EPT2017 - 2018 Football Thread - Page 53
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Topin
Peru10080 Posts
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mAKiTO
Colombia4171 Posts
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mAKiTO
Colombia4171 Posts
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Topin
Peru10080 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51490 Posts
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Mafe
Germany5966 Posts
On September 06 2017 16:27 Pandemona wrote: What the hell is going on in South American qualifying lol. Both Chile and Argentina are in huge trouble. Business as usual actually. There's always 3-4 great teams in there and so many potential banana skins. Even the 2002 brazil team (greatest team of my lifetime so far) struggled more in qualifying than in the actual world cup. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51490 Posts
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Mafe
Germany5966 Posts
On September 06 2017 18:53 Pandemona wrote: Yeah but Brazil walked this qualifying campaign and surely this is one of Argentina's "greatest" generation right? They have huge stars in many positions, Di Maria Messi Higuain to name a few. Chile also on the back of winning copa america too, can't even beat bolivia! I'd argue these "few" are already most of their stars. Check their wikipedia page and you will find out that even if you also include romero, aguero, mascherano and otamendi, the remaining four places have to be filled with relative unknowns. Also any of those seven is 29+, so you cannot even expect them to all be fit at the same time. Versus venezuela, argentina was starting players named fazio, icardi, pizarro, with benedetto and acuna coming from the bench. I never heard of any of those before (which I admit may not mean too much, but have you?). Apart from their big names, they have only two players listed as having in the range of 20-60 caps (pastore and banega). Now go compare that to other nations. It appears argentina is heavily lacking in depth of their squad. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51490 Posts
But Messi Higuain Aguero DiMaria Mascherano Pastore can easily be a basis of a squad to come top 4 in South America surely. Bolivia Venezuela Paraguay Peru have better players than this Argentina? | ||
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BeaTeR
Kazakhstan4130 Posts
just found out only Bolivia scored less goals than Argentina this qualifying campaign lol 16-15 in 16 games wtf | ||
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Mafe
Germany5966 Posts
On September 06 2017 21:09 Pandemona wrote: Icardi is a striker from Inter who has been linked with Chelsea and Arsenal, i believe in Italy he is a top top striker. Fazio was the CB from Spurs who was never in the side and no idea where he went from there, don't think he settled in England though. Not heard of that pizaro, i only know Claudio Pizzaro xD, Bennedetto i only have heard from on FM and FIFA so i guess that doesn't count either. But Messi Higuain Aguero DiMaria Mascherano Pastore can easily be a basis of a squad to come top 4 in South America surely. Bolivia Venezuela Paraguay Peru have better players than this Argentina? I agree. My point was not to doubt the fact that argentina have a good basis, but they seem have barely any other players which they use to build upon this basis. But you cant expect your basis (they players you named) to be fit in every game of a 18-match qualifying campaign spanning several years, so I would say that argentina struggling isnt that surprising. And while the players from the smaller countries might still be slightly worse than the argentinian replacements, the difference isnt that big anymore. These players then have the experience of playing together more often, and also are more likely to based in south america, whereas more of the argentinian players are based other parts of the world and may also have to deal with travel. And may be more used to high-altitude conditions which afaik give bolivia and peru a much bigger home advantage than usually. TLDR: In a vacuum, argentinas players should be much better than their competitors. But beyond the surface, there are several small factors which all go against argentina, leading to much more even playing field. | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28674 Posts
 I was just looking to see if you had any similarly underperforming teams, based on player material, in europe. To be honest, I don't really think so, the netherlands is the strongest candidate, but looking at their squad, Robben is the only player I think is on the same level as the ~top 6 argentinian ones. So it's mostly just this idea I have that Netherlands is supposed to have a bunch of world class players, but right now, they actually don't. I still think Peru loses and Argentina and Chile both make it though. Peru's remaining games are away vs Argentina and home vs Colombia. 1 point total is prolly on par for those two matches. Chile has to win home vs Equador (last match is away vs Brazil), but that also seems likely. And Argentina has Peru home and Equador away. Lots of possible outcomes though, this qualifier is absurdly tight tbh.. Browsing through the different games played, more than half the matches so far have been draws or wins by 1 goal, less than 20% of matches wins by more than 2 goals. Also, the coolest factoid I learned from browsing this stuff.. Germany has EIGHTEEN different goal scorers so far, in 8 matches, Müller top goalscorer with 5 out of 35 goals. Spain is the second most spread out with 11. Meanwhile Poland has Lewandowski scoring 12 of 18 goals, and no other player with more than 1. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8658 Posts
theyve been contenders for the world cup for as long as i have been born from what i can remember. this year they seem ridiculous as well. their players are world class and they have a bench full of them. also they seem to have a chemistry between them thats not found in other strong countries (spain) because they arent assholes like ramos | ||
GTR
51462 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51490 Posts
On September 07 2017 01:19 Mafe wrote: I agree. My point was not to doubt the fact that argentina have a good basis, but they seem have barely any other players which they use to build upon this basis. But you cant expect your basis (they players you named) to be fit in every game of a 18-match qualifying campaign spanning several years, so I would say that argentina struggling isnt that surprising. And while the players from the smaller countries might still be slightly worse than the argentinian replacements, the difference isnt that big anymore. These players then have the experience of playing together more often, and also are more likely to based in south america, whereas more of the argentinian players are based other parts of the world and may also have to deal with travel. And may be more used to high-altitude conditions which afaik give bolivia and peru a much bigger home advantage than usually. TLDR: In a vacuum, argentinas players should be much better than their competitors. But beyond the surface, there are several small factors which all go against argentina, leading to much more even playing field. Yeah i guess that is a fair assessment of the situation, i mean for sure Chile are without Sanchez mediocre names on paper. But going back to World Cup 2014 the final, they were the team who made many many chances but failed to take them thus imo being the better team that final. So unless something major happened i don't get how 4 years on top of that squad would send them to this place in the SA qualifiers. Oh well from a personal point of a view and being English i am not the biggest fan of Argentina so i do hope they fail | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28674 Posts
On September 07 2017 16:55 GTR wrote: hmm, i'd say france is more stacked than germany but that's just talent wise ya if you only compare player by player and you look strictly at footballing ability, the top 20 is comparable, with France imo fielding a slightly stronger offense. But Germany's professionalism is through the roof, and they have the most strings to play of anyone. | ||
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WillyWanker
France1915 Posts
On September 07 2017 17:51 Liquid`Drone wrote: ya if you only compare player by player and you look strictly at footballing ability, the top 20 is comparable, with France imo fielding a slightly stronger offense. But Germany's professionalism is through the roof, and they have the most strings to play of anyone. Germany is well above France, even taking players one by one. How many French players have won a CL or been a leader in a top team? Potential looks good, but until it's confirmed... | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51490 Posts
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28674 Posts
ter stegen Kimmich Rudiger Hummels Hector Rudy Muller Kroos Özil Draxler Werner France vs Netherlands was LLoris Sidibe Koscielny Umtiti Kurzawa Pogba Kante Coman Griezman Lemar Giroud I really don't see the German team as (significantly, anyway) better, player by player. But I think Germany has more different options, and a whole other level of professionalism that makes them always show up. They'd beat Luxembourg by more than 2 goals 50 out of 50 games, no slipups, but if you strictly compare peak performances, I think it's close. | ||
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sneirac
Germany3464 Posts
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