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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. - Neo, 9:49 KST, Nov 9th |
On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them.
That guy who evened up his series versus Whitera in the losers bracket after Whitera got DQed for being late even though the time of his game was told to him wrong got a pretty good deal by evening up the series. Granted, that's far out of the prize money so all you can really earn is brownie points, but still ^_^
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Vancouver14381 Posts
On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them.
This actually happened at an MLG. White-Ra got DQ'd early in the upper bracket because he was late giving Gimix a 2-0 lead when they happened to meet up again in the losers bracket. Gimix decided that the DQ ruling wasn't fair and he didn't deserve a 2-0 lead so he forfeited the first 2 games in the extended series (worker rush) so they started on even footing. It's too bad we haven't seen too much from him since then.
Damn shen'd
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the Jatt guys seems really BM...
back then when he was still in team WHALE, he shit talked about his teammate and locodoco
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People bitched about it a lot before Dignitas won but obviously WCG/Riot aren't going to change their ruling once it's been handed out. It just makes them look bad and looks like they're giving into a mob.
I agree with you that Regi should just stop because there's nothing that can be gained outside of exposure at this point but they definitely did try and get it reversed they just didn't try to appeal to an already pissed off community mob. Once it was over Regi decided, "know what? Let's see how pissed off we can get this internet mob!"
Oh, and yeah, the right thing for Dignitas to do in that situation would have been to forfeit. They didn't though and I can't completely blame them. I just hope a free trip to Korea was worth it for all of the backlash they're getting.
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On November 02 2011 07:24 daemir wrote:
This Odee guy came out like..I don't know, like a corporate douche? Dodge questions, tells something is shady when it was pretty clear in the rules before they got changed and all this shit.
Okay internet bandwagoning on voyboy not cool, but jesus trying to draw "12 years in esports" card when the talk was about LoL tournament play and how Esports does it...gosh.
same shit for Matt Marcou LOOOL
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I thought this was about the patch notes, so i come in to read and people are still talking about dignitas. Isnt there like another thread you can debate this shit in? The ruling has already been made, they arent going back on it, no it wasnt fair.
it's all been said to death
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On November 02 2011 07:36 overt wrote:
People bitched about it a lot before Dignitas won but obviously WCG/Riot aren't going to change their ruling once it's been handed out. It just makes them look bad and looks like they're giving into a mob.
I agree with you that Regi should just stop because there's nothing that can be gained outside of exposure at this point but they definitely did try and get it reversed they just didn't try to appeal to an already pissed off community mob. Once it was over Regi decided, "know what? Let's see how pissed off we can get this internet mob!"
Oh, and yeah, the right thing for Dignitas to do in that situation would have been to forfeit. They didn't though and I can't completely blame them. I just hope a free trip to Korea was worth it for all of the backlash they're getting.
Regi said on his last vlog that he's done talking about it on his vlogs. I'm assuming this will be one of the last public mentions he does for it, he was probably just wanted a public forum with someone from Dignitas for once.
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On November 02 2011 07:39 arb wrote:
I thought this was about the patch notes, so i come in to read and people are still talking about dignitas. Isnt there like another thread you can debate this shit in? The ruling has already been made, they arent going back on it, no it wasnt fair.
it's all been said to death
It's because it was discussed on tv a few minutes ago lol.
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On November 02 2011 07:33 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:32 Craton wrote:On November 02 2011 07:30 Juicyfruit wrote:
Look, it didn't get to this degree of media coverage before CDE "lost". Reginald didn't make his vblog before CDE lost. The ridiculous forum backlack didn't happen until after CDE lost.
I'm pretty sure most people had the same mentality, "we'll grab our pitchforks IF CDE loses". What kind of attitude is that. ??? Reddit, LoL general forums, IRC (#clgaming, #solomid.lol, #teamliquidlol, etc), and GD were all on fire about this topic. Just because you stuck your head in the sand and missed it all doesn't mean it didn't happen. I was there for ALL of it. I know perfectly well what was happening the entire time. There was no shortage of people who were simply waiting for the last game before protesting. There are at least 30x more bitching on forums after sunday than before.
