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I got inspired with the Zerg thread and I think it's time to make one for Terran.
As a sterter question:
How can I safely open mech play TvP? I just can't get it to work.
For me, the biggest problem is msc/blink. You need to always watch out for DT's or Stargate play.. I think the range of aggresive builds Protoss can execute now is too wide for Terran to have safe macro (mech) opening.
Widow mines are simply not an option, because Stalkers just run around your base with msc and kill every single one.
I'm kinda lost here.. Maybe reactor mines, siege tank + siege tech right away? But then again, you need to watch out for DT's and stuff..
Ideas?
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Nice idea, but I guess your answer won't be simple 
So I try to explain, how I open against protoss if I want to go mech, which I only think is wisely on specific maps (such as Newkirk City and other small maps; on bigger maps I do not feel like I can pressure enough to stop the protoss from getting to many expos).
In general it is super important to scout what the protoss does. If he goes for an early expand you can go for 1x rax exe easily and if he goes for Nexus first, you should go for 1x rax 2x exe.
If he is going for one base I prefer to scan with my 3rd scan to see what is going on.
I stay onebase if I go for mech then, going for fast siege and a lot of marines and vikings and follow up with a late expo.
As you mentioned blink stalker + MSC are fucking hard to hold; if you experience a lot of allins I would rather go for bio, because atm I do not see a chance to hold this early aggression with mech.
Widow mines are not useful against early game protoss in my eyes, DTs can be avoided by turrets or a raven, which is not as hard to get these days.
Another really strong opener you have to look out for, is a fast tempest build. The only way to counter this, in my view, is to go as greedy as possible or simply base trading.
Just my ideas so far
Greetz
Fibbz
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Thank you..
This is kinda what I expected to see, because I really tried hard to make it work and I just failed most of the time. I guess I'll just experiment more, I really want to find a solid opener. :-)
And yeah, I experienced the fast Tempest build, but it requires now Fleet Beacon I think is possible to scout in time. I defended it, because I luckily had starport so I just swapped for reactor and with some micro + scv repair I was able to hold it. But I just want to avoid Starport if possible, isn't it the whole point of widow mines after all? :-(
Teching to Raven seems very risky to me and sets you back economically too much to my liking, but it might be necessary.
I'll upload some replays when I find something interesting..
edit: Oh, and if you happen to have Raven with enough energy for PDD, it can buy you so much time against Tempest..
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Hey all! I JUST got into beta, and I'm in dire needs of tvp mech openings. I enjoyed mech in WoL and im sure the rules have changed for HotS
Anyone have any suggestions of where to start? Maybe we can develop a something here.
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Basically its the same. Tanks, Thors, Hellions (or its more battle hellions) + air support (vikings, raven, bcs) + some ghosts.
I dont think there are any real Buildorders.
My question:
Is there a build order wher you can go fairly economic while not gettin terrible terrible damage by the common stalker, zealot, mothershipcore push?
I think 1 rax expand is too risky when you want to go to mech afterwards. You always get damaged heavily. CC first isnt viable at all etc.
Another thing:
Blink Allin - what is the best way to defend against it? Is it even possible with a "mech" opening?
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OMG what in the world beats swarmhost, hydra, viper? I had 5 bases and all the money I want and he stayed and 4 bases even...I went bio with hellbats in case of mass ling, 3-3 upgrades, mass medivac with the new upgrade. He was defended against drops. I tried to run past swarmhosts but didnt work. Eventually the waves of free units ran me over, he also made some banes and ultras later, but srsly, every time I try to stim and kills the swarmhosts he does blinding cloud with his like 5 or more vipers, I am forced to run and take tons of damage from the hydras. Do I have to get tanks even when i am going bio and tanks are not even upgraded? Also he can blind the tanks and then cant move out of it...This is even worse than brood infestor in wol. Any ideas or is this really a balance issue?
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Ok here is a question ive been struggling with for a while.
I feel like I'm mechanically better and have better multitasking than most of the people I play (I am in platinum), but I often kind of "wing it" and I think it's holding me back a ton. I really don't really have any solid build orders that I can rely on, and sometimes think to myself "WTF am I doing?!".
I think my chances of getting in diamond or maybe masters is pretty good if I kick ass in the beta, so my question to you is what are some solid builds us mediocre terrans can practice to push us to the next level? I realize its early to really assess the meta game at this point, but looking for maybe some suggestions.
Thanks TL you kick ass
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I've been doing mech most of my games so far. I just started playing since new patch. I open gas first (on 12) then cut scv to get 12 barracks. Rush out reactor mines. Keep rallying mines to Protoss base, micro them from time to time when they're on cooldown. Keep making marines out of barracks for safety. Expand, get more factories, go into full mech. Mines are really good against Protoss from what I've seen so far.
