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KawaiiRice
United States2914 Posts
are there good learning resources for starting players? I'm pretty bad at playing from behind / playing aggressively / no idea about lane counters or team synergy. I've been playing blue ezreal mostly (currently silver 3) and some zilean support but I feel like there's a lot I don't know yet. thanks o/ | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
On August 27 2013 23:51 KawaiiRice wrote: hi, are there good learning resources for starting players? I'm pretty bad at playing from behind / playing aggressively / no idea about lane counters or team synergy. I've been playing blue ezreal mostly (currently silver 3) and some zilean support but I feel like there's a lot I don't know yet. thanks o/ We have an inhouse learning group that's playing almost every night at this point. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=422875 Keep up with that thread, times and channel are posted in there. | ||
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
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deathray797
196 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
Lifesteal quints basically let you sustain correctly for most of the early/midgame with a dblade or two on top of it. It helps when you've got a non-sustain support, and on any champion you want to build IE first on (since it saves you 800 gold by not needing to buy a vamp scepter for sustain right off the bat). | ||
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wraR.Raven
Argentina19 Posts
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Ethelis
United States2397 Posts
On September 02 2013 03:30 wraR.Raven wrote: Is there any soloq situation where karma outshines any other support? Karma is a great supporty solo laner. Horrible 0 cs support, so no. | ||
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Frudgey
Canada3367 Posts
And on that note, does anyone have tips for laning against Yorick? I'm trying to solve that match-up currently. It's tough for me. Thanks! | ||
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Simberto
Germany11786 Posts
And, well, a matchup always has two sides. What champion are you playing? Especially in the first few levels and if you got enough pots you might be able to just outsustain his manapool. Some champs can kill him in an allin. Some can outsustain his harrass even when he got a tear. Generally speaking he tends to push a lot and is rather easy to gank. Fighting after he used W+E for harass is usually a good idea, since that means you got less ghuls punching you and giving boni to yorick. If you can't sustain his harass, can't kill him in an allin, and can't convince your jungler to gank for you, sucks to be you. | ||
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Frudgey
Canada3367 Posts
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Aside from that, Yorick will probably beat you in lane unless you get significant jungle pressure. Just straight up Yorick is scummy. | ||
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Efficient
Australia32 Posts
I’ve been playing and watching LoL for a few months now. I’m only level 12 and feel like I really need some pointers. I’m apprehensive about posting something so long and this probably isn’t a simple question, but I’m reluctant to make a new post when I’m so inexperienced. Hopefully this post justifies its length. Here we go... When I played SC2 there was an accepted way of improving at low levels; learn safe build orders, work on your mechanics, learn how to beat the cheeses as you come across them and eventually you’ll start to move up. I did exactly that and improved steadily over time. But LoL games at level 12 play out in such a strange way, that I don’t really know what I can do to help my team win. No one jungles, no one plays support, no one listens to anyone else and in particular, no one farms. Almost every player just runs around the lane or map, trying to kill the other guy. So a 40 minute game usually ends up with 30-40 kills per team! I thought that trying to play safe and work on fundamentals like last hitting, not pushing my waves too hard, practicing some basic combos, learning how the different stats work and following pro guides would help. And it’s worked! A typical game for me: I end of with the most farm by close to 100, stats like 5-10 kills with 1-2 deaths. I’m not exaggerating here and I’m definitely not claiming I’m good or whining about the ranking system. A win is a win, a loss is a loss. And I’ve lost 8 of my last 10 games. I absolutely accept that I have infinity left to learn. But despite such crazy stats that’s about as much gold as a player that’s say 17 kills 11 deaths. So I don’t have this crushing advantage because everyone feeds everyone else like crazy. I’m finding it hard to farm in lane (which I guess is a fundamental skill to learn as a noob) because there’s always a teammate in your lane who just pushes the wave as hard as possible, tries to duel at every opportunity and doesn’t listen to you. I can accept that because at this level people are just screwing around having fun. I thought, screw it, I’ll go jungle. That way I won’t have to put up with a teammate. I was playing jungle Eve (which is so fun!) and was able to out CS everyone on the map just killing jungle camps and occupying unmanned lanes after my teammates died. And I would go ahead and jump on weaker players who had pushed their lanes too hard and picked up a bunch of kills. But with skirmishes breaking out left, right and center everyone feeds up and I feel like my safe strategy isn’t making an impact. And after 40 minutes with everyone fed, all inner turrets down on both sides and no one coordinating with anyone else it feels a bit random as to who secures the killing blow. Anyway, I thought that I was doing things right by trying not to take stupid risks. So I feel like my ‘play conservative and try to do the basics well’ philosophy (that worked so well in SC2) is translating into great individual stats relative to my peers but isn’t winning games. So here’s my actual question: Does everything I read about how to play orthodox and improve as a player apply to the batshit crazy ‘level 12’ metagame. Are there resources, guides or tutorials that do apply to me? I will take crap for my long post and am grateful for any advice. See you on the rift! EEfficient | ||
