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Chronicle
161 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Waypoint 3 satisfied: 6:13.31: 79M 27G 34E 34/ 34S Buildings: 1 Nexus 2 Assimilator 3 Pylon 3 WarpGate 1 Cybernetics Core 1 Twilight Council 1 Dark Shrine Units: 22 Probe 2 Zealot 2 Stalker 2 Dark Templar Upgrades: Warp Gate Transformation | ||
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leo23
United States3075 Posts
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Roblicious
United States64 Posts
On November 16 2010 04:38 Hurkyl wrote: Switch that to 5 Chrono Boosts on WarpGate, and the 5 Stalkers are completed at 4:51, according to the simulator. I either did 4 or 5 CBs dont remember but heres a replay of me doing it to a Terran that was doin 2 rax expo PvT 5 stalker 5 mins | ||
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fishjie
United States1519 Posts
On November 15 2010 18:45 Chronicle wrote: Your not not the sharpest tool in the box. Learn 2 Read posts before you make stupid comments. its "you're" not "your" and he's right, its not a korean 4 gate, because there's only 2 gates l2read yourself kthxbai User was temp banned for this post. | ||
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Chronicle
161 Posts
On November 16 2010 09:07 fishjie wrote: its "you're" not "your" and he's right, its not a korean 4 gate, because there's only 2 gates l2read yourself kthxbai You are either blind or very stupid. L2Read, more specifically the below quote. I'll even highlight the important parts so it is easier for your feeble mind to take in. On November 15 2010 14:59 Chronicle wrote: No because it uses 2 gates not 4 with less units overall. Costwise Stalkers are twice as expensive as zealots which is why you have less gateways. A Korean 4 gate done correctly can have 7 zealots out with 4 gates with a better econ around the same time this comes out, with the ability to continually warp in 4 zealots each cycle. User was banned for this post. | ||
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Seide
United States831 Posts
On November 16 2010 08:04 Steelflight-Rx wrote: I was watching some high level euro games today (tarson vs white-ra) and noticed, that like many players, tarson opted not to scout at all. That might be an artifact of playing against white-ra a lot, and knowing his play style, but I have seen other terrans opt out of SCV scouting. Tarson was going a banshee/tank build, that at 5 minutes had him with about 5 marines and a bunch of tech buildings just starting to kick into production. I think at high levels, this 5stalker rush could hurt greedy terrans who don't scout, although low-mid diamond, most terran players are probably SCV scouting. Tarson is a player known for not scouting or scouting late. As he says: "If I know my build is safe fom early agression, and that my BO doesnt really depend on their build(cloak banshee is one such build, if you deny scouting), why should I sacrifice that economy for unneeded information". With banshees vs P, all you need to know is whether its a 4gate or not. If its not a 4 gate, and there is no robo, you already ahead due to lack of detection, so if the Terran knows its not a 4gate, which can be accomplished with a later SCV scout(when each SCV matter less), he only has to account for Robo, as in other cases he has already achieved a BO win. If that late SCV scout does see a 4 warpgate, 1-2 bunkers and some extra marines with repair will hold untill you get banshees out, then the protoss is in trouble. | ||
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michaelhasanalias
Korea (South)1231 Posts
The only viability I think this has is in team games or 4-player maps. Steppes vs. Zerg is the only other time I can see this build working, as a lot of zerg players tend to do blind openers (which is this case here). Still, I plan to share this with my 2's toss partner, as this + 7RR seems like it might win outright. edit: i watched this replay, and the zerg clearly beat you. The only reason he lost is because he stopped mining. Through everything he was economically ahead of you up until he quit mining and afk'd 13 drones in his base for about a minute. You also micro'd them poorly and I think you could have done better, so maybe it cancels out. Very interesting though... I need to find this BOoptimizer. | ||
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Steelflight-Rx
United States1389 Posts
On November 16 2010 09:33 Seide wrote: Tarson is a player known for not scouting or scouting late. As he says: "If I know my build is safe fom early agression, and that my BO doesnt really depend on their build(cloak banshee is one such build, if you deny scouting), why should I sacrifice that economy for unneeded information". With banshees vs P, all you need to know is whether its a 4gate or not. If its not a 4 gate, and there is no robo, you already ahead due to lack of detection, so if the Terran knows its not a 4gate, which can be accomplished with a later SCV scout(when each SCV matter less), he only has to account for Robo, as in other cases he has already achieved a BO win. If that late SCV scout does see a 4 warpgate, 1-2 bunkers and some extra marines with repair will hold untill you get banshees out, then the protoss is in trouble. The point is that some cheeses can take advantage of terrans who don't scout. Even if the fast banshee is safe vs standard play, something like 5stalkers hitting just before the banshee comes out can do a ton of damage. This build order is obviously cheesey, but it could do a lot of damage vs someone who isn't ready for it | ||
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Perscienter
957 Posts
Here are some numbers for Zerg build orders I ran with haploid: 14 gas, 13 pool. mb ready at 4:42 14 hatch, 13 pool, 16 gas. mb finishes at 6:05 15 hatch, 14 pool, 16 pool. mb ready at 6:01. 14 pool, 16 hatch, 16 gas. mb ready at 5:50. 'mb' means metabolic boost. | ||
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10372 Posts
yeah against PvZ it would be risky, but in PvP it would seem relatively safe, not standard and not economical but "safe", reason being protoss usually 4gate or 3gate robo or other things that won't prepare them for 5 stalkers problem is i'm not sure if you will be able to suceed well if he scouts you we need to find if for example a standard protoss who scouts such an early gate will be able to put a forge up in time with enough canons while not having a worse economy than Protoss (doesn't matter how bad the econ is, as anything less than equal will give the 5 Stalker rush player an advatage, especially since he has 5 mobile stalkers vs static defense) or is able to get some stalkers going himself, and able to reinforce slowly with a better economy than the rusher since the rusher will only have about 12 probes and therefore may not be able to maintain the 5 stalker advantage perhaps since you know how to use the build order tester you could do this? (probably under the conditions that the probe scouts after a 12 gate, or to be safe and even more sure about this build may be after their 9 pylon, etc.) | ||
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mikell
Australia352 Posts
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Hurkyl
304 Posts
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michaelhasanalias
Korea (South)1231 Posts
On November 16 2010 13:05 Hurkyl wrote: A couple of variations have already been posted, that have a lot more probes. link? | ||
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Hurkyl
304 Posts
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patron
United States63 Posts
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Barook
Germany143 Posts
On November 16 2010 12:40 mikell wrote: this is nothing like the 7rr, this is completely all in . the 7rr maintains atleast 17 drones.. The "correct" version has 3 Warpgates, 5 Stalkers at 5 minutes and still 20 Probes (normal production with Chronoboost support would most likely be around 23-24 at that point). I don't see why people would disregard the build just because the one of the OP is based on a program flaw. | ||
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Jayrod
1820 Posts
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Seide
United States831 Posts
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Roblicious
United States64 Posts
On November 16 2010 14:32 Jayrod wrote: okay i finally got to try this build against my zerg friend and i can say that beyond the shadow of a doubt this build sucks. like most all in/cheese builds if they are scouted they are easily defended | ||
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Pitsot
Russian Federation20 Posts
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