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All racist comments will result in a ban. Think well before posting. |
On September 28 2011 20:45 n00b3rt wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:39 The KY wrote:
Ok fuck this thread too many people either concerned with the minimal difference between race and ethnicity (seriously who gives a fuck) or busy telling me what I do and do not know.
/caring. you just trolled a thread with your abysmal stupidity and all you can say is /caring ??? The difference is not minimal, there's actually nothing in common. There was even a movement in France, 60-70 years ago, when people whose blood was not gypsy wanted to live "a life closer to nature's, closer to gypsies' way". Even though this movement seems to have disappeared, if it hadn't we'd be against it too, because it's gypsy culture.
I have posted with nothing but politeness and said nothing that I do not think to be true. I was merely pointing out that whether you want to call it racism or not, it is unimportant. I'll leave it to hypercube who said it much much better than me.
On September 28 2011 20:31 hypercube wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What if you start to assume that people share those cultural characteristics because they share the racial features? FWIW, there are people who will claim that gypsies are genetically predisposed towards criminal or antisocial behaviour. But many will say that because they feel blaming it on culture is PC. In the end it's not really an opinion just something they will say because they feel gypsies "deserve" it. Which is why the whole racism debate is unhelpful. It is what is: prejudice based on experience generalized to most or all members of the group who share the same appearance. Whether you think it should be called racism or not shouldn't change your moral judgement of the sort of behaviour.
As for people wanting to live like gypsies, because Roma gypsies are recognised under the Race Relations Act (once again, in my country), those people would not be gypsies. They would just be hippies in caravans. Travellers.
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Fenrax
United States5018 Posts
We in Germany have a much better strategy for the Roma plague that everyone can learn from. We pay them welfare, don't persecute their crimes, don't force their kids to go school and call everyone a Nazi who questions that strategy.
User was temp banned for this post.
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Bigpet, its not inflated. Thats the reality we live in.
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On September 28 2011 20:53 Fenrax wrote:
We in Germany have a much better strategy for the Roma plague that everyone can learn from. We pay them welfare, don't persecute their crimes, don't force their kids to go school and call everyone a Nazi who questions that strategy.
hmm i guess all of europe must have copied your "Special tactics"
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On September 28 2011 20:40 Thorakh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:31 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What if you start to assume that people share those cultural characteristics because they share the racial features? FWIW, there are people who will claim that gypsies are genetically predisposed towards criminal or antisocial behaviour. But many will say that because they feel blaming it on culture is PC. In the end it's not really an opinion just something they will say because they feel gypsies "deserve" it. Which is why the whole racism debate is unhelpful. It is what is: prejudice based on experience generalized to most or all members of the group who share the same appearance. Whether you think it should be called racism or not shouldn't change your moral judgement of the sort of behaviour. I haven't seen anyone other than Cloud say that because someone is gypsy that person is scum. People who assume every Romani person is scum are stupid. Just like people who assume every black person steals are stupid.
You should read more carefully because there was a person who said just that. And a few who seem to be thinking along those lines.
And yes, people are stupid. My favourite is when a gypsy (by appearance) gets refused work because apparently they steal and don't like to work. Yeah, the guy who doesn't want to work showed up for an interview. I wonder what he's up to. Maybe he got tired leeching off the state and wants to find a poor employer instead.
I feel this is a very big problem in the western world. As soon as someone even suggests that a particular culture might not mingle well into society it's like all the leftwing activists jump from behind the trees and start screaming RACIST RACIST NAZIS RACIST NAZIS. It's disgusting really. Unless you're attributing character traits to a race instead of a culture, IT'S NOT RACIST.
As I said you should actually read what people write instead of skimming a few words and assuming they fit one of the few stereotypes you have.
For the record I didn't say it was racism. I said that if you're over-generalizing (as a lot of people do) it doesn't matter.
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On September 28 2011 20:46 The KY wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:43 hgt1002 wrote:On September 28 2011 20:39 The KY wrote:
Ok fuck this thread too many people either concerned with the minimal difference between race and ethnicity (seriously who gives a fuck) or busy telling me what I do and do not know.
