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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on.
Posts of the following nature are banned:
1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post.
2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no.
3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture.
4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments.
Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. |
On April 25 2018 16:54 Ghostcom wrote:
I'm pretty sure you are just being kind of a dick right now mahrgell. Not wanting to waste time has very little to do with insecurity.
Ghosting is a dick move regardless of who does it.
In a self-focused world, it is a dick move, yes.
But if you have only a minimum ability to put yourself in the girls position or only know a a tiny bit about their experiences on platforms like Tinder (which are obviously not represented on a gaming forum) it is very easy to understand why this is by far the best strategy in many cases and very understandable.
And complaining about how things work won't do anything to improve the situation. Of course, if this is all only done as pretext to come to the conclusion, that they are not deserving for one's greatness anyway, this might be a valid strategy.
But if one is interested in actually finding someone else, maybe stopping to complain how unfair the world supposedly is (without ever considering anyone elses perspective) and trying to adapt would be the more proper solution.
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All of the girls I know and with whom I talked about this have some stories how being verbally attacked and heavily insulted after rejecting (politely) someone either online or on social media. Given this is what happens (as mentioned before I'm sure TL has much higher standards than a typical dating app  ) I see why a girl might want to 'ghost' someone, or simply remove him from her contacts.
After you receive comments and 'remarks' while walking on the streets (I was honestly surprised because as a guy I don't 'see' this happening from my point of view, but this is quite common), being insulted by some random guy online because you said him 'no', I can see why someone does not want to deal with this bullshit anymore and just stop replying, even if you are a nice guy who means no harm at all.
About the rational/emotional, personally I think it's really false. Women are as rational as men, men are as emotional as women.
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All of the girls I know and with whom I talked about this have never been verbally attacked and heavily insulted after rejecting (politely) someone. What is your point? Your personal experience is not the totality of things. There will always be jerks that insult, but if the response to jerkiness is more jerkiness (ghosting), I don't like that road.
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The only thing I ever did was ask them, sometimes in a lengthy and dissapointed way, why they stopped replying to me. I'm not bad feeling out social situations, but when you're having a good time (presumably) and both are chatting a lot in a past few days, it always felt extremelt jarring to suddenly be dropped. I know they might've found someone more interesting than me or I might've ended the chat with the most cringy thing or whatever, but it just suuuuuuucks that they're not willing to give feedback or give an honest reply back (even after the sometimes kind of rant about them not replying and asking what I said wrong). Feedback from the people you strike out with after genuinely trying to know each other better would be SOOOO helpful.
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On April 25 2018 15:14 sc-darkness wrote:
Well, apart from those girls' photos, I don't find anything interesting about them either. If anti-social girls like that think ghosting is fine, then I'm surely happy in the long-term to avoid them. The problem is lack of effort from their part to continue conversation. I might be the one to start it but it's too much weight to keep it going and keep them interested. They have to do something more than upload a few photos and wait.
Honestly, one of my biggest problems with Tinder is that it doesn't show when they were last online, so I know if I can just safely unmatch someone. If they're not interested, that's fine, but it's a waste of time for me if I have no idea whether it's time to unmatch them or wait for them to appear online. If you go to work rather than just being a student, you'll understand.
You shouldn't be on Tinder, period. If you can't handle some ghosting, dont be on it. Do you even realize how many guys talk to these girls? If you're not creme de la creme, you're fucked.
Do you want them to say "Sorry my Liege, I will ignore you now, as I have other decent men to talk to." before ghosting?
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On April 25 2018 17:59 mahrgell wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2018 16:54 Ghostcom wrote:
I'm pretty sure you are just being kind of a dick right now mahrgell. Not wanting to waste time has very little to do with insecurity.
Ghosting is a dick move regardless of who does it. In a self-focused world, it is a dick move, yes. But if you have only a minimum ability to put yourself in the girls position or only know a a tiny bit about their experiences on platforms like Tinder (which are obviously not represented on a gaming forum) it is very easy to understand why this is by far the best strategy in many cases and very understandable. And complaining about how things work won't do anything to improve the situation. Of course, if this is all only done as pretext to come to the conclusion, that they are not deserving for one's greatness anyway, this might be a valid strategy. But if one is interested in actually finding someone else, maybe stopping to complain how unfair the world supposedly is (without ever considering anyone elses perspective) and trying to adapt would be the more proper solution.
