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This is a tragic event. Let's not derail the thread with a gun control debate. Posts from page 9 onward will be moderated for steering the discussion towards gun control. |
12 confirmed casualties and 71 shot overall. (From news conference)
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The police chief of Aurora is speaking live now on ABC. Not sure if it's anywhere else, but that's where I'm watching it.
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On July 21 2012 02:55 FallDownMarigold wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:45 RetroAspect wrote:On July 21 2012 02:07 Lumi wrote:
Okay, so, even more wow. Here's an update to my post on the last page.
I just talked to my friend who was there via phone, and, as it turns out, he was actually in that theater with his family originally. They asked another family to move over or something, but then decided they should just go to the theater next door where there was more space. He said his mind is just stuck on a few things.
A) That other family.
B) His dad carries a gun in a shoulder holster and there probably would have been a gun f ight if they had been there still. He's just lost between feeling lucky, freaked out, bad for the other family and thinking maybe they could have done something (his dad) if they had stayed there. But all things considered he seems to be doing pretty good.
Talk about crazy. Carrying a gun into a movie theater? and it's allowed? I don't even... Im speechless.. This whole thing is insane.. Poor people and their families Unless the movie theater, being a private place, has an explicit policy prohibiting any firearms from being brought into the theater, it's legal to do so provided the firearm owner has a concealed carry permit. It could also depend on state policy. In some states, for example, you can't concealed carry anywhere that requires paying for admission. In all states you can't concealed carry on premises where alcohol is served. There are probably lots of other rules that could vary from state to state. In my personal opinion, you shouldn't concealed carry in movie theaters due to the close proximity of so many other people. Freak accidents happen. However, I'm not sure whether or not it's expressly prohibited at that, or all movie theaters. Probably isn't allowed if I had to guess.
I'm pretty sure he walked in during the movie from the emergency exits... so its not like he snuck into the theater from the front where security would usually be.
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On July 21 2012 02:51 I_Love_Bacon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:47 Whole wrote:On July 21 2012 02:46 I_Love_Bacon wrote:
Anytime somebody does something terrible like this I sort of wish we, as a society, would agree or do our best to wipe their name from history like the ancient Greeks tried with Herostratus (who burned down the Temple of Artemis). While I don't think it would be successful, I think removing the somewhat glorifying news cycle of shit like this might be for the better.
I know it's wishful thinking, but that doesn't stop me from doing wishing it. i just read 1984...i don't think that'd be a good idea So you think massive news coverage given to mass murderers by exposing their face, plans, reasoning, and ideas to the entire world on a news cycle that lasts for weeks is a good thing? It only begets more of the same from disgusting and depraved individuals.
No, I just don't think erasing or altering the past is a very good idea in any circumstance.
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On July 21 2012 02:53 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:50 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:36 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 20 2012 18:16 lost_artz wrote:
Did they at least kill the bastard?
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Post below answered question.
Should have shot them both dead. No. How are you then any different from the guy who burst into the theatre and shot a bunch of people, dead? They'll almost definitely get life. That should be more than enough. A 24 year old has about 75 long years of suffering ahead of him in Max. Sec. If you police had killed him they would have been just as bad as he is? what am I reading? In cold blood - yes. If there had been necessity to defend themselves that would be understandable. But to say that you wish the police had just killed this guy when they found him is about one of the most horrible things I think you can come up with. Think about the families and loved ones of the victims - not about revenge. Haven't enough people died already? How will yet another death solve anything? No one wants there to be any more blood spilled. Batman doesn't kill the Joker. Theoden doesn't kill Grima. Hell, even Cary Elwes doesn't kill Prince John. A hero is not forged through rash decisions based on revenge, but by logical decisions made at awkward times in the face of extreme adversity. In my opinion as soon as you take another life without justification your own life is forfeit, that's fine if you disagree.
