EPTNew HotS Units/Abilities in Blizzcon - Page 343
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nazdrovie
27 Posts
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Daralii
United States16991 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:01 Unnamed Player wrote: You mean anti air against the ULTIMATE air unit. Spores will be nullified by Oracles. Of course you are right we have nothing much to do with our time so will be able to split up our overlords easily around all our bases. Corruptors should counter tempest pretty hard if their attack stays the same. The tempest's air attack doesn't do much to armored units as of now. | ||
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KiF1rE
United States964 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:03 Daralii wrote: Corruptors should counter tempest pretty hard if their attack stays the same. The tempest's air attack doesn't do much to armored units as of now. pretty much the same with vikings... now my question is, ive always have had trouble with mass terran mech if they manage to get to late game. my solution carriers.... now how will this tempest hold up against mass viking and quickly eliminate siege tanks and turrets and thors? the oracle seems useless, we need a raider not a rainbow generator. it would be awesome if we could use the arc nexus ability in combination with it though. as we would deny mining and kill workers. replicator is going to be impossible to balance. its either going to be awesome or useless. to me it sounds like alot units with the other races are getting tweaked as well... i havent heard about any tweaks or changes to protoss units... | ||
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CrumpetGuvnor
Australia302 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:01 Unnamed Player wrote: You mean anti air against the ULTIMATE air unit. Spores will be nullified by Oracles. Of course you are right we have nothing much to do with our time so will be able to split up our overlords easily around all our bases. In all honesty, it won't be hard to prevent. I bet you can just magic box your corruptors to kill a lone tempest. Or give each set of overlords a different rally point whilst they are hatching. Stop whinging and try to see the positives. The game isn't even out yet. You have no idea how things will turn out | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:01 Unnamed Player wrote: You mean anti air against the ULTIMATE air unit. Spores will be nullified by Oracles. Of course you are right we have nothing much to do with our time so will be able to split up our overlords easily around all our bases. Yeah, we're going to have enough oracles to defeat all your spores, and have fleet beacon and tempests on the field just to kill your overlords, before you have hydras, infestors, or corrupters out on the field. Did you really think this one through? | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:02 nazdrovie wrote: Also, can anybody give me insight as to why the mothership needed to be scrapped in favor of giving nexus mass recall? We were just starting to see players like Kiwikaki using them consitently with awesome results... Uh ya and now KiwiKaki will be able to use it even more. Is that bad? It's pretty much what they said, mothership is the first target and it's slow so it wasn't exciting. Plus I think vortex was a really difficult ability to balance so they just wanted to get rid of it. Frankly, the archon toilet is stupid. | ||
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muffinsssss
29 Posts
On October 23 2011 12:55 Unnamed Player wrote: Those Tempest are going to be able to fly in and kill every friggen clumped up overlord in 5 seconds and fly out unharmed, leaving Zergs severely supply capped. Wow I never thought of that...talk about broken. Might as well remove Zerg as a race. | ||
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Unnamed Player
Australia89 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:09 CrumpetGuvnor wrote: In all honesty, it won't be hard to prevent. I bet you can just magic box your corruptors to kill a lone tempest. Or give each set of overlords a different rally point whilst they are hatching. Stop whinging and try to see the positives. The game isn't even out yet. You have no idea how things will turn out Firstly, don't tell me what i can and can not do. Secondly i was not whinging, i was pointing out what one of these new units could do that was a positive for the Protoss as the general consensus from them so far has been that their units are crap and they have been dudded. As for the counters of Corruptors etc, according to Browder, the Tempest is going to be the dominant air unit by far, so i'm not as convinced how easily they will be countered but time will tell of course. | ||
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moocow2009
77 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:15 Unnamed Player wrote: Firstly, don't tell me what i can and can not do. Secondly i was not whinging, i was pointing out what one of these new units could do that was a positive for the Protoss as the general consensus from them so far has been that their units are crap and they have been dudded. As for the counters of Corruptors etc, according to Browder, the Tempest is going to be the dominant air unit by far, so i'm not as convinced how easily they will be countered but time will tell of course. Use hydras then. They're getting a speed upgrade, you might as well make use of it. Honestly, the whole idea of using Tempests to kill overlords just seems ridiculous to me. They're capital ships -- the replacements for carriers -- meaning that they're very late game units. If you seriously don't have the forces to deal with them at that point, why would the Protoss bother killing overlords? They might as well just kill all your buildings. | ||
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Soulish
Canada1403 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:08 KiF1rE wrote: pretty much the same with vikings... now my question is, ive always have had trouble with mass terran mech if they manage to get to late game. my solution carriers.... now how will this tempest hold up against mass viking and quickly eliminate siege tanks and turrets and thors? the oracle seems useless, we need a raider not a rainbow generator. it would be awesome if we could use the arc nexus ability in combination with it though. as we would deny mining and kill workers. replicator is going to be impossible to balance. its either going to be awesome or useless. to me it sounds like alot units with the other races are getting tweaked as well... i havent heard about any tweaks or changes to protoss units... who cares if it doesnt do much damage against armoured? It has splash! it'll rape everything that's not massive | ||
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nazdrovie