Ghosting is probably one of the single most ultimate self-centered acts in the dating scene - up there with the "nice guys". I find it hilarious that you try to act like it isn't a self-centered act.
If you had only a minimum of the empathy you pretend like none of the rest of us have you would quickly realize how much of a dick you currently are, but by all means, keep on arguing against your misconception of everyone else. In the real world, quite a lot of us here are actually in stable relationships and/or married. You are not the only one who is well aware of what females (and males) experience on Tinder. Complaining about ghosting is not in any way invalid - it is a shitty phenomenon and part of what makes dating feel more like a chore than fun. And it didn't use to be like that (yeah I'm an old man, get off my lawn).
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On April 25 2018 21:11 Ghostcom wrote:Show nested quote +On April 25 2018 17:59 mahrgell wrote:On April 25 2018 16:54 Ghostcom wrote:
I'm pretty sure you are just being kind of a dick right now mahrgell. Not wanting to waste time has very little to do with insecurity.
Ghosting is a dick move regardless of who does it. In a self-focused world, it is a dick move, yes. But if you have only a minimum ability to put yourself in the girls position or only know a a tiny bit about their experiences on platforms like Tinder (which are obviously not represented on a gaming forum) it is very easy to understand why this is by far the best strategy in many cases and very understandable. And complaining about how things work won't do anything to improve the situation. Of course, if this is all only done as pretext to come to the conclusion, that they are not deserving for one's greatness anyway, this might be a valid strategy. But if one is interested in actually finding someone else, maybe stopping to complain how unfair the world supposedly is (without ever considering anyone elses perspective) and trying to adapt would be the more proper solution. Ghosting is probably one of the single most ultimate self-centered acts in the dating scene - up there with the "nice guys". I find it hilarious that you try to act like it isn't a self-centered act. If you had only a minimum of the empathy you pretend like none of the rest of us have you would quickly realize how much of a dick you currently are, but by all means, keep on arguing against your misconception of everyone else. In the real world, quite a lot of us here are actually in stable relationships and/or married. You are not the only one who is well aware of what females (and males) experience on Tinder. Complaining about ghosting is not in any way invalid - it is a shitty phenomenon and part of what makes dating feel more like a chore than fun. And it didn't use to be like that (yeah I'm an old man, get off my lawn).
Dating is fun. Attempting to reach women to get to the actual dating stage is the part which is frustrating.
And yeah, ghosting is shitty thing to do. Getting tons of attention just from the virtue of being "a female" does not make you any less of a dick for doing so.
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I don't agree that it is a valid thing to complain about girls ghosting on tinder in this thread. You might not like it, you might even hate it. But it is the reality of online dating.
> And it didn't use to be like that (yeah I'm an old man, get off my lawn).
It has always been this way online grandpa. At least as far as I've been on tinder. Online dating and dating in real are two very separate things.
I do think there are two types of ghosting though. One is fine, the other one is really a douchebag move.
The first kind is when you don't know each other, haven't dated, you have just talked for 3 days online. Ghosting is perfectly fine here to me. If you actually have a problem with handling ghosting in this scenario, do yourself a service and tell yourself that the person ghosted who just ghosted you just said "Sorry, I'm not interested in talking anymore.". That is what she/he actually meant by ghosting.
The second scenario is when you have actually gone on >= 1 date. I honestly think it is less rude to say "Fuck you, you're ugly and smell like tuna." than to go cold turkey and ghost. Any respectable person would say something here in my opinion. If they do not, they're just weak minded people to me. In any case, I would just take it as a "I'm not interested" and go about my way to find a decent girl. Last girl I dated did this, just removed me from tinder after the second date.
Anyway, complaining about women ghosting WILL NOT help you in anyway, so just don't bother. Focus on what you can do to increase your level of attractiveness instead.
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Genocide is also a thing that happens. You might not like it, you might even hate it. But it is the reality of this world.
The quality of your arguments are truly compelling.
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This is the wrong place to argue.
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stop trying to have conversations with women on tinder. have conversations in person. after 2-3 messages that test basic literacy and decency you should be trying to meet with them. they will either agree to meet or not. then you can move on. complaining about ghosting during the texting phase is silly and desperate.
