EPTThe Best and Worst Race - Page 4
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Kare
Norway786 Posts
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Melt
Switzerland281 Posts
Against Protoss or in Zerg Mirror, if i loose i can see my faults or a nice thing the opponent did that gave him the lead... i often don't have this feeling against Terran. It feels like, even though you knew what the opponent was going to do, you can't do anything effective against it.. so it's really frustrating... I don't like to whine, but at this point, something really has to be done. | ||
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tfmdjeff
United States170 Posts
Yet still, i love Zerg because I can macro hardcore like no other race can do, and even though it technically lacks in depth, when you start to get creative with your micro, it becomes a lot of fun. The best race, on the other hand is terran. Though it's not overpowered, it's a brainlessly easy race. Move, siege, stim just about sums it up. Even though the race is "highly immobile", it makes up for it in the fact that 90% of terran units have an absurdly long attack range. Half it's units have >10 range, and neither zerg nor protoss have units that can fire from across the map like that. | ||
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InRaged
1047 Posts
On July 20 2010 10:42 Gunman_csz wrote: I don't get. you state that you are a zerg player, and Terran is the hardest race for you to play with. Now Common sense dictates that you would obviously win more with main race than with your offrace right? Or are you now a disguised "cough" Terran player? who clearly can't tolerate all the terran hate, so you go out of your way to bombard such threads with multiple posts which don't make any sense. http://beta-us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1855/1/ "I'm a Z player" he said, lol | ||
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Naraka
Canada21 Posts
Voted down here probably because of the mass void terrible players. Heavy void builds result in terrible players? Gee, Whitera must be Terrible with a capital T in all his PvT games. Anyways...Best Race: Terran. By far. Plain and simple. They have incredible harass, incredible scouting, the most potent ground units by far (bio and tanks) and a range of disproportionately strong AA units (thor and viking). Their macro mechanic is also arguably the best of the three (mule) as it opens the door for all kinds of ridiculous openings without suffering too much on the economic end. To top it all off, planetary fortress; the single best anti harass structure in the game which is basically a 1500 hp siege tank that doesn't hurt your own units and is large enough to be team repaired by a dozen scvs. Worst Race: Zerg. Again, by far. Their lack of true AA outside of queens, slow roaches, vulnerable zerglings and just generally weak T1 units usually results in Z being defeated within the first few minutes of the game. And by defeated I don't mean the Z player has typed "GG" and left the game, rather by defeated I mean that Z has suffered significant losses by 2 gate zealots, reapers, hellions, marine/tank, phoenix, banshee, or the dozens of other possible harass openings abused against Zerg that the Z player has no chance in actually making a comeback against a competent player. TvZ is probably one of the most broken match ups in the game and it's not really because Zerg is too weak, rather Terran is too strong. ZvP seems to generally be even minus a few complaints about muta/ling, but that has never been an explosive issue. At least not on the scale that TvZ has been for the last several weeks of beta. In my personal opinion, patch 12 broke Zerg. It made ZvT borderline impossible and ZvZ a frustrating mess consisting mostly of green goo and zergling organs spread all over the battlefield. I will be switching to Protoss most likely come live. I played Zerg for the majority of beta and after the Best Buy chat which basically consisted of DB saying "Z and T are fine by our numbers" I've lost faith for the time being that Z will see any significant improvements or T any significant reductions in potency that would actually result in ZvZ or ZvT becoming a more enjoyable match up. I've found protoss to have plenty of tools and tactics at their disposal to deal with harassment and to dish out the harassment as well. They have a wide variety of openings and require a certain level of finesse to play effectively. I enjoy all the match ups to some degree. PvT can still be quite frustrating with the dreaded bio ball --> emp --> stim --> a click --> victory screen, but the different is that protoss can deal with it. If you lost to this, there was most likely something you could have done better to overcome your opponent. This is usually not the case with ZvT. I simply do not find Zerg enjoyable anymore. Not even a little bit. -_- | ||
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perfectflaw72
Canada94 Posts
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Gunman_csz
United Arab Emirates492 Posts
On July 20 2010 11:04 InRaged wrote: http://beta-us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1855/1/ "I'm a Z player" he said, lol Hahaha  , Nice find.I bet you 100bucks that he won't respond to this thread anymore. Funny because he was on a role till I got to him. | ||
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fAker
Denmark44 Posts
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Ownos
United States2147 Posts
I feel terran is the best. They have a potential to completely decimate any army and lose little. Mostly due to tanks. And when I play as them, if I don't die to a rush, they are pretty fun to play. Hard to do early agression as terran because marines don't start to pay off until you got a handful of them. It's nearly undeniably that while having the least strategic depth, spawn larvae is the most difficult mechanic to maintain, simply because if you forget ---> you lose it permanently. You forget to mule, you drop two. You forget to chrono, you chrono something else as well. Difficult for a human. Simple to have some kind of timer running in the background to remind you every 40 seconds. Not hard to make a script for that. But why do that when you can just not play as zerg? | ||
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NATO
United States459 Posts
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Shootemup.
