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Mini Mafia 2 - Page 30
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
GG. | ||
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Chezinu
United States7466 Posts
To: Zato-1 [ Profile | Buddy ] Subject: If I get lynched Date: 1/8/10 21:55 kill Ace tonight. Then the next day town will lynch mikeymoo. | ||
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L
Canada4732 Posts
On January 11 2010 16:49 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote: Ace, if my play was so bad, and I was for sure not the medic... why kill me? Let it set in. GG. Exactly. It isn't enough that you think judge is lying. You need to think he's mafia and stands to gain something from lying. Additionally, how could I have been batting blind if my switch from criticism to support was admittedly when judge told me the content of his plan during day 1. What godfather would volunteer himself for a CONFIRMATION lynch and call a huge amount of town attention to himself? If judge was mafia, he asked for a DT check and would be killed according to his plan. If he was godfather, my slight modification to his plan would have removed his trade for our DT and left him essentially self-raped for no benefit. If he was town, we got a confirmed townie pool to claim to. So why would I want to have him killed day 1? | ||
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vx70GTOJudgexv
United States3161 Posts
On January 11 2010 16:53 Ace wrote: I don't know Judge. If someone had a plan and it's pretty a pretty ridiculous lie I'd be crazy to not attack it. GG. You're an idiot. I stand by my statement that you're an incompetent mafia player, now I'm adding in you're just plain incompetent. I'll ask again. If I'm such a bad player, and I'm such a hinderance for the town. Why the NIGHT KILL jackass? Usually mafia only nightkill those who they feel are a threat to them in the town. But funny, according to you, I seem to be useless and the reason town almost lost. Hmmmm.... flawed logic much? So again. GG. | ||
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nemY
United States3119 Posts
On January 11 2010 16:49 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote: Ace, if my play was so bad, and I was for sure not the medic... why kill me? Let it set in. GG. Way to be cocky about it bud, I was the one who sent the hit in (Ace was afk) and I just blindly picked someone and it happened to be you  My original plan was to lynch Chez, but after he up and outed me as mafia, I felt that would be a bit too blatant to kill him, so with time running out i resorted to a random hit. Your play had nothing to do with your death  | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 17:00 L wrote: Exactly. It isn't enough that you think judge is lying. You need to think he's mafia and stands to gain something from lying. Additionally, how could I have been batting blind if my switch from criticism to support was admittedly when judge told me the content of his plan during day 1. What godfather would volunteer himself for a CONFIRMATION lynch and call a huge amount of town attention to himself? If judge was mafia, he asked for a DT check and would be killed according to his plan. If he was godfather, my slight modification to his plan would have removed his trade for our DT and left him essentially self-raped for no benefit. If he was town, we got a confirmed townie pool to claim to. So why would I want to have him killed day 1? He gains the fact that the town believes he's a legit Medic. It doesn't matter if I believe he has nothing else to gain from it. He's lying. This is fundamental action of the game: a person lying blatantly is anti-town. There is no extra layer of what ifs and whys. It also doesn't matter that he asked for a confirmation lynch via DT check: How do you know once he's checked whatever he flips doesn't call for the DT to talk up? You don't. That's the entire point of Lynch All Liars play. You don't know as much information as he does so you can't know what his benefits are. Hence, you just lynch anyone lying to stop any Mafia from bullshit claims on Day 1. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 17:08 vx70GTOJudgexv wrote: You're an idiot. I stand by my statement that you're an incompetent mafia player, now I'm adding in you're just plain incompetent. I'll ask again. If I'm such a bad player, and I'm such a hinderance for the town. Why the NIGHT KILL jackass? Usually mafia only nightkill those who they feel are a threat to them in the town. But funny, according to you, I seem to be useless and the reason town almost lost. Hmmmm.... flawed logic much? So again. GG. I DIDNT KILL YOU I WASNT HERE. How many times do I have to tell you that? Durrrr? | ||
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L
Canada4732 Posts
