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On February 10 2013 10:21 llIH wrote:
What are good defense against oracle opening? Would a widow mine work - do they one shot oracles?
What about friendly fire? Do the widow mine's friendly splash work on scvs if the widow mine fire on an oracle that is above my mineral line?
As of the new patch the widow mine should one shot oracles, due to the extra shield damage, but I haven't tried yet myself. The mine will splash some of your SCV's for 40 damage, which won't kill them, and overall its a good hold if your mines hit the way it was already. Turret is still the safer option in my opinion.
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IS there any way to beat protoss after 17-20 mins mark if neither players harasses?
I just played a very long game, had 19 barracks 3 starports making ravens and 1 making viking medivac, but still never won , I emp his stuff before hand, use seekier missles on his collos/stalker, still zealots and archons get the best out of me, even if they dont have any aoe, to me waprgate late game is too strong, and cant find a way around it :/
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On February 10 2013 11:23 Derez wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 10:21 llIH wrote:
What are good defense against oracle opening? Would a widow mine work - do they one shot oracles?
What about friendly fire? Do the widow mine's friendly splash work on scvs if the widow mine fire on an oracle that is above my mineral line? As of the new patch the widow mine should one shot oracles, due to the extra shield damage, but I haven't tried yet myself. The mine will splash some of your SCV's for 40 damage, which won't kill them, and overall its a good hold if your mines hit the way it was already. Turret is still the safer option in my opinion.
Ok I am going to try it out. I just feel the turret is too slow. He gets so many kills and manage to get away without losing the oracle. I guess I could just put up a few and research range?
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On February 10 2013 20:16 llIH wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2013 11:23 Derez wrote:On February 10 2013 10:21 llIH wrote:
What are good defense against oracle opening? Would a widow mine work - do they one shot oracles?
What about friendly fire? Do the widow mine's friendly splash work on scvs if the widow mine fire on an oracle that is above my mineral line? As of the new patch the widow mine should one shot oracles, due to the extra shield damage, but I haven't tried yet myself. The mine will splash some of your SCV's for 40 damage, which won't kill them, and overall its a good hold if your mines hit the way it was already. Turret is still the safer option in my opinion. Ok I am going to try it out. I just feel the turret is too slow. He gets so many kills and manage to get away without losing the oracle. I guess I could just put up a few and research range?
No you definitely shouldn't research range that early. Just one turret in each mineral line should drive away the oracle without you taking too many losses, unless you're placing the turret in a really bad place.
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1 turret in each mineral line is of course more than enough to stop oracles. Also, wm 1-shot them.. I don't fear oracles anymore..
The problem I face when playing higher level Protoss players is that they just go for quick stargate, grab 3rd the second they scout I'm going mech and go for Zealot/Immortal/Archon + Voidray composition which is really difficult to deal with..
So far I've lost engagements basically no matter what composition I had. I was trying Hellbat/Tank/Thor + Ghost/Vikings as support and I've still lost because of warpin. Otherwise I was able to trade evenly, but that means losing in TvP.
I'm kinda ok with quick Tempests, because 2-3 Ravens + SCVs for mass repair makes for a really powerfull push and Protoss can't really do anything about this, you just kill his bases and even if he manages to clear you up, he's got no eco to catch up.
Any ideas?
edit: some high level TvP mech replays would be such helpful. If there is some +/- master Protoss willing to train with me, I'd be glad - Rope#2777
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On February 10 2013 13:54 never_Nal wrote:
IS there any way to beat protoss after 17-20 mins mark if neither players harasses?
I just played a very long game, had 19 barracks 3 starports making ravens and 1 making viking medivac, but still never won , I emp his stuff before hand, use seekier missles on his collos/stalker, still zealots and archons get the best out of me, even if they dont have any aoe, to me waprgate late game is too strong, and cant find a way around it :/
There is something wrong with your micro, it sounds like you did a good job but if you lost the fight, you did not. We must see your replay. Give it and we can give amazing feedback tailored for your play style. This will help you in all your games.
Or do not provide one and you will improve so very slowly, because your blindspots will be kept in the dark. It takes another man to point out mistakes you never thought you had.
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I advice anyone that is interesting in mech TvP to check StC's stream (I think there are like 2 Vods currently).
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397711
He playes very BW feel-like mech in TvP and he wins A LOT with it.. Just slowly leapfrogging tanks/mines with raven/vikings checking air + sniping observers.. Really cool.
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can someone give me some builds for tvz, tvp, tvt?
all im doing now is the hellbat drop, expand and just go on from there.
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@mokumoku
Try this reaper build
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=393468
I had very fun moment with it + it's quiet effective vs P and vs Z. I currently get to mid master only playing that in all matchup in the beta
Vs T it's more difficult since everyone is doing hellbat drop and hellions counter reaper hard.
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Just tried out hots today for the first time. Only played 3-4 games so far but it seems quite fun.
What Im trying to create is a 3 reaper harass with two widowmines into 3 hellbat drop (only 3 reapers because I put down reactor on rax to switcharo with factory once done. The widowmines can function both offensively and defensively depending on what your opponent does is the idea. Mainly against protoss and zerg. Not sure if it would be any good vs T.
Trying to fit a build together as neatly as possible. Well see if its any good. 
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how do you deal with lategame sky toss with a mech composition?
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On February 13 2013 13:50 SHODAN wrote:
how do you deal with lategame sky toss with a mech composition?
I am only Diamond, so take this with grain of salt, but if he has storm and dont donate somehow his HT or energy I just die no matter what composition I get. New Void Rays+Tempest/Carrier+Storm etc. just seem so powerful ...
