EPTDo I keep going for my damage items? My team mates got pretty mad "j4 y u still go dps??" Or do defensive items just put me even more behind?
Simple Questions, Simple Answers - Page 29
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miicah
Australia2470 Posts
Do I keep going for my damage items? My team mates got pretty mad "j4 y u still go dps??" Or do defensive items just put me even more behind? | ||
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
He then just continues to walk through your jungle, never even thinking about going into his own. It is like nunu, except he kills you if you come close to him. | ||
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miicah
Australia2470 Posts
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
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schmutttt
Australia3856 Posts
On August 06 2013 15:06 Simberto wrote: I think i should just start red and do a lvl 3 gank bot if the enemy has a stronger dueling jungler, though my top will probably die to the lvl 3 gank top. I should generally do that a lot more, that gank is the most annoying thing to happen if you are bot, since your mid never wards. Red start is always safe vs a strong duelist unless they know you are starting red and go to your blue after they do their buff, but that is really rare. At least in soloq I'd always do this as you can't reliably trust randoms to help you if you get invaded. | ||
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VashTS
United States1675 Posts
Personally, I really like Ghostblade. The active is great and both items it builds from are pretty good in their own right. | ||
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
I am mostly interested in the tanky aatrox stuff, not the squishy carry thingy. | ||
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Airking990
United States193 Posts
As Caitlyn ADC, which item is better in a winning situation? Losing situation? A) Runaan's Hurricane + BotRK B) Phantom Dancer + Statikk Shiv + Bloodthirster IMO, I've found that Runaan's works a lot better in most cases, even building it as your first item works really well. Something that is very much overlooked is that Runaan's works with Caitlyn's passive, meaning if you're waveclearing, or even in a teamfight, you get your passive up every 2-3 hits, and if you're in a bush, every 1-2 hits, making you deal a ton more damage, and hit more enemies. Although you don't get crit rate or anything from Runaan's though, meaning you need Phantom Dancer or Statikk Shiv eventually. | ||
AsmodeusXI
United States15536 Posts
On August 24 2013 05:54 Airking990 wrote: Okay, this is a pretty simple question, but the answer could go into huge analysis and have an overly complicated answer, or a simple "this" or "that" question. so here it comes. As Caitlyn ADC, which item is better in a winning situation? Losing situation? A) Runaan's Hurricane + BotRK B) Phantom Dancer + Statikk Shiv + Bloodthirster IMO, I've found that Runaan's works a lot better in most cases, even building it as your first item works really well. Something that is very much overlooked is that Runaan's works with Caitlyn's passive, meaning if you're waveclearing, or even in a teamfight, you get your passive up every 2-3 hits, and if you're in a bush, every 1-2 hits, making you deal a ton more damage, and hit more enemies. Although you don't get crit rate or anything from Runaan's though, meaning you need Phantom Dancer or Statikk Shiv eventually. I believe that there's a general consensus that the range on Runaan's extra bullets is too small to be of any practical use in a teamfight, even with its interaction with Cait's passive. Additionally, considering ADCs scale hardest on crit power, Runaan's is considered to be a waste of money. That being said, I think option B) would be universally preferred. Building upon that, however, I think option B) is superceded by an IE build, like IE + PD + LW. Season 2-esque it may be, but it brings the best use of Cait's at-range, mostly-single-target damage. At least, I think that's the case. Someone who plays more ADC should jump in here. | ||
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SgtSquiglz
United States668 Posts
To elaborate on option B, he's also correct there (though I prefer shiv to PD, just my preference). Bloodthirster is generally built early on ADCs that are more "casters". They rely on AD scaling abilities to do a lot of their damage in lane (think graves/varus). Cait is more about sitting back at long range and autoing people. This makes IE a much better choice since the crit stats increase your auto damage far more than the extra AD you'll get from a BT. | ||
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entropius
United States1046 Posts
What I don't know is what to do when I randomly get fed. Last game I was Malphite top and wound up getting quite a few kills early even though I lost lane (a random triple in a teamfight bot lane that I tele'd into), while the rest of the team wasn't doing so hot (our Lux couldn't aim her laser for shit, etc.) By the endgame, I was a giant tanky monster: I had tabi, sunfire, banshee's, spirit visage (was laning against kennen, needed the MR early), thornmail (they had a fed trist and a fed xin), and frozen heart. I'd have built abyssal, but our eve (who kept dying) had one. With W up I had 555 armor. In teamfights I'd initiate, knock people up, cc everyone, absorb a bunch of damage, deal a bunch of damage, and die fighting... but meanwhile our team was just bad at teamfights and underfarmed and would get caught and go down. Is it a good idea in these situations to forego some tankiness and get items like liandry's or iceborn gauntlet in order to actually blow people up in lategame teamfights, or to just keep building into an even tankier monster like I did? I mean, the last half of that 555 armor was probably overkill... | ||
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
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entropius
United States1046 Posts
What sort of items do you build to become a threat, though, when transitioning from tank build to bruiser build? Stuff like wit's end and maw, and get good at slapfighting? (I mention MR items in the context of that game because they had a fed orianna, and kennen had been owning me in lane.) Stuff like rylai's/liandry's? Duplicate the abyssal that our eve already had? I mean, I know AP Malphite is a thing, but you sort of have to build for it from the beginning to make items like rabadon's worthwhile. | ||
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
Also, Randuins is a really good armor item. Lots of Armor, slows, HP. I don't think you want both a FH and a thornmail, since they both don't give HP. I rarely build any of those actually. And you probably don't want 2 big MR items on a tank, the combination of HP + a bit of MR should be enough unless their team is extremely lopsided towards magic damage, maybe to the point where they don't even have an ADC. | ||
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
Haunting Guise/Liandry's default Abyssal Scepter if my team can use the aura well Triforce or IBG if I'm going to get lots of autos off in fights - new triforce is bossmode on Malph. Triforce for damage, IBG for more utility. P.S. has anyone tested if triforce proc and Malphite W are multiplicative? I'd assume they aren't, but %AD steroids are very rare indeed. | ||
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Simberto
Germany12086 Posts
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [Here's the raw numbers: ] + Level 5 Malphite, no AD runes or items, attacking caster minions on Dominion. No W, no sheen proc: 72 W, no sheen proc: 93 No W, sheen proc:144 W, sheen proc: 166 In both cases, W added 21 damage (presumably the 22 was due to rounding), so no, it's not multiplicative. | ||
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mordek
United States12705 Posts
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Tooplark
United States3977 Posts
Assumptions: Pure tank, so no AP. Somewhere around 300 armor. Q damage without void staff: 270 * 100 / (100 + MR) Q damage with void staff: 312 * 100 / ( 100 + MR * .65) E damage without void staff: 310 * 100 / (100 + MR) E damage with void staff: 324 * 100 / (100 + MR * .65) R damage without void staff: 400 * 100 / (100 + MR) R damage with void staff: 470 * 100 / (100 + MR * .65) Here's a graph of the damage increases on your various skills: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/aecy6D1.jpg) and here's my spreadsheet if anyone wants to check my math. https://www.dropbox.com/s/f124sp3eagi0k2b/malphite void staff.ods | ||
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