|
On August 15 2010 04:25 Pandain wrote:
Fadoodle this. It looks like there needs to be a Boxer for Zerg, a new Emperoer.
If these pros won't be cool kids and think of varying strats, then it looks like I'll need to fill in the gap.
Time to make Zerg strong again.
Pandain: The Zerg Bonjwa.
Wish me luck!
I've had no encouragement so far 
|
If they don't come out with a balance patch, i suspect starcraft 2 is gonna be all TvT
I don't really think zerg is underpowwered. People didn't abuse nydus enough to call imba yet
|
On August 15 2010 09:39 DaZe wrote:
Having a job that is depending on whether a 1 month old game is balanced or not might be the issue.
Looking back at SC1 / BW / WC3 / TFT, basically all previous blizzard games, I'm sure we wont see a very balanced SC2 over the next couple of months.
By playing the "underpowered race" and showing blizzard there is "nothing" u can do, no matter what, might be a better approach than switching to the "overpowered race". Not only for your team, but for the entire community...
Though that would be the smarter move for the long term approach, since dimaga depends on doing good to make money he's probably decided he needs to act now and needs a change soon if he were to stay as zerg.
|
On August 15 2010 10:31 rauk wrote:
i play terran and completely agree that the race is stupid broken. i switched from Z with 300 points and over 700 games at the very end of beta and now i've got 600+ in diamond as T with less than 100 games.
nerf hydra DPS, put them back at tier 1 and make hydra speed researchable again while nerfing their speed on creep. put roaches back at tier 2 with 2 armor. move banelings to tier 2. hydras + overlords with default detection basically put Z on equal footing with any of the several early game T strats. you also get the added possibilty of a hydra break in the early game which is a little more difficult to defend than just "lol make 7 roaches and die to one bunker." also, baneling busts are boring to watch, boring to defend against, and boring to do. hydra breaks are much more exciting. move marauders back in the tech tree, it's pretty stupid to have a siege unit that kills spines instantly available right away.
increase magic box size so your units don't clump as much, and tanks become slightly less powerful, which should also benefit bio vs banelings.
should decrease mining efficiency so that 1 base play is a lot weaker than it is now. if you saturate earlier, your income is less and the extra workers you produce aren't worth as much until you expand. since expanding becomes more important, get rid of kulas and LT and all cliffable maps since the only purpose of cliffs is to be abused by one base terran.
While we're at it, they should put in lurkers and defilers, give all of the units new portraits, add 30 missions and call it "Heart of the Swarm".
This is not how you balance a game, this is how you troll a community. You are overshooting so hard you're breaking the sound barrier.
|
I switched from T to P, it's much more fun for my 1a2a3a playstyle and I get a shiny DT icon. just went 1-2 vs Zerg.
|
this thread makes me want to switch to zerg
|
On August 15 2010 10:37 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2010 10:31 rauk wrote:
i play terran and completely agree that the race is stupid broken. i switched from Z with 300 points and over 700 games at the very end of beta and now i've got 600+ in diamond as T with less than 100 games.
nerf hydra DPS, put them back at tier 1 and make hydra speed researchable again while nerfing their speed on creep. put roaches back at tier 2 with 2 armor. move banelings to tier 2. hydras + overlords with default detection basically put Z on equal footing with any of the several early game T strats. you also get the added possibilty of a hydra break in the early game which is a little more difficult to defend than just "lol make 7 roaches and die to one bunker." also, baneling busts are boring to watch, boring to defend against, and boring to do. hydra breaks are much more exciting. move marauders back in the tech tree, it's pretty stupid to have a siege unit that kills spines instantly available right away.
increase magic box size so your units don't clump as much, and tanks become slightly less powerful, which should also benefit bio vs banelings.
