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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on.
Posts of the following nature are banned:
1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post.
2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no.
3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture.
4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments.
Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. |
On June 27 2014 03:13 Plansix wrote:
Yeah. The beautiful mind plan was better, it had a sort of charm to it and was way less narcissistic.
"I find you attractive. Your aggressive moves toward me... indicate that you feel the same way. But still, ritual requires that we continue with a number of platonic activities... before we have sex. I am proceeding with these activities, but in point of actual fact, all I really want to do is have intercourse with you as soon as possible."
edit: what a 10000 post
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On June 27 2014 03:29 Titusmaster6 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 03:13 Plansix wrote:
Yeah. The beautiful mind plan was better, it had a sort of charm to it and was way less narcissistic. "I find you attractive. Your aggressive moves toward me... indicate that you feel the same way. But still, ritual requires that we continue with a number of platonic activities... before we have sex. I am proceeding with these activities, but in point of actual fact, all I really want to do is have intercourse with you as soon as possible."
That is the truth, but sometimes you date a girl that wants to have sex as much as you do. And it happens. AND afterwards you dump her because you think that she is a slut while she might be your dream girl. Sterotypes and Hollywood sux.
ps. gratz on 10000 post in this thread bro 
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There was something charming about the directness of that speach. And it worked out after a while.
Pro tip: the ladies know you want to sleep with them, it's implied by the dating. Just let the topic come up naturally, cause it will happen. It also becomes less of a taboo subject the older you get. You do need to go all agro and try to set a time line for sex. You will just kinda look like a creeper.
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On June 27 2014 03:14 ComaDose wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 03:03 Xiphos wrote:On June 27 2014 02:34 ComaDose wrote:
Xiphos can i have a picture of you so i can warn my sister and extended family? Can I have a picture of your sister so I can decide whether or not to court her in the first place? I know by court you mean disregard her psychological well being and offering sexual ultimatums so no.
That is if I manage to notice her in the place.
On June 27 2014 03:13 Plansix wrote:
Yeah. The beautiful mind plan was better, it had a sort of charm to it and was way less narcissistic.
Too bad the result showed otherwise.
And please check up on dictionary on the precise definition of "narcissism" as you are showing in no form understand it in the correct manner.
"Your aggressive moves toward me... indicate that you feel the same way." = narcissism
Charming a girl by carrying in a conversation with good common sense, great sense of humor, interesting topics to bring out, and dress in stylish fashion != narcissism
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What movie did you watch? He ends up happily married for years. His terrible, yet charming plan works out once he finds a woman that is willing to put up with him. Which is the real moral of this story.
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why are we calling a list of subjective things not narcissism? thats exactly what it is. an excessive interest in oneself.
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Poll: Should this thread get locked ?Yes (14) 58% Yes (10) 42% 24 total votes Your vote: Should this thread get locked ? (Vote): Yes
(Vote): Yes
User was warned for this post
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voted bottom yes to be hipster
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I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk
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On June 27 2014 06:21 Najda wrote:
I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk
Yeah that's why I put different options on the poll.
But seriously, I agree, the one sided poll and the fact that it probably has no influence on mods was just a way to state how I, and seemingly many others, feel about this thread, especially the last pages. The 30 last pages. At least.
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I suggest creating a new thread called "Romantic hollywood-style dating, how's your luck?".
And allow only poetry in there.
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On June 27 2014 06:29 Cynry wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 06:21 Najda wrote:
I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk Yeah that's why I put different options on the poll. But seriously, I agree, the one sided poll and the fact that it probably has no influence on mods was just a way to state how I, and seemingly many others, feel about this thread, especially the last pages. The 30 last pages. At least.
The options are "yes" and "yes" unless you're seeing a different poll than I am seeing.
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On June 27 2014 06:43 Najda wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 06:29 Cynry wrote:On June 27 2014 06:21 Najda wrote:
I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk Yeah that's why I put different options on the poll. But seriously, I agree, the one sided poll and the fact that it probably has no influence on mods was just a way to state how I, and seemingly many others, feel about this thread, especially the last pages. The 30 last pages. At least. The options are "yes" and "yes" unless you're seeing a different poll than I am seeing.
forgot the /sarcasm I guess.
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On June 27 2014 06:43 Najda wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 06:29 Cynry wrote:On June 27 2014 06:21 Najda wrote:
I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk Yeah that's why I put different options on the poll. But seriously, I agree, the one sided poll and the fact that it probably has no influence on mods was just a way to state how I, and seemingly many others, feel about this thread, especially the last pages. The 30 last pages. At least. The options are "yes" and "yes" unless you're seeing a different poll than I am seeing.
But if you don't like the first yes, you have a different yes you can pick.
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On June 23 2014 07:49 sluggaslamoo wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2014 02:41 JoeCool wrote:On June 20 2014 01:43 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:On June 20 2014 01:22 JoeCool wrote:On June 17 2014 06:52 JoeCool wrote:Thank you guys, never expected so much comments! On June 16 2014 20:22 quetzy wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:
...Deeds are better than words.