Yes! And he will be given a sentence equal to multiple life sentences he will be in jail for the rest of his life. Do you have any idea what the other convicted mass murderers are going to do to a skinny white kid who shot a baby in the face? My guess is he doesn't even make it as long as Dahmer. Still - there is absolutely NOTHING healthy about wishing death on another human being. You know what I hope - and this may sound crazy - but I hope the guy gets rehabilitated, somehow gets the opportunity for parole (unlikely), makes it, gets out of prison and starts a new life somewhere.
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On July 21 2012 03:00 Arghmyliver wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:53 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:50 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:36 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 20 2012 18:16 lost_artz wrote:
Did they at least kill the bastard?
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Post below answered question.
Should have shot them both dead. No. How are you then any different from the guy who burst into the theatre and shot a bunch of people, dead? They'll almost definitely get life. That should be more than enough. A 24 year old has about 75 long years of suffering ahead of him in Max. Sec. If you police had killed him they would have been just as bad as he is? what am I reading? In cold blood - yes. If there had been necessity to defend themselves that would be understandable. But to say that you wish the police had just killed this guy when they found him is about one of the most horrible things I think you can come up with. Think about the families and loved ones of the victims - not about revenge. Haven't enough people died already? How will yet another death solve anything? No one wants there to be any more blood spilled. Batman doesn't kill the Joker. Theoden doesn't kill Grima. Hell, even Cary Elwes doesn't kill Prince John. A hero is not forged through rash decisions based on revenge, but by logical decisions made at awkward times in the face of extreme adversity. In my opinion as soon as you take another life without justification your own life is forfeit, that's fine if you disagree. Yes! And he will be given a sentence equal to multiple life sentences he will be in jail for the rest of his life. Do you have any idea what the other convicted mass murderers are going to do to a skinny white kid who shot a baby in the face? My guess is he doesn't even make it as long as Dahmer. Still - there is absolutely NOTHING healthy about wishing death on another human being. You know what I hope - and this may sound crazy - but I hope the guy gets rehabilitated, somehow gets the opportunity for parole (unlikely), makes it, gets out of prison and starts a new life somewhere.
a dime shouldn't even be paid to give him a lick of water. As soon as he's convicted guilty just shoot him in the head and throw the body in a furnace.
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My goodness it sounds like this guy came in wearing full military grade body armor according to the police chief. Where the hell does a civilian get that sort of stuff?
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On July 21 2012 02:58 dark_dragoon10 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:55 FallDownMarigold wrote:On July 21 2012 02:45 RetroAspect wrote:On July 21 2012 02:07 Lumi wrote:
Okay, so, even more wow. Here's an update to my post on the last page.
I just talked to my friend who was there via phone, and, as it turns out, he was actually in that theater with his family originally. They asked another family to move over or something, but then decided they should just go to the theater next door where there was more space. He said his mind is just stuck on a few things.
A) That other family.
B) His dad carries a gun in a shoulder holster and there probably would have been a gun f ight if they had been there still. He's just lost between feeling lucky, freaked out, bad for the other family and thinking maybe they could have done something (his dad) if they had stayed there. But all things considered he seems to be doing pretty good.
Talk about crazy. Carrying a gun into a movie theater? and it's allowed? I don't even... Im speechless.. This whole thing is insane.. Poor people and their families Unless the movie theater, being a private place, has an explicit policy prohibiting any firearms from being brought into the theater, it's legal to do so provided the firearm owner has a concealed carry permit. It could also depend on state policy. In some states, for example, you can't concealed carry anywhere that requires paying for admission. In all states you can't concealed carry on premises where alcohol is served. There are probably lots of other rules that could vary from state to state. In my personal opinion, you shouldn't concealed carry in movie theaters due to the close proximity of so many other people. Freak accidents happen. However, I'm not sure whether or not it's expressly prohibited at that, or all movie theaters. Probably isn't allowed if I had to guess. I'm pretty sure he walked in during the movie from the emergency exits... so its not like he snuck into the theater from the front where security would usually be.
You are misinterpreting my post. Originally, somebody mentioned that they knew of someone who was concealed carrying in another theater -- to which another was prompted to reply: "I can't believe it's allowed".