/caring. "Gypsy is not synonymous with criminal" well yes it is, since the ancient greek word have the meaning "opposer of law". up to this day, they not just referred by others, but also referring to themselves with the same word. you certainly cared enough to show us how uninformed you are. however upon your request ill let you make a clown out of yourself and stop correcting. here you go.... "The English term Gypsy (or Gipsy) originates from the Greek word for "Egyptian" You sure told me. But yeah man I've made a huge clown of myself, by relating my impression of gypsy people based on personal experience.
so show the greek word pls. =))))))
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On September 28 2011 20:40 Thorakh wrote:
And besides, I've never even seen gypsies as an ethnic group or race. The translation of gypsy would be zigeuner in Dutch and that simply means someone living a nomadic life. The correct ethnical term would be Romani (as far as I know). When people refer to gypsies they mean the Romani people practicing the gypsy culture.
I'm sorry, but if you think only Roma who live a travelling lifestyle face prejudice you are simply uninformed.
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On September 28 2011 20:55 hgt1002 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:46 The KY wrote:On September 28 2011 20:43 hgt1002 wrote:On September 28 2011 20:39 The KY wrote:
Ok fuck this thread too many people either concerned with the minimal difference between race and ethnicity (seriously who gives a fuck) or busy telling me what I do and do not know.
/caring. "Gypsy is not synonymous with criminal" well yes it is, since the ancient greek word have the meaning "opposer of law". up to this day, they not just referred by others, but also referring to themselves with the same word. you certainly cared enough to show us how uninformed you are. however upon your request ill let you make a clown out of yourself and stop correcting. here you go.... "The English term Gypsy (or Gipsy) originates from the Greek word for "Egyptian" You sure told me. But yeah man I've made a huge clown of myself, by relating my impression of gypsy people based on personal experience. so show the greek word pls. =))))))
Αιγύπτιοι (Aigyptioi, whence modern Greek γύφτοι gifti)
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On September 28 2011 20:55 hgt1002 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:46 The KY wrote:On September 28 2011 20:43 hgt1002 wrote:On September 28 2011 20:39 The KY wrote:
Ok fuck this thread too many people either concerned with the minimal difference between race and ethnicity (seriously who gives a fuck) or busy telling me what I do and do not know.
/caring. "Gypsy is not synonymous with criminal" well yes it is, since the ancient greek word have the meaning "opposer of law". up to this day, they not just referred by others, but also referring to themselves with the same word. you certainly cared enough to show us how uninformed you are. however upon your request ill let you make a clown out of yourself and stop correcting. here you go.... "The English term Gypsy (or Gipsy) originates from the Greek word for "Egyptian" You sure told me. But yeah man I've made a huge clown of myself, by relating my impression of gypsy people based on personal experience. so show the greek word pls. =))))))
+ Show Spoiler +http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/gypsy Etymology
From Middle English Gypcyan, Old French gyptien (“Egyptian, gypsy”), from Latin Aegyptius, because it was wrongly believed that dark-skinned Gypsies came from Egypt. See Egyptian. Then: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/EgyptEtymology
From Middle French Egypte, from Latin Ægyptus, from Ancient Greek Αἴγυπτος (Aígyptos), from Mycenaean Greek *aikupitos (nb. 𐁁𐀓𐀠𐀴𐀍 (aikupitijo) 'Egyptian'), from Late Egyptian Hikuptah 'Memphis', from Middle Egyptian ḥȝ.t kȝ ptḥ (Ḥaʔat-Kuʔ-Patāḥa), literally, 'The Temple of the Soul of Ptah', initially referring to Ptah's temple in the city of Memphis, a capital during the Middle Kingdom.
ninja'd by KY
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On September 28 2011 21:03 The KY wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:55 hgt1002 wrote:On September 28 2011 20:46 The KY wrote:On September 28 2011 20:43 hgt1002 wrote:On September 28 2011 20:39 The KY wrote:
Ok fuck this thread too many people either concerned with the minimal difference between race and ethnicity (seriously who gives a fuck) or busy telling me what I do and do not know.