Uhh, you have a lot to learn about girls. I know it maybe shouldn't be this way, and it's changing slowly, but many girls still want the man to act/lead. They will do the word part, and often even without any actual words. It's up to you to act based on the signals you catch. Specific to your case, the very fact that she wanted to talk to you and explain makes her as direct as you can wish someone to be (already more than many others, men or women, are). Yes, it took her time, but she wanted to open up to you, and it was obviously not easy for her. Instead of appreciating it and being a, well, human being, I have to say you were acting rather butthurt with "there's nothing to talk about". Yes there is. Be happy you found a girl that actually wants to say how she feels! Just lighten up a bit, hear her out, and then see what you want to do. And good luck man! Edit: just read the whole history of you two... Sounds like she just panicked that time when you tried to kiss her. When you say you "terminated the contact", you probably did come across as angry to her (which was completely unnecessary btw). She probably spent the month between being happy that you like her, and angry at herself for possibly blowing it. It took some courage on her part to approach you, respect that. In any case, seems things are going well now so that's good (I would still ask her what she wanted to "explain", just in case there was something else on her mind) Thank you for your comment! The reason why I said that deeds are better than words is simple and you probably know it since you read the story. After she refused my dating suggestions two times and still sent me messages like "I´ve been thinking of you all day long" I felt like these were nothing but empty phrases... And when she "refused" to kiss me I sent her a message asking whether I was wrong about the whole situation and since she did not answer I felt like it would be the best thing to "move on". Maybe I came across angry but what else was I supposed to do? And yeah... it seems things are going well. On June 16 2014 21:22 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:
Joe, LET ME STOP YOU RIGHT THERE. Basically what you're doing at the moment is EXACTLY what you should be doing. You're sort of cold-shouldering her, and that is making her madly attracted to you. The second you start being very nice to her and doing the explaining and talking part, she probably gets scared of that she might have to commit and she will probably bail out. So even if you want more of her, want to fall in love and get married etc, HOLD OFF WITH "THE TALK". You want to gradually move to that territory, and not make her do a full emotional 180 since that is something that scares the shit out of her. Eventhough it might feel wrong for you, as if you're being an emotionally void asshole that is only leading her on, all you're doing is letting her safely get used to expanding the relationship. Take it easy but steadily. Be VERY careful of explanations and everything. If "it" happens, it happens anyway. And no amount of rational communication will help you when hormones should be doing the work. Yeah from my personal experience this leads to nothing. I did it once. From that point on that girl was still dating me for a couple of months including making out and such things. But she was... different? And as our "relationship" ended she told me exactly what you said. She was scared. On June 16 2014 23:59 r.Evo wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:On June 16 2014 07:53 Zooper31 wrote:On June 16 2014 07:14 Belisarius wrote:On June 16 2014 00:38 JoeCool wrote:
Four weeks ago I tried to kiss my co-worker because I felt that she was interested in me. Some of you might remember the (long) story. She refused and from that point on I terminated our contact.
This friday I saw her for the first time since four weeks and guess what? She asked me whether I had some time because she wants to explain this situation to me, hopes that I´m not angry with her and also added that I was right when I assumed that she was interested. Since talking about such things is pretty pointless (imo) I said that I´m fine and don´t feel that it´s necessary to talk. Later on she grabbed me from behind and kissed my neck. Then I left.
Yesterday she gave me a massage, started cuddling multiple times, ran her finger through my hair and asked whether she was allowed to give me a kiss on my scrag aaaannnndddd ... after multiple attempts to kiss me, we made out (no sex but lots of kissing).
I´m pretty confused right now. ...you would be a lot less confused if you had actually let her tell you what was going on... that's not exactly rocket science. EXACTLY! Somehow she was interested in you in the past but couldn't act on it or wasn't prepared for it. Now she's still interested but now can handle things and wants more. Just ask her what she wanted to explain that one time and just move on and continue on with how things are going. The reason why I did not want to talk is pretty simple; If she is interested in me she could just kiss me, propose a date or do sth similar => Deeds are better than words. And if she is not interested in me (for whatever reason) there is no need to talk. I don´t need her to tell me that she´s still in love with her ex bf or sth like that. I´m not beeing a dick here but that´s just from my experience. The last part (continue on how things are going) sounds fine though, that is what I´m planning to do. I´ll give her a call this evening and ask her out for thursday. That´s a holiday here in Ger. If she refuses, I might ask what is/was wrong because then we´re basically at the same point like four weeks ago => Signs of interest and still too afraid to date/have sex. 1) It's your job to start a sexual relationship, it's her job to define it. Initiating a kiss or making a date happen are your jobs early on in the relationship. Man up, take responsibility. 2) Stop pretending that she's not interested. She clearly is, it's your job to take it to the next level. Take responsibility. 3) "If she refuses to date me I'll ask what's wrong" is a horrible frame of mind. You're basing your decision on her choices which, again, means you're trying to shove responsibility onto her. It's random pressure and drama that will get you nowhere. Have a life, don't base yours around hers. If she's afraid of something it's your job to handle it. Be empathetic. I appreciate your comment! 1) That´s what I did. All the time. I asked her out and I tried to kiss her. 2) Yeah right now it seems like she is but four weeks ago it was more like she was interested as long as I was far away but as soon as I came closer (dating & kissing) ... well the attraction was gone. 3) True! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I met her today for a couple of mins (at work) and asked her out for dinner on thursday, she agreed. So we´re going to have a dinner together. Mexican or Sushi ... I haven´t decided yet but I told her that I´ll contact her in the following days. We´ll see what happens. Thanks again for all the comments! Aaaaand she did not appear for our date. Like I said, on monday she agreed to have dinner with me on thursday. On tuesday I went to the restaurant and made a reservation for two persons; that´s what I also texted her on tuesday afternoon. On wednesday I wrote that I´ll pick her up at about 5.30 she just has to tell me where. Not a single response and about thirty mins ago I had to cancel the reservation. Since she did not respond until this morning I got a bad feeling and spent the whole day at a lake with some friends, still hoping she might call/text me. Well, now that I´m home and alone I´m kinda ... sad?! :-/ Unpleasant feeling. Ok if she ditched you, really you have the right to be pissed at her. Be angry with her and "let her go". She probably has reasons, but any decent person would just tell you in time why she couldnt make it. Yep I was/am angry with her. The next day (at work) she came to me, asked whether I´m pissed at her and said that she understands my anger. But also added that she did not agree 100% to my proposal. Which might be true but still she could´ve told me earlier that she has no time on thursday (or does not want to). I said that it doesn´t matter to which she replied that it does. Well ... since I did not talk to her - besides the usual stuff from work - she left after a couple of mins. During my break on saturday she came to me and started touching me again (also under my shirt). This was reasons enough for me to ask wtf this whole thing was/is about. I told her that she should make up her mind. And asked why she rejects my proposals although she seemingly wants me. What followed were the usual phrases; "I don´t think that this will work out because you are a student..., I don´t want a relationship right now..., ...," Again I told her to make up her mind, if she wants me she should get her shit together. And if she does not then theres no more touching/hugging/kissing. Ever. According to her this would be - and I qutote - "[...]almost impossible[...]" for her, so she would like to give "it" - "it" in this case is an affair where we meet here and there - a try. Although she mentioned that she is scared if one of us wants more or this won´t work out and such things ... basically because here and there we work together (until Februrary). Then I made the mistake to respond to her kisses and so we made out ... a little. Now comes the kicker: Suddenly she opened my belt and wanted to give me a BJ, in my "office". I stopped her since I felt that this was going too far and there was lots of stuff going on in my store. But man I´m (still) confused. O_o She stayed a little longer and told me that she´ll ask me out - no she won´t - next monday. Four hours later she asked me via sms what I´m doing and sent me a picture of herself. On June 20 2014 05:23 r.Evo wrote:On June 20 2014 01:22 JoeCool wrote:On June 17 2014 06:52 JoeCool wrote:Thank you guys, never expected so much comments! On June 16 2014 20:22 quetzy wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:
...Deeds are better than words.
Uhh, you have a lot to learn about girls. I know it maybe shouldn't be this way, and it's changing slowly, but many girls still want the man to act/lead. They will do the word part, and often even without any actual words. It's up to you to act based on the signals you catch. Specific to your case, the very fact that she wanted to talk to you and explain makes her as direct as you can wish someone to be (already more than many others, men or women, are). Yes, it took her time, but she wanted to open up to you, and it was obviously not easy for her. Instead of appreciating it and being a, well, human being, I have to say you were acting rather butthurt with "there's nothing to talk about". Yes there is. Be happy you found a girl that actually wants to say how she feels! Just lighten up a bit, hear her out, and then see what you want to do. And good luck man! Edit: just read the whole history of you two... Sounds like she just panicked that time when you tried to kiss her. When you say you "terminated the contact", you probably did come across as angry to her (which was completely unnecessary btw). She probably spent the month between being happy that you like her, and angry at herself for possibly blowing it. It took some courage on her part to approach you, respect that. In any case, seems things are going well now so that's good (I would still ask her what she wanted to "explain", just in case there was something else on her mind) Thank you for your comment! The reason why I said that deeds are better than words is simple and you probably know it since you read the story. After she refused my dating suggestions two times and still sent me messages like "I´ve been thinking of you all day long" I felt like these were nothing but empty phrases... And when she "refused" to kiss me I sent her a message asking whether I was wrong about the whole situation and since she did not answer I felt like it would be the best thing to "move on". Maybe I came across angry but what else was I supposed to do? And yeah... it seems things are going well. On June 16 2014 21:22 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:
Joe, LET ME STOP YOU RIGHT THERE. Basically what you're doing at the moment is EXACTLY what you should be doing. You're sort of cold-shouldering her, and that is making her madly attracted to you. The second you start being very nice to her and doing the explaining and talking part, she probably gets scared of that she might have to commit and she will probably bail out. So even if you want more of her, want to fall in love and get married etc, HOLD OFF WITH "THE TALK". You want to gradually move to that territory, and not make her do a full emotional 180 since that is something that scares the shit out of her. Eventhough it might feel wrong for you, as if you're being an emotionally void asshole that is only leading her on, all you're doing is letting her safely get used to expanding the relationship. Take it easy but steadily. Be VERY careful of explanations and everything. If "it" happens, it happens anyway. And no amount of rational communication will help you when hormones should be doing the work. Yeah from my personal experience this leads to nothing. I did it once. From that point on that girl was still dating me for a couple of months including making out and such things. But she was... different? And as our "relationship" ended she told me exactly what you said. She was scared. On June 16 2014 23:59 r.Evo wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:On June 16 2014 07:53 Zooper31 wrote:On June 16 2014 07:14 Belisarius wrote:On June 16 2014 00:38 JoeCool wrote:
Four weeks ago I tried to kiss my co-worker because I felt that she was interested in me. Some of you might remember the (long) story. She refused and from that point on I terminated our contact.
This friday I saw her for the first time since four weeks and guess what? She asked me whether I had some time because she wants to explain this situation to me, hopes that I´m not angry with her and also added that I was right when I assumed that she was interested. Since talking about such things is pretty pointless (imo) I said that I´m fine and don´t feel that it´s necessary to talk. Later on she grabbed me from behind and kissed my neck. Then I left.
Yesterday she gave me a massage, started cuddling multiple times, ran her finger through my hair and asked whether she was allowed to give me a kiss on my scrag aaaannnndddd ... after multiple attempts to kiss me, we made out (no sex but lots of kissing).