United States1044 Posts
On July 20 2010 10:44 ta2 wrote: As a Zerg player I feel that Terran having both an insane ground splash unit (tank) and an insane air splash unit (thor) is ridiculous. I would change: Thor loses splash for air and maybe gets slight buff to single-target air damage. Tank siege mode 45 dmg (from 50), range 11 (from 13) and deploy time 6 (from 3.5) But then that would imbalance TvP. In a lot of situations, Terrans are dependent on tanks to hold off protoss aggression. Also, nerfing the thor too much would mean Terrans would have problems holding off mutas. They have marines, but the mutas outrun even stimmed marines. Also, Mech is supposed to be absurdly strong. Instead of 1aing into it, use Zerg mobility in Drops and Nydus Worms to force him to choose between assaulting your base and saving his. | ||
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shlomo
258 Posts
On July 20 2010 11:04 InRaged wrote: http://beta-us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1855/1/ "I'm a Z player" he said, lol rofl so predictable... Terran players clinging to their every super-effective units like a fat kid to cake. Not in the least bit interested in a balanced game, just in making sure they stay on easymode. hahahahaha | ||
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synapse
China13814 Posts
On July 20 2010 10:05 DooMDash wrote: When has 200/200 not been the best ( for terran )? You have played SC1 right? Just look at the macro mechanics of Terran vs Z and P. I hope to god that they have the best 200/200 army considering they cant just instantly warp in units and build up larva like their counter parts. I would also make the argument that a combo of broodlords, curropters, and ultras is pretty hard to beat. Now, obviously that is EXTREMELY situational but I think thats probably the best 200/200 army ATM. The OP mentions that 200/200 Protoss is very strong, or something. I'm merely disagreeing. | ||
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Maji
Australia82 Posts
Broodlords basically just guardians with different effect of firing, corruptors basically just devours and arnt as effective, infestors replace defilers and queens and imo defilers and queens were more useful, imo that overseer ability to make a illusion of a unit is usless give them parasite that queens had in sc1 so that zerg has a ability to see what oponents doing without having to sucide overlords all game lol. The worm is nothing but a nexus canal, basically zerg has nothing new worth mentioning and really needed some inspirational unit or units like toss and terran got. I feel that blizzard put no effort into zerg at all and its true that zerg doesnt feel as horde as it did in sc1, the macro is only fun part to them infact collosus anilate roach/hydra if supported by sentry and stalker and you only need 3-4 collosus. voids anilate bases so fast that if caught of guard zerg cant even prevent it and voids and phoenixs both can beat corruptors and muta in a fight, then you have storm which anilates hydras and roachs and ling like no tomorrow and then you combine collosus with storm and basically hydras roachs lings become usless, people suggest go ultra vs a good toss they can micro the stalkers well enough to destroy the ultra and even collosus/immortal/void kill ultras so fast it not funny, it is situational and fact that zerg are so slow of creep makes zerg a hassle to play and more defense now than offensive. Now lets look at terran, terran can destroy zerg with just bio np, only counter would be a insane amount of upgraded banelings with speed, roachs and hydra will both get owned to maurder marine medivacs, you wouldnt even need tanks throw in a few tanks and roachs got no chance, now some people might think ultras kill bio terran but they dont maurders actually kill ultras quite fast as well and the slowing allows for micro easily, you can also have few tanks or thors and ultras become usless as well. Now terran has alot mobilitys if people start to use dropships to carry the tanks around instead of just having tanks slow down the movement of the bio, viking good for harashing overlords and banshee with cloak can easily be used to harash, reapers not such a problem now since nefs but where a pain before, emp > infestors, hunter missles destroys groups of anything like no tomorrow, point defense counter all zerg ranged combined with terran bio and even turrents can be deadly so hence in conclusion. Zerg players who are doing well at present are extremely skilled more so than any toss or terran who beats them so I respect any of the top zerg players because it takes so much more work to win than it does for other two races. with warp gates protoss are able to quickly reforce to any position a plyon is placed, hence zerg has lost there ability to be fastest reforcing race in game, terran is slower but is capable to reforce but not as effective as protoss can 'instant units'. Remember zerg must wait for the extra larve if you think about it this way 10 gates of toss can produce simlar numbers than queens are producing on 3 base zerg on 2 base toss and 4 base zerg on 3 base toss. watch some reps and see how fast toss is able to reforce itself and look also at numbers zerg is producing same time it will be obvious now that warp gates have given toss a much easier production option. | ||