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Simberto
Germany11786 Posts
On September 05 2013 22:19 Efficient wrote: Hey TL I’ve been playing and watching LoL for a few months now. I’m only level 12 and feel like I really need some pointers. I’m apprehensive about posting something so long and this probably isn’t a simple question, but I’m reluctant to make a new post when I’m so inexperienced. Hopefully this post justifies its length. Here we go... When I played SC2 there was an accepted way of improving at low levels; learn safe build orders, work on your mechanics, learn how to beat the cheeses as you come across them and eventually you’ll start to move up. I did exactly that and improved steadily over time. But LoL games at level 12 play out in such a strange way, that I don’t really know what I can do to help my team win. No one jungles, no one plays support, no one listens to anyone else and in particular, no one farms. Almost every player just runs around the lane or map, trying to kill the other guy. So a 40 minute game usually ends up with 30-40 kills per team! I thought that trying to play safe and work on fundamentals like last hitting, not pushing my waves too hard, practicing some basic combos, learning how the different stats work and following pro guides would help. And it’s worked! A typical game for me: I end of with the most farm by close to 100, stats like 5-10 kills with 1-2 deaths. I’m not exaggerating here and I’m definitely not claiming I’m good or whining about the ranking system. A win is a win, a loss is a loss. And I’ve lost 8 of my last 10 games. I absolutely accept that I have infinity left to learn. But despite such crazy stats that’s about as much gold as a player that’s say 17 kills 11 deaths. So I don’t have this crushing advantage because everyone feeds everyone else like crazy. I’m finding it hard to farm in lane (which I guess is a fundamental skill to learn as a noob) because there’s always a teammate in your lane who just pushes the wave as hard as possible, tries to duel at every opportunity and doesn’t listen to you. I can accept that because at this level people are just screwing around having fun. I thought, screw it, I’ll go jungle. That way I won’t have to put up with a teammate. I was playing jungle Eve (which is so fun!) and was able to out CS everyone on the map just killing jungle camps and occupying unmanned lanes after my teammates died. And I would go ahead and jump on weaker players who had pushed their lanes too hard and picked up a bunch of kills. But with skirmishes breaking out left, right and center everyone feeds up and I feel like my safe strategy isn’t making an impact. And after 40 minutes with everyone fed, all inner turrets down on both sides and no one coordinating with anyone else it feels a bit random as to who secures the killing blow. Anyway, I thought that I was doing things right by trying not to take stupid risks. So I feel like my ‘play conservative and try to do the basics well’ philosophy (that worked so well in SC2) is translating into great individual stats relative to my peers but isn’t winning games. So here’s my actual question: Does everything I read about how to play orthodox and improve as a player apply to the batshit crazy ‘level 12’ metagame. Are there resources, guides or tutorials that do apply to me? I will take crap for my long post and am grateful for any advice. See you on the rift! EEfficient As you said yourself, lowlevel games are weird. Really really weird. Generally speaking, i'd suggest taking more risks and learning from them. In real lowlevel games which are not on smurf island, you got a great chance to learn without it being too annoying. Just go balls to the wall, and if it does not work remember that situation and why it went wrong. You need to acquire a gigantic amount of information at this point. Playing passively is the first instinct, but you gain more information by doing stuff, winning should not be your first priority. This does not mean copy your teammates and run around doing silly stuff. But if you don't know if you can win a fight, take it to see if you can and remember afterwards. Your main goal should be to gain data. Mechanical skill is also useful of course, but there is kind of a limit to that that is nowhere as high in LoL as it is in SC. But there is a lot more knowledge involved. How will a fight between champ x and champ y go if x got these items, and y got those? Can we kill dragon with the guys we have alive while the enemies who are currently alive try to stop us? Where is the enemy jungler probably right now? Stuff like that. You need to get that knowledge, and the only way to do so is by trying it. Another hint: If you kill something, try to get something off of that. Each time. Get a dragon, go kill more guys, push a lane into tower, steal a buff. After some time you will learn what you can gain in any given situation. If you kill someone, that means you gained immediate mappresence because one of their team is not on the map, and that can give you stuff beyond the 300 gold, making that kill more valuable both for you and your team. Especially in lowlevel games noone ever kills the dragon. So if you kill someone on the bottom side of the map and are above ~lvl 8, spam ping on it and hope that your teammates like to kill dragons. If you are ~lvl 10-12 and/or someone that is good at killing dragon, just ping it and kill it alone. If you killed a lane, push