I´m pretty confused right now. ...you would be a lot less confused if you had actually let her tell you what was going on... that's not exactly rocket science. EXACTLY! Somehow she was interested in you in the past but couldn't act on it or wasn't prepared for it. Now she's still interested but now can handle things and wants more. Just ask her what she wanted to explain that one time and just move on and continue on with how things are going. The reason why I did not want to talk is pretty simple; If she is interested in me she could just kiss me, propose a date or do sth similar => Deeds are better than words. And if she is not interested in me (for whatever reason) there is no need to talk. I don´t need her to tell me that she´s still in love with her ex bf or sth like that. I´m not beeing a dick here but that´s just from my experience. The last part (continue on how things are going) sounds fine though, that is what I´m planning to do. I´ll give her a call this evening and ask her out for thursday. That´s a holiday here in Ger. If she refuses, I might ask what is/was wrong because then we´re basically at the same point like four weeks ago => Signs of interest and still too afraid to date/have sex. 1) It's your job to start a sexual relationship, it's her job to define it. Initiating a kiss or making a date happen are your jobs early on in the relationship. Man up, take responsibility. 2) Stop pretending that she's not interested. She clearly is, it's your job to take it to the next level. Take responsibility. 3) "If she refuses to date me I'll ask what's wrong" is a horrible frame of mind. You're basing your decision on her choices which, again, means you're trying to shove responsibility onto her. It's random pressure and drama that will get you nowhere. Have a life, don't base yours around hers. If she's afraid of something it's your job to handle it. Be empathetic. I appreciate your comment! 1) That´s what I did. All the time. I asked her out and I tried to kiss her. 2) Yeah right now it seems like she is but four weeks ago it was more like she was interested as long as I was far away but as soon as I came closer (dating & kissing) ... well the attraction was gone. 3) True! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I met her today for a couple of mins (at work) and asked her out for dinner on thursday, she agreed. So we´re going to have a dinner together. Mexican or Sushi ... I haven´t decided yet but I told her that I´ll contact her in the following days. We´ll see what happens. Thanks again for all the comments! Aaaaand she did not appear for our date. Like I said, on monday she agreed to have dinner with me on thursday. On tuesday I went to the restaurant and made a reservation for two persons; that´s what I also texted her on tuesday afternoon. On wednesday I wrote that I´ll pick her up at about 5.30 she just has to tell me where. Not a single response and about thirty mins ago I had to cancel the reservation. Since she did not respond until this morning I got a bad feeling and spent the whole day at a lake with some friends, still hoping she might call/text me. Well, now that I´m home and alone I´m kinda ... sad?! :-/ Unpleasant feeling. Edit: 8.50 pm Received a message "Sorry ...  have been to france with my parents all day long, just came back. What are you doing?" Next. In an ideal world you'd have a buddy, female buddy or woman you're interested in (from worst to best obv) that you can call an hour or two before your reservation and ask if they want to go out to dinner that evening. That also allows for the good ol' "Oh, I had an awesome dinner with xyz, what did you do?" which is pretty much the only way to bounce back these kind of things easily. Yeah that would have been an option... you´re right! Like I said I spent the whole day at a lake with a couple of friends which was also fine for me. Besides; public viewing is a great opportunity to meet new people. There was a huge event yesterday evening when germany was playing, since no one but me wanted to go there I went there alone, met a buddy from my lectures and he introduced me to a couple of other guys/gals. I missed the opportunity to get to know one of the girls better, she was smiling towards me couple of times, but I guess that we´ll meet again on thursday for the match between Ger and USA. Still it has been a great evening. Yeah basically it just seems like she has no boundaries, she's always looking for a cheap thrill and her decisions are completely based on her emotions. With these kinds of girls its best not to actually plan anything and just go with the flow. There's nothing to be confused about except for the fact that it doesn't make logical sense, there's a saying, you cannot fix something with logic that wasn't put there by logic in the first place. The guys she blows off are the ones that do get affected, they start worrying and getting needy, its like a really powerful instinctive test that she doesn't even realise she's doing. If anything she's looking for someone with very strong boundaries (the opposite of her), but this is really easy to fuck up when you think about it too much. You've done alright so far in this department anywho. e.g this. Show nested quote +This was reasons enough for me to ask wtf this whole thing was/is about. I told her that she should make up her mind.
Again I told her to make up her mind, if she wants me she should get her shit together. And if she does not then theres no more touching/hugging/kissing. This is boundary setting, I think she likes it and it plays into her whole fantasy. Show nested quote +What followed were the usual phrases; "I don´t think that this will work out because you are a student..., I don´t want a relationship right now..., ...,"
and I qutote - "[...]almost impossible[...]" for her, so she would like to give "it" - "it" in this case is an affair where we meet here and there - a try. Although she mentioned that she is scared if one of us wants more or this won´t work out and such things ... basically because here and there we work together (until Februrary). Speaking of fantasies that's basically what is going on here, the anxiety of getting with someone she shouldn't be with seems to turn her on. Telling her that "this isn't right" and that she shouldn't be doing it is exactly what is causing her to want to do it. She wants you to set a boundary and then she wants to break it as if she were defying her parents. Seems like an open and shut case to me. Being your type don't expect to be in any proper relationship with her. Don't expect her to come to any sort of date or anything like that, she will just abandon it at the drop of a hat. If you don't like playing games its best to go with someone who also doesn't like to screw around like this, its really a game, a dumb game if you ask me, but... sex... There are girls that aren't into this kind of stuff and make more sense. If you want to get into a relationship it would be better to find someone that doesn't fuck with you.
Thanks, this analysis seems to be pretty much spot-on!