Just because the final aftermath is more intense than the initial response doesn't mean CDE just 'laid down and took the easy way out."
I forget what year it was, but there was an NFL game where Ed Hochuli blew a ridiculous call in the waning moments of a game. The initial reaction was crazy, but not foaming at the mouth insanity, because the game still had to be finished and his call wasn't going to be overturned. After the fact, when the call indeed proved to be the deciding moment in the game, the response was incredible. That's just how things work, in any sort of controversy like this. You make your case as much as you can to try to get a ruling made, but you do that knowing that you will have to comply in the moment with the ruling and hope it doesn't have an impact. After the fact you can bring a point with more fervor as a form of closure because this shit cost you something.
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Dignitas used to be my favorite team but after how voyboy and jatt handled this I no longer like them.
Honestly the rule changing involved in this mess makes no sense. Any idiot can tell this is done completely wrong. There's definitely some shady shit going on or Matt marcou has the brain of a goldfish.
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On November 02 2011 07:36 overt wrote:
People bitched about it a lot before Dignitas won but obviously WCG/Riot aren't going to change their ruling once it's been handed out. It just makes them look bad and looks like they're giving into a mob.
I agree with you that Regi should just stop because there's nothing that can be gained outside of exposure at this point but they definitely did try and get it reversed they just didn't try to appeal to an already pissed off community mob. Once it was over Regi decided, "know what? Let's see how pissed off we can get this internet mob!"
Oh, and yeah, the right thing for Dignitas to do in that situation would have been to forfeit. They didn't though and I can't completely blame them. I just hope a free trip to Korea was worth it for all of the backlash they're getting.
That's the problem, I don't see how it could be worth it. The biggest up and coming team with huge community support, instead of building on that support and popularity, they decide to throw it all away for 1 tournament. I mean WCG is big, but is it worth losing so much support for it? All they've done now is push all of that support back to CLG and TSM.
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On November 02 2011 07:41 red_ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:33 Juicyfruit wrote:On November 02 2011 07:32 Craton wrote:On November 02 2011 07:30 Juicyfruit wrote:
Look, it didn't get to this degree of media coverage before CDE "lost". Reginald didn't make his vblog before CDE lost. The ridiculous forum backlack didn't happen until after CDE lost.
I'm pretty sure most people had the same mentality, "we'll grab our pitchforks IF CDE loses". What kind of attitude is that. ??? Reddit, LoL general forums, IRC (#clgaming, #solomid.lol, #teamliquidlol, etc), and GD were all on fire about this topic. Just because you stuck your head in the sand and missed it all doesn't mean it didn't happen. I was there for ALL of it. I know perfectly well what was happening the entire time. There was no shortage of people who were simply waiting for the last game before protesting. There are at least 30x more bitching on forums after sunday than before. Just because the final aftermath is more intense than the initial response doesn't mean CDE just 'laid down and took the easy way out." I forget what year it was, but there was an NFL game where Ed Hochuli blew a ridiculous call in the waning moments of a game. The initial reaction was crazy, but not foaming at the mouth insanity, because the game still had to be finished and his call wasn't going to be overturned. After the fact, when the call indeed proved to be the deciding moment in the game, the response was incredible. That's just how things work, in any sort of controversy like this. You make your case as much as you can to try to get a ruling made, but you do that knowing that you will have to comply in the moment with the ruling and hope it doesn't have an impact. After the fact you can bring a point with more fervor as a form of closure because this shit cost you something.
I know what your point is, but really, it's one thing to have to finish a game that's currently in progress....another thing completely when the game you need to play is several days away.
From my point of view, those last set of games should never have been played and in that 48h period they could have sold their story to so many sources and make a super strong and concise case for themselves. I only feel this way in particular because the wrongdoings here are so fucking clear-cut.
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On November 02 2011 07:33 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:32 Craton wrote:On November 02 2011 07:30 Juicyfruit wrote:
Look, it didn't get to this degree of media coverage before CDE "lost". Reginald didn't make his vblog before CDE lost. The ridiculous forum backlack didn't happen until after CDE lost.
