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Blazinghand
United States25562 Posts
EBWOP
On October 23 2015 22:55 marvellosity wrote:
when you lynch rayn literally every time he is mafia and don't ever lynch him when he is town, then you can tell me what and when i should be reading rayn
understood?
historically, is this actually true when you're town?
On October 23 2015 23:01 Xatalos wrote:
I can't say I'm an expert on rayn, but I'll just say that I feel his current game is closer to his scumgame on VS than anything else.
I seem to have missed it in your back-and-forths with marv or maybe I read it and forgot it, but a link or a quote or something when you make statements liket his is important if you want to actually convice people. Of course, I am pro rayn lynch since he is scum, because he got RNGed, so as your ally in this let me advise you: posts like this won't convince peopel. Please link me pls
On October 23 2015 23:08 marvellosity wrote:
my reasoning was that you're a bit of a pussy as mafia and it would be much easier for you just to townread me when if you are mafia you know there is a 0% chance of me ever getting lynched.
the fact you pushed me before under similar circumstances weakens that as a heuristic though
although i doubt you'd make the same mistake twice
BTW this is the reason that GB isn't necessarily scum for tunnelling Vivax. Obviously "stuborrnness as a towntell" is an easily fatigued heuristic, but you don't want to chuck it out just for that reason.
On October 23 2015 23:10 Chromatically wrote:So I assume no one agrees with me on Xatalos then? Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless. Here are the basic points I made: Xatalos was active without posting anything particularly in the beginning of the game (mafia do this because they want to appear active but have trouble posting content), waffling on votes (mafia do this because they want to keep their options open and not ignore their partners), throwing suspicion on rayn initially (mafia do this to make people look worse than they are), weird read on BH (mafia throw out townreads without thinking about why). The last two points are meh, but the first two I think are pretty clearly scum traits and certainly not "null at worst" from any perspective. The filter length defense is the only good one I've heard, but filter length is not everything. If people really don't want to lynch Xatalos, I'll obviously consolidate onto someone else. But I do think I made a strong case and I feel good about it.
Uh, isn't that consistent with Xat buying into RNG, townreading me, and pushing the RNG target? The actions you've described are like, the actions of someone who has joined the glory of RNG so unless you're saying "buying into RNG is scummy" I dont' think you've got a case here buddy
On October 23 2015 23:24 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 23:20 Xatalos wrote:On October 23 2015 23:08 marvellosity wrote:
my reasoning was that you're a bit of a pussy as mafia and it would be much easier for you just to townread me when if you are mafia you know there is a 0% chance of me ever getting lynched.
the fact you pushed me before under similar circumstances weakens that as a heuristic though
although i doubt you'd make the same mistake twice Btw can you really say I'm a pussy as scum after that game where I and Artanis bussed each other all game?  That was fun. yes, bussing each other is pussy way out because it means you don't have the balls to tunnel a townie gonna have to try meta Chrome at some point. My evening cleared up (i was gonna be afk all weekend and spring that on you guys when i finished work, but my plans fell through) Show nested quote +On October 22 2015 13:59 Chromatically wrote:
Alright yamato is off the lynch list for me. I have a hard time seeing him faking anger about getting scumread by people for this and I don't think he's just making up his reasoning there as mafia. Both of those last posts feel really town to me. Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 00:26 Chromatically wrote:
I don't really see why GB is mafia for that read rather than it just being a bad read. Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 02:47 Chromatically wrote:On October 23 2015 02:41 marvellosity wrote:
pretty hard to shake my townfeels on rayn when he comes into the thread saying he has 2 townreads and no mafiareads when at that point i had 2 townreads and no mafiareads and the 2 townreads were the same as mine. I like this post a lot, I get a strong town feeling from this. I don't like any of these posts much. I don't think the anger thing is a good reason to townread yamato. I made an unexplained punt vote on GB and it reads as a bit of a weird defence. I'm also not sure that Chrome should be getting strong townfeels from the post i made rather than others/the whole body of play. Also have this nagging feeling where Chrome described ritoky as picking up on "textbook mafia tells" and he's essentially doing the exact same thing with Xatalos. I don't like it. I understand picking up on Xata's read progression on rayn, I think it's possibly reasonable to be suspicious of that, but the rest of it I don't think I like much.