should decrease mining efficiency so that 1 base play is a lot weaker than it is now. if you saturate earlier, your income is less and the extra workers you produce aren't worth as much until you expand. since expanding becomes more important, get rid of kulas and LT and all cliffable maps since the only purpose of cliffs is to be abused by one base terran. While we're at it, they should put in lurkers and defilers, give all of the units new portraits, add 30 missions and call it "Heart of the Swarm". This is not how you balance a game, this is how you troll a community. You are overshooting so hard you're breaking the sound barrier.
i think that they should put lurkers and defilers back in.
why should we have to spend a whole year playing nothing but TvT until HOTS and LOV get released and rebalance the game with new units?
either they intentionally released an unbalanced game planning to rebalance it with expansion packs later, or they're incompetent and really don't understand why T is OP right now.
you also didn't actually respond to any of my proposed changes, none of which require anything more than shuffling around the tech tree and tweaking some numbers (though i could be oversimplifying how hard it is to change mining efficiency).
|
On August 15 2010 10:42 Backpack wrote:
this thread makes me want to switch to zerg
This thread guilted me into switching...but I'm only high bronze so it's not that big a jump(hopefully)
|
On August 15 2010 10:40 jalstar wrote:
I switched from T to P, it's much more fun for my 1a2a3a playstyle and I get a shiny DT icon. just went 1-2 vs Zerg.
wouldn't it be W-s-click-s-click-s-click in SC2 
|
I think a buff to overlord/transport/nydus worms would help out. also a buff to creep tumors and hydra life.
|
On August 15 2010 10:43 rauk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2010 10:37 Redmark wrote:On August 15 2010 10:31 rauk wrote:
i play terran and completely agree that the race is stupid broken. i switched from Z with 300 points and over 700 games at the very end of beta and now i've got 600+ in diamond as T with less than 100 games.
nerf hydra DPS, put them back at tier 1 and make hydra speed researchable again while nerfing their speed on creep. put roaches back at tier 2 with 2 armor. move banelings to tier 2. hydras + overlords with default detection basically put Z on equal footing with any of the several early game T strats. you also get the added possibilty of a hydra break in the early game which is a little more difficult to defend than just "lol make 7 roaches and die to one bunker." also, baneling busts are boring to watch, boring to defend against, and boring to do. hydra breaks are much more exciting. move marauders back in the tech tree, it's pretty stupid to have a siege unit that kills spines instantly available right away.
increase magic box size so your units don't clump as much, and tanks become slightly less powerful, which should also benefit bio vs banelings.
should decrease mining efficiency so that 1 base play is a lot weaker than it is now. if you saturate earlier, your income is less and the extra workers you produce aren't worth as much until you expand. since expanding becomes more important, get rid of kulas and LT and all cliffable maps since the only purpose of cliffs is to be abused by one base terran. While we're at it, they should put in lurkers and defilers, give all of the units new portraits, add 30 missions and call it "Heart of the Swarm". This is not how you balance a game, this is how you troll a community. You are overshooting so hard you're breaking the sound barrier. i think that they should put lurkers and defilers back in. why should we have to spend a whole year playing nothing but TvT until HOTS and LOV get released and rebalance the game with new units? either they intentionally released an unbalanced game planning to rebalance it with expansion packs later, or they're incompetent and really don't understand why T is OP right now. you also didn't actually respond to any of my proposed changes, none of which require anything more than shuffling around the tech tree and tweaking some numbers (though i could be oversimplifying how hard it is to change mining efficiency).
Your changes are useless and you're whiny. I play random at diamond and while Zerg is a little weaker than the other two races, the state of the game isn't anywhere near as bad as people like you make it out to be. T is a little too strong, Z is a little too weak. Neither race is unplayably broken.