/caring. "Gypsy is not synonymous with criminal" well yes it is, since the ancient greek word have the meaning "opposer of law". up to this day, they not just referred by others, but also referring to themselves with the same word. you certainly cared enough to show us how uninformed you are. however upon your request ill let you make a clown out of yourself and stop correcting. here you go.... "The English term Gypsy (or Gipsy) originates from the Greek word for "Egyptian" You sure told me. But yeah man I've made a huge clown of myself, by relating my impression of gypsy people based on personal experience. so show the greek word pls. =)))))) Αιγύπτιοι (Aigyptioi, whence modern Greek γύφτοι gifti)
ατσιγανος (atsiganos). do the two words look the same for u?
"cigany", the word romani people refer to themselves comes from the greek word ατσιγανος (atsiganos). it translates forward to english as "gypsy", but for example in england irish travellers are also called to gypsys, however they are not cigany. as cigany is a cultural aspect of roma people.
no one talked about where the "gypsy" word comes from, as they dont refer themselves to "gypsy", "egyptian" or whatever. they say "cigany".
please continue....
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On September 28 2011 20:55 hypercube wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:40 Thorakh wrote:On September 28 2011 20:31 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What if you start to assume that people share those cultural characteristics because they share the racial features? FWIW, there are people who will claim that gypsies are genetically predisposed towards criminal or antisocial behaviour. But many will say that because they feel blaming it on culture is PC. In the end it's not really an opinion just something they will say because they feel gypsies "deserve" it. Which is why the whole racism debate is unhelpful. It is what is: prejudice based on experience generalized to most or all members of the group who share the same appearance. Whether you think it should be called racism or not shouldn't change your moral judgement of the sort of behaviour. I haven't seen anyone other than Cloud say that because someone is gypsy that person is scum. People who assume every Romani person is scum are stupid. Just like people who assume every black person steals are stupid. You should read more carefully because there was a person who said just that. And a few who seem to be thinking along those lines. And yes, people are stupid. My favourite is when a gypsy (by appearance) gets refused work because apparently they steal and don't like to work. Yeah, the guy who doesn't want to work showed up for an interview. I wonder what he's up to. Maybe he got tired leeching off the state and wants to find a poor employer instead. My point is that just because some people are racists shouldn't mean we should all abstain from discussing bad cultures.
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On September 28 2011 19:05 Boblion wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 18:49 dakalro wrote:On September 28 2011 11:39 discodancer wrote:On September 28 2011 11:22 decemberTV wrote:
Again, someone who has no idea about the issue and thinks its the same thing as minorities in the US. You are so naive and i don't care if you say you come from eastern europe you still don't know what you're talking about. The issue is completely different as eastern european governments are NOT the same as in the US and they actually rarely resolve these problems. Which is why the bulgarians rioted in the first place and is why this thread is here.
And its not just the Bulgarian government; the french PRESIDENT SARKOZY DEPORTED GIPSIES FROM FRANCE BACK TO ROMANIA AND BULGARIA. Does anyone actually understand what this means ? Its not just the european governments that can't deal with the situation but also the western governments. Yeah I have no idea about Eastern Europe even though I lived there for 19 years before moving to the US. Stop with this garbage talk please, people are not as dumb as you think. I lived in a district full of gypsies and went to school with at least 3 of them. In 6th grade they couldn't read for shit but that's not the point, is it? I saw just as many local white majority kids selling stolen cellphones and getting shitfaced and hustling people for money. Don't exaggerate because someone like me will always call you out on your bullshit. End of story. And yeah, Sarkozy deported gypsies back to where they came from because they crossed the border illegally and if it was an illegal Bulgarian he would have been deported exactly the same way. Not because he is Bulgarian. There is no illegal border crossing anymore dude. France has no limitations on bulgarians/romanians going there for various purposes. Get a grip. They just got deported for being gypsies. At the current time there simply is no solution outside of forging each and every family to let their children get an education. And there just isn't enough police to force all of them. Romania and Bulgaria are not members of the Schengen Agreement. Just sayin'
Schengen agreement relates mostly to merchandise transport and the external border of the EU. The moment a person enters Schengen space they will not be checked at borders anymore, no matter where he is from (been there, done that like 12 years ago during a trip through Europe). If you were from Turkey and you'd fly to Schengen via Romania you'd be checked both in RO and destination. If Romania was in Schengen then you'd only be checked in Romania. The only thing they check when I go on business trips anywhere in the EU is my ID, versus the long line for non-EU citizens.
