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10dla
127 Posts
On May 04 2018 11:39 JimmyJRaynor wrote: i'm saying the RTS genre and the SC franchise is priority # ~15. and that is a bad spot to be in. Blizzard isn't a "volume publisher" like EA. Blizzard has currently 8 games going, so its max #8 | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17435 Posts
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10dla
127 Posts
On May 04 2018 11:44 JimmyJRaynor wrote: ATVI has multiple incubation teams working on games right now. Blizzard developes the games, not Activision | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17435 Posts
check my reply in full. | ||
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10dla
127 Posts
Go ahead and post the internal documents on what team has X amount of heads working on it. Sick of those wild guesses just to back up a shitty number. Ironically, they could work on 4 different RTS. But you wont tell us about them... What a shame | ||
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orvinreyes
577 Posts
On May 04 2018 09:52 rackdude wrote: But SCBW? I didn't know shit about anything that eonzerg posted. I come to TL quite a bit but the foreigner stuff just isn't focused. No one is doing a nice writeup about it, or has a Youtube channel I can subscribe to. Someone really needs to write a guide on "how to get into the SC E-sports community", since I'd bet $100 that the ASL only caught on because it's posted to Afreeka's Youtube channel which also has SC2 so people already knew about it. Okay, that was all over the place but there's young professionals like me who would love to watch the games and contribute to the scene, but only follow the scene a little bit. Direct us to the right channels. Wading through TL forums to find a VoD is too time consuming and requires prerequisite knowledge about the scene. Someone should curate the content. Day9 did some super accessible starcraft content a while back, from both an esports and player perspective. Here's the playlist: | ||
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Kare
Norway786 Posts
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Alpha-NP-
United States1242 Posts
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rackdude
United States882 Posts
On May 04 2018 12:21 orvinreyes wrote: Day9 did some super accessible starcraft content a while back, from both an esports and player perspective. Here's the playlist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q67zv_p0jBA&list=PLgmCLtUkEutKY8IlwyVCUFoRtgQe3LCf1 Day9 dailies are different though. I don't want a full analysis, I just wanna watch some fun games with commentary. Honestly, the fact that I say accessible SCBW content and someone points to the Day9 dailies should be a warning sign that the community is misaligned. Day9's stuff is great, but it's not just a set it on the side and have fun content. Where's the channel of casts for random SCBW events? Who's doing something in a professional looking manner, putting some effort into making it look good, and making these events accessible? I see that there are streams around, but I don't want to watch streams of people laddering. There used to be people like NukeTheStars and CholeraSC. In the new era, there was EsportsJohn for a bit, but that's gone. How come no one is casting KCM? (The fact that I found that was great, but random) What's the channel to subscribe to that's for foreign BW? I don't want it muddled with streams, I just want an SCBW tournament channel like there used to be, and like there is for any other esport. Here's the example of the WC3 channel which is growing right now: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8AUf3tg5Id7kZjfsjkILMA Good professional casts of tournament games with consistency, both in the content and the style. Instead what we have is all Korean language casts or FPVODs. Even the curated FPVODs are going away with one of the best channels not posting anymore: https://www.youtube.com/user/vr33m/featured and it's no surprise to me that the foreigner community isn't (in general) excited to open up Korean language casts: I'm just doing it because I'm used to it after all of these years. There's something great about a cast since you can always have it on, even when working, and tune in when it heats up. I am just really surprised that no one has done this stuff (or I haven't found it yet!). | ||
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Qikz
United Kingdom12027 Posts
On May 04 2018 09:33 rackdude wrote: I had no idea about any of this. Can this stuff get a TL writeup with links to Youtube videos so we can follow along? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/bw-tournaments/531961-stpl-r-and-s-shinhan-tank-proleague-18-19-season This is the STPL at least, the tournament I run, you can find the vods all here: https://www.youtube.com/user/QikzSC | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
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Navane
Netherlands2751 Posts
But it's true, it's hard to get to the visible spot in all the shite that internet produces these days. | ||
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Cryoc
Germany912 Posts
