I'm going to break this down into two parts. Let's start with the warning. Koshi received a warning for the following:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/510753-bavarian-nightkills?page=11#220Koshi clearly overreacts to Palmar's laughing "he's a good town" comment made by Skynx. The problem is, if you look at context, Palmar wasn't flaming Koshi's skill - using that as a comparison to the "braindead monkey" comments Koshi himself brought up as an example - looking deeper into the indexed comments you will see that Palmar legitimately thought Koshi was mafia based on tone (flipside: Palmar as potential mafia can choose to push Koshi on tone as a poor read, getting under people's skin as mafia has been done before without going too far) and he was laughing at anyone calling Koshi town, full stop. Not at Koshi directly.
Either way, regardless of alignment, Palmar did not insult Koshi's skill, and regardless of interpretation, Koshi completely overreacted to the comment. If you read his filter, it should be obvious why. These two comments were pushes on Koshi that directly preceded the "I'm not buying his fake tone" - hardly an insult at all, just connecting his tone to him being mafia.
On July 05 2016 07:18 Palmar wrote:
Koshi is mafia 100%
On July 05 2016 19:35 Palmar wrote:
Koshi is 100% mafia I'm never unvoting.
Now if Koshi can't handle Palmar calling him mafia for tone, that's entirely on him.
However, if he had honestly thought Palmar was flaming, the correct thing to do would have been to PM the mods. Instead, he does what he did and proceeded to PM me asking to replace out. In thread, Koshi also additionally mentioned replacements and replacing out as a statement, which had it gone though (and I'd never have allowed it for that reason, ever) it'd have been a bannable offence.
The reaction - along with asking to modkill Palmar in subsequent posts completely justified the warning.
On July 06 2016 01:19 Koshi wrote:
Well I asked to be replaced or that Palmar gets replaced.
On July 06 2016 03:38 Koshi wrote:
hmm. Replacing is indeed pretty stupid. Modkill it is.
On July 06 2016 03:44 Koshi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 06 2016 03:44 Skynx wrote:On July 06 2016 03:38 Koshi wrote:
hmm. Replacing is indeed pretty stupid. Modkill it is.
Man don't do dis fuck the haterz just play
oh. I meant modkill Palmar. lol
It takes him 3 posts in the span of 2 hours for him to cool down over this, only after he's called out by other players, does he do so.
Now to the second part of Koshi - that is regarding overall BM. Not just in one post, but overall. This is my opinion.
There were several posts where Koshi called people's arguments trash or criticised play (i.e. Sicklucker's tracker claim). I re-read Koshi's filter individually and in context to the thread, this to me is valid, I would never warn for this. You are insulting the argument, not the person. For comparison's sake, I recall geript in a BH-run newbie way back when using the F word umpteen times to describe how terrible an argument was, but not once did he insult the player. Because of the excessive swearing though, BH informed me to pre-warn him for the swearing with an acknowledgement that he was not insulting the player, but yes, the swearing was excessive.
Post 919 - Koshi puts down VE's meta. Read it over and over again. Is it blistering? Yes. Is it warnable? He connects VE's mafia-siding - true or not - to an ineffective or "horrible" meta. He does call him horrible, but it's not outright flaming, it addresses gameplay.
828 is slightly worse though - it's a direct insult - "trashtownies who don't have a clue"
The post that has the most direct insult I am seeing here:
On July 08 2016 23:55 Koshi wrote:
VE/RB/Kush
Kush is almost lock mafia for me. TMI and really bad lists. I remember him making lists as mafia. Long time ago though. But there is no fire in him at all.
VE is discussed. I literally can only say bad things about him that would hurt his feelings if he is town and actually trying to solve this game so w.e.
RB. Started with superstrong reads but that was probably TMI mixed with overcompensating trying to pretend he was helping town. Fell down flat to the floor with horrific replies to Shape and others. Came back strong right before EoD. Fell down flat to the floor after EoD. Didn't get up yet.
1 mafia is hiding. I don't know who.
The problem I have with this? Like you pushed his lynch, you made your case as to why you should lynch him based on a meta you cannot discern or read (post 919) plus arguments you made on his gameplay. Why was this (bolded) even necessary? This is probably the one post (926) that crosses the line for personal insult territory.
(I was AFK at the time you'd made this post so no I didn't and couldn't rule on it then.)
The post where he says VE is horrible, his analysis is horrible, again, borderline but he's still connecting it to gameplay. Ever other blistering post, even the ones where he pushed sicklucker - again connected to play, and either called play, posts, analysis, etc, all poor, and not necessarily the players.
I read all of Koshi's posts and excepting I can say he was blistering, he was condescending towards townies after the lynch d1, but that is stuff you don't warn for. Post 926, I'd definitely say he crossed that line, especially when you read for context. 919 is borderline, he calls him horrible, and then a sentence later on analysis.
EPT
