EPTThe HotS Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 80
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Guileful
Kazakhstan137 Posts
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Destruktor
Spain60 Posts
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hearters
Singapore224 Posts
On July 08 2013 21:08 Destruktor wrote: Hi there! When I play vs 1 gate expand usually I take my third when I see hi's expanding but then I don't know when exactly sac my over to scout his main or what are the most usually Toss builds that I should to know. Is there any scout guide or similar for this situation? Thanks 1 minute earlier than usual -> 5.30 scout Unless it's actually inbase forge expand, then you scout at the regular 6.30. | ||
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darkphantom
98 Posts
how should i remax and on what ? | ||
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b0ub0u
Canada445 Posts
On July 10 2013 04:40 darkphantom wrote: i know zerg mainly relies on good economy and remaxing very quickly ( in the ideal pro world at least ), but what i always fail at is remaxing after a terran pushes with some armies and have a little portion of it left ( while u on ling bane infestor muta tech ) nothing i can make would make it out of the hatch if the terran manages to get to ur nat . lings will roast the second they pop out. infestors useless. banes u got no lings ..mutas are crap... and boom u got 0 larva :/ how should i remax and on what ? About that remax. The idea is to have the engagement on his side of the map. That will leave you time to remax. What units you make is entirely dependent on the matchup and the situation. This is too broad of a question. | ||
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darkphantom
98 Posts
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loginn
France815 Posts
The only way is, as said b0ub0u, to take your engagement on his side of the map so you can group your lings together before engaging/making a bunch of banes. | ||
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Crugio
Australia45 Posts
If Terran needs 100 less gas for cloak, then it make sense that: Some weird 1 gas play: cloak can start 60 seconds earlier; and On a normal banshee rush, 2 gas play: cloak will start 30 seconds earlier. This is based on roughly 100gas/minute from: Liquipedia Gas Mining Previously Cloaked Banshee » Cloak First • 1st banshee @6:40, cloak @7:07, 2nd banshee @7:40 » Banshee First • 1st banshee @6:16, 2nd banshee @7:16, cloak @7:29 This is from the old WoL timing guide Normally these times are 2 gas, so we could potentially see cloak banshee as early as 6:40ish? Has anyone had experience on the new timing of cloaked banshees? | ||
stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
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Tsubbi
Germany7967 Posts
On July 10 2013 14:15 stuchiu wrote: I was messing around, seeing if there were any timings you could kill a gate expo with when I went 5-0 with Roach speedling busts. Anyone else ever try this? what kind of timing are u taling about? basically variations of 28 drone roach speedling build like in wol dont work at all in my experience on high master/gm as the mothership core has enough energy for photon overcharge and a sentry is ready always on the other hand 14 14 expand with speedlings off 15 drones is surprisingly good against mothership core expands, basically mess around with him with your first 6 lings (delay mining/mess with wall) then build another 10 lings with first inject then start droning | ||
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CivilAnarchy
United States59 Posts
I'm playing mid-low masters Protoss btw | ||
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b0ub0u
Canada445 Posts
On July 10 2013 22:46 CivilAnarchy wrote: I've been having trouble dealing with Gateway expands, as I'm not so familiar with the timings yet. If I scout an expansion off 1 Gateway, with additional gates being added, when is a safe time to take a third? I know you're supposed to get the roach warren at about 5:45, and scout around with lings, but with the mothership core flying around it's incredibly difficult to scout pylons and potential attacks on most maps. I'm playing mid-low masters Protoss btw You take your third as he takes his natural. Earlier RW if you suspect Gateway pressure. I am only diamond I am sure someone else can answer you better than I can. But I think this is mostly right. | ||
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Decendos
Germany1338 Posts
On July 10 2013 23:14 b0ub0u wrote: You take your third as he takes his natural. Earlier RW if you suspect Gateway pressure. I am only diamond I am sure someone else can answer you better than I can. But I think this is mostly right. this as 3rd timing. and vs 4 gates (3 in wall off) i like to go burrow into roaches. its such a hardcounter imo AND you get to delay his 3rd + you can put on counterpressure if you want to or build minimal amount of roaches with burrow since he has no detection at that time. | ||