the minions into turret and either back or take that turret. Getting kills is not the main objective of this game, you want to destroy the nexus. Sure, gold from kills helps with that, but more gold across your team helps more, and blowing up turrets also helps a lot due to the gained mappresence. One thing you might find intersting is that lowlevel games are kind of split in two, since matchmaking exists. There are legitimate lowlevel games like those you are in, and there is smurf island, where you get mostly people who play the meta, but are kinda bad and/or really ragey. If you win enought games you will end up there, where people are similarly stupid, but kinda know what they are doing. I am currently at a laptop that is really shitty, so i don't really want to play LoL here, but if you want you could send me a few replays of yours to look at. I am not the best player ever, but i think i should be adequate in this situation to give you a few ideas regarding what to look at. You can produce replays with this tool As far as i know there aren't really any serious guides dealing with crazy lowlevel meta, mostly because it just doesn't make any sense at all. If you want to win lowlevel games, you should not look at how you can play save, but try to find out how you can stomp the opposition harder without increasing your risks by a lot. | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
You said it yourself, everyone is farming chaos and feeding, so go get fed by others mistakes. Get more gold, win games. | ||
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RouaF
France4121 Posts
It also depends on the kind of champ you're playing, if you're playing fizz or zed yes you should go roam and assassinate other lanes and it's ok to have a bit less cs, if you're playing karthus you should probably focus on farming minions/monsters and killing other lanes with your ult. Oh also I encourage you to try taking mid lane as at your level it's the only solo lane, you'll be able to train your farming, roaming and dueling mechanics. An other solution would be to play only junglers as people don't seem to jungle at your level you'll get the spot every time, yes you don't have the runes and masteries and nobody will pull for you but some junglers can still clear decently without those, maybe try buying the armor yellow runes at least - these are the most important. But honestly you can just ignore all this low level bullshit and play what you feel like playing, learn all champions skills and item builds and you'll be lvl 30 eventually :D | ||
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
Lately I've been experimenting with Movement Speed quints on any, except for Lee, jungler I play. It have felt really nice, and actually felt like resulting in a slightly faster clear [with a decent leash] due to the faster traveling from camp to camp. The bonus speed, makes for slightly earlier ganks/counter jungling which have caught the opponent off guard quite a few times by now - the ganks feel quite more powerful too since I'm usually faster than the targets. My question(s) are now: 1) Experience from fellow summoners? 2) Thoughts on pros and cons? 3) Too gimmicky? The biggest 'con' I've considered would be weakness vs invades and counterganks early due to the slightly lower statistics - but being able to walk away easier somewhat helps, I'd imagine caution should be used against strong duelist junglers. But in so far it haven't really been much of an issue, is this due to opponents not being that keen to read into my setup and punish it by invading/counterganks early in mid gold? Lastly, is this standard and I'm just really slow at picking things up. :-P | ||
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iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On September 15 2013 21:47 Jek wrote: I'm a bit unsure if this should be posted here or in the TROLLS thread, so please bear with me. Lately I've been experimenting with Movement Speed quints on any, except for Lee, jungler I play. It have felt really nice, and actually felt like resulting in a slightly faster clear [with a decent leash] due to the faster traveling from camp to camp. The bonus speed, makes for slightly earlier ganks/counter jungling which have caught the opponent off guard quite a few times by now - the ganks feel quite more powerful too since I'm usually faster than the targets. My question(s) are now: 1) Experience from fellow summoners? 2) Thoughts on pros and cons? 3) Too gimmicky? The biggest 'con' I've considered would be weakness vs invades and counterganks early due to the slightly lower statistics - but being able to walk away easier somewhat helps, I'd imagine caution should be used against strong duelist junglers. But in so far it haven't really been much of an issue, is this due to opponents not being that keen to read into my setup and punish it by invading/counterganks early in mid gold? Lastly, is this standard and I'm just really slow at picking things up. :-P I thought Movespeed Quints on Jungler were pretty standard? I'm not a great player, but as a high to mid gold player I've always ran Movespeed Quints. Pros: Faster jungler, more map pressure, better ganks, Run fast... Cons: Less dueling power against people who dont go Movespeed, but erryone go movespeed... so none. | ||
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olabaz
United States298 Posts
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Simberto
Germany11786 Posts
If you want SV against a full AD team, build Zekes instead. The main problem with full AD is that certain champions become immortal a lot easier. A Nasus/Renekton with SV + Sunfire is annoying and hard to kill. One of them at similar standing in the game with Sunfire + Randuins against pure AD is immortal. | ||
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Pooshlmer
United States1001 Posts
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