On May 04 2018 15:19 Qikz wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/bw-tournaments/531961-stpl-r-and-s-shinhan-tank-proleague-18-19-season This is the STPL at least, the tournament I run, you can find the vods all here: https://www.youtube.com/user/QikzSC ZZZero also uploaded the games from BSL on Youtube: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/bw-tournaments/531965-bsl-4-pro-and-chobo-leagues-start https://www.youtube.com/user/DiDeKZZZ/videos | ||
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MaxModeration
2 Posts
The point is, how big would non Korean SC 2 be if Blizzard treated SC2 like they do Broodwar? It would be in the same freaking boat... every pro would quit tomorrow if Blizzard announced they would treat SC 2 like they do Broodwar. The casuals would quickly follow. All you ever see is whining and complaining. The rarest thing in SC 2 is finding someone who loves the game -- who isn't paid to "love" it. It's just a slap in the face, all things considered, that Blizzard can't even spare a dime in regards to Broodwar, yet they can pay streamers 50k or whatever just to stream some campaign stuff for a few days. Come on. All I ever hear about is how Morhaime will never stop investing in SC 2 cause it's a passion project. Returns be damned. Given the numbers... that comment makes sense. But, on the other hand, what, does this guy have zero passion for Broodwar? He loves the inferior version? What, is he dumb? Last I checked, Broodwar helped make Blizzard what it is today. What has SC 2 done? Provided us with some of the worst units in RTS history? The Broodwar scene was ridiculously big back in the day, for having no money to play for... This game has NEVER been given a chance to flourish, outside of Korea. Honestly, it just looks they're afraid they can't monetize Broodwar properly. They don't want people to play it. They'd rather them play any of their other games. A sick fetish that is embarrassing and unbecoming. The last ASL series got more viewers than SC 2 will EVER REACH AGAIN. Korea, alone, is bigger than the entirety of SC 2. SC 2 needs a boycott more than it needs another penny put into it. Enabling this treatment is sick. | ||
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AntiHack
Switzerland553 Posts
On May 04 2018 12:21 orvinreyes wrote: Day9 did some super accessible starcraft content a while back, from both an esports and player perspective. Here's the playlist: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q67zv_p0jBA&list=PLgmCLtUkEutKY8IlwyVCUFoRtgQe3LCf1 As much as I like Day9 and I'm extremely gratefull for this series I would have prefer a more new-players-friendly series instead of how-to-be-a-pro series taking in account that the majority of his streams audience was made of people that had never touched BW in their life. | ||
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
On May 04 2018 17:56 MaxModeration wrote: It's just a slap in the face, all things considered, that Blizzard can't even spare a dime in regards to Broodwar, yet they can pay streamers 50k or whatever just to stream some campaign stuff for a few days. Come on. According to the first pylon episode, they did put a lot of money into the Anniversary event. So not sparing a dime is a gross exaggeration. | ||
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AntiHack
Switzerland553 Posts
On May 04 2018 17:56 MaxModeration wrote: Korea is an example of what CAN happen if people actually take the scene seriously and invest in it. What gets me is, no one ever brings up SC 2: There is all of this money pumped into SC 2, by Blizzard, yet... it's not a big esport. The numbers are never anything worth talking about. They're embarrassingly low compared to the money put into the game. The point is, how big would non Korean SC 2 be if Blizzard treated SC2 like they do Broodwar? It would be in the same freaking boat... every pro would quit tomorrow if Blizzard announced they would treat SC 2 like they do Broodwar. The casuals would quickly follow. All you ever see is whining and complaining. The rarest thing in SC 2 is finding someone who loves the game -- who isn't paid to "love" it. It's just a slap in the face, all things considered, that Blizzard can't even spare a dime in regards to Broodwar, yet they can pay streamers 50k or whatever just to stream some campaign stuff for a few days. Come on. All I ever hear about is how Morhaime will never stop investing in SC 2 cause it's a passion project. Returns be damned. Given the numbers... that comment makes sense. But, on the other hand, what, does this guy have zero passion for Broodwar? He loves the inferior version? What, is he dumb? Last I checked, Broodwar helped make Blizzard what it is today. What has SC 2 done? Provided us with some of the worst units in RTS history? The Broodwar scene was ridiculously big back in the day, for having no money to play for... This game has NEVER been given a chance to flourish, outside of Korea. Honestly, it just looks they're afraid they can't monetize Broodwar properly. They don't want people to play it. They'd rather them play any of their other games. A sick fetish that is embarrassing and unbecoming. The last ASL series got more viewers than SC 2 will EVER REACH AGAIN. Korea, alone, is bigger than the entirety of SC 2. SC 2 needs a boycott more than it needs another penny put into it. Enabling this treatment is sick. I totally agree but I fear that the BW fans that play sc2 are a small minority so no way to bring Blizz back on earth. I also believe that being a 2D kind of realistic style RTS put you in a bad spot in nowadays Blizzard. | ||
