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Observer style? Which type do you prefer for SC2? - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
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MetalPanda
Profile Joined April 2012
Canada1152 Posts
May 20 2012 14:53 GMT
#21
I actually didn't like OGN's observing that much in SC2. Gotta hand it to GSL there.
menaceko
Profile Joined May 2012
United States58 Posts
May 20 2012 15:13 GMT
#22
I like everyoneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
BW: Nal_rA, JangBi, Grape, Stork, Brave, Bisu, mini, Horang2, BeSt, Movie, Jaehoon, Pusan, Kal, Shuttle, Reach, Anytime SC2: PartinG, Squirtle. HerO, NonY, MaNa, MC, HuK, SaSe, WhiteRa, Genius, Inori, Oz, ToD, JYP, KilleR(SangHo), VINES, TAiLS, NaNiwa
0kz
Profile Joined January 2010
Italy1118 Posts
May 20 2012 16:06 GMT
#23
If feel like being in bw forums ogn would obviously win hahaha... I didn't feel much the difference so I cant really vote..
constantine
Profile Joined June 2009
Bulgaria49 Posts
May 20 2012 16:17 GMT
#24
On May 20 2012 17:20 Lucumo wrote:
Don't care, I don't watch it.


Nice contribution,

On topic: OGN obs know what they are doing
"Stick them with the pointy end."
Fragile51
Profile Joined October 2011
Netherlands15767 Posts
May 20 2012 16:21 GMT
#25
OGN obs didn't bother me, but i prefer GSL's style. I wanna see things like how many workers were lost and things like that. It's valuable information that is hard to actually keep track off for the viewer.
SenorChang
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Australia4730 Posts
May 20 2012 16:29 GMT
#26
not really going to get an objective answer asking in this forum though
legend is a good obs (gsl eng obs)
ლ(╹◡╹ლ)
Lucumo
Profile Joined January 2010
6850 Posts
May 20 2012 16:33 GMT
#27
On May 21 2012 01:17 constantine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2012 17:20 Lucumo wrote:
Don't care, I don't watch it.


Nice contribution

Just another way of saying:
On May 20 2012 20:29 Stratos wrote:
I don't understand the thread at all. Why is it in the BW forums?
slytown
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Korea (South)1411 Posts
May 20 2012 16:45 GMT
#28
OGN does very well and I think they may have the best production in esports, but I have to give it up for ST_Legend over at GSL. He really stepped it up for SC2 and improved upon everyone before him. The best observer on the planet, "The Sauron Observor, ST_Legend.
The best Flash meme ever: http://imgur.com/zquoK
chillpenguin
Profile Joined March 2011
United States90 Posts
May 20 2012 16:59 GMT
#29
On May 20 2012 22:53 fabiano wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2012 22:28 Angra wrote:
What's the GSL/Foreign tournaments style? I haven't really watched much of either so what's the difference between those and the OGN style?


OGN is awesome, with dramatic close-ups in players faces and the observer never misses any action, the screen is overall cleaner (no unit health bar, no APM bar, no units lost bar, or any other of the useless bars). Cast feels dynamic, especially with such awesome commentators and BW epic crowd.

In GSL they just put on the screen as much shit as they possibly can, they often keep switching those useless bars (APM, units lost, workers lost, etc), they also leave all the units/buildings health bars on all the time. Instead of epic zooms, they just have a static camera in each players face all game long in the HUD. Cast feels static, especially with almost no crowd cheering.


This is not true. In GSL only the units/buildings selected have health bars shown, and they mainly only show the Production and Units tab. After a successful (or even unsuccessful) harrassment they may bring up the "Units/Workers Lost" overlay on the middle for a brief amount of time to show how successful the harrassment. I never see them use the APM tab (not to say they never have I just haven't seen it), and I actually saw OGN use the APM in the first game I watched today, the PvP with Best vs whoever he was playing.
KaiserCommander
Profile Joined April 2010
Mexico290 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-20 20:16:21
May 20 2012 20:12 GMT
#30
On May 21 2012 01:59 chillpenguin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2012 22:53 fabiano wrote:
On May 20 2012 22:28 Angra wrote:
What's the GSL/Foreign tournaments style? I haven't really watched much of either so what's the difference between those and the OGN style?


OGN is awesome, with dramatic close-ups in players faces and the observer never misses any action, the screen is overall cleaner (no unit health bar, no APM bar, no units lost bar, or any other of the useless bars). Cast feels dynamic, especially with such awesome commentators and BW epic crowd.

In GSL they just put on the screen as much shit as they possibly can, they often keep switching those useless bars (APM, units lost, workers lost, etc), they also leave all the units/buildings health bars on all the time. Instead of epic zooms, they just have a static camera in each players face all game long in the HUD. Cast feels static, especially with almost no crowd cheering.


This is not true. In GSL only the units/buildings selected have health bars shown, and they mainly only show the Production and Units tab. After a successful (or even unsuccessful) harrassment they may bring up the "Units/Workers Lost" overlay on the middle for a brief amount of time to show how successful the harrassment. I never see them use the APM tab (not to say they never have I just haven't seen it), and I actually saw OGN use the APM in the first game I watched today, the PvP with Best vs whoever he was playing.


That's 'cause the opinion you're quoting was a very stubborn biased OGN fan... I've seen Proleague for long time and GSL too and I both are good to their objetives. It's annoying how hard fans of Father BroodWar (I've been one for 11 years) have silly, biased and unfounded opinions. If you don't like Starcraft and Strarcraft 2 you're not a Starcraft fan at all in overall terms. The fact about the tabs was almost hillarious, only streamers use APM tabs...