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On April 26 2018 00:36 IgnE wrote:
stop trying to have conversations with women on tinder. have conversations in person. after 2-3 messages that test basic literacy and decency you should be trying to meet with them. they will either agree to meet or not. then you can move on. complaining about ghosting during the texting phase is silly and desperate.
For me I've not gotten part the first message yet.. at this point I'm not quite sure what exactly you're suppose to do. You'd think people who matches are at least willing to start a simple conversation.
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On April 26 2018 01:24 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On April 26 2018 00:36 IgnE wrote:
stop trying to have conversations with women on tinder. have conversations in person. after 2-3 messages that test basic literacy and decency you should be trying to meet with them. they will either agree to meet or not. then you can move on. complaining about ghosting during the texting phase is silly and desperate. For me I've not gotten part the first message yet.. at this point I'm not quite sure what exactly you're suppose to do. You'd think people who matches are at least willing to start a simple conversation.
Why? She swiped right on you, then immediately after swiped right on McDreamy, have gone on 3 dates and are about to get married. Why does she owe you a message just because she considered you might be interesting for the 0.5 seconds it took her to swipe right on Tinder?
Her not sending you anything is the equivalent of her sending you a message saying "whoops, I meant to swipe left". Accept it.
But I have been where you were. Way before Tinder. I asked for a girl's phone number, she gave it, then she never picked up or phoned back. I actually got really upset. Eventually she did pick up, and I told her ghosting me was a shitty thing to do. She seemed a bit guilty about it, but I have since grown up and consider it one of the crappier things I have done: it didn't make me feel any better and just made a girl I was interested in feel bad about herself (I assume). Moreover, as I told her, I had understood her message loud and clear. As have you. So learn that lesson: ghosting = she doesn't want you.
It's like when instead of unsubscribing from some shitty email list you mistakenly said you wanted, you teach your spam filter to permanently ignore it. That's what the girl is doing to you. It's just a different way of saying no. One in which she doesn't have to (potentially) deal with your insecurities.
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There's a huge difference between tinder and real life. Ghosting on tinder is fine (I completely agree with acro). In real life it's a dick move. They way you initiate a conversation is also very important to get a girl to respond. A simple hi won't cut it if you don't look like George Clooney.
If you're really frustrated with Tinder and dating just go to Thailand or something. You're sure to match a lot of sweet and cool girls there and you're sure to get some dates.
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The ghosting problem honestly has much more to do with the platform itself than with being a jerk. Common courtesy would support not leading someone on if you already decided not to spend more time on them, but as mentioned above the realities of the platform support a more guarded and "numbers game" approach. Better to either learn to deal with it or to find a different way to meet women. And to be fair the latter is not a bad option.
Incidentally, ghosting IRL happens too and honestly it's a really shitty thing to do. Dunno about Acrofales' "sucks but take it and move on" approach - it does have its merits, but I won't deny that every time it's happened to me I took it extremely personally, and I've yet to see any reason that I shouldn't. Common courtesy dictates that you should be less of a jerk to someone who shows interest in you and disappearing because it's easier than saying "sorry but I changed my mind" or some variant thereof is not great.
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On April 26 2018 01:24 Excludos wrote:
For me I've not gotten part the first message yet.. at this point I'm not quite sure what exactly you're suppose to do. You'd think people who matches are at least willing to start a simple conversation.
Your pictures are not good enough. Simple as that. You are delusional if you think what you write matters to a great deal. It's like 95% pictures, 5% being suave.
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Perhaps you gotta seee it simply as a series of gates you have to get through to get to the treasure chamber of the castle. First one opening to you might narrow the possible applicants the most, but that doesn't mean you're anywhere near the treasure chamber yet. You still need the inner gate to open, the courtyard gate, the gate of the actual keep, boobytrapgate, the fake gate (only to realise it leads nowhere), and the treasure chamber gate.
The amount of gates is different with every castle as well as the type of gates. Also, each treasure laying in the treasure chamber will be different in size and composition. You might get access to treasure only to realize its filled piles and piles of dead stuff. And you don't want piles and piles of dead stuff (unless you do of course)
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On April 25 2018 19:49 SoSexy wrote:
All of the girls I know and with whom I talked about this have never been verbally attacked and heavily insulted after rejecting (politely) someone. What is your point? Your personal experience is not the totality of things. There will always be jerks that insult, but if the response to jerkiness is more jerkiness (ghosting), I don't like that road.