If you make it to late game with decent bank and near max, start transitioning into air since you get free 3/3.
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On maps where blink stalkers can only get in through a limited area, widow mines are effective enough to open mech. You have to put them out of range of the stalkers on the low ground so they have to blink into range of the mine to attack it. Otherwise it's not possible. I think if the mothership core wasn't mobile then it could work, but a flying detector that early in the game means that tanks, hellions, and widow mines aren't flexible enough to deal with Protoss aggression.
I just can't figure out how to kill the mothership core with a mech opening. Adding a quick starport hurts your unit count a lot, plus blink stalkers can easily snipe off the one or two vikings. Quick thor is soooo risky. It can kill it, but it would basically be your only unit.
On the other hand, bio-mech play should be a LOT stronger, since upgrades are combined. I wonder if marine/tank/viking could work against Protoss now. I'll try it over the next few days.
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Anyone able to successfully rush protoss?
Marine/scv, 2rax (concussive), and 3rax+stim are all very ineffective for me at the moment, even against opponents who are going 1gate expo. They just seem invulnerable with ms core + cheap dt's.
1/1/1 appears to be pretty strong still though.
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In WoL I meched all the time against toss, and it worked. But I just cant get it to work in HotS. The problem is three-fold for me. First there is that even if I get a mech army, the toss kinda expects it and they arent as clueless as in WoL about what to do against mech. Next we got that the mech boosts. Hellbat is nice, no complaining there, and while thors removal of energy bar means you can use them against toss, the only reason you want to use them against toss is as anti-air, which wasnt needed in the first place in WoL because toss air was worse (and even if it was useful against mech, they still didnt make it). Okay they are nice against archons too, but that just means archons get replaced by immortals.
But then the main problem I have, is getting to mech in the first place without falling enormously behind. The initial stalkers, zealot, mcore poke is already a bitch to hold off, let alone if he really does an offensive strategy. In WoL I opened with cloak banshee harras to buy me the required time, but that is pointless in hots for so many reasons.
Blizzard keeps doing desperate attempts at making reapers relevant in TvP, but besides breaking them in TvT they dont achieve much with it, so reapers to buy time are also off.
I can try what Scila said, mass mines. However from my usage of mines my conclusion is that they are pretty close to useless against toss, and overrated against most other races. They have some use, like a burrowed lings on expansion location, but then better, however in the end a toss just kills them all one at a time. And with mcore they dont even need observers to do it.
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United Kingdom2950 Posts
Hello!
Tried playing Zerg in HOTS but it feels weird, so I swapped back to Terran pre-2.0.2 and have been playing it post patch. I still feel really weak late game vs Protoss and have not gotten comfortable with the new units at all. I feel like with the huge armory buff that mech is viable/necessary because bio against colossi/templar feels too fragile even with the medivac buff.
Also how are people dealing with reapers in TvT? I almost always open reaper now just to counter reaper and it leads to crazy situations. Is there a list of maps where reaper is bad/good? There are some maps where it is so hard to defend vs reaper if you open 1rax cc or something.
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Is there a way to open save in TvT without Reapers? With all that lag from EU its a waste to even try and micro reapers.
And is there any source of generel builds? I'm really lost in nearly all matchups, because I don't want to play WoL style and try to use the new units what ends up in having like a few of each of them.
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When I open mines I always contain protoss first then get the battle helion asap with 1 or 2 medivac.
Late game is a bigger problem for me when protoss goes zealot mass immortals... I can't find anything else than a sky terran switch a this point.
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I've been experimenting with reaper openings in all matchups and they seem strongest in TvT so far. I've had the most trouble with the build when they get widow mines. If they get marauders and/or bunkers i just keep expanding. Doing a banshee followup to reapers seems strong too, since reapers can keep their marine count down.
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In TvP, I find rushing for Thor and pushing out with a handful of SCVs and Reactor Marines really effective, especially if you proxy the Thor and immediately upgrade armor.
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I have a question about the mine : in what situation do you build hellions and when to build mines ?
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I have a question: since the new patch I win virtually all games as Terran. Any advice?
User was temp banned for this post.
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With the new buff to medivac healing has anyone experimented on Terran bio coupled with Hellbats since heal effects them too (looking at it like firebat with no stim). And does anyone think it's a viable playstyle?
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Masters Terran here -- Have people had any success with MMM + Hellbat vs Zerg when they go Roach/Hydra/Swarm Host?
I've been getting raped every game when trying this out.. Is it a must to get tanks out vs this composition? There have been games when I havent even been able to take a 3rd base b/c Roach/Hydra/SH is so strong, they just contain you...
Whats a good opener that people have found to be effective? Reactor Hellions? Just straight bio?
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EPT