I definitely think Chrom isn't being well-organized on his Xat push. He's on my "people i might consider lynching who are not named raynpelikoneet today" which is fairly impressive since currently that list is very short and includes raynpelikoneet, even though it explicitly excludes him, because of the glory of rng
seriously though I can't track that thought process. Still pushing forwards, one way or another I'll have this sorted out by the time I'm caught up with thread. what an adventure!
On October 23 2015 23:28 marvellosity wrote:
we're not gonna lynch rayn
i'm not totally confident he's town but i have enough reason to take him off the table today
your call on this since you are obvtown and the best non-me player here, but if he is scum and got rnged, think about how mad he'd be to get lynched cause of that kekeke
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Blazinghand
United States25562 Posts
ok taking a quick dinner break, all this reading his hungry work and it's time for second breakfast
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On October 24 2015 03:36 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:35 Chromatically wrote:
marv. Do you think you have reasonable evidence that I make townreads as mafia and not as town? Do you think the case you've made for that is good enough? what's that got to do with anything? it's not why i scumread you it's an observation
So it had nothing to do with your read on me? Why would you post it then? You did use it as a point towards me being mafia.
It got a reaction from me because a) it's completely untrue and b) it's such a nitpicky thing to bring up. You pointed out one game as town I played and used it as the basis to say that I don't make townreads as mafia, which is a clearly unsupported statement that you then used as a point against me.
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On October 24 2015 03:31 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 21:46 Xatalos wrote:
Really marv? I think Slam has said a lot more interesting stuff already than he ever did last game (as scum). There he just basically hanged around, trolling, but I thought he was town because he was so "natural" in the thread.
This game... Mostly I was enlightened by him liking ritoky for his "town BH makes reads based on his RNG push DING DING" post (which really makes me feel better about ritoky too, since I forgot that post and wondered a bit about his confidence in BH being town... Now I understand). Also I liked how he brought up the weird progression from rayn regarding GB... Which basically went like certain town -> die scum, based on.. What? Missing posts from GB earlier? Then why that hard defense of him in the first place, without even reading his posts? And now the confident scumread because that's where the thread was flowing?
What I'm trying to say is, reading Slam's posts made me feel better about Slam and ritoky, and worse about rayn. Not really sure how you came to your conclusions marv...?
On the other hand, GB has felt a bit better lately. The Vivax read is a bit... But like marv said, it feels like a really weird target to pick as scum. And I liked his meta thing about me. And he's unlikely scum with rayn (no reason for scum rayn to suddenly go on the offensive this late in the day otherwise after hard defending him before). So I See you going to the mat for slam here. How does Slam convince you rayn is scum? I'm glad to see someone on board with the "GB being stubborn could be a town-tell" boat, but how does this have to do with an associative tell with rayn? Rayn is totally willing to attack teammates when appropriate as scum, and in a game with no investigative roles I'd be a lot more confident about rayn lasting through lylo as scum than I would GB. Can you explain in a bit more detail why rayn as scum wouldn't change his mind on GB as scum, if GB's push starts to falter? Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless. This post is bad and you should feel bad. Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 22:34 Xatalos wrote:
Let's see... My current thoughts are... (not in any particular order)
Town
Vivax
Blazinghand
ritoky
Alakaslam
Nullish
GlowingBear
gumshoe
Hopeless1der
Onegu
yamato77
marvellosity
Scummy
Chromatically
raynpelikoneet
That's where I'm at... I think there's at least 1-2 scum between rayn/Chrom and then 1-2 in the null section. Why do you have marv as scum? As I noted earlier, Marv is like supremely demotivated as scum now (to the point of almost throwing games, never trying, conceding with 3 or 2 scum alive, etc). It's super obvious to me that marv is town, since he's actually trying to play the game rather than be a little whiny baby about it. Just look at his game history.
It wasn't a decisive part really, but Slam brought up the whole issue of rayn's read on GB and how it shifted based on thread sentiment rather than anything changing about GB. He was first oddly certain about GB being town, then suddenly oddly certain about him being scum (and this happened because of pressure gathering on GB, not because he said new stuff). I don't really see why rayn should have dropped the GB read as scum since GB is still a lynch candidate.
Do you townread Chromatically and why?