He gains the fact that the town believes he's a legit Medic If the plan didn't involve him admitting he wasn't a medic post check, then subsequently KILLING HIMSELF you might be right.Unless you think that having enough people believing he was medic to keep himself alive into day 2 was a good trade off for painting crosshairs on his head in the first place. I'd argue that it isn't. How do you know once he's checked whatever he flips doesn't call for the DT to talk up? Oh, it obviously does call for the DT to talk up, but there's a way to prevent judge from being the person that gets talked to by the DT; Make someone else the mouth. Anyways, sleep for me. | ||
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nemY
United States3119 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:47 Incognito wrote: L kept saying that the town should keep checking HeavOnEarth's post, someone (Scamp?) compiled a list but it was ignored. nemY kept questioning the mafia's choice to kill HeavOnEarth day 1, but the town didnt' catch on. Too bad since HeavOnEarth picked out Ace + nemY as mafia. I was really sad about that, but I guess it doesnt matter too much ja? Next game no medic self protects. Question for everyone about DT checks: should checks be returned when they are asked for or after the day post comes up? Usually I think this hasn't been much of an issue, but this game DT got two mafia in a row and DID decide to claim so I don't know what you guys think about that. See this game had a weird/interesting scenario that will probably never happen again (unless Chez is DT again... ok it will probably happen again). Last night I wanted to hit Chezinu so bad. MM was dead and gone, Ace had been afk for awhile, so it was essentially team me. I wanted to hit Chez for a few reasons: 1.) He's the DT at best, a mouth at worst. If he's the DT, great we got him and we eliminate the possibility of role checks. If he's a mouth for somebody, then we've eliminated that channel for the DT to use and will be that much closer to drawing him out. 2.) He's annoying. 3.) He just busted MM on being mafia. Of course we'd want to kill him, unless we can convince the town he's not actually the DT (which i was trying rather unsuccessfully to do). 4.) He's annoying. So anyways I log onto TL at or around half time of the Packers/Cardinals game to report my hit when I notice I have a new PM. I log into my msgs and guess who it's from? Sure enough after that I go look at the mafia thread and see some number of posts of Chez saying "NEMY'S MAFIA". Kinda puts a wrench in my plans to kill him doesn't it? I can kill him out of spite and i'd still be dead the next day or i can kill somebody else and try to defend myself against the useless onslaught of "HE'S MAFIA" posts and absurd logic of the town. At least I thought the town's logic was absurd... I thought I did a decent job of defending myself considering the situation, oh well probably too little too late. However if I had gotten the hit in before he could receive DT check then this situation would have never happened. He'd be dead and the spotlight wouldn't have shone so brightly on me. It wouldn't have mattered in the end game of this game because Ace was vigi'd anyways, but it certainly could be a game changer in future games. | ||
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Chezinu
United States7466 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + To: nemY [ Profile | Buddy ] Subject: HI MAFIA!!! Date: 1/11/10 07:15 You guys think you can hidez from me??? lololololololol!!!!!!! DIE DIE DIE DIE !!!! Are you going to try and kill me out of spite now??? eh??? Then.. + Show Spoiler + From: nemY [ Profile | Buddy ] Subject: Re: INNER PERSONALITY! Date: 1/11/10 08:43 You are full of so much shit I can't wait to bust you on this; have fun being lynched! ----------------------------------------- Original Message: So wouldn't that be cool if I was like a mad detective and I could see inner personalities? Just saying... Anyways! Why didn't you say hi to Scamp publicly??? Are you afraid people would notice you?? huh huh?? I would love to see your defense this time! MUHAHAHAHA I IS ARE MAFIA!!!!! USE THIS PM AGAINST ME AND I WILL RELEASE FAR WORSE INFORMATION!!! *TAUNT! TAUNT! TAUNT!* To: nemY [ Profile | Buddy ] Subject: Oh I forgot to thank you Date: 1/11/10 08:50 THANK YOU FOR NOT KILLING ME TONIGHT!!!! Good luck trying to lynch me!!! NOT!!! I want you to fail for obvious reasons! You guys to kill Ace tonight while the Vigi kills you!! | ||
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Vivi57
United States6599 Posts
The minute Judge claimed Medic I was expecting a town lynch. It was actually the perfect reaction no matter what role I had : any Day 1 claims especially something that can't be proven should be looked at as a Mafia ploy. We've been through this like almost every game but it's impossible to know when the town is thinking straight. wrong. there's very little to gain from lynching judge at that point I immediately told Incognito to make me a Medic and I started accusing Judge. Even with Judge's bad play I was hoping I'd get DT checked. Amazingly I didn't, nor did Judge. This was my alibi for calling Judge out - I knew he was lying not only because it was a dumb move but because I was the real medic. mistake 2. We agreed that judge would turn up blue whether he was gf medic or vet. We were wrong, but there was still a 100% chance he wouldn't