Nowhere am I implying that this man walked into the theater in blatant violation of possible theater-specific anti-concealed carry policy -- that actually makes no sense given that you cannot "concealed carry" an AR-15 & pump action shot gun (which is beside the point).
Simply put, I was referring to someone's mention of a "dad in a theater with concealed handgun on shoulder", and was not referring to the actual shooter.
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Update from the police - Holmes was apprehended in the back of the theater by his vehicle. He had:
AR-15 Assault Rifle
Remmington 15 12-gauge shotgun
.40 cal Glock handgun
Second .40 cal Glock found in the car
71 people shot
12 deceased (10 on-site, 2 in hospitals)
Not looking for any other suspects, currently confident he acted alone. Full investigation to follow.
Body Armor included throat and groin protector (this is a lot of body armor for someone who just turned himself in - he was geared up for a full firefight.)
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My thoughts and prayers to the victims and their families. It's quite solemn here today everywhere Ive gone so far and Im just sad about all of this.
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On July 21 2012 02:55 yeint wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:35 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 MasaDaKing wrote:On July 20 2012 18:29 Looms wrote:
"One of the attackers shot a baby at point blank range," he said.
WHAT. THE. FUCK. ???!!??!?!?
this better not be true Thats so fucked up. This whole thing is. What kind of an human being CAN do this kind of shit? Humans like this should not deserve to get death penalty. This may be a bit radical but they should just be kept alive to suffer. Say, keep them alive but make their life a living hell, not just in jail but some other way. Fucking break their knees and make them walk for the rest of their lives. This makes me so angry. Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering. Careful my friend. This is why others are in charge of their sentencing. Sure you could blow out their kneecaps and make them crawl around on all fours across the Salt Flats, but what would that do to your soul? If I knew 100% that he was guilty, me and my soul would be knocking back a scotch with one hand as my other hand would swing a cat-o-nine-tails to make him hobble on his broken knees faster. Revenge fantasies aside, I wish they'd lock him the fuck up, throw away the key, and never talk about him again. Let psychiatrists and geneticists study him so that we can one day engineer this kind of sickness out of our species.
I am sorry for you my friend.
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Bisutopia19398 Posts
Well, I just got official confirmation that one of my gf's friends was killed in the shooting. Trying to find out more presently. Really hard to f-ing work during a time like this.
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On July 21 2012 03:00 Arghmyliver wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:53 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:50 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:36 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 20 2012 18:16 lost_artz wrote:
Did they at least kill the bastard?
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Post below answered question.
Should have shot them both dead. No. How are you then any different from the guy who burst into the theatre and shot a bunch of people, dead? They'll almost definitely get life. That should be more than enough. A 24 year old has about 75 long years of suffering ahead of him in Max. Sec. If you police had killed him they would have been just as bad as he is? what am I reading? In cold blood - yes. If there had been necessity to defend themselves that would be understandable. But to say that you wish the police had just killed this guy when they found him is about one of the most horrible things I think you can come up with. Think about the families and loved ones of the victims - not about revenge. Haven't enough people died already? How will yet another death solve anything? No one wants there to be any more blood spilled. Batman doesn't kill the Joker. Theoden doesn't kill Grima. Hell, even Cary Elwes doesn't kill Prince John. A hero is not forged through rash decisions based on revenge, but by logical decisions made at awkward times in the face of extreme adversity. In my opinion as soon as you take another life without justification your own life is forfeit, that's fine if you disagree. Yes! And he will be given a sentence equal to multiple life sentences he will be in jail for the rest of his life. Do you have any idea what the other convicted mass murderers are going to do to a skinny white kid who shot a baby in the face? My guess is he doesn't even make it as long as Dahmer. Still - there is absolutely NOTHING healthy about wishing death on another human being. You know what I hope - and this may sound crazy - but I hope the guy gets rehabilitated, somehow gets the opportunity for parole (unlikely), makes it, gets out of prison and starts a new life somewhere.
I'm glad you're not in charge. We don't need another mass murder on our hands if he were to get out again.
And I read what you said, rehabilitation, yada yada yada. Can you ever truly know if a person has changed? The mind is a very complex thing.
