EPTso the statements are contradicting each other am i right? man it's so hard to see the truth in this conflict.
Ukraine Crisis - Page 241
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Undead1993
Germany17651 Posts
so the statements are contradicting each other am i right? man it's so hard to see the truth in this conflict. | ||
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m4ini
4215 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:23 Cheerio wrote: A parody on russian media covering Crimean events Would be more fun if i actually could understand it even in the slightest. -,- | ||
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radiatoren
Denmark1907 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:03 Sermokala wrote: Russia is right in that the current Ukrainian govt isn't legitimate and they're basically put in power by a bloody and frothing mob. Moving into the crimera to protect their military assets is just a good ol fashioned power play by putin. He cant lose this and won't back down without a fight. Scary stuff all around. Basically this, but annex Crimea and what then? The ukrainian government will still be illegitimate seen from russian eyes after a presidential election that Yanukovych didn't approve of so they can pretty much munch on the rest of the eastern Ukraine as soon as the reforms start to hurt. The precendence seems to be that as soon as you do not recognize a central authority in a bordering country, you can basically ignore their authority in the provinces. Not at all a comfortable thing if you think about a certain benelux country... | ||
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Sub40APM
6336 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:25 m4ini wrote: Would be more fun if i actually could understand it even in the slightest. -,- Studio can you hear me, we are here in Sevastopol in the middle of action, where the fascists are burning the only Russian library. Do you see this smoke, its from the books of our great heritage like Bulgakov, Dostoyevsky, Lermontov, they are cynically killing RUssian culture. First explosion -- you hear that? They just blew up the only Russian school! next explosion, see, the left over of a student! then he says 'got it'?' ok, do we have any more fireworks left? Ya two more, okay lets go film 'Kharkov' and we are done | ||
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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On March 08 2014 05:07 m4ini wrote: Reuters just confirmed it. Maybe read "less biased" (western is biased as well i know, but seemingly still more reliable) news. Don't you think that's a bit unfair? Isn't it actually formidable to try to confirm it by your own correspondents instead of just picking up the news from other agencies? It's honestly not bad to be a bit more slow compared to bringing false information. "Russia fires ICBM" to "Russia fires test ICBM" to "Well... Russia did that ICBM test they announced before the crisis". I rather wait for the 3rd news, instead of reading news 1+2... | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22703 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:31 Zocat wrote: Don't you think that's a bit unfair? Isn't it actually formidable to try to confirm it by your own correspondents instead of just picking up the news from other agencies? It's honestly not bad to be a bit more slow compared to bringing false information. "Russia fires ICBM" to "Russia fires test ICBM" to "Well... Russia did that ICBM test they announced before the crisis". I rather wait for the 3rd news, instead of reading news 1+2... The downside of present day journalism, where being the first to shout it out is more important then making sure the info is correct. | ||
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Sub40APM
6336 Posts
Fact-Finding Envoys in Crimea Face Hostility As the United Nations sent an eight-member human rights fact-finding mission to Ukraine on Friday, an envoy with the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe said she had faced noisy, threatening crowds chanting pro-Russian slogans in the Crimea regional capital of Simferopol earlier this week and had been forced to cut short her visit. In her four-day mission, Ms. Thors said she could establish that there were no imminent threats to the rights of Russians, nor to Ukrainian Jews. “They don’t feel their existence is threatened by other communities,” she said. "We have all the facts on this we need. We don't need any more facts. In the land of truth, my friend, the man with one fact is the king." | ||
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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:33 Sub40APM wrote: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/03/08/world/europe/fact-finding-envoys-in-crimea.html "We have all the facts on this we need. We don't need any more facts. In the land of truth, my friend, the man with one fact is the king." http://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2012/10/23/texas-attorney-general-tells-u-n-election-observers-to-keep-their-distance/ "Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott has informed a group of international observers who intend to monitor polls in the Lone Star state on election day, that they best keep their distance. Literally. He wrote that if observers are found to be stationed within 100 feet of the entrace of a polling place they could be subject to criminal prosecution." | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
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Sub40APM
6336 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:35 Zocat wrote: http://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2012/10/23/texas-attorney-general-tells-u-n-election-observers-to-keep-their-distance/ "Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott has informed a group of international observers who intend to monitor polls in the Lone Star state on election day, that they best keep their distance. Literally. He wrote that if observers are found to be stationed within 100 feet of the entrace of a polling place they could be subject to criminal prosecution." And that is relevant? http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/mar/07/ukraine-debate-both-sides-wrong?CMP=twt_fd It's perfectly possible for a westerner to oppose both Russia's action in Crimea and the invasion of Iraq – indeed, to oppose both for the same reason: as unmerited violations of sovereignty. Admittedly, that might be tricky for John Kerry, given his Senate vote in 2002 giving George W Bush the authority to use military force against Saddam Hussein – a record that should have given him pause before denouncing Vladimir Putin for acting "in a 19th-century fashion by invading another country on a completely trumped-up pretext". | ||