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AntiHack
Switzerland553 Posts
On May 04 2018 15:19 Qikz wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/bw-tournaments/531961-stpl-r-and-s-shinhan-tank-proleague-18-19-season This is the STPL at least, the tournament I run, you can find the vods all here: https://www.youtube.com/user/QikzSC Thank you | ||
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MarcoJ
Germany146 Posts
On May 04 2018 17:56 MaxModeration wrote: [...] The last ASL series got more viewers than SC 2 will EVER REACH AGAIN. Korea, alone, is bigger than the entirety of SC 2. SC 2 needs a boycott more than it needs another penny put into it. Enabling this treatment is sick. do you have some numbers to back that up? | ||
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lestye
United States4206 Posts
On May 04 2018 08:32 KungKras wrote: To be honest I think SC2 killed the RTS. It had a more narrow appeal than SC1 since it was designed to be all about E-sports and neglected everything else (like custom games). And thus boxed in the RTS genre into E-sports. And then, new non-RTS E-sports got big, and that was the end of that. That doesn't make much sense. 1) There was hardly any actual development resources put into the game for esports. It was pretty much all put into the campaign, the criticism of the custom games holds up. 2) I don't think the custom game thing makes any sense at all. For one, custom games have gone the way of the dinosaur with the advent of f2p, mobile games, cheap AAA titles, big content patches in games. Also I don't see why custom games matter, if you look at the popular games and genres on the market, none of them rely on custom games to be successful or popular. I think if your make the argument that the RTS needs custom games to flourish, that says more about the unappealing aspects of RTS than anything else. Also, most succsesful RTS games outside of Blizzard dont have custom games at all, or even decent map editors. They didnt "need" that stuff. Ultimately, the post would only make sense if SC2 bombed and thats what drove people away from making RTS games, when it was a plethora of other factors. Ensemble studios shuttered, and EA took EA Los Angeles off of RTS before SC2 was released. CNC4 failing so bad probably had more of an effect than any shortcomings of SC2. On May 04 2018 17:56 MaxModeration wrote: Korea is an example of what CAN happen if people actually take the scene seriously and invest in it. What gets me is, no one ever brings up SC 2: There is all of this money pumped into SC 2, by Blizzard, yet... it's not a big esport. The numbers are never anything worth talking about. They're embarrassingly low compared to the money put into the game. The point is, how big would non Korean SC 2 be if Blizzard treated SC2 like they do Broodwar? It would be in the same freaking boat... every pro would quit tomorrow if Blizzard announced they would treat SC 2 like they do Broodwar. The casuals would quickly follow. All you ever see is whining and complaining. The rarest thing in SC 2 is finding someone who loves the game -- who isn't paid to "love" it. It's just a slap in the face, all things considered, that Blizzard can't even spare a dime in regards to Broodwar, yet they can pay streamers 50k or whatever just to stream some campaign stuff for a few days. Come on. All I ever hear about is how Morhaime will never stop investing in SC 2 cause it's a passion project. Returns be damned. Given the numbers... that comment makes sense. But, on the other hand, what, does this guy have zero passion for Broodwar? He loves the inferior version? What, is he dumb? Last I checked, Broodwar helped make Blizzard what it is today. What has SC 2 done? Provided us with some of the worst units in RTS history? The Broodwar scene was ridiculously big back in the day, for having no money to play for... This game has NEVER been given a chance to flourish, outside of Korea. Honestly, it just looks they're afraid they can't monetize Broodwar properly. They don't want people to play it. They'd rather them play any of their other games. A sick fetish that is embarrassing and unbecoming. The last ASL series got more viewers than SC 2 will EVER REACH AGAIN. Korea, alone, is bigger than the entirety of SC 2. SC 2 needs a boycott more than it needs another penny put into it. Enabling this treatment is sick. This post is just incredibly ignorant. They've spent a good chunk on BW events over the years, so to say "they cant spare a dime" after we had the anniversary events, and several showmatches, not to mention Blizzcons, Worldwide Invitiationals, etc in the past. And they said they're planning on a competition this year and something bigger next year. (That's not to say there's not stuff worth criticizing its just that statement sucks) Also you fail to mention that SC2 is still bringing in money for them. Your viewership anecdotes don't really matter much when those are almost exclusively in Korea. That's 1 niche market compared to the weight of the rest of the world. Your call for boycott is also incredibly nonsensical, if you had the numbers for a decent boycott, then there wouldnt be player/viewership problems in the West. | ||
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