And for topic purposes, I'm more comfortable with GSL observer, Starcraft 2 flux of information (due higher dps and mobility) runs at higher rate and it's necesary certain extra info for enjoy the game... Both systems are designed for their purposes...
Jinro, Polt, Bomber, ForGG, MajOr, Flash, Maru. Terran Fighting...
UndoneJin
Profile Joined February 2011
United States438 Posts
May 20 2012 20:19 GMT
#31
I only started watching BW when SC2 came out but the OGN observers/camera work/production are just off-the-charts good.
I've been lost since the day I was born ----- You're gonna carry that weight
RotterdamBlt
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Canada46 Posts
May 20 2012 20:22 GMT
#32
Is it just me or was the resolution for PL kinda weird? It's my first time watching, so I have no clue what their stream setup is like. Anyways, I prefer GSL's as they often show information such as upgrades, worker count, etc. Plus, during a big battle I want to watch just the fight, not the player's reactions.
0kz
Profile Joined January 2010
Italy1118 Posts
May 20 2012 20:28 GMT
#33
On May 21 2012 05:22 RotterdamBlt wrote:
Is it just me or was the resolution for PL kinda weird? It's my first time watching, so I have no clue what their stream setup is like. Anyways, I prefer GSL's as they often show information such as upgrades, worker count, etc. Plus, during a big battle I want to watch just the fight, not the player's reactions.


it is because they brodcast for tv, but I read somewhere they want to change and make it better next year
bITt.mAN
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Switzerland3701 Posts
May 20 2012 20:33 GMT
#34
The production (blending of the shots of both player's faces) was impeccable, and bar Windows 7 trolling, the show went great (discounting any of the games \.

What I really wish the observers would do is get really good at manipulating the camera, bringing more cinemamatic artsy stuff! When all it is is watching big (beathball^2) engagements or big busts, they can make it look REALLY cool if they want to. Maybe not too much in the live games, but certainly in the replay review I would really like to see them:
  • Rotate the camera to align with the sides of attack so not // or \\ but || .
  • Zoom in adequately, especially for small micro engagements.
  • Unless they are deliberately showing stats on something that is selected, hide the GUI at the bottom for the most part. This is my preference, I just feel it looks much nicer! Combine with Zoom.
  • The best: Zoom, follow the army close as it makes a large dynamic movement, then rotate and spin out and around as the battle stabalizes.

The last one would be AMAZING for situations like "CJ Z" 's first bust/agression versus "KT T". When the big zergling army is streaming in, how sick would it be if in the recap you could watch that engagement, flying low over the zerglings as they run in and then panning out. It would finally look like a semi-realistic movie, rather than a strategy 'simulator'.

I should do a video of Observer techniques I wish would be implemented, I guess. It's all about using the tools to the most of their potential, and I would prefer a bit of artsyness over straight-forward strategy.
BW4LYF . . . . . . PM me, I LOVE PMs. . . . . . Long live "NaDa's Body" . . . . . . Fantasy | Bisu/Best | Jaedong . . . . .
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
May 20 2012 20:36 GMT
#35
OGN will improve over the course of time anyway.
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Kuja
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States1759 Posts
May 20 2012 21:01 GMT
#36
To be honest, I think I enjoyed them not having the production tab on the whole time. There was one point in the game where they showed storm when it just began researching and when an attack came a bit later they didnt switch back to the production tab. It increased the excitement for me i was yelling in my head please have storm please have storm! and he ended up getting it in the middle of the engagement which I think is cool.
“Who's to say that my light is better than your darkness? Who's to say death is better than your darkness? Who am I to say?”
Herculix
Profile Joined May 2010
United States946 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-20 21:36:26
May 20 2012 21:33 GMT
#37
I think OGN does better camerawork but ST Legend (GSL obs) is better at utilizing some of the SC2 specific obs tools. I think with some practice OGN will just be better in every way, coming from someone who has only seen WCG and a few PL games, while playing SC2 since beta. They already do some of what Legend does, such as timing the relevent information like worker loss after harassment, etc. but they've got a little bit more to go! I'm really excited overall with how well they did since it was OGN's second major SC2 broadcast, counting WCG.
Neo7
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States922 Posts
May 20 2012 22:00 GMT
#38
I enjoy the OGN style much better. Who honestly cares about specifics when it comes to numbers? All you need to know was harassment was successful and instead of wasting time exclaiming how many a player got, the caster should be stating how significant of a blow it is to him and how he/she will recover as well as possible follow ups by the attacking player. Some people are curious though and this can be shown in the replay overview rather than the actual game (something that GSL and GSTL are severely lacking in their broadcasts). APM and stuff by OGN is usually done in individual leagues right after a commercial break with graphs to show peak APM and average APM. There is no need to view that information in game (again useless information right then).
It takes an idiot to do cool things.
Chvol
Profile Joined August 2010
United States200 Posts
May 20 2012 22:17 GMT
#39
Every tournament has a slightly different observing style, and as long as the observer catches the action, the little differences don't make or break the show. In fact, I like seeing stylistic differences between tournaments, and hope this diversity remains.
Darksoldierr
Profile Joined May 2010
Hungary2013 Posts
May 20 2012 22:29 GMT
#40
On May 21 2012 01:33 Lucumo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 21 2012 01:17 constantine wrote:
On May 20 2012 17:20 Lucumo wrote:
Don't care, I don't watch it.


Nice contribution

Just another way of saying:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2012 20:29 Stratos wrote:
I don't understand the thread at all. Why is it in the BW forums?


I wonder why could it be
What do humans know of our pain? We have sung songs of lament since before your ancestors crawled on their bellies from the sea.
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