lost heavily, been completely outmatched, not on the same level etc. There are a lot more appropriate ways to say the above; the verb to rape is used way too liberally in the gaming community.. Beat is also used super liberally, and literally means to inflict blows on. You know full well that is not the same thing. Beat is a word with multiple definitions in the english language. The second of which is, "defeat (someone) in a game, competition, election, or commercial venture." Here is a list of the generally accepted definitions for rape. So like I said, not even close to the same thing So, in 1920, beat picked up a secondary meaning of defeating someone in competetion, while in the 2000s, rape started to pick up a secondary meaning of humiliating someone in competition. Surely not even close to the same thing. Yeah sure. I'd rather we didn't pick such as shitty word to create a secondary definition for but it seems some people think the die is cast on that and there is nothing we can do to stop this "secondary definition" of rape. And yeah it is still different TODAY because that second definition isn't at all established or agreed upon. So, if the secondary meaning was better established, it wouldn't be a problem, just like how it isn't a problem that beat makes light of physical assault? If you don't mind I'm going to stop swimming after this red herring now It's fine if you don't want to explain your opinions.
Beat isn't an offensive word.
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On November 22 2014 08:11 CamoPillbox wrote:Show nested quote +On November 22 2014 08:02 Darkhorse wrote:On November 22 2014 07:57 CamoPillbox wrote:Hmm so rape no pointed on nickname + Sweden tourney and most of this weird cause gets miracously Sweden player Sortof who advance for free no conspiracy here? points for kas that he keeped his cool about this, cause this is bu.ls.it of high calibre.For protest i will not watch tournament easy for me i dont like unfair games behind scenes. If he sayed it in game or in lobby cause rage ok but with no point on twitter u can say u rape whole world and who cares cause words is free especcially in games on internet where nobody mean what they write in 99% of time . I guess in Sweden have no sense of humour. PS: if u play tournament watch opponents twitters cause they can say something that u can capitalize on Oh for the love of god man With that logic on this case is MC disqualified from all tournaments nearly , there is only that MC is well known for that KAS not so they just diss him + it help Sweden player advance for free i guess i am on point . Go pray to another God maybe he will not be blind like yours.....
take a nice chill pill from your box. you are not making a lot of sense.
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Sometimes my emotions goes out of control, but it happens not quite often, so I think the same thing happened to Kas, don't blame him too much, he's a good guy.
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I don't mind seeing double meanings in words but when you put that word in this context that argument is gone entirely. I don't think it is a big deal though, but the punishment is just. He probably regrets it we move on and an example is set. Shouldn't make too big of a deal out of this one. People are obsessed with being entirely on one side of the other. It's annoying.
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EPT