Dimaga is bluffing in an attempt to get Blizz to buff Zerg. And you're a whiny little brat who wants things his way. Your balance suggestions are terrible, so just don't try. Thanks.
|
Can't say I blame him at all. I switched myself from Z to P cause it got too frustrating
|
On August 15 2010 10:51 Gecko wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2010 10:40 jalstar wrote:
I switched from T to P, it's much more fun for my 1a2a3a playstyle and I get a shiny DT icon. just went 1-2 vs Zerg. wouldn't it be W-s-click-s-click-s-click in SC2
yes, still too used to bw lingo haha.
|
On August 15 2010 10:52 Ocedic wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2010 10:43 rauk wrote:On August 15 2010 10:37 Redmark wrote:On August 15 2010 10:31 rauk wrote:
i play terran and completely agree that the race is stupid broken. i switched from Z with 300 points and over 700 games at the very end of beta and now i've got 600+ in diamond as T with less than 100 games.
nerf hydra DPS, put them back at tier 1 and make hydra speed researchable again while nerfing their speed on creep. put roaches back at tier 2 with 2 armor. move banelings to tier 2. hydras + overlords with default detection basically put Z on equal footing with any of the several early game T strats. you also get the added possibilty of a hydra break in the early game which is a little more difficult to defend than just "lol make 7 roaches and die to one bunker." also, baneling busts are boring to watch, boring to defend against, and boring to do. hydra breaks are much more exciting. move marauders back in the tech tree, it's pretty stupid to have a siege unit that kills spines instantly available right away.
increase magic box size so your units don't clump as much, and tanks become slightly less powerful, which should also benefit bio vs banelings.
should decrease mining efficiency so that 1 base play is a lot weaker than it is now. if you saturate earlier, your income is less and the extra workers you produce aren't worth as much until you expand. since expanding becomes more important, get rid of kulas and LT and all cliffable maps since the only purpose of cliffs is to be abused by one base terran. While we're at it, they should put in lurkers and defilers, give all of the units new portraits, add 30 missions and call it "Heart of the Swarm". This is not how you balance a game, this is how you troll a community. You are overshooting so hard you're breaking the sound barrier. i think that they should put lurkers and defilers back in. why should we have to spend a whole year playing nothing but TvT until HOTS and LOV get released and rebalance the game with new units? either they intentionally released an unbalanced game planning to rebalance it with expansion packs later, or they're incompetent and really don't understand why T is OP right now. you also didn't actually respond to any of my proposed changes, none of which require anything more than shuffling around the tech tree and tweaking some numbers (though i could be oversimplifying how hard it is to change mining efficiency). Your changes are useless and you're whiny. I play random at diamond and while Zerg is a little weaker than the other two races, the state of the game isn't anywhere near as bad as people like you make it out to be. T is a little too strong, Z is a little too weak. Neither race is unplayably broken. Dimaga is bluffing in an attempt to get Blizz to buff Zerg. And you're a whiny little brat who wants things his way. Your balance suggestions are terrible, so just don't try. Thanks.
T is broken to the point that a bad player like me can beat better players than myself, and to the point where i find it unfun to play against T as Z.
Nice ad hominem by the way. Really shows how much thought you put into your post.
|
Just for the fun of it, here my unrealistic ideas:
1) roaches movement speed reduced, range reduced to melee, armor increase by 2 and supply reduced to 1
idea: Roaches become shit by themselves but can be used as a shield/cannonfodder
2) banelings damage changed to 0/+50vs light
idea: pretty much just to justify 3)....and ofc some acid shouldnt hurt a good armor
3) Lurkers introduced into the zerg arsenal as a conterpart to the baneling
Lurker damage 0/+X vs armored units (x is up to balance)
idea: with making the roach a melee unit at least 1 other range unit was needed to make the range upgrade still attractive, also Lurkers are fun and they fill the whole i created with the banelings.
ps: 1) it is fun to write and think about such things and
2) i never liked roaches for the sole reason they are ranged. It makes me cry to see a range army of hydra and roaches, because the reason i always played zerg was to get into melee fights.
To me, Zerg was always the melee fighting army as contrast to the only range terran army.
It was hard to see that my beloved zerglings have exchanged power for speed and have become and equivalent to vultures/hellions.