The worst thing about this whole situation is not that she´s playing this "game". And it´s not because she refused to date me. No, the worst thing is that I´m feeling that I´ve could done better. I´ve got the feeling that I made a couple of mistakes that led to this situation. Maybe I was too needy when I asked her out, maybe I should have had sex with her early on, maybe I should never had this "talk" with her, maybe I was too much of a nice guy ... and so on and so on.
A (female) friend of mine gave me the advice to ask her whether she wants to have sex with me. No emotions, no dinner ... just ask her out for sex. And I got to admit that I´ve already thought about this multiple times. But like you said, she´s obviously no relationship material. And you know, if the sex is (too) good I´ll probably get more attached to her than the other way around. Hell... she looks like a Kate Beckinsale/Cheryl Cole hybrid. O_o
Anyways, now I do not have to work for almost six weeks (due to lots of extra hours and some exams) and this means that I won´t see her except she calls me on monday and asks for a date, what she suggested but (probably) won´t pull through, or we party at the same club. Which probably will not happen either.... and who knows what happens in the following weeks.
Edit:
Just noticed the poll, I really do like this topic (obviously). It´s probably one of the best on TL and I don´t know why this should be closed. If theres too much off-topic just warn the users... or ban them. But I don´t think that you should close this whole thing.
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On June 27 2014 06:55 Cynry wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2014 06:43 Najda wrote:On June 27 2014 06:29 Cynry wrote:On June 27 2014 06:21 Najda wrote:
I'd be more inclined for stricter moderation on the thread rather than closing it. Maybe we could have some just dating thread moderators or a way to vote people off the thread idk Yeah that's why I put different options on the poll. But seriously, I agree, the one sided poll and the fact that it probably has no influence on mods was just a way to state how I, and seemingly many others, feel about this thread, especially the last pages. The 30 last pages. At least. The options are "yes" and "yes" unless you're seeing a different poll than I am seeing. forgot the /sarcasm I guess.
Haha sorry the way you talked about it made it sound like you had changed the poll and I was thinking maybe because I had already voted the options didn't change for me.
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On June 27 2014 07:05 JoeCool wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2014 07:49 sluggaslamoo wrote:On June 23 2014 02:41 JoeCool wrote:On June 20 2014 01:43 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:On June 20 2014 01:22 JoeCool wrote:On June 17 2014 06:52 JoeCool wrote:Thank you guys, never expected so much comments! On June 16 2014 20:22 quetzy wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:
...Deeds are better than words.
Uhh, you have a lot to learn about girls. I know it maybe shouldn't be this way, and it's changing slowly, but many girls still want the man to act/lead. They will do the word part, and often even without any actual words. It's up to you to act based on the signals you catch. Specific to your case, the very fact that she wanted to talk to you and explain makes her as direct as you can wish someone to be (already more than many others, men or women, are). Yes, it took her time, but she wanted to open up to you, and it was obviously not easy for her. Instead of appreciating it and being a, well, human being, I have to say you were acting rather butthurt with "there's nothing to talk about". Yes there is. Be happy you found a girl that actually wants to say how she feels! Just lighten up a bit, hear her out, and then see what you want to do. And good luck man! Edit: just read the whole history of you two... Sounds like she just panicked that time when you tried to kiss her. When you say you "terminated the contact", you probably did come across as angry to her (which was completely unnecessary btw). She probably spent the month between being happy that you like her, and angry at herself for possibly blowing it. It took some courage on her part to approach you, respect that. In any case, seems things are going well now so that's good (I would still ask her what she wanted to "explain", just in case there was something else on her mind) Thank you for your comment! The reason why I said that deeds are better than words is simple and you probably know it since you read the story. After she refused my dating suggestions two times and still sent me messages like "I´ve been thinking of you all day long" I felt like these were nothing but empty phrases... And when she "refused" to kiss me I sent her a message asking whether I was wrong about the whole situation and since she did not answer I felt like it would be the best thing to "move on". Maybe I came across angry but what else was I supposed to do? And yeah... it seems things are going well. On June 16 2014 21:22 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:
Joe, LET ME STOP YOU RIGHT THERE. Basically what you're doing at the moment is EXACTLY what you should be doing. You're sort of cold-shouldering her, and that is making her madly attracted to you. The second you start being very nice to her and doing the explaining and talking part, she probably gets scared of that she might have to commit and she will probably bail out. So even if you want more of her, want to fall in love and get married etc, HOLD OFF WITH "THE TALK". You want to gradually move to that territory, and not make her do a full emotional 180 since that is something that scares the shit out of her. Eventhough it might feel wrong for you, as if you're being an emotionally void asshole that is only leading her on, all you're doing is letting her safely get used to expanding the relationship. Take it easy but steadily. Be VERY careful of explanations and everything. If "it" happens, it happens anyway. And no amount of rational communication will help you when hormones should be doing the work. Yeah from my personal experience this leads to nothing. I did it once. From that point on that girl was still dating me for a couple of months including making out and such things. But she was... different? And as our "relationship" ended she told me exactly what you said. She was scared. On June 16 2014 23:59 r.Evo wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:On June 16 2014 07:53 Zooper31 wrote:On June 16 2014 07:14 Belisarius wrote:
[quote]
...you would be a lot less confused if you had actually let her tell you what was going on... that's not exactly rocket science. EXACTLY! Somehow she was interested in you in the past but couldn't act on it or wasn't prepared for it. Now she's still interested but now can handle things and wants more. Just ask her what she wanted to explain that one time and just move on and continue on with how things are going. The reason why I did not want to talk is pretty simple; If she is interested in me she could just kiss me, propose a date or do sth similar => Deeds are better than words. And if she is not interested in me (for whatever reason) there is no need to talk. I don´t need her to tell me that she´s still in love with her ex bf or sth like that. I´m not beeing a dick here but that´s just from my experience. The last part (continue on how things are going) sounds fine though, that is what I´m planning to do. I´ll give her a call this evening and ask her out for thursday. That´s a holiday here in Ger. If she refuses, I might ask what is/was wrong because then we´re basically at the same point like four weeks ago => Signs of interest and still too afraid to date/have sex. 1) It's your job to start a sexual relationship, it's her job to define it. Initiating a kiss or making a date happen are your jobs early on in the relationship. Man up, take responsibility. 2) Stop pretending that she's not interested. She clearly is, it's your job to take it to the next level. Take responsibility. 3) "If she refuses to date me I'll ask what's wrong" is a horrible frame of mind. You're basing your decision on her choices which, again, means you're trying to shove responsibility onto her. It's random pressure and drama that will get you nowhere. Have a life, don't base yours around hers. If she's afraid of something it's your job to handle it. Be empathetic. I appreciate your comment! 1) That´s what I did. All the time. I asked her out and I tried to kiss her. 2) Yeah right now it seems like she is but four weeks ago it was more like she was interested as long as I was far away but as soon as I came closer (dating & kissing) ... well the attraction was gone. 3) True! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I met her today for a couple of mins (at work) and asked her out for dinner on thursday, she agreed. So we´re going to have a dinner together. Mexican or Sushi ... I haven´t decided yet but I told her that I´ll contact her in the following days. We´ll see what happens. Thanks again for all the comments! Aaaaand she did not appear for our date. Like I said, on monday she agreed to have dinner with me on thursday. On tuesday I went to the restaurant and made a reservation for two persons; that´s what I also texted her on tuesday afternoon. On wednesday I wrote that I´ll pick her up at about 5.30 she just has to tell me where. Not a single response and about thirty mins ago I had to cancel the reservation. Since she did not respond until this morning I got a bad feeling and spent the whole day at a lake with some friends, still hoping she might call/text me. Well, now that I´m home and alone I´m kinda ... sad?! :-/ Unpleasant feeling. Ok if she ditched you, really you have the right to be pissed at her. Be angry with her and "let her go". She probably has reasons, but any decent person would just tell you in time why she couldnt make it. Yep I was/am angry with her. The next day (at work) she came to me, asked whether I´m pissed at her and said that she understands my anger. But also added that she did not agree 100% to my proposal. Which might be true but still she could´ve told me earlier that she has no time on thursday (or does not want to). I said that it doesn´t matter to which she replied that it does. Well ... since I did not talk to her - besides the usual stuff from work - she left after a couple of mins. During my break on saturday she came to me and started touching me again (also under my shirt). This was reasons enough for me to ask wtf this whole thing was/is about. I told her that she should make up her mind. And asked why she rejects my proposals although she seemingly wants me. What followed were the usual phrases; "I don´t think that this will work out because you are a student..., I don´t want a relationship right now..., ...," Again I told her to make up her mind, if she wants me she should get her shit together. And if she does not then theres no more touching/hugging/kissing. Ever. According to her this would be - and I qutote - "[...]almost impossible[...]" for her, so she would like to give "it" - "it" in this case is an affair where we meet here and there - a try. Although she mentioned that she is scared if one of us wants more or this won´t work out and such things ... basically because here and there we work together (until Februrary). Then I made the mistake to respond to her kisses and so we made out ... a little. Now comes the kicker: Suddenly she opened my belt and wanted to give me a BJ, in my "office". I stopped her since I felt that this was going too far and there was lots of stuff going on in my store. But man I´m (still) confused. O_o She stayed a little longer and told me that she´ll ask me out - no she won´t - next monday. Four hours later she asked me via sms what I´m doing and sent me a picture of herself. On June 20 2014 05:23 r.Evo wrote:On June 20 2014 01:22 JoeCool wrote:On June 17 2014 06:52 JoeCool wrote:Thank you guys, never expected so much comments! On June 16 2014 20:22 quetzy wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:
...Deeds are better than words.
Uhh, you have a lot to learn about girls. I know it maybe shouldn't be this way, and it's changing slowly, but many girls still want the man to act/lead. They will do the word part, and often even without any actual words. It's up to you to act based on the signals you catch. Specific to your case, the very fact that she wanted to talk to you and explain makes her as direct as you can wish someone to be (already more than many others, men or women, are). Yes, it took her time, but she wanted to open up to you, and it was obviously not easy for her. Instead of appreciating it and being a, well, human being, I have to say you were acting rather butthurt with "there's nothing to talk about". Yes there is. Be happy you found a girl that actually wants to say how she feels! Just lighten up a bit, hear her out, and then see what you want to do. And good luck man! Edit: just read the whole history of you two... Sounds like she just panicked that time when you tried to kiss her. When you say you "terminated the contact", you probably did come across as angry to her (which was completely unnecessary btw). She probably spent the month between being happy that you like her, and angry at herself for possibly blowing it. It took some courage on her part to approach you, respect that. In any case, seems things are going well now so that's good (I would still ask her what she wanted to "explain", just in case there was something else on her mind) Thank you for your comment! The reason why I said that deeds are better than words is simple and you probably know it since you read the story. After she refused my dating suggestions two times and still sent me messages like "I´ve been thinking of you all day long" I felt like these were nothing but empty phrases... And when she "refused" to kiss me I sent her a message asking whether I was wrong about the whole situation and since she did not answer I felt like it would be the best thing to "move on". Maybe I came across angry but what else was I supposed to do? And yeah... it seems things are going well. On June 16 2014 21:22 Slayers_Red.Cracker wrote:
Joe, LET ME STOP YOU RIGHT THERE. Basically what you're doing at the moment is EXACTLY what you should be doing. You're sort of cold-shouldering her, and that is making her madly attracted to you. The second you start being very nice to her and doing the explaining and talking part, she probably gets scared of that she might have to commit and she will probably bail out. So even if you want more of her, want to fall in love and get married etc, HOLD OFF WITH "THE TALK". You want to gradually move to that territory, and not make her do a full emotional 180 since that is something that scares the shit out of her. Eventhough it might feel wrong for you, as if you're being an emotionally void asshole that is only leading her on, all you're doing is letting her safely get used to expanding the relationship. Take it easy but steadily. Be VERY careful of explanations and everything. If "it" happens, it happens anyway. And no amount of rational communication will help you when hormones should be doing the work. Yeah from my personal experience this leads to nothing. I did it once. From that point on that girl was still dating me for a couple of months including making out and such things. But she was... different? And as our "relationship" ended she told me exactly what you said. She was scared. On June 16 2014 23:59 r.Evo wrote:On June 16 2014 16:12 JoeCool wrote:On June 16 2014 07:53 Zooper31 wrote:On June 16 2014 07:14 Belisarius wrote:
[quote]
...you would be a lot less confused if you had actually let her tell you what was going on... that's not exactly rocket science. EXACTLY! Somehow she was interested in you in the past but couldn't act on it or wasn't prepared for it. Now she's still interested but now can handle things and wants more. Just ask her what she wanted to explain that one time and just move on and continue on with how things are going. The reason why I did not want to talk is pretty simple; If she is interested in me she could just kiss me, propose a date or do sth similar => Deeds are better than words. And if she is not interested in me (for whatever reason) there is no need to talk. I don´t need her to tell me that she´s still in love with her ex bf or sth like that. I´m not beeing a dick here but that´s just from my experience. The last part (continue on how things are going) sounds fine though, that is what I´m planning to do. I´ll give her a call this evening and ask her out for thursday. That´s a holiday here in Ger. If she refuses, I might ask what is/was wrong because then we´re basically at the same point like four weeks ago => Signs of interest and still too afraid to date/have sex. 1) It's your job to start a sexual relationship, it's her job to define it. Initiating a kiss or making a date happen are your jobs early on in the relationship. Man up, take responsibility. 2) Stop pretending that she's not interested. She clearly is, it's your job to take it to the next level. Take responsibility. 3) "If she refuses to date me I'll ask what's wrong" is a horrible frame of mind. You're basing your decision on her choices which, again, means you're trying to shove responsibility onto her. It's random pressure and drama that will get you nowhere. Have a life, don't base yours around hers. If she's afraid of something it's your job to handle it. Be empathetic. I appreciate your comment! 1) That´s what I did. All the time. I asked her out and I tried to kiss her. 2) Yeah right now it seems like she is but four weeks ago it was more like she was interested as long as I was far away but as soon as I came closer (dating & kissing) ... well the attraction was gone. 3) True! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I met her today for a couple of mins (at work) and asked her out for dinner on thursday, she agreed. So we´re going to have a dinner together. Mexican or Sushi ... I haven´t decided yet but I told her that I´ll contact her in the following days. We´ll see what happens. Thanks again for all the comments! Aaaaand she did not appear for our date. Like I said, on monday she agreed to have dinner with me on thursday. On tuesday I went to the restaurant and made a reservation for two persons; that´s what I also texted her on tuesday afternoon. On wednesday I wrote that I´ll pick her up at about 5.30 she just has to tell me where. Not a single response and about thirty mins ago I had to cancel the reservation. Since she did not respond until this morning I got a bad feeling and spent the whole day at a lake with some friends, still hoping she might call/text me. Well, now that I´m home and alone I´m kinda ... sad?! :-/ Unpleasant feeling. Edit: 8.50 pm Received a message "Sorry ... have been to france with my parents all day long, just came back. What are you doing?" Next. In an ideal world you'd have a buddy, female buddy or woman you're interested in (from worst to best obv) that you can call an hour or two before your reservation and ask if they want to go out to dinner that evening. That also allows for the good ol' "Oh, I had an awesome dinner with xyz, what did you do?" which is pretty much the only way to bounce back these kind of things easily. Yeah that would have been an option... you´re right! Like I said I spent the whole day at a lake with a couple of friends which was also fine for me. Besides; public viewing is a great opportunity to meet new people. There was a huge event yesterday evening when germany was playing, since no one but me wanted to go there I went there alone, met a buddy from my lectures and he introduced me to a couple of other guys/gals. I missed the opportunity to get to know one of the girls better, she was smiling towards me couple of times, but I guess that we´ll meet again on thursday for the match between Ger and USA. Still it has been a great evening. Yeah basically it just seems like she has no boundaries, she's always looking for a cheap thrill and her decisions are completely based on her emotions. With these kinds of girls its best not to actually plan anything and just go with the flow. There's nothing to be confused about except for the fact that it doesn't make logical sense, there's a saying, you cannot fix something with logic that wasn't put there by logic in the first place. The guys she blows off are the ones that do get affected, they start worrying and getting needy, its like a really powerful instinctive test that she doesn't even realise she's doing. If anything she's looking for someone with very strong boundaries (the opposite of her), but this is really easy to fuck up when you think about it too much. You've done alright so far in this department anywho. e.g this. This was reasons enough for me to ask wtf this whole thing was/is about. I told her that she should make up her mind.
Again I told her to make up her mind, if she wants me she should get her shit together. And if she does not then theres no more touching/hugging/kissing. This is boundary setting, I think she likes it and it plays into her whole fantasy. What followed were the usual phrases; "I don´t think that this will work out because you are a student..., I don´t want a relationship right now..., ...,"
and I qutote - "[...]almost impossible[...]" for her, so she would like to give "it" - "it" in this case is an affair where we meet here and there - a try. Although she mentioned that she is scared if one of us wants more or this won´t work out and such things ... basically because here and there we work together (until Februrary). Speaking of fantasies that's basically what is going on here, the anxiety of getting with someone she shouldn't be with seems to turn her on. Telling her that "this isn't right" and that she shouldn't be doing it is exactly what is causing her to want to do it. She wants you to set a boundary and then she wants to break it as if she were defying her parents. Seems like an open and shut case to me. Being your type don't expect to be in any proper relationship with her. Don't expect her to come to any sort of date or anything like that, she will just abandon it at the drop of a hat. If you don't like playing games its best to go with someone who also doesn't like to screw around like this, its really a game, a dumb game if you ask me, but... sex... There are girls that aren't into this kind of stuff and make more sense. If you want to get into a relationship it would be better to find someone that doesn't fuck with you. Thanks, this analysis seems to be pretty much spot-on! The worst thing about this whole situation is not that she´s playing this "game". And it´s not because she refused to date me. No, the worst thing is that I´m feeling that I´ve could done better. I´ve got the feeling that I made a couple of mistakes that led to this situation. Maybe I was too needy when I asked her out, maybe I should have had sex with her early on, maybe I should never had this "talk" with her, maybe I was too much of a nice guy ... and so on and so on.
Embrace it. It's exactly that feeling that will enable you to be a little bit better with the next person you meet. And the next. And so on until you end up needed all that experience in a situation you never expected to need it in and find someone totally awesome.
Since we're all on a gaming forum, we all know the guys who "did everything right" yet they've lost a match or they can't climb out of Bronze/Elo hell. People with such an attitude improve at incredibly slow rates compared to people who constantly scan for mistakes, become aware of them and try and work on them at a conscious level the next time.
Keep it up!
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On June 27 2014 03:55 Plansix wrote:
What movie did you watch? He ends up happily married for years. His terrible, yet charming plan works out once he finds a woman that is willing to put up with him. Which is the real moral of this story.
Alicia Lopez-Harrison de Lardé married him. She was portrayed by Jennifer Conelly in the movie. The scene you are referring stars Amy Walz as the blond girl in the bar.
So no his plan didn't work out because he didn't manage to get with her.
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I feel that a big problem with this thread is that a lot of the discussion conflates "dating advice" and "how to get physically intimate". I really wish the two could be separated better - while sex is nice and can be a big part of a relationship, it does not have to be the main focus of the entire thing. There is, I think, a somewhat unfounded assumption that a relationship or date is not "real" without physical intimacy.
Most of the silliness seems to stem from this. The view also ignores that in much more conservative communities where physical intimacy is frowned upon or religiously prohibited, people still fall in love and get into relationships. Just skim the past 100 posts or so: so much of it is centred around sex.
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On June 27 2014 13:10 levelping wrote:
I feel that a big problem with this thread is that a lot of the discussion conflates "dating advice" and "how to get physically intimate". I really wish the two could be separated better - while sex is nice and can be a big part of a relationship, it does not have to be the main focus of the entire thing. There is, I think, a somewhat unfounded assumption that a relationship or date is not "real" without physical intimacy.
Most of the silliness seems to stem from this. The view also ignores that in much more conservative communities where physical intimacy is frowned upon or religiously prohibited, people still fall in love and get into relationships. Just skim the past 100 posts or so: so much of it is centred around sex.
Technically you have three basic components to any form of relationship. It comes down to an emotional, intellectual and sexual connection. The main issue here is that people who have issues intellectually connecting to someone are incredibly rare because it seems the vast majority of adults have figured out that common interests and opinions are something desirable in a partner and we are easily capable of screening and evaluating how someone deals with someone else on that level.
Keeping that out of the equation most issues can be condensed to either having trouble connecting emotionally to someone else or sexually (rarely both). So now you either have someone who has no problem dealing with the other sex as long as he isn't attracted to them, can from great friendships with women but feels incapable of creating some form of "spark" let alone be able to seduce them physically, or you have someone who is competent at getting women into bed but seemingly can't keep them around for more than a week or two let alone build an actual relationship.
From my experience with helping out people there are a LOT more guys who have trouble connecting sexually who'd like to improve that area of their lives than guys who have trouble connecting emotionally and would like to improve in that area.
There is, I think, a somewhat unfounded assumption that a relationship or date is not "real" without physical intimacy.
The thing is that it's not "real" in the sense that we have specific names for it. If someone aims for a non-sexual relationship we call it friendship, if someone aims for an exclusive sexual relationship we call it a looking for a hookup or affair. Sure, both are valid forms of a relationship but they're not what the vast majority of people think about when they use the word. Even in the conservative communities you're mentioning it is very, very rare that someone looks for a non-sexual romantic relationship. Saying "I don't want to have sex before marriage" is NOT equivalent to saying "I want a relationship with someone I wouldn't want to have sex with in the future".
tl;dr: Most guys posting their stories or asking for advice here have issues with the physical portion of forming a relationship so it ends up being the most discussed topic.
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EPT