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m4ini
4215 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:31 Zocat wrote: Don't you think that's a bit unfair? Isn't it actually formidable to try to confirm it by your own correspondents instead of just picking up the news from other agencies? It's honestly not bad to be a bit more slow compared to bringing false information. "Russia fires ICBM" to "Russia fires test ICBM" to "Well... Russia did that ICBM test they announced before the crisis". I rather wait for the 3rd news, instead of reading news 1+2... No, i don't. First of all, i said Okay, i'm all for being careful n stuff, but.. Second of all, if you get pictures and tweets not from news agencies, but from reporters live at the site (not comparable to the ICBM, where newsagencies were the source, not actual "on-site-reports"), it's pretty sure to assume that they have something going. Not to mention that it seems funny to me to wait for a russian confirmation, or how long did it take for them to actually reveal that those armed guys are russian soldiers? Oh wait, up to this point, they did not. It's absolutely reasonable to assume that russian media won't cover this at all, since it's not certain (to put it softly) that putin/ministery even give out a statement on what happened. edit The downside of present day journalism, where being the first to shout it out is more important then making sure the info is correct. Answer fits to you as well. Studio can you hear me, we are here in Sevastopol in the middle of action, where the fascists are burning the only Russian library. Do you see this smoke, its from the books of our great heritage like Bulgakov, Dostoyevsky, Lermontov, they are cynically killing RUssian culture. First explosion -- you hear that? They just blew up the only Russian school! next explosion, see, the left over of a student! then he says 'got it'?' ok, do we have any more fireworks left? Ya two more, okay lets go film 'Kharkov' and we are done Cheers mate. | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
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Powerpill
United States1693 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:01 MoltkeWarding wrote: As far as the comparison can be sustained in the purely political sphere, Russia has been merely conducting herself along the standards set by the Americans for the past two decades, albeit on a far more modest scale. However, there is also an unspoken asymmetry in the comparison as well, because for Russia, the West is not only a rival but a model. There is a duality in the way Russia perceives the West which has been a running meme in Russian history since the 18th century; on one hand, fear and suspicion, on the other, envy and imitation. In the warmer periods of association, such as the relationship between Alexander I and Napoleon, between Peter III and Frederick the Great, or even the Stalin's relationships with Hitler and Roosevelt, this esteem has bubbled into outright professions of admiration. How the Western nations conduct themselves with Russia matters, not only because of their responsibility to themselves, but because of their responsibility to all those who will imitate their behaviour. I love how you pointed out the odd polarity of Russia's view of the West, and I agree, the way the West has been conducting itself the past decade or so (much longer actually) has certainly been a substantial catalyst to what is going on in Ukraine today, both directly and indirectly. Always love your posts Moltke, even if they have become somewhat of a rarity in the past few years. ^_-v | ||
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Sub40APM
6336 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:50 Ghanburighan wrote: https://twitter.com/akymenko_o/status/442052624645636096 https://twitter.com/RolandOliphant/status/442053903606362113 Shaun Walker @shaunwalker7 12m He was on way to hospital to take cameraman who had been beaten by mob outside base being stormed by Russians. I spoke to him 20 min before Details Shaun Walker @shaunwalker7 13m SOS: Andrei Tsaplienko of Inter TV,& others awol nr Sevastopol. Called friend to say pursued, shouts of get out of car heard. Now phone off. | ||
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WOPR
Canada145 Posts
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
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m4ini
4215 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:55 WOPR wrote: is it me or does russia seem HUGE on google maps (when i wanted to see where Crimea was) Not the largest country in the world for no reason. | ||
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WOPR
Canada145 Posts
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DonKey_
Liechtenstein1356 Posts
On March 08 2014 06:35 Zocat wrote: http://www.forbes.com/sites/christopherhelman/2012/10/23/texas-attorney-general-tells-u-n-election-observers-to-keep-their-distance/ "Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott has informed a group of international observers who intend to monitor polls in the Lone Star state on election day, that they best keep their distance. Literally. He wrote that if observers are found to be stationed within 100 feet of the entrace of a polling place they could be subject to criminal prosecution." I understand that you are trying to argue a point, but this adds 0 content to a thread about Ukraine, and the Tu quoque gets very irritating when its used for the 30th time in the same thread. At the very least explain the connection in your post, it seriously comes off lazy otherwise. | ||
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WOPR
Canada145 Posts
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