I mean, where is all the character of the zerg gone, all this zergish feel to it, when i i see marauders and marines fight vs roaches and hydras. I mean god, the roach could just as well be called infested marauder and there we almost have our mirror.
If i cannot flank and surround an enemy army to success, then how can this race i am playing be called zerg?
There were many reasons why i loved sc bw, even though i lost all day.
One big one was the moment i trapped my enemy with some lurkers or flanking zerglings or both., that was the moment you knew you were playing zerg when from every goddamn direction you had your units swarm into this ball of an enemy army and rape his shit.
sc2 is all about the bigger strategy, where are those game winning tactical moves gone, all those epic moments?
pps: yes i know i am the king of going offtopic, but hell it is fun to write shit...my fun right now is just caged by the realization that so far i had a lot more epic moments and fun with sc bw than with sc2.
|
On August 15 2010 10:37 Redmark wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2010 10:31 rauk wrote:
i play terran and completely agree that the race is stupid broken. i switched from Z with 300 points and over 700 games at the very end of beta and now i've got 600+ in diamond as T with less than 100 games.
nerf hydra DPS, put them back at tier 1 and make hydra speed researchable again while nerfing their speed on creep. put roaches back at tier 2 with 2 armor. move banelings to tier 2. hydras + overlords with default detection basically put Z on equal footing with any of the several early game T strats. you also get the added possibilty of a hydra break in the early game which is a little more difficult to defend than just "lol make 7 roaches and die to one bunker." also, baneling busts are boring to watch, boring to defend against, and boring to do. hydra breaks are much more exciting. move marauders back in the tech tree, it's pretty stupid to have a siege unit that kills spines instantly available right away.
increase magic box size so your units don't clump as much, and tanks become slightly less powerful, which should also benefit bio vs banelings.
should decrease mining efficiency so that 1 base play is a lot weaker than it is now. if you saturate earlier, your income is less and the extra workers you produce aren't worth as much until you expand. since expanding becomes more important, get rid of kulas and LT and all cliffable maps since the only purpose of cliffs is to be abused by one base terran. While we're at it, they should put in lurkers and defilers, give all of the units new portraits, add 30 missions and call it "Heart of the Swarm". This is not how you balance a game, this is how you troll a community. You are overshooting so hard you're breaking the sound barrier.
You're suggesting that we should wait until the Zerg expansion for multiplayer to be balanced? His suggestions are entirely reasonable.
|
Zerg is fine race if you are korean 
|
I kinda think this is a bluff, but i wouldnt be surprised if he excelled as terran regardless of balance. he is a very aggressive player so terran would suit his play style.
|
On August 15 2010 04:25 Pandain wrote:
Fadoodle this. It looks like there needs to be a Boxer for Zerg, a new Emperoer.
If these pros won't be cool kids and think of varying strats, then it looks like I'll need to fill in the gap.
Time to make Zerg strong again.
Pandain: The Zerg Bonjwa.
Wish me luck!
Actually, when people started seeing how weak zerg was compared to protoss, there was still one guy that played zerg amazingly and fresh, and he could even beat top tier players, and his name was TheLittleOne.
After the death stroke nerf of zerg in the latest beta patches he sadly moved to Terran like everyone else. Buy I am telling you, we were close to be getting a Boxer for sc2, but I guess Zerg was just too bad even for that to happen.
Right now I am teaching my gf to 4gate or void ray rush zergs at diamond league, and so far, she have made it EVERY time with an avarage apm of 15. This. This. This. Blizzard, act now before its too damn late
|
On August 15 2010 04:18 Ruthless wrote:
Most new rts games have one race tournaments due to imbalance. Starcraft is much better at hiding it than most though.
this. hell, select (dunno if its the same select as the one currently active in sc2) even changed to chaos 2 or 3 weeks before the 2nd wcg in DoW because of the balance issues. (he used to be an eldar player)
and at that time, the game was already out for almost 2 years.
ofc he won the wcg dow competition and went home with 25k $.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