My point is: perhaps it's not that weird that a woman decides to 'ghost' someone.
Explanation: there are cases in which a women might prefer to avoid an interaction that can degenerate quickly into insults by stopping the conversation.
I don't think I have to provide a statistics to make this point valid ...
More generally: a large fraction of women is harassed, much larger than men. You can find the statistics you prefer (across nations, age, etc.), independently of the situation (if they had just rejected someone or they were just walking down the street). Is it strange to see that a women prefers to ghost someone rather than expose herself to potentially being harassed/insulted/attacked?
She owes you (or the person she's talking to online) nothing, it's possibly a bit impolite to stop answering, but nothing worse than the rest that's accepted as standard online (e.g. most of the discussion happening here on TL has a 'tone' that would never happen in real life, because people are not harsh when talking in person).
Sometimes I swipe left on someone by accident and I don't notice, then the person sends me a 'hi, how are you?' and I simply remove the contact. I don't think I'm a 'jerk' for not replying 'hey sorry I swiped by accident but I'm actually not interested'.
Finally, the *most important point*: this is not a discussion you can fully have without women participating to it. I imagine this thread is 99.999% men -- how can you expect to discuss the reaction of women to Tinder interactions without actually having women participating ???
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On April 25 2018 23:37 bloodwhore~ wrote:
I don't agree that it is a valid thing to complain about girls ghosting on tinder in this thread. You might not like it, you might even hate it. But it is the reality of online dating.
That doesn't make it any better. Just because you act differently in real life doesn't mean you have full permission to be a socially awkward person online just because you can hide at your house, sitting in front of computer without actual face to face interaction. More to the point, let's say the brutally honest truth while we're here, some girls swipe right just for validation (someone here said it a few pages back) to see who liked them. That to me means Tinder makes attention whores out of arguably normal girls. As a consequence, many people like me, and I'm sure like all of you here because you're probably not the next Brad Pitt guy (no offense, I'm not either), get unmatched or ghosted (no reply). I'm fine with the former actually. The former wastes my time and their time. That's the keyword here.
Why can't you just swipe right when you really like someone? Sure, mistakes happen, but then make sure to unmatch the person rather than keep them on your list for days or weeks without a reply. That's why I said earlier that I wanted to see when they were last online, so I can UNMATCH them. I don't want to ask them desperately "hey, why don't you reply already?". I just want to know I can unmatch them and move on. Otherwise, how do I know if they're just inactive? Please think logically before declaring all guys are desperate if they want to see last seen status.
On April 25 2018 23:37 bloodwhore~ wrote:
Anyway, complaining about women ghosting WILL NOT help you in anyway
Again, we're stating the underlying issue here which is that Tinder and similar applications are turning women into attention whores who waste people's time because of their insecurity. Or, if they wish to do so, as I said, they could just unmatch someone which I prefer over no reply. I don't want them on my list for days or weeks if they have no interest either so we can both move on.
Also, in theory, it helps if you say it directly to women. That's how change begins. If we take your argument, why would anything ever change in the human history? Why is communism gone in Eastern Europe ("oh, don't bother, it's fine), why is fascism gone in Germany ("oh, don't bother, it's fine"), why bother with medicine ("oh, don't bother, we're all going to die"), etc. It's in human nature to change something or avoid something bad.
On April 25 2018 20:38 bloodwhore~ wrote:
You shouldn't be on Tinder, period. If you can't handle some ghosting, dont be on it.
First, be careful with your extremities. You have no idea how you sound like to a third person (it's ridiculously arrogant at the very least). I already said it about ghosting, so no need to repeat myself.
On April 25 2018 20:38 bloodwhore~ wrote:
Do you want them to say "Sorry my Liege, I will ignore you now, as I have other decent men to talk to." before ghosting?
It's "Liebe" (love) in German.
I'm not personally attacking you, but some of posts already say what you said. It's just in different wording. You were helpful in the past, but you seem to deal with extremities too much. Perhaps this is your insecurity? Don't worry, it's ok, we all have some. No one is Superman. 
Also, I say some posts agree with you but I see there are plenty who disagree either with you personally or with those who agree with you which implies you as well. At the very least, that means your opinion is not widely accepted, so I think you need to tone it down a bit.