For a EU citizen there isn't much difference between Schengen or not, for businesses there is.
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On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism.
What a joke.
So if I say, for example, that I hate Britons, for whatever reason, say because they are liars and thieves and pedophiles, I can then pretend that I am not a racist because it's not genetic, it's their culture I dislike? Sounds less convincing nuh?
It's as dishonest as the people who say that Muslims are the root of all evil in Europe, that they are lazy, they want to invade us, and they are liars etc etc... and then say "Oh we are not racists, it's against Islam and Islamic culture, not against the race".
Hating a culture and its people is racism. Like it or not. If someone says that Jews are greedy and liars and that they want to dominate the world, but then say "oh, but it's about Jewish culture, not the race", he is just as antisemitic than someone who hate them on racist theoretical basis. Any kind of hatred towards human group for things they were born with is equally unacceptable, whether it's culture, religion, race, handicap or sex.
Now, I know Gypsy musicians who are among the best I have met in my life, play with an incredible virtuosity music from the culture so many people hate without having a clue about; and thinking about them while reading that thread makes me very very sad. It's because of people's attitude and hatred that Gypsies have no chance to integrate, to get a job or to live a honest life.
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On September 28 2011 21:12 Biff The Understudy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What a joke. So if I say, for example, that I hate Britons, for whatever reason, say because they are liars and thieves and pedophiles, I can then pretend that I am not a racist because it's not genetic, it's their culture I dislike? Sounds less convincing nuh? It's as dishonest as the people who say that Muslims are the root of all evil in Europe, that they are lazy, they want to invade us, and they are liars etc etc... and then say "Oh we are not racists, it's against Islam and Islamic culture, not against the race". Hating a culture and its people is racism. Like it or not. If someone says that Jews are greedy and liars and that they want to dominate the world, but then say "oh, but it's about Jewish culture, not the race", he is just as antisemitic than someone who hate them on racist theoretical basis. Any kind of hatred towards human group for things they were born with is equally unacceptable, whether it's culture, religion, race, handicap or sex. Now, I know Gypsy musicians who are among the best I have met in my life, play with an incredible virtuosity music from the culture so many people hate without having a clue about; and thinking about them while reading that thread makes me very very sad. It's because of people's attitude and hatred that Gypsies have no chance to integrate, to get a job or to live a honest life.
If the culture of Bretons is to lie, steal and rape and you hate them, because of that, its not a racism, but just a normal human reaction.
I`ve dealt with gypsies whole my life and its in their culture to commit crimes, no matter that they can make nice music.
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talking about roma musicians on this issue is just as clueless as you could get. musicians is a distinct class of romani people being admired by everyone for their skills and honest living. yes there is traditional musician romani families, i think noone have problem with them. the problem is the gypsy way of life what unfortunately most romani people practices...
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Hating a culture and its people is racism. Like it or not. If someone says that Jews are greedy and liars and that they want to dominate the world, but then say "oh, but it's about Jewish culture, not the race", he is just as antisemitic than someone who hate them on racist theoretical basis. Any kind of hatred towards human group for things they were born with is equally unacceptable, whether it's culture, religion, race, handicap or sex. But if Jews ARE greedy and liars then that is a valid reason to label their culture as bad. If gypsy culture means stealing, begging and other kinds of shady things that means gypsy culture is bad. There is NOTHING racist about that. It becomes racist when you discriminate against functioning Roma people. And just so you know, you aren't born with a culture, you are born in a culture. You can change your culture but not your skin color. Therefore hatred against a culture is perfectly acceptable if the reasons for it are valid.
Now, I know Gypsy musicians who are among the best I have met in my life, play with an incredible virtuosity music from the culture so many people hate without having a clue about; and thinking about them while reading that thread makes me very very sad. It's because of people's attitude and hatred that Gypsies have no chance to integrate, to get a job or to live a honest life. According to all the Eastern Europeans gypsies are being given a chance but they don't take it. And besides, of course there are Roma people who are great human beings. That's why it's not racism, but hate against a culture (which may or may not be justified, but judging from the responses of Eastern Europeans it seems justified).
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On September 28 2011 21:10 Thorakh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 20:55 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:40 Thorakh wrote:On September 28 2011 20:31 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What if you start to assume that people share those cultural characteristics because they share the racial features? FWIW, there are people who will claim that gypsies are genetically predisposed towards criminal or antisocial behaviour. But many will say that because they feel blaming it on culture is PC. In the end it's not really an opinion just something they will say because they feel gypsies "deserve" it. Which is why the whole racism debate is unhelpful. It is what is: prejudice based on experience generalized to most or all members of the group who share the same appearance. Whether you think it should be called racism or not shouldn't change your moral judgement of the sort of behaviour. I haven't seen anyone other than Cloud say that because someone is gypsy that person is scum. People who assume every Romani person is scum are stupid. Just like people who assume every black person steals are stupid. You should read more carefully because there was a person who said just that. And a few who seem to be thinking along those lines. And yes, people are stupid. My favourite is when a gypsy (by appearance) gets refused work because apparently they steal and don't like to work. Yeah, the guy who doesn't want to work showed up for an interview. I wonder what he's up to. Maybe he got tired leeching off the state and wants to find a poor employer instead. My point is that just because some people are racists shouldn't mean we should all abstain from discussing bad cultures.
And my point is that this has nothing to do with my post.
If it wasn't intended to be you might want to make that clear next time, or I might get confused again.
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On September 28 2011 20:09 kinray wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I am astonished how little most of the US/Canada citizens here think they understand the problem and why while it IS racist it's nothing like the racism you have.
The current problem is about an organized crime boss being untouchable for years and years because he can make his minions vote for any politic for something like 5 euro per person (the actual voter get about 1-2 euro). And those people are used last 20 years by any party. So this crime boss (well actually some of his people) killed 19 year boy who was trying to voice that they are criminals. And the riots actually started after said crime boss went on TV saying that if anyone else want to accuse him the same fate will follow.
I just wish to hear how this will be normal to happen in USA for example if said crime boss was black?
The bigger portion of this topic is about racism against gypsies in Bulgaria. First I will just state some facts:
1. It's norm for gypsy girls to marry at 12 and start having babies as soon as they can without stopping for as long as they can. Why is that? Here in Bulgaria for every child you get some money (i guess like in most countries) and if you have more children you get more money for every child you have untill it reach 18 years. So basically you get about 100 euro per month per child for 18 years. It does not matter if you have your own.
I guess you can make the math by yourself? While your mother gets money for you, you get money for your own child....
And for reference minimal wage here is 120 euro.
2. There are countless programs that offer free education and food for gypsy children. The government even pay them to send their children to school. What happens? As soon the money are in their hand children stop attending school and start stealing/begging/drug dealing... And this goes on every year.
Those are some of the problems in big cities.
I will give some examples what happens in villages or small towns:
A mob of gypsies enters someones land. They take everything and when the person try to resist they beat him. After a few of those in one village old man (he is like 70 years old) shoot and killed the gypsy teenager who was stealing his sheep. This man was sued for murder because the boy was "returning" the sheep that was fled...
In another incident an old man was killed by gypsy teenager who was stealing from his yard. The boy was found and released because he was self defending for the old man inside the old man's yard....
And the list goes on and on...
So you will ask how can this problem be fixed? It's easy. It was done by the communists. What they do was basically that: you are gypsy and believe you should be able to do whatever you want? FUCK YOU! YOU ARE COMMUNIST NOW AND WILL DO WHAT THE PARTY SAY! + Show Spoiler +
Is it the right thing to do with people? Hell no. Is it the only working solution known so far for gypsy? Hell yes.
P.S. And something else i forgot to mention. Every Bulgarian citizen should pay for electricity/water/public transport BUT the gypsy does not. Why? Because when the companies try to stop water/electricity somewhere mobs of gypsies gather in basically every major city, some gypsy leaders start chanting that they are being looked like second hand people and the government makes exeption and let them have whatever was stopped being promissed that they will pay "later".
So excuse me for being racist but when i am treated like an idiot that will pay everything for someone and i can't say no i will hate him.
I think this is a fundamentally important fact and needs more discussion--it's basically a demonstration that gypsies can indeed function in a society when the proper social incentives are provided and the rule of law is enforced.
In the soviet era gypsies were much more integrated than they are now, petty crime and illiteracy still existed but were nowhere endemic as they are now, most of them had jobs and families generally had less than four children. That's not to say that the social structure was any good, but can be used as an argument that not allowing them to form a parallel society does lead to better outcome to everyone involved, most of all the average gypsy themselves.
Still, I as I said in my previous post, this misunderstanding of multiculturalism is not the main cause of current situation. But adhering to the hypocritically "politically-correct" way of speaking and hesitating to enforce the rule of law in fear of being labeled "racist", the political elites of Europe (and Bulgaria in particular) have given rise to the far-right extremists, which in itself is a much more dangerous problem.
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On September 28 2011 21:23 hypercube wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 21:10 Thorakh wrote:On September 28 2011 20:55 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:40 Thorakh wrote:On September 28 2011 20:31 hypercube wrote:On September 28 2011 20:15 KwarK wrote:On September 28 2011 20:10 Keldrath wrote:
saying you dont like their culture and stuff is fine, but when you use blanket statements like all gypsies are bad is when you become a racist biggot. No because it's not the race being hated on, it's a culture. Disliking a cultural trait that is shared by a racial group is not racism. What if you start to assume that people share those cultural characteristics because they share the racial features? FWIW, there are people who will claim that gypsies are genetically predisposed towards criminal or antisocial behaviour. But many will say that because they feel blaming it on culture is PC. In the end it's not really an opinion just something they will say because they feel gypsies "deserve" it. Which is why the whole racism debate is unhelpful. It is what is: prejudice based on experience generalized to most or all members of the group who share the same appearance. Whether you think it should be called racism or not shouldn't change your moral judgement of the sort of behaviour. I haven't seen anyone other than Cloud say that because someone is gypsy that person is scum. People who assume every Romani person is scum are stupid. Just like people who assume every black person steals are stupid. You should read more carefully because there was a person who said just that. And a few who seem to be thinking along those lines. And yes, people are stupid. My favourite is when a gypsy (by appearance) gets refused work because apparently they steal and don't like to work. Yeah, the guy who doesn't want to work showed up for an interview. I wonder what he's up to. Maybe he got tired leeching off the state and wants to find a poor employer instead. My point is that just because some people are racists shouldn't mean we should all abstain from discussing bad cultures. And my point is that this has nothing to do with my post. If it wasn't intended to be you might want to make that clear next time, or I might get confused again. Then what was your point? I've read your post multiple times but I can't seem to figure it out.
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I'm sorry for all the USians ranting about comparisons between this and blacks treatment. I'm sorry because at no point in my life have I ever considered or thought about someone of a different skin color as being inferior. Unlike your culture it's not a matter that stemmed from the gypsies being considered an inferior race.
There is nothing that you could say or show me that will make me change my mind about the fact that currently the gypsy culture is an outsider culture, with no nationality traits, a world of their own. That most consider doing anything in their power to survive as right. Be it abusing their children, stealing, killing. Their clans are the one ruler and there's nothing wrong with breaking the rules of the current society they live in.
To this I add that I have always given everyone the benefit of the doubt. I managed to get along just fine with plenty of people and wouldn't discriminate one person. But unfortunately gypsies are the ones that broke my trust more than any other (them being a minority you see that there's a discrepancy here). Call me naive but I still don't want to judge everyone by experience.
The oddest thing though. Why do muslims manage to integrate romanian society so well and gypsies don't. Yet you seem to have so many issues with them in the civilized west.
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EPT
