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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On May 08 2013 17:14 -Archangel- wrote: Spirit of D&D is party based gameplay and roleplaying, which this game has neither. So all those Hack & Slash Dungeon Crawler groups with basically no RP are not in the spirit of D&D ? The spirit of D&D is one thing: Have fun with your friends (or random strangers you meet at cons) with this rough ruleset. And this game is offering exactly this. | ||
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On May 08 2013 18:06 Zocat wrote: So all those Hack & Slash Dungeon Crawler groups with basically no RP are not in the spirit of D&D ? The spirit of D&D is one thing: Have fun with your friends (or random strangers you meet at cons) with this rough ruleset. And this game is offering exactly this. Not really. Not since 2nd edition. 4e tried to bring back the 1st edition spirit of D&D by removing ROLEplaying options and introducing more ROLLplay options and they lost more then half their users as a result. But 1st edition was more combat heavy only because it was made from a boardgame H&S game so they didn't know any better and didn't figure out the games true potential yet. | ||
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incifan
Germany138 Posts
Same goes for Pen and Paper games, if the group decides not to roleplay there is nothing the choice of game system can do about it. There are people who claim different, but they are usually just full of shit. That said, DnD 4 is a horrible PnP system - mainly because of the massive bookkeeping and lack of out of combat abilities. Which kinda makes it a perfect basis for a cRPG. | ||
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On May 08 2013 18:54 incifan wrote: Well, you cant code roleplaying in a computer game. If players decide not to do it, there is nothing any game designer can change about it. Same goes for Pen and Paper games, if the group decides not to roleplay there is nothing the choice of game system can do about it. There are people who claim different, but they are usually just full of shit. That said, DnD 4 is a horrible PnP system - mainly because of the massive bookkeeping and lack of out of combat abilities. Which kinda makes it a perfect basis for a cRPG. Of course you can. Not to the level of Pen&paper but you can. It is called choice and consequence. Many RPG games have those. Really few MMO bother. This one didn't. | ||
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AnomalySC2
United States2073 Posts
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incifan
Germany138 Posts
A computer game can only be a crutch for roleplaying - a place to meet likeminded people and make up your own shit. But for that PnP and online tools like Roll20.net will always be superior because your creativity isn't limited by the arbitrary set of rules of a computer game. MMOs especially are by now very antisocial games where you have to make an effort to actually find roleplaying. It doesn't help a vocal part of the MMO community goes out of their way to ruin the fun of those who manage to organize that. | ||
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Zhiroo
Kosovo2724 Posts
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On May 08 2013 21:31 AnomalySC2 wrote: Honestly it perfectly captures the feeling of playing the oldschool dnd crpg games like Neverwinternights, Baldur's Gate, Icewind Dale, etc etc even though the combat is drastically different. loooooool..... we must have played widely different games back then... This MMO has almost nothing in common with the games you mentioned. Even putting them in the same sentence and naming them all is an insult too all those awesome classics. | ||
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
On May 08 2013 21:47 incifan wrote: I am sorry, but choice and consequence isn't roleplaying. It's just presenting a choice - which is part of proper quest design and missing in NWO and basically every MMO and cRPG. A good/evil scale or a pick of faction isn't different from picking a different car in Need for Speed. That doesn't make the Need for Speed series roleplaying games by design. A computer game can only be a crutch for roleplaying - a place to meet likeminded people and make up your own shit. But for that PnP and online tools like Roll20.net will always be superior because your creativity isn't limited by the arbitrary set of rules of a computer game. MMOs especially are by now very antisocial games where you have to make an effort to actually find roleplaying. It doesn't help a vocal part of the MMO community goes out of their way to ruin the fun of those who manage to organize that. It is still roleplaying, you know playing a role. It is just much worse and I did say that. There are two ways to play a role. One is to react to inside stimuli (mostly emotions). For this you don't really need to PnP at all, you can imagine it all alone. Another way is to react to outside stimuli. This is where choice and consequence comes into play and why it is integral part of roleplay. You play a story, and like all story you (your character that you choose to play) comes to certain crossroads. In standard story the choice is already made for you (books, movies, MMO games :D), in proper cRPG that support roleplaying you get a choice or couple of choices and each of those have a consequence. In PnP you have no limitation of choices, you can choose to do whatever you can come up with and all those choices also have consequences. Those choices define your character, his wants, wishes and morals. Without choice there cannot be 2nd kind of roleplay. Some cRPG games support roleplay by presenting many interesting choices, others like this game have almost zero. But it is still within the power of code to let you roleplay by making those choices and consequences available to you. | ||