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On February 11 2013 20:20 Everlong wrote:I advice anyone that is interesting in mech TvP to check StC's stream (I think there are like 2 Vods currently). http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=397711He playes very BW feel-like mech in TvP and he wins A LOT with it.. Just slowly leapfrogging tanks/mines with raven/vikings checking air + sniping observers.. Really cool.
I am obviousely not StC, but I have tried similat style and just got always rolled over by zealot+archon+immortal+new VR. I will check out his stream though, its more then likely that he does something much better. Thanks for a suggestion.
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is it even possible to beat turtle mech with bio/tank?
i feel like the only way to win in TvT is to go mech, which i think is extremely boring because of siege battles. its impossible to drop harass when opponents turtle up on fast 3cc with mines and turrets until they get a ton of tanks hellions and thors, not to mention the fact that mech allows them to virtually guarantee map control because of the mobility of hellions and when you morph them into battle hellions, it requires so much to take back things such as towers.
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I recently switched into hots on a serious level, currently mid masters. I have something like a 90% winrate TvT opening 12 rax 14 refinery reactor hellion expand into a strong 2 base hellbat marine push that I've yet to lose with. (Will be interested to see how this fairs considering hellbat nerf)
My TvZ consists of a 1 rax FE, grab a gas geyser, third CC, then second gas (like Bomber), 2 fac 1 reactor 1 tech lab, and 3 rax to begin with. I go up to 5 barracks and do a big 12 minutes marine marauder medivac widow mine push while I take my fourth.
My question however lies in TvP, I can't seem to find an opener that is safe. Protoss are consistently one base all inning me, I've tried to open with reapers, I've tried 1 rax FEing, the only thing I can confidently do to protoss to kill them as of right now is to 111, which is not how I want to play a match up. IS there a safe macro opener against protoss at this point? I feel MSC gives protoss too much of an ability to all in with that time warp spell, and voidrays massacre bunkers.
Any suggestions?
Also, will upload replays for TvT and TvZ when I get more collected data, literally less than 50 overall games played in hots so I'd like to refine my builds a bit before throwing them out to the community.
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On February 15 2013 05:10 Strykerz wrote:
I recently switched into hots on a serious level, currently mid masters. I have something like a 90% winrate TvT opening 12 rax 14 refinery reactor hellion expand into a strong 2 base hellbat marine push that I've yet to lose with. (Will be interested to see how this fairs considering hellbat nerf)
My TvZ consists of a 1 rax FE, grab a gas geyser, third CC, then second gas (like Bomber), 2 fac 1 reactor 1 tech lab, and 3 rax to begin with. I go up to 5 barracks and do a big 12 minutes marine marauder medivac widow mine push while I take my fourth.
My question however lies in TvP, I can't seem to find an opener that is safe. Protoss are consistently one base all inning me, I've tried to open with reapers, I've tried 1 rax FEing, the only thing I can confidently do to protoss to kill them as of right now is to 111, which is not how I want to play a match up. IS there a safe macro opener against protoss at this point? I feel MSC gives protoss too much of an ability to all in with that time warp spell, and voidrays massacre bunkers.
Any suggestions?
Also, will upload replays for TvT and TvZ when I get more collected data, literally less than 50 overall games played in hots so I'd like to refine my builds a bit before throwing them out to the community.
Really looking forward to your TvT replays
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Hi Everybody!
I have a question: I've been having troubles against late-game skytoss. I'm wondering what is the most potent combo to counter the skytoss deathball? Is it viking/bc/raven? or viking/raven? Is it even possible to try and whittle their deathball down using a bioball with ghosts? Any suggestions would be great thanks. (On a side note, I dont know if this has been answered already i just havent found the post if thats the case).
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I play mech in HotS in TvZ and get often crushed by roach/hydra with Viper support. My Composition is Tanks+Hellbat and maybe 2-4 Thors.
How do you react to this composition perfectly?
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United Kingdom12041 Posts
On February 23 2013 04:43 saaaa wrote:
I play mech in HotS in TvZ and get often crushed by roach/hydra with Viper support. My Composition is Tanks+Hellbat and maybe 2-4 Thors.
How do you react to this composition perfectly?
I would say personally unless he's getting mutas or corrupters I wouldn't bother with thors. Get vikings instead as they've got much better range against the vipers and also use turrets to help zone him out too.
Make sure you never put your tnaks directly next to each other either, go for a nice line with a line slightly behind it and set up nice little killzones with some mines infront too. You basically want to make his vipers as useless as possible and force him if anything to waste his energy on abducts or clouds that only hit a single tank. You'll want to stay relatively defensive and very slowly push across the map moving your killzone closer and closer until you get into his bases.
The reason I say don't bother with thors is they're so big, take up so much supply and do so little damage to anything that isn't a clumped air unit they're not really worth it at all.
Oh one other thing that I'd say is ESSENTIAL with mech in HoTS is the raven. The raven has sok much usability late game against zerg and it makes both ultras and broodlords much easier to handle. Throw off some seeker missiles into his army to force him back if he does manage to cloud a lot of your stuff, and use that time to move your tanks back slightly. If he doesn't move back, he's guarenteed to lose a hell of a lot of stuff just from the HSM's if you place them correctly.
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On February 23 2013 04:43 saaaa wrote:
I play mech in HotS in TvZ and get often crushed by roach/hydra with Viper support. My Composition is Tanks+Hellbat and maybe 2-4 Thors.
How do you react to this composition perfectly?
You want a decent size of tanks, a larger amount of widow mines and a few hellbats for zerglings. Widow mines really help against flying in vipers and roaches. As long as you split up efficiently and don't clump all of your mines in one area you should be able to trade very effectively.
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EPT