I'm pretty sure most people had the same mentality, "we'll grab our pitchforks IF CDE loses". What kind of attitude is that. ??? Reddit, LoL general forums, IRC (#clgaming, #solomid.lol, #teamliquidlol, etc), and GD were all on fire about this topic. Just because you stuck your head in the sand and missed it all doesn't mean it didn't happen. I was there for ALL of it. I know perfectly well what was happening the entire time. There was no shortage of people who were simply waiting for the last game before protesting. There are at least 30x more bitching on forums after sunday than before.
The alternative that CDE constantly bitch about the situation the days before the rematch, and either 1) get DQ'd, or 2) spend the whole time on a crusade but lose because they don't actually practice. I can't imagine how much it must have sucked to have the adrenaline pumping on a win-or-go-home mentality in the bo3 down a game, win the set and think you're going to korea, then have that taken away and being told you have to play again (in a weakened mental state). As a player it's correct to remain focused and practice.
If CDE won again none of this would have happened, but then again - can you fault them for not playing 100% when they got their rightful win taken away like that?
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On November 02 2011 07:41 red_ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:33 Juicyfruit wrote:On November 02 2011 07:32 Craton wrote:On November 02 2011 07:30 Juicyfruit wrote:
Look, it didn't get to this degree of media coverage before CDE "lost". Reginald didn't make his vblog before CDE lost. The ridiculous forum backlack didn't happen until after CDE lost.
I'm pretty sure most people had the same mentality, "we'll grab our pitchforks IF CDE loses". What kind of attitude is that. ??? Reddit, LoL general forums, IRC (#clgaming, #solomid.lol, #teamliquidlol, etc), and GD were all on fire about this topic. Just because you stuck your head in the sand and missed it all doesn't mean it didn't happen. I was there for ALL of it. I know perfectly well what was happening the entire time. There was no shortage of people who were simply waiting for the last game before protesting. There are at least 30x more bitching on forums after sunday than before. Just because the final aftermath is more intense than the initial response doesn't mean CDE just 'laid down and took the easy way out." I forget what year it was, but there was an NFL game where Ed Hochuli blew a ridiculous call in the waning moments of a game. The initial reaction was crazy, but not foaming at the mouth insanity, because the game still had to be finished and his call wasn't going to be overturned. After the fact, when the call indeed proved to be the deciding moment in the game, the response was incredible. That's just how things work, in any sort of controversy like this. You make your case as much as you can to try to get a ruling made, but you do that knowing that you will have to comply in the moment with the ruling and hope it doesn't have an impact. After the fact you can bring a point with more fervor as a form of closure because this shit cost you something.
Another good comparison would have been the blown perfect game last season. As in - even though the call was terrible, the game is already finished, and you do not go back and change the ruling of an ALREADY FINISHED game.
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United States47024 Posts
On November 02 2011 07:14 Juicyfruit wrote:
All of what's happening now, should have happened BEFORE the rematch.
Regi addressed this in one of his videos--essentially, CDE contacted WCG about their disagreement, and WCG basically gave CDE an ultimatum to the effect of "play the match in 48 hours or get DQed. There was no time for them to discuss or raise the issue at that stage.
When you're presented with an ultimatum like that, is your first response to go make a vlog, or to say "ok, lets set this shit up so that even if we don't agree with it, we don't lose our chance to go to Korea stupidly"?
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On November 02 2011 07:35 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them. That guy who evened up his series versus Whitera in the losers bracket after Whitera got DQed for being late even though the time of his game was told to him wrong got a pretty good deal by evening up the series. Granted, that's far out of the prize money so all you can really earn is brownie points, but still ^_^
Yes that is one case, but can you really see it happening in an important match between 2 people who really have a chance at prize money. Both Dignitas and CDE are composed of players who are near the best in the game and whoever wins USA qualifiers has a very good chance at winning the whole thing (Compitition from China and Canada are really the only ones i can think of unless there are some star teams not appearing yet). Also that person was praised because that was such a great thing to do and it was unheard of.
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ya except the ref manned up afterwards, something thats definitely not happening here l0l (about the blown perfect game call)
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On November 02 2011 07:48 NoobieOne wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:35 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them. That guy who evened up his series versus Whitera in the losers bracket after Whitera got DQed for being late even though the time of his game was told to him wrong got a pretty good deal by evening up the series. Granted, that's far out of the prize money so all you can really earn is brownie points, but still ^_^ Yes that is one case, but can you really see it happening in an important match between 2 people who really have a chance at prize money. Both Dignitas and CDE are composed of players who are near the best in the game and whoever wins USA qualifiers has a very good chance at winning the whole thing (Compitition from China and Canada are really the only ones i can think of unless there are some star teams not appearing yet). Also that person was praised because that was such a great thing to do and it was unheard of.
I don't put the fault on Dignitas for not throwing/ff the match, CLG Canada wouldn't have done it and neither would CDE. The problem I have with Dignitas is that they went to the WCG admins in the first place after accepting defeat and wishing CDE well in Korea.
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On November 02 2011 07:48 NoobieOne wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:35 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them. That guy who evened up his series versus Whitera in the losers bracket after Whitera got DQed for being late even though the time of his game was told to him wrong got a pretty good deal by evening up the series. Granted, that's far out of the prize money so all you can really earn is brownie points, but still ^_^ Yes that is one case, but can you really see it happening in an important match between 2 people who really have a chance at prize money. Both Dignitas and CDE are composed of players who are near the best in the game and whoever wins USA qualifiers has a very good chance at winning the whole thing (Compitition from China and Canada are really the only ones i can think of unless there are some star teams not appearing yet). Also that person was praised because that was such a great thing to do and it was unheard of.
Regi would've just accepted the initial loss and never bitched @ WCG admins.
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On November 02 2011 07:51 shavi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 07:48 NoobieOne wrote:On November 02 2011 07:35 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On November 02 2011 07:15 NoobieOne wrote:On November 02 2011 07:10 red_b wrote:
on the bright side Regi played one thing perfect. (paraphrasing inbound)
Odee asked him what he would do in that situation.
Regi responds : can't answer because that's a hypothetical
Odee presses: I bet you would play. you wouldn't give your spot up.
Regi : I never would have acted in a way that would have led to this situation.
exactly right way to do that.
but yeah Regi should have spent the whole time talking about WCG changing the rules after the fact. just hammer that over and over again and ignore Odee. that's what I would have done. Obviously Regi doesn't know how to debate as well as some people on team liquid. In High School and start of college I won multiple awards for debate competitions and I know a lot of things I would have said differently but I doubt Regi ever took classes on debate or knew how to prepare for the topics he should have known were coming (would you have done the same? and the personal attacks issue). I think he did pretty well considering he was going up against a veteran such as Odee. On November 02 2011 07:14 Craton wrote:
Just think, had Dignitas done the right thing and forfeited, this would've all been avoided.
I doubt there's any legal recourse that CDE could take against WCG, even if it would be deserved. Are you kidding me? Would you imagine if lets say in a MLG you had a player like Incontrol who is outspoken against the extended series rule being up 2-0 against a player like Bomber who is a lot better than he is (don't ask how he managed to get there) Do you think he would have forfeited the first 2 games to make it an even series just because he doesn't like the ruling? I personally believe that a player would take whatever advantage they can get against a player/team that they feel can give a challenge to them. That guy who evened up his series versus Whitera in the losers bracket after Whitera got DQed for being late even though the time of his game was told to him wrong got a pretty good deal by evening up the series. Granted, that's far out of the prize money so all you can really earn is brownie points, but still ^_^ Yes that is one case, but can you really see it happening in an important match between 2 people who really have a chance at prize money. Both Dignitas and CDE are composed of players who are near the best in the game and whoever wins USA qualifiers has a very good chance at winning the whole thing (Compitition from China and Canada are really the only ones i can think of unless there are some star teams not appearing yet). Also that person was praised because that was such a great thing to do and it was unheard of. I don't put the fault on Dignitas for not throwing/ff the match, CLG Canada wouldn't have done it and neither would CDE. The problem I have with Dignitas is that they went to the WCG admins in the first place after accepting defeat and wishing CDE well in Korea.
Yah I totally put Dignitas at fault for this but someone here said that they should have thrown the match and I really disagree with that.
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EPT