27 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:11 happyness wrote: Uh ya and now KiwiKaki will be able to use it even more. Is that bad? He won't be using it at all because the mothership got scrapped, if you're saying mass recall is going to be used more then no that's not bad, but giving that ability to every nexus with apparently no tech requirement seems like a apretty unreasonable buff when you see how well mass recall already works with a single mothership... It's pretty much what they said, mothership is the first target and it's slow so it wasn't exciting. Plus I think vortex was a really difficult ability to balance so they just wanted to get rid of it. Frankly, the archon toilet is stupid. Wasn't exciting? Didn't you hear the crowd when kiwi beat stephano with it? Or hear about "don't worry tahts halo"? I can understand vortex was hard to balance but they could have replaced that single ability without removing the unit couldn't they? And the archon toilet got patched, they shouldn't have trouble fixing the air units issue. | ||
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PermaScrub
32 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:24 Soulish wrote: who cares if it doesnt do much damage against armoured? It has splash! it'll rape everything that's not massive LOGIC! Because thors do so well against brood lords when terrans go mech. :/ | ||
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Doc Daneeka
United States577 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:02 nazdrovie wrote: Also, can anybody give me insight as to why the mothership needed to be scrapped in favor of giving nexus mass recall? We were just starting to see players like Kiwikaki using them consitently with awesome results... it's possible they'll continue to take the WoL ladder (and any pros still playing WoL) into consideration when they're looking for changes to make for LotV. but yeah, i have mixed feelings about removing units. also it astonishes me that terran had nothing removed. if you're going to keep piling toys on top of toys for one race why take such drastic measures to 'balance' the other two? like the viper, i wouldve even been happy if it had just been a new utility caster and they left the overseer in. it's not like the overseer broke the game or anything. actually nothing they removed was broken. it's all stuff people hadn't figured out how to use yet. kind of irritating. also it kinda blows me away that the marauder is still in the game when they added yet another armor-busting unit. | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:25 nazdrovie wrote: He won't be using it at all because the mothership got scrapped, if you're saying mass recall is going to be used more then no that's not bad, but giving that ability to every nexus with apparently no tech requirement seems like a apretty unreasonable buff when you see how well mass recall already works with a single mothership... I don't understand. So you think kiwi only used mass recall because it was on the mothership? I think he got the mothership so he could use recall and now he can use recall more, that is what I was trying to say. Wasn't exciting? Didn't you hear the crowd when kiwi beat stephano with it? Or hear about "don't worry tahts halo"? I can understand vortex was hard to balance but they could have replaced that single ability without removing the unit couldn't they? And the archon toilet got patched, they shouldn't have trouble fixing the air units issue. The kiwi stephano game was good because of the recall ability. Then at the end when kiwi was all mined out and had a smaller army, he tried to vortex, missed, vortexed again and roflstomped stephano because the archon toilet is still ridiculously good. I don't like games where if a player gets a good vortex he wins if not he loses. The whole game shouldn't rest on one ability from one unit. | ||
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nazdrovie
27 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:36 Doc Daneeka wrote: actually nothing they removed was broken. it's all stuff people hadn't figured out how to use yet. kind of irritating. This is exactly how i feel, it's like blizzard isn't aware of the recent gain in interest for the mothership.. also it kinda blows me away that the marauder is still in the game when they added yet another armor-busting unit. yea that choice also puzzles me | ||
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Daralii
United States16991 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:36 Doc Daneeka wrote: also it kinda blows me away that the marauder is still in the game when they added yet another armor-busting unit. Terran was in danger of dropping below a 50% winrate that one time. Can't have that. | ||
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Reaper51
Canada64 Posts
Mutas are already handled by the following: -blink stalkers -sentries -archons -high templars -phoenixes | ||
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nazdrovie
27 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:38 happyness wrote: What I'm saying is that kiwi found out that the mothership is fine the way it is (at least against zerg) and it is only a matter of time before motherships can have a real part in the metagame, many protoss players have been integrating them into their games recently, which is why i don't understand blizzards decision to remove it.I don't understand. So you think kiwi only used mass recall because it was on the mothership? I think he got the mothership so he could use recall and now he can use recall more, that is what I was trying to say. The kiwi stephano game was good because of the recall ability. Then at the end when kiwi was all mined out and had a smaller army, he tried to vortex, missed, vortexed again and roflstomped stephano because the archon toilet is still ridiculously good. I don't like games where if a player gets a good vortex he wins if not he loses. The whole game shouldn't rest on one ability from one unit. Kiwi didn't rest on one ability to win, he used several: mass recall, blink, vortex and mass cloacking amongst other things. you said yourself that the game was good because of mass recall, so why are you taking the "omg he only won because of vortex" stance? And why are you in favor of a major buff to mass recall? Also and on an unrelated note, @ the post below this one: guardian shield is exceptionally good against mutas. | ||
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JinnAxel
Canada50 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:42 Reaper51 wrote: I don't get the point of the Tempest Mutas are already handled by the following: -blink stalkers -sentries -archons -high templars -phoenixes Lol sentires. They'll tickle the mutas to death. Archons are on the same tech level as Tempests and have the same gas cost, their aoe is significantly smaller than a tempest though. Phoenix can't adequately deal with mass muta unless you're willing to micro them around the map continuously. Honestly, they just tried to buff Protoss air and kind of failed. | ||
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Daralii
United States16991 Posts
On October 23 2011 13:42 Reaper51 wrote: I don't get the point of the Tempest Mutas are already handled by the following: -blink stalkers -sentries -archons -high templars -phoenixes The main thing is that those stop working once zerg gets an enormous cloud of them, which is pretty common if they want to force a baserace. I *think* phoenixes can infinitely kite mutas, but it's going to take a long time and a lot of focus. Storm works, but it's going to take a lot of storms if they're not just letting their mutas sit in it. | ||
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