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shlomo
258 Posts
Every combat unit other than Zergling at 2+ supply lolol. Yeah ok Zerg it up bro, GL. | ||
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Maji
Australia82 Posts
I cant beat him when he uses terran at all, hes actually one the best players he choked in the tourney in semi finals lost to cheese basically but his one the best macro gamers there is, he can take over a map like no tomorrow if people dont get a sucessful cheese on him. Point is zerg is the worst clearly and terran is clearly the best then toss. | ||
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bulge
161 Posts
early defense T and P can wall-in and slack on scouting until later. Z has to be constantly vigilant of scouting to not get rolled. Z has the best 'farms' and gets great early map control. however if they lose map control, they will probably lose because they can't charge in blindly like T or P pumping units Z has to expand or create a 2nd hatch, otherwise he will have shite ability to create units. T and P can create juiced armies on 1 turtled base. zerg expos are easy to scout, because the creep. defensive structures T's towers rape air, planetary fortress is phat (they forgot to add that it's supposed to lift off and attack air also) P's towers give you comfort like diapers Z has to choose how he think he will get raped. fortunately he can reposition his towers after spending too much on them. units T has the best units in the game. Thor with 250mm is best ground unit, BC with yomomma cannon is best air. marines/hellions are the best unit mineral sink. colossus are the coolest unit in the game. broodlords are good in principle, but suck in practice. air to air rapes them so fast. only if they shot out banelings, i would use them instead of ultras. and ultras are fat and cause pathfinding woes. T has MMM which is the most straightforward combination ever and can take you to high level diamond. stim is a no-brainer that makes your units like %50 better. many players finish researching it, push out, and press 1, a, t, to win. can zerg and protoss get stim also? P's tier 1 warpgate units are the definition of balance: melee, ranged, support. warpgates/prisms are super freakin cool. forcefields win games. Z's tier 1 units = death by 1 banshee or voidray. banelings which can be amazing, also take incredible skill to use if you're plan is not to just bust some depots or sacrifice them to ranged attacks. maps a lot of maps are great for T (ledges, cliffs, islands) and suck balls for zerg (chokes, enclosed spaces). the worst being (s)crap station and kula's tank ravine. bases T's bases can turn into a giant gun or an orbital command that can juice minerals (on equal base count, T has highest income by far), scan (scouting/emergency), or unsupply block you. protoss get chronoboost which is pretty to look at. zerg get jack-all and instead have to spread creep and spawn larva, which eats up macro time for your average player who can't do 200 APM. T will never lose in a base trade, especially on scrap station. Also if you suck at building placement, you can rearrange them later with T. workers with a special ability T's workers can repair their pimp units or defensive structures. queens won't make it far off creep, and are not auto heal, so its not even close. it'd be nice if we could sacrifice drones for HP or probes for shields. EMP because TvP was pretty balanced, blizz gave ghosts the ability to rape protoss, so once again humans could rule. conclusion but don't worry, Wings of Liberty was made to feature terrans. next chapter gives OP zerg units that shoot banelings, and last chapter protoss will be able to mass motherships that cloak each other and provide a new level of cloaking. | ||
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lycheejello
United States59 Posts
On July 20 2010 09:46 Backpack wrote: Its simple, everyone votes the race that they play for best, and zerg for worst. Just like they do every single time someone makes this thread. haha jerk "zerg for worst" my race: zerg so i guess following your outline i would say best: zerg worst: zerg but so far ive actually had more trouble with zvp than zvt. who knows maybe its my silly playstyle. | ||
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Maji
Australia82 Posts
On July 20 2010 11:25 synapse wrote: The OP mentions that 200/200 Protoss is very strong, or something. I'm merely disagreeing. well it is situational it depends on what the 200/200 is vsing up against, clearly collosus own hydra correct and even roach when supported by sentry stalkers, but corruptors can beat collosus but phoenix void beat corruptor, so people basing it on the matchup not if like say toss forgets to have aa to counter corruptors, remember how fast that collosus can kill zergs ground you will lose alot before the corruptors kill them say the toss has 7-9 collosus rest a mix of stalkers sentry phoenix what you gonna do? | ||
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Synk
United States297 Posts
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