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Towards the end of the beta, I've been holding steady around Diamond rank 30 as protoss... sometimes rising into the top 20 but rarely staying. As somewhat of a "lazy" player I almost never reviewed my own replays. During the game I would do mental checks like making sure my money was low etc., but I never actually went into my replays and dissected them.
Now with the beta down and my epic boredom, I have done it a few times. I noticed that my average APM is like 70. By many, many people's standards, that is utter crap. I do spike to around 120 during mico-heavy battles and my APM rises steadily throughout the game (naturally I suppose as I build more bases and have to macro more) so that my non-battle APM is around 90 at the 25 minute mark of a game... but still, that's really low.
So do you guys think that it's possible to be a diamond league, division top 10 SC2 player with 70 apm? Does this mean that the rest of my game is somehow better than most people's or is this just an epic example of how division rank means nothing? If I increased my APM would it make a huge difference in my effectiveness? Does spamming at the start really help you get a "rhythm"? I've never ever felt like I've had a Starcraft "rhythm"... is that bad?
I'm pretty new to starcraft as a whole... I played SC:BW but never rose above C- and spent the vast majority of my time as a D+. Have there been progamers with low APMs?
edit: fixed a type... lol i wrote "fast majority" instead of "vast majority" ahaha...
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Really good.
Focus on remember doing the right actions instead of doing actions fast, and you'll become a great player.
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in SC2 you need about half the APM than in SCBW, so around 150 should be ok to do pretty much everything you need/want to do (especially as protoss who don't require quite as much APM as Terran or Zerg).
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I was hoping apm wouldn't be a focus in sc2 but meh.
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as long as you get your things that you want to get done (eg. makro and micro) you dont need higher APM.
If you cant get stuff done that you remember to do and want to do then yeah.
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you can get really good with low apm but at some point i feel like youll have a hard time keeping up wiht your macro. use hot keys and macro while you attack and your apm should rise to at least 100.
edit. i really like what this guy said above me. if you are playing and want to do somthing but just arent fast enough. say your attacking and you want to make 10 goons and 2 ht while your attacking. and also start upgrading +2 attack and maybe also build probes from your 2 running nexus and send 2 idle probes to mine. and you feel like your too slow to do it. then your probably moving too slow to do it. what you need to do is get in the rythem of using hot keys. so that while your microing you can hit 1g2g3g4g5t6t9p0p and then bounce back to main and hit the upgrades and bounce back. i dont know how you like your hotkeys eveyrone has there own preference. just see whats comfortable for you and go with it. if you need a practice buddy hit me up on iccup charlie420247
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I'm going to say that yes you can become a top diamond level player with low APM. However, no offense, but this will not apply to you because you have another problem... You are "lazy and don't watch replays". If you aren't actively trying to improve, even if you have enough APM you won't.
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if you really limited your actions so you didn't spam at all (by this i include right clicking units alot to certain areas) you could have 100 apm and do pretty well (considering apm is cut by like 50% on the counter) so 100 apm on sc2, is like 150 actual.
Overall, apm is a pretty bad measurement of how well you can do - with the new replay watching methods of first person views you can see players hopping around pretty quickly and having a decently low apm. The players that usually spam alot - their screes will often sit still or stay set on 1 position for longer than normal.
While it's good to be able to have high actions - accuracy and swiftness are more key points.
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APM doesn't say too much about a player. It's just a number that helps noobs distinct one another from even bigger noobs 
The requirement of lower realAPM is just that more people can play SC2 competitively and E-sports will benefit from that.
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On July 05 2010 01:04 BigT wrote:
I'm going to say that yes you can become a top diamond level player with low APM. However, no offense, but this will not apply to you because you have another problem... You are "lazy and don't watch replays". If you aren't actively trying to improve, even if you have enough APM you won't.
I'm lazy and don't watch MY OWN replays. I watch more Day9 then I do standard tv
I guess I should go back and watch my own replays... especially the losses... but I hate watching myself lose T_T
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On July 05 2010 01:04 Inori wrote:
I remember WhiteRa saying somewhere that 120 apm is enough for him in SC2.
He plays Toss. So, yeah, if he's well organized 120 APM can be enough.
I'm at around 120-130 APM and begin to struggle w/ Zerg when I approach 4 saturated bases. You have to do lot of things that repeat over and over again (larvae, creep tumors) and then there's macroing. But I'd say early-midgame is no problem at all with ~120 APM as Zerg.
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if you watch yourself lose you can look and see why you lost. instead of just raging about how x unit is imba.
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On July 05 2010 01:06 farseer_dk wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2010 01:04 BigT wrote:
I'm going to say that yes you can become a top diamond level player with low APM. However, no offense, but this will not apply to you because you have another problem... You are "lazy and don't watch replays". If you aren't actively trying to improve, even if you have enough APM you won't. I'm lazy and don't watch MY OWN replays. I watch more Day9 then I do standard tv I guess I should go back and watch my own replays... especially the losses... but I hate watching myself lose T_T
Yeah, you need to be analyzing exactly what you need to improve upon specifically, you cant just focus on what other people are doing and trying to replicate that. It's too broad of a focus. But if you stop being so lazy and start to actively try to improve, theres no doubt that you will 
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Netherlands4511 Posts
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70 is quite good apm for sc2.
That's not like in sc1 where you had 100apm and you barely kept macroing and attacking, sc2 does not need so much spamming due to the MBS and unlimited control groups.
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On July 05 2010 01:11 charlie420247 wrote:
if you watch yourself lose you can look and see why you lost. instead of just raging about how x unit is imba.
The only thing I ever rage about (balance wise) is how much archons suck lol... If they buffed archons think about the dt --> archon opening you could do against a zerg...
Back on topic... I usually can tell why I lost. It's rare that I lose and do not know why. My style of play involves a lot of early aggression and the vast majority of my loses are due to a mis-micro or messed up timing... and I can usually tell when that happens without watching the replay...
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High AMP's are mostly from spamming so if you only count the AMP of the non spamming you probable get under the 100 but I feel by spamming you are more focused and you can respond easier when it can gets micro intensive. You also have to be very precise with you timing when non spamming so I think it makes stuff easier by spamming
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You could win tournies with 70 apm. In the future maybe not but for now you be the best with that apm.
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Keep playing and don't worry about APM. It's not fixed technical skill of your body/mind, it is developed. It's not even that your fingers become faster, but just your mind wants to get more things done in shorter time (for strat/micro-sake), as you learn more reasons and timings, and you begin to worry about more stuff than before. I can guarantee you that your APM will get better, just don't watch it at all, for now, watch your game; then some day you look back and realize your apm has gotten much higher, without you even realizing. There are some of the top players who can be seen get away with 100-150 apm range, doing pretty well, so that's enough in terms of hands speed, as long as you know what you're doing.
p.s. And for Jaedong's sake watch your own bloody replays! (: 1game+1replay watch > 10 games. Particularly the losses, but also any game where your opponent did stuff that surprised you, and you haven't figured them out at the time.
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EPT