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stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On July 10 2013 15:52 Tsubbi wrote: what kind of timing are u taling about? basically variations of 28 drone roach speedling build like in wol dont work at all in my experience on high master/gm as the mothership core has enough energy for photon overcharge and a sentry is ready always on the other hand 14 14 expand with speedlings off 15 drones is surprisingly good against mothership core expands, basically mess around with him with your first 6 lings (delay mining/mess with wall) then build another 10 lings with first inject then start droning I do something a bit between those two. I have about 20 drones after opening with either hatch gas pool or pool into hatch then gas. It just kills them as the timing seems to hit when they use up all of their gas. | ||
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Tribuno
Italy261 Posts
i'm using (with a nice success) the snute build.. gasless opening into 1/1 roaches timing while taking a third and drone behind the attack. When i go lair, i immediately morph and overseer to scout the tech.. if i see muta (at this timing the spire is generally 1/2 or 3/4 done), i generally make 6 spores (2 for each base but i make 2 in the middle of the creep waiting for my third base to finish) and i plant an hydra den making like 4-5 hydras when it pops. I generally defend by the mutas quite easy doing this but i don't know if this is an overcommit..cause i have to rebuild the drones used for the spines and my economy is not in an optimal shape.. what do you think about it? | ||
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Kaleidos
Italy172 Posts
On July 11 2013 03:56 Tribuno wrote: ZvZ i'm using (with a nice success) the snute build.. gasless opening into 1/1 roaches timing while taking a third and drone behind the attack. When i go lair, i immediately morph and overseer to scout the tech.. if i see muta (at this timing the spire is generally 1/2 or 3/4 done), i generally make 6 spores (2 for each base but i make 2 in the middle of the creep waiting for my third base to finish) and i plant an hydra den making like 4-5 hydras when it pops. I generally defend by the mutas quite easy doing this but i don't know if this is an overcommit..cause i have to rebuild the drones used for the spines and my economy is not in an optimal shape.. what do you think about it? Snute updated his roach play quite a bit. You can check this vod where he explains it in details : Snute Roach play Basically he takes a faster 3rd and a quick lair while skipping the carapace upgrade. | ||
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Incognoto
France10239 Posts
On July 11 2013 04:09 Kaleidos wrote: Snute updated his roach play quite a bit. You can check this vod where he explains it in details : Snute Roach play Basically he takes a faster 3rd and a quick lair while skipping the carapace upgrade. nice link right there edit: so i'm watching what happens if you get all-in'd? bane/ling or just pure mass speedling? | ||
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Kaleidos
Italy172 Posts
On July 11 2013 04:10 Incognoto wrote: nice link right there edit: so i'm watching what happens if you get all-in'd? bane/ling or just pure mass speedling? As crazy as it may sound Snute is able to hold those too (sometimes he understimate the allin and fail to defend, guess he is still in the learning process). He adds extra evos to fortify the wall and uses his 3 queens to defend, sometime 1 spine too. I think he waits the warren to complete and avoids making lings when possible. It' hard to explain and even harder to execute, but if you check his other vods you will find a couple ones where he face those strategies  | ||
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Buzerio
United Kingdom135 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On July 12 2013 00:12 Buzerio wrote: I have a problem dealing with widow mines when I play Muta/Ling/Bling (or really anything) I just cant kill them cost effectively even if I know exactly where they are The general consens seems to be to take some time to make the mines go off costinefficiently and afterwards trying to crush the enemy army in the 20-40second window before the mines recharge. Here is a list of tricks how to do so (but they usually require some training and are not bulletproof!):
Generally speaking, protected mines are much harder to deal with than unprotected mines. However, if the Terran just sits on top of his mines he has two problems: a) he is not moving forward, which gives you more time b) his mines won't be efficient, as they won't kill the banelings before they hit the other units and will splash the marines. Use that to your advantage to move forward and then draw most of your army back the moment he starts to run backwards, while a small part of your units keeps on running forward and eats the mineshots. This is probably one of the most important parts of dealing with mines: Never be shy to break off a charge and retreat your army if the alternative is to run into mines. | ||
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