turn up red. We also knew that if you were mafia, you'd be gf so checking you was stupid. When the lynch came we also got another break. Chezinu said he was PMing around with Scamp. Scamp then last minute votes while Chez is playing around and taunting Malongo and Judge. Then Chez flip flops. I was actually sitting here thinking to myself how is possible no one would lynch Chez at this point? timing. At this point, you said you'd lynch chez if others would too. At this point, I would have lynched chez for being a retard. Chez can now say he made a genius play by doing this after it was too late to swap votes Then the play that ended the game came. Malongo didn't off Judge. This was the major play of the game that saved the town. None of the Mafia had any incentive to switch off of Judge because it made 0 sense - Judge looked guilty. If he died and flipped whatever he was (I knew he wasn't a Medic) Zato was going to be fucked royally (well, probably not with the way the town was playing). L still had a decent alibi saying he wanted to see what the plan was. Malongo was surely going to live no matter what, and we would have went into the next night sailing smooth with some good targets to hit. yes, amazing play by malongo Chezinu role claims the next day, and then Zato does right after. This was SWEET for us because no matter what Chez said it wasn't going to stick. I went to bed knowing it was highly possible for chez to die. mistake 3. Going over all the possible scenarios, it was an extremely easy decision to hit mikey then vig chez if necessary. You keep playing under the assumption that killing all claimers is the best way to go about it and that's made you make many mistakes this game. So all in all I think we did well considering the town had 0 clue what was going on, and it was Malongo's play and Chez's Ids that got the game sealed away. The town was making mistake after mistake and before this time frame no one was doing anything. The best players will make you think they played like shit and just get lucky while in reality, they're so many levels ahead of you that you can't begin to comprehend what they're thinking. Your continual cries to lynch the claimer hurt you badly because everyone could ignore you instead of having to respond to constructive play. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On January 11 2010 18:15 Vivi57 wrote: No it's right. We know he's lying. Its no longer even a question of "oh gee why would Mafia do that?!". You don't know what the Mafia knows. You don't know if someone slipped up some info in PMs. It comes down to is this guy lying or not? And townies that lie aren't going to get you very far. This very game showed you that because for all the praise of Judge's plan it didn't even come through. Wrong again. You have NO idea about anything relating to Judge. Nothing. There was no one connected to Judge in any way. All you know is this: Judge claimed Medic on Day 1. Stop trying to make it sound like there was some hidden condition by which Judge had to be innocent. There isn't one. You also didn't know I was GF. This is the same logic that was used last game I was Mafia and look what happened then. What is this bs? Can you list all the possible scenarios? The only claimer I wanted to kill was Judge. He lied, he had a plan, and it was on a role that couldn't be verified. Whether I'm town or Mafia why in the hell would I want him in a leadership role? Amazing, because the best players this game were 2, possibly even a 3rd person no one would have expected. Don't even try to post drivel like this and make it sound like there was some major mind game going on here. There was no major comprehension that was missing at all this game - everyone was playing screwy and letting things that normally would lead to death, like lying, just go. The site Judge even plays on his this in plain sight. Then again you can just ask other Mafia players on this forum that didn't play but watched this game what they think. Either way I had fun this game but in no way should anyone think Medic claims on Day 1 is some brilliant strategy that only Einstein could come up with - especially when it didn't even help you win. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
Why did you guys hit HoE night one? That seemed like a really strange decision. You had plenty more good hits in you. But Judge the main reason your plan didn't work was because of the GF. There is literally no reason to check you as the DT, whatever he gets back won't be mafia no matter what. It could be argued that you could hide a normal mafia by doing this plan (since he won't get checked anyway) which would be an epic move. I was not only against your plan because I was the medic, but it was because your plan hinged on the DT checking you which just wasn't going to happen. Even if he sees green it doesn't matter, you could still be the GF. But yes you could suicide and prove your true allegiance but what would that really accomplish? Oh and Ace, I think lynching Judge would of actually benefited the town more. A lot of people were still very skeptical about Judge and his plan could