On April 26 2018 02:32 Uldridge wrote:
Perhaps you gotta seee it simply as a series of gates you have to get through to get to the treasure chamber of the castle. First one opening to you might narrow the possible applicants the most, but that doesn't mean you're anywhere near the treasure chamber yet. You still need the inner gate to open, the courtyard gate, the gate of the actual keep, boobytrapgate, the fake gate (only to realise it leads nowhere), and the treasure chamber gate.
The amount of gates is different with every castle as well as the type of gates. Also, each treasure laying in the treasure chamber will be different in size and composition. You might get access to treasure only to realize its filled piles and piles of dead stuff. And you don't want piles and piles of dead stuff (unless you do of course)
This is a good post to argue against my previous ones. I like it. It has positive vibe, which is helpful and you can actually focus on the given advice rather than being told "Fuck you, that's why, deal with it" like some posts above.
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On April 26 2018 04:18 sc-darkness wrote:As a consequence, many people like me, and I'm sure like all of you here because you're probably not the next Brad Pitt guy (no offense, I'm not either), get unmatched or ghosted (no reply). I'm fine with the former actually. The former wastes my time and their time. That's the keyword here.
Why can't you just swipe right when you really like someone? Sure, mistakes happen, but then make sure to unmatch the person rather than keep them on your list for days or weeks without a reply. That's why I said earlier that I wanted to see when they were last online, so I can UNMATCH them. I don't want to ask them desperately "hey, why don't you reply already?". I just want to know I can unmatch them and move on. Otherwise, how do I know if they're just inactive? Please think logically before declaring all guys are desperate if they want to see last seen status.
No doubt. I've asked out around 10 girls this years, who have enthusiastically said yes to a date, only to ghost or remove me from tinder. People are flakey, moreso in certain citys.
Furthermore, tinder used to have the functionality for seeing when you were last active. Your entire reasoning of why you should have it is wrong. The functionality was removed because a lot of guys are insecure as fuck and got mad about seeing their matches be online but not responding. I know I got insecure watching it back in the day, and even I had girls talk to me about why I didn't answer when I was online. It's creepy as hell.
Again, we're stating the underlying issue here which is that Tinder and similar applications are turning women into attention whores who waste people's time because of their insecurity. Or, if they wish to do so, as I said, they could just unmatch someone which I prefer over no reply. I don't want them on my list for days or weeks if they have no interest either so we can both move on.
You're free to remove them yourself if you're scared of getting ghosted. Delete any girl who you haven't talked to for 3 days unless it's obvious she is busy. And stop putting all your eggs in one basket. The "waste time" argument is kinda shit to me. What does it take to send a message, 20 seconds?
Also, in theory, it helps if you say it directly to women. That's how change begins. If we take your argument, why would anything ever change in the human history? Why is communism gone in Eastern Europe ("oh, don't bother, it's fine), why is fascism gone in Germany ("oh, don't bother, it's fine"), why bother with medicine ("oh, don't bother, we're all going to die"), etc. It's in human nature to change something or avoid something bad.
"Why don't we just talk to criminals and tell them its bad to steal stuff? It would be so much nicer if people were nice."
I get what you're saying but people not ghosting is just not happening. You will probably never be able to persuade anyone to stop ghosting. And if you were to try questioning a girl on tinder why she isn't answering you will go from "uninteresting guy" to "psychopath" in a heartbeat.
It's "Liebe" (love) in German.
It isn't and wasn't german for love. Synonyms: "liege lord, lord, feudal lord, seigneur, suzerain, overlord, master, chief, chieftain, superior, monarch, sovereign, baron, ruler"
I'm not personally attacking you, but some of posts already say what you said. It's just in different wording. You were helpful in the past, but you seem to deal with extremities too much. Perhaps this is your insecurity? Don't worry, it's ok, we all have some. No one is Superman. Also, I say some posts agree with you but I see there are plenty who disagree either with you personally or with those who agree with you which implies you as well. At the very least, that means your opinion is not widely accepted, so I think you need to tone it down a bit.
> Not personally attacking you
> Goes on personal attack
Alright man.
Tone down my opinions? They aren't even that controversial. I haven't heard a single good argument against them so far either. I'm afraid people being insecure about getting ghosted just isn't cutting it for me.
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