I didn't have marv as scum back when I made that post. Currently I'm leaning towards the possibility. Mostly because of his odd hard defense of rayn that was based on something that didn't even happen. It makes the most sense in the event of a rayn/marv team, but we'll see if that's the case.
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##Unvote
##Vote Chromatically
He failed the entry test of participating on a wavelength with others (which is why he didn't make it into my initial town list)
He's good at nonstop producing reads with some arguments attached to them but doesn't really interact with the thread much until he gets scummed.
The ritoky picture argument he called a slam dunk argument (Not sure if bad or mafia for this one, but both is also possible. So it's 66 % vs 33%, science never fails).
Feels mechanical (stick up his arse).
And obviously, this is part me, part marv propaganda.
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On October 24 2015 03:41 Blazinghand wrote:... Show nested quote +On October 23 2015 23:10 Chromatically wrote:So I assume no one agrees with me on Xatalos then? On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless. Here are the basic points I made: Xatalos was active without posting anything particularly in the beginning of the game (mafia do this because they want to appear active but have trouble posting content), waffling on votes (mafia do this because they want to keep their options open and not ignore their partners), throwing suspicion on rayn initially (mafia do this to make people look worse than they are), weird read on BH (mafia throw out townreads without thinking about why). The last two points are meh, but the first two I think are pretty clearly scum traits and certainly not "null at worst" from any perspective. The filter length defense is the only good one I've heard, but filter length is not everything. If people really don't want to lynch Xatalos, I'll obviously consolidate onto someone else. But I do think I made a strong case and I feel good about it. Uh, isn't that consistent with Xat buying into RNG, townreading me, and pushing the RNG target? The actions you've described are like, the actions of someone who has joined the glory of RNG so unless you're saying "buying into RNG is scummy" I dont' think you've got a case here buddy ...
Are you trying to say that Xatalos' read on rayn is based on him following RNG?
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On October 24 2015 03:46 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:41 Blazinghand wrote:... On October 23 2015 23:10 Chromatically wrote:So I assume no one agrees with me on Xatalos then? On October 23 2015 21:59 Xatalos wrote:
Ah, and Chromatically... Not sure yet. He's kept being pretty reasonable / constructive all game, but I don't really think there's been much (if anything?) I've agreed with him on... And that case against me is just, pretty much describing my town meta features as scummy points. The stuff he's saying about me is null at worst. And then I'm confidently scum? I've received a couple of cases like that (from scum) before. Most notably the case that called me a "drama queen" or something (LOL). That was a funny case. Anyways, it feels kind of like those cases, nitpicking null/towny things and painting them in the worst possible light. It doesn't even feel like an actual case, more like an effort to try and find *somethjng* (anything) bad about me... And failing, but calling me scum regardless. Here are the basic points I made: Xatalos was active without posting anything particularly in the beginning of the game (mafia do this because they want to appear active but have trouble posting content), waffling on votes (mafia do this because they want to keep their options open and not ignore their partners), throwing suspicion on rayn initially (mafia do this to make people look worse than they are), weird read on BH (mafia throw out townreads without thinking about why). The last two points are meh, but the first two I think are pretty clearly scum traits and certainly not "null at worst" from any perspective. The filter length defense is the only good one I've heard, but filter length is not everything. If people really don't want to lynch Xatalos, I'll obviously consolidate onto someone else. But I do think I made a strong case and I feel good about it. Uh, isn't that consistent with Xat buying into RNG, townreading me, and pushing the RNG target? The actions you've described are like, the actions of someone who has joined the glory of RNG so unless you're saying "buying into RNG is scummy" I dont' think you've got a case here buddy ... Are you trying to say that Xatalos' read on rayn is based on him following RNG?
Haha :D:D:D:D
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The ritoky picture thing was a joke. I assumed that was obvious.
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 On October 24 2015 03:44 Vivax wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote Chromatically
He failed the entry test of participating on a wavelength with others (which is why he didn't make it into my initial town list)
He's good at nonstop producing reads with some arguments attached to them but doesn't really interact with the thread much until he gets scummed.
The ritoky picture argument he called a slam dunk argument (Not sure if bad or mafia for this one, but both is also possible. So it's 66 % vs 33%, science never fails).