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incifan
Germany138 Posts
So for roleplaying purposes Neverwinter is just like any other MMO. If you like the setting you can make it work with some effort. And the Foundry has potential to help with that. | ||
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vol_
Australia1608 Posts
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daemir
Finland8662 Posts
The game might be like really nice modern mmo thingie, but I was just completely put off by the simple fact that they call it Neverwinter and it has absolutely 0 to do with DnD mechanics. | ||
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Ayaz2810
United States2763 Posts
On May 09 2013 05:13 daemir wrote: I watched bit of a stream of someone playing a sorcerer?wizard? I don't even know, lot of aoe ice spells and stuffs, doing a boss fight with his group and after a while of button mashing and rotating his cooldowns and using his "daily" for the 5th time I'm like...yea, so what does this have to do with Neverwinter or DnD? That guy spammed more spells in 3 minutes of boss fight than a real DnD wizard would be able to cast in a month. The game might be like really nice modern mmo thingie, but I was just completely put off by the simple fact that they call it Neverwinter and it has absolutely 0 to do with DnD mechanics. Yeah the limited number of abilities and mindless fights are starting to wear on me. There are no gimmicks to learn or anything. And one skirmish boss took like 20 minutes to defeat with everyone just clumped up on him. He must have had like 10 million HP and couldn't kill a single one of us. It was pretty stupid. Also, the fact that the same loot drops from bosses in dungeons every time is pretty bad. | ||
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Infernal_dream
United States2359 Posts
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AnomalySC2
United States2073 Posts
On May 09 2013 05:42 Infernal_dream wrote: If you're bored of the game at any point before 60, you're going to be bored at 60. The boss mechanics are the exact same throughout every point in the game. Spawn a million adds. If any of you have fought chartilifax in the lair of the mad dragon dungeon at level 30 you'll know what I mean. He's basically the epitome of level 60 dungeons, epic and not. Well that sounds....disappointing. Maybe I'll focus a bit more on pvp. | ||
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MethodSC
United States928 Posts
On May 09 2013 06:04 AnomalySC2 wrote: Well that sounds....disappointing. Maybe I'll focus a bit more on pvp. PvP only has 1 mode, capture the points. It's like a really dumbed down arathi basin, I got bored after an hour. | ||
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Resisty
United States375 Posts
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Infernal_dream
United States2359 Posts
On May 09 2013 06:04 AnomalySC2 wrote: Well that sounds....disappointing. Maybe I'll focus a bit more on pvp. PVP takes about 5 hours to farm your entire set of gear. There's only two maps both of which are the same exact game mode. Capture and hold the three points. Anyone with the fastest mount in the game will win you that arena. There's no way to defend points against people with mounts three times as fast as yours. | ||
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MethodSC
United States928 Posts
On May 09 2013 07:31 Resisty wrote: There are no anti-afk mechanics in place at the moment so you get games where 3 people sit in spawn and there's absolutely no way you can win that. It's because you still get 300 honor for losing, so if you lose really quickly you still gain honor at a reasonable rate. Considering how awful the pvp is anyways, with every class bursting eachother in 3 seconds, it's not surprising that people would rather just sit there than play the game. On May 08 2013 12:24 xBebop wrote: Are you sure that the Doomguide's Duty quest is repeatable? I finished it once and wen't back to try to do it some more but the guy isn't offering it. Is there some way to make it show up again? + Show Spoiler + Alright what you need to do is find someone that has the quest, then ask them to share it with you. After that, you go into the place, collect your reward, leave the instance, then drop the quest and repeat. Basically you need 1 other person to do this efficiently. You'll get around 20-30 proffession packs an hour, and the items contained will sell for 1mil~ ad. So you only have to do this for a few hours at most to have everything you could ever want. | ||
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Kaal
Djibouti2539 Posts
On May 08 2013 18:44 -Archangel- wrote: Not really. Not since 2nd edition. 4e tried to bring back the 1st edition spirit of D&D by removing ROLEplaying options and introducing more ROLLplay options and they lost more then half their users as a result. But 1st edition was more combat heavy only because it was made from a boardgame H&S game so they didn't know any better and didn't figure out the games true potential yet. 4E is why you see such a massive movement of people toward Pathfinder and people just playing 3.5, but if you're insinuating that D&D is D&D based on what ruleset you play you're a sillybutt. PVP takes about 5 hours to farm your entire set of gear. There's only two maps both of which are the same exact game mode. Capture and hold the three points. Anyone with the fastest mount in the game will win you that arena. There's no way to defend points against people with mounts three times as fast as yours. Wrong. A GF with lunge, shield dash, the 3 charge stun and anvil drop can 1v1 anyone even half-equipped. He just sits in the center with shield up and there's nothing you can do with only one person. | ||
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