not take effect because the DT wouldn't do as he wanted because the GF mechanic made it seem pointless. If Judge died it would of made me suspect either you or L as the GF. The way you were posting was suspicious because I saw the same thing Zato did (I didn't research it nearly as well as he did. Amazing job.) and L was just being abrasive again and is hard to read because he always plays the same. Judge being alive left too many possibilities and if he died instead of Malongo it would of cleared a lot up for me at least. The plan ended up not working though, just as Ace said. We won because of Chez's checks and behavior analysis and Zato's amazing GF analysis. I don't think Malongo not killing himself was a big deal. The only reason Malongo's play MAY have fucked you is simply because you all ended up on the same list which wasn't even that suspicious considering we thought that Judge might of been mafia which meant the people on the Malongo list were more suspect then those on the Judge list. Except obviously to Judge who knew who he was looking at. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
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Incognito
United States2071 Posts
On January 11 2010 18:53 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Oh and Ace am I still on your lovely Abyss list? That would be very hurtful I don't think you need to ask that after protecting YOURSELF twice in a row :D | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
We hit HoE because he was posting quality stuff, and we didn't even need to touch the main townies. All of them were playing suspicious enough that leaving them alive was beneficial. I think nemy or MM also had Scamp as a possible target. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On January 11 2010 18:59 Incognito wrote: I don't think you need to ask that after protecting YOURSELF twice in a row :D Fuck that, self preservation. You gave me an immortal role. The fact I didn't role claim and laugh at everyone is impressive to myself. But yeah, no more self protection  I didn't even bother to think about who to protect. I figure if I keep posting they will think I am blue or catching on to them and hit me. I didn't feel like guessing at who was going to die.I can also assure you I would of missed both protects both days. If I wasn't going to protect myself Night 1 I would of protected Ace maybe? Dunno. At that time he was being arguing to lynch Judge and wasn't attacking as many townies. Night two I would of protected Chezinu. So I figure rather then guess where the mafia were, try to trick them into hitting me. I also thought Judge was a mafia so I told him my role and taunted him figuring it would fuck with his head on whether or not to hit me or not. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
As to DTs getting results instantly: I think it's fine, really. As to medics protecting themselves: I think it's better if they were unable to do this. Some thought that responding to role claims so favorably was uncharacteristic of the Town. The way I see it- the Town needs leadership and a plan if they want to win. Sitting back, chilling and waiting to see what happens is lazy / sloppy Town play, in my book. Worst case scenario for Town is when they're pointing the finger at each other while mafia lie back and don't commit to anything- which is exactly the situation Ace and Pyrr engineered on that other game I quoted, Mini Mafia 2. For this reason, I was relatively sympathetic to bold moves like Judge and Chezinu's roleclaim. For me, the turning point happened shortly after Day 2 came- we were two Townies down and with no good leads for mafia, and the Town members had begun to get restless. Losing our temper promised to be bad, which is why I roleclaimed shortly thereafter- besides, the timing and my role made it relatively inexpensive to give myself away. I'd use my special ability before mafia could take it away from me. Then there was Chezinu's DT checks. He screwed up Judge's plan, but was so ridiculously effective at uncovering mafia, he took care of pretty much everything but the godfather. On a side note, I'm glad I was right about Ace- after starting a misguided bandwagon on Malongo, getting a second innocent killed would've looked bad ^^; | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On January 11 2010 15:55 Incognito wrote: I know Qatol gives the results immediately. Don't know about other hosts though. I know for sure BC does it that way as well. I'm pretty sure Chuiu has also been doing that? Not 100% though. As for medics, I believe they are way too strong with self-protect. The biggest problem I have with it is what incentive is there to use Veteran any more? A medic who just self-protects every night is stronger than a Veteran. And on top of that, the medic can change that prot to anyone else? I guess you can use Veteran as a "dumbed down" role, but really, I just don't like that much of an overlap. Also, if 3 life Veterans and the Rock Star were too strong, an infinite life Medic is highly unlikely to be balanced. | ||
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