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On July 21 2012 03:02 xrapture wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 03:00 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:53 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:50 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:36 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 20 2012 18:16 lost_artz wrote:
Did they at least kill the bastard?
--
Post below answered question.
Should have shot them both dead. No. How are you then any different from the guy who burst into the theatre and shot a bunch of people, dead? They'll almost definitely get life. That should be more than enough. A 24 year old has about 75 long years of suffering ahead of him in Max. Sec. If you police had killed him they would have been just as bad as he is? what am I reading? In cold blood - yes. If there had been necessity to defend themselves that would be understandable. But to say that you wish the police had just killed this guy when they found him is about one of the most horrible things I think you can come up with. Think about the families and loved ones of the victims - not about revenge. Haven't enough people died already? How will yet another death solve anything? No one wants there to be any more blood spilled. Batman doesn't kill the Joker. Theoden doesn't kill Grima. Hell, even Cary Elwes doesn't kill Prince John. A hero is not forged through rash decisions based on revenge, but by logical decisions made at awkward times in the face of extreme adversity. In my opinion as soon as you take another life without justification your own life is forfeit, that's fine if you disagree. Yes! And he will be given a sentence equal to multiple life sentences he will be in jail for the rest of his life. Do you have any idea what the other convicted mass murderers are going to do to a skinny white kid who shot a baby in the face? My guess is he doesn't even make it as long as Dahmer. Still - there is absolutely NOTHING healthy about wishing death on another human being. You know what I hope - and this may sound crazy - but I hope the guy gets rehabilitated, somehow gets the opportunity for parole (unlikely), makes it, gets out of prison and starts a new life somewhere. a dime shouldn't even be paid to give him a lick of water. As soon as he's convicted guilty just shoot him in the head and throw the body in a furnace.
My friend. There is a terrible poison inside you. You are afraid. Look at this man not with fear, but with pity. For that is what he is - piteous - nothing more. Surely when you quest yourself, you will find your heart.
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On July 21 2012 03:03 BisuDagger wrote:
Well, I just got official confirmation that one of my gf's friends was killed in the shooting. Trying to find out more presently. Really hard to f-ing work during a time like this.
Condolences man. Sorry to hear :\
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Rumor that he was dressed as the Joker is stated as false
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On July 21 2012 02:55 jdseemoreglass wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:51 I_Love_Bacon wrote:On July 21 2012 02:47 Whole wrote:On July 21 2012 02:46 I_Love_Bacon wrote:
Anytime somebody does something terrible like this I sort of wish we, as a society, would agree or do our best to wipe their name from history like the ancient Greeks tried with Herostratus (who burned down the Temple of Artemis). While I don't think it would be successful, I think removing the somewhat glorifying news cycle of shit like this might be for the better.
I know it's wishful thinking, but that doesn't stop me from doing wishing it. i just read 1984...i don't think that'd be a good idea So you think massive news coverage given to mass murderers by exposing their face, plans, reasoning, and ideas to the entire world on a news cycle that lasts for weeks is a good thing? It only begets more of the same from disgusting and depraved individuals. People are watching the news, people are following the story, people are posting in this thread. The people want to know and discuss these things, there is nothing wrong with providing it. I don't think it's horrible to talk about it. The people who do this do it because they have psychological issues not because they saw something on television.
Think about some of the crazy people who go on killings for a political rampage. They do so, knowing full well, that they'll get media coverage. They're crazy so it doesn't go the way they planned as people will just think they're crazy, but it still is motivation for these people.
Is violence on TV a gigantic problem? I'd say no. It is a problem, but not some leading cause of pyschos shooting up movie theaters. But nothing good can actually come of making events like these greatly publicized. I'm sure the news will spend the next week pouring over everything he's done and said and will find something. I'd wager there's a good chance that publicity/attention were among the reasons he did it.
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On July 21 2012 03:04 Gatored wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 03:00 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:53 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:50 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 21 2012 02:36 Dodgin wrote:On July 21 2012 02:32 Arghmyliver wrote:On July 20 2012 18:16 lost_artz wrote:
Did they at least kill the bastard?
--
Post below answered question.
Should have shot them both dead. No. How are you then any different from the guy who burst into the theatre and shot a bunch of people, dead? They'll almost definitely get life. That should be more than enough. A 24 year old has about 75 long years of suffering ahead of him in Max. Sec. If you police had killed him they would have been just as bad as he is? what am I reading? In cold blood - yes. If there had been necessity to defend themselves that would be understandable. But to say that you wish the police had just killed this guy when they found him is about one of the most horrible things I think you can come up with. Think about the families and loved ones of the victims - not about revenge. Haven't enough people died already? How will yet another death solve anything? No one wants there to be any more blood spilled. Batman doesn't kill the Joker. Theoden doesn't kill Grima. Hell, even Cary Elwes doesn't kill Prince John. A hero is not forged through rash decisions based on revenge, but by logical decisions made at awkward times in the face of extreme adversity. In my opinion as soon as you take another life without justification your own life is forfeit, that's fine if you disagree. Yes! And he will be given a sentence equal to multiple life sentences he will be in jail for the rest of his life. Do you have any idea what the other convicted mass murderers are going to do to a skinny white kid who shot a baby in the face? My guess is he doesn't even make it as long as Dahmer. Still - there is absolutely NOTHING healthy about wishing death on another human being. You know what I hope - and this may sound crazy - but I hope the guy gets rehabilitated, somehow gets the opportunity for parole (unlikely), makes it, gets out of prison and starts a new life somewhere. I'm glad you're not in charge. We don't need another mass murder on our hands if he were to get out again. And I read what you said, rehabilitation, yada yada yada. Can you ever truly know if a person has changed? The mind is a very complex thing.
In Norway they rehabilitate their criminals instead of putting them in jail for X amount of time. Guess how much lower their repeat crime rate is ^_^? I'm glad people like me run the better systems in the world ^_^.
User was warned for this post
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On July 21 2012 02:55 FallDownMarigold wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2012 02:45 RetroAspect wrote:On July 21 2012 02:07 Lumi wrote:
Okay, so, even more wow. Here's an update to my post on the last page.
I just talked to my friend who was there via phone, and, as it turns out, he was actually in that theater with his family originally. They asked another family to move over or something, but then decided they should just go to the theater next door where there was more space. He said his mind is just stuck on a few things.
A) That other family.
B) His dad carries a gun in a shoulder holster and there probably would have been a gun f ight if they had been there still. He's just lost between feeling lucky, freaked out, bad for the other family and thinking maybe they could have done something (his dad) if they had stayed there. But all things considered he seems to be doing pretty good.
Talk about crazy. Carrying a gun into a movie theater? and it's allowed? I don't even... Im speechless.. This whole thing is insane.. Poor people and their families Unless the movie theater, being a private place, has an explicit policy prohibiting any firearms from being brought into the theater, it's legal to do so provided the firearm owner has a concealed carry permit. It could also depend on state policy. In some states, for example, you can't concealed carry anywhere that requires paying for admission. In all states you can't concealed carry on premises where alcohol is served. There are probably lots of other rules that could vary from state to state. In my personal opinion, you shouldn't concealed carry in movie theaters due to the close proximity of so many other people. Freak accidents happen. However, I'm not sure whether or not it's expressly prohibited at that, or all movie theaters. Probably isn't allowed if I had to guess.
Yeah well, allowed or not, it's just plain wrong.. Call it my liberal european viewpoint or whatever the fuck, i don't care
If i found out that someone was carrying a fireweapon in a movie theater or other social gathering while being close to my loved ones, i'd fucking haunt him
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On July 21 2012 02:07 Lumi wrote:B) His dad carries a gun in a shoulder holster and there probably would have been a gun f ight if they had been there still. He's just lost between feeling lucky, freaked out, bad for the other family and thinking maybe they could have done something (his dad) if they had stayed there. But all things considered he seems to be doing pretty good.
I'd be happy for his dad not getting into a gunfight he'd probably lose. Pistol vs ar 15 and body armor?
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EPT