Feels mechanical (stick up his arse).
And obviously, this is part me, part marv propaganda.
Hmm... Well, I'm extremely fine with the lynch being rayn vs Chromatically.
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11589 Posts
On October 24 2015 03:35 gumshoe wrote:ebwop yamato I'd like some answers to the following two question. 1: What did you find scummy about slam early on? in response to also what about hopeless? what made you read him as town? has anything changed?
you bore me
what do you think about them?
going back now and explaining why I thought those things at that time is pointless
not much has changed
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United Kingdom36161 Posts
On October 24 2015 03:43 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:36 marvellosity wrote:On October 24 2015 03:35 Chromatically wrote:
marv. Do you think you have reasonable evidence that I make townreads as mafia and not as town? Do you think the case you've made for that is good enough? what's that got to do with anything? it's not why i scumread you it's an observation So it had nothing to do with your read on me? Why would you post it then? You did use it as a point towards me being mafia. It got a reaction from me because a) it's completely untrue and b) it's such a nitpicky thing to bring up. You pointed out one game as town I played and used it as the basis to say that I don't make townreads as mafia, which is a clearly unsupported statement that you then used as a point against me.
in Detention as town you didn't make a townread
in Order as mafia you did
it's not totally untrue. look for yourself.
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##Unvote
##Vote: Alakaslam
I think I've been clearly posting my thoughts in the thread and that you should be able to see my thought process behind how my reads have formed or changed.
I'm okay with Slam being lynched. I think BH or Xatalos would probably be better but I'm doubting myself on Xatalos now too so I don't really know.
I'm probably overreacting to marv because no one else seems to think it's weird.
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Ah, the delicious tears of rayn :D
"Post: #2216RE: WTHITAHAIH?!?!?!?!? Mafia
Like Xatalos doesn't have any reason to think i am mafia other than "sheeping cory".
Xatalos when did you become adumb sheeple in your opinion?
You sheeped me on D1, you sheeped cory on D1. You sheeped cory on N1, now you don't have cory to sheep so you are making bad cases, you are not being consistent at all.
You call me tunneling and attacking "easy targets". You FUCKING voted for Tiger who was the "easiest target" ever on D1, you had SIU as a scumread all game long, another "easy target". Your vote ended up on rsoultin who you yourself called "an easy target". At least i had fucking balls to think scummy play is scum.
Hypocrite scum."
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United Kingdom36161 Posts
Xatalos stop posting shit noone gives a flying fuck about.
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I did skim that game trying to catch a glimpse of something sexual
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On October 24 2015 03:57 Chromatically wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: Alakaslam
I think I've been clearly posting my thoughts in the thread and that you should be able to see my thought process behind how my reads have formed or changed.
I'm okay with Slam being lynched. I think BH or Xatalos would probably be better but I'm doubting myself on Xatalos now too so I don't really know.
I'm probably overreacting to marv because no one else seems to think it's weird.
Hm you mean the way how he "cherrypicked" on your meta? Well... Dunno really, as I don't know your meta. And it's overall hard to comment since I don't exactly trust either of you.
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On October 24 2015 03:54 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2015 03:43 Chromatically wrote:On October 24 2015 03:36 marvellosity wrote:On October 24 2015 03:35 Chromatically wrote:
marv. Do you think you have reasonable evidence that I make townreads as mafia and not as town? Do you think the case you've made for that is good enough? what's that got to do with anything? it's not why i scumread you it's an observation So it had nothing to do with your read on me? Why would you post it then? You did use it as a point towards me being mafia. It got a reaction from me because a) it's completely untrue and b) it's such a nitpicky thing to bring up. You pointed out one game as town I played and used it as the basis to say that I don't make townreads as mafia, which is a clearly unsupported statement that you then used as a point against me. in Detention as town you didn't make a townread in Order as mafia you did it's not totally untrue. look for yourself.
Yes, I'll take your word for it that those statements are true. Then, in your post, you used those games to imply that I don't give townreads as town, which is a clearly untrue statement you made based on very flimsy evidence. There's no point splitting hairs over this, you should know what I meant.
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On October 24 2015 04:00 Vivax wrote:
I did skim that game trying to catch a glimpse of something sexual